Arrow768

From the title I expected this to be a revive of one of the more controversial camera suggestions. But this is actually pretty reasonable and could be interesting to try out.

Given the posts below, this is going to be implemented at some point in the future when we have figured out how to best implement it (mechanically)

I have re-read parts of this thread, and I would like to point out a few things: There were two things that have been shot down when that claim was made: (see this post) Xeno XOs with any sort of elevated power Another vote regarding the 2IC XO. Everything else was up for (a reasonable) debate. Some things mentioned in this topic are answered/addressed quite easily, those are the things I got to first. (Large) Posts that raise larger issues generally take more time to answer, so that is something where I have to take the time to think about the issue presented and then create a reply that properly represents my thoughts on those matters. (In some cases, I also have to check in with the rest of the people involved in creating the directive; Especially if this is something that wasn't discussed already) This is time I usually do not have during the week, so I left (most of) those for later. However, I do not have infinite time, so when it became obvious that certain people engaged in this discussion have no interest in an actual productive discussion, any effort put into a discussion like that is wasted. As such, the discussion has been ended prematurely. I also noticed that I never posted the results of the poll. A total of 134 ckeys voted for an option that wasn't "I dont care". Out of those 107 votes, 94 (70%) were for the change and 40(30%) against. (When removing inactive ckeys the ratio sinks to ~63%; depends how "inactive" is defined) As usual, it needs to be pointed out that the polls are opinion polls to gauge the opinion of the larger player base about a specific topic but are not binding. If someone has questions (about the planned implementation) or is interested in a reasonable discussion, I am available via Discord DM. (If I do not reply, there is a good chance I just didn't see the message / forgot about it; Feel free to just message me again after a while.) The creation of additional topics on the forum about the 2IC XO is not wanted.

You are again choosing to ignore a key part of what I wrote in the initial response. And then you wonder why I choose not to waste my time on individuals such as yourself, who try to intentionally misinterpret things I write. There is absolutely no point in continuing this discussion at this time. My interest to discuss these changes has been severely hampered when people started coming up with alternative facts and then continued to perform mental gymnastics to create a narrative that just isnt there. After a brief discussion with the rest of the present head staff we will proceed as follows: The changes will be implemented as described in my original post. There might be some IC news/events to accompany the implementation. There might be additional changes to other directives or regulations to support the new XO reg After sufficient time (as determined by the headmins/devs) these changes will be reviewed and possibly altered. This will be a private review process at first. We might open up this (or another) topic at that time to get input from the larger community.

Standard procedures, 1.1: "During standard operation, all Departmental Heads of Staff are equal, under the command of the Captain present onboard the vessel. Should a department find itself lacking a Head of Staff, the Captain is able to either assume direct supervision of the department or otherwise appoint a senior crew member to fill the missing role. During non-standard operation, a specific Departmental Head of Staff may be elevated above others, should the crisis situation fall under the responsibility of their department. At that point, other departments should act in a supporting role." It is impressive how hard you are trying to misinterpret things. My statement was made in regard to this: You are trying to imply here that if a XO approaches a head of staff and claims that they got an order from the captain to pass along to the head of staff, that XO is somehow the acting captain. I do not see how you can interpret my response (where I point out that we do not have a regulation that would force heads of staff to comply with XOs orders that were given by a captain to the XO if the XO has no solid documentation of those orders) in a way where this is somehow covered by a the acting captainship regulation. It simply does not apply here, as a captain giving a XO an order to pass along requires that there is already a (acting) captain, so by definition the ship cannot be without an acting captain. As it takes some quite impressive mental gymnastics to come to your conclusion, I believe you are arguing in bad faith and do not see any point in continuing this argument with you. (And I have stopped reading your post at that point)

No I don’t expect people who want to be the person in command to make a character for those „10-20% of games when there is a captain present“. That is not purpose of the XO. To re-iterate it again: If someone wants to be the captain in „80-90% of the rounds“, they can make a captain character. We don’t need a XO for that. I expect people who wish to play a character that works together with the person in command to make/use a XO character. And I do expect some of the people who are planning to make a new captain character to make use of the XO Position for a time (to introduce their char to the setting). I also expect people who want to be in command of the ship to make a captain character.

This is not covered by extension regulations and heads of staff are well within their rights to tell the „service and bridge head of staff“ (XO) to bugger off if they come to them with (captain) orders. (Unless they have a signed and stamped from with them or until the captain verified those orders somehow) If a player wants to play a role that is in complete control of the ship, we have that role already: captain. adding another role like that would be duplication, as such the XO has been geared towards a playstyle where you work with whoever is in command. If someone wants to be in command in that 80-90% of the rounds, they can play captain.

Who do you think is the most qualified individual to take acting captainship (as required in recital 5) when someone starts shooting up the ship and there is only a CMO, RD and XO. Let me give you a hint: it’s not the CMO and the RD as they don’t (need to) have any knowledge about the capabilities of the security department. (And with that the XO satisfies the „unless absolutely required“ condition that needs to be met for them to take acting captainship)

I do not see much point in continuing the part of the discussion regarding xeno XOs as it was opened by certain people stating how xeno XOs make up most of the characters, which was then quickly disproved. Now the claim is that they didn’t mean all XOs but only „well established“ XOs. (Without defining what „well established“ means) I could now get and post the number of rounds grouped by character. But I don’t see the point in that, as I am sure the same people will shift the goalposts again. (Most likely by re-defining „well established“) Another quite common theme in this thread is that the XO at the moment has some sort of authority and this policy reduces that. At the moment the XO has exactly the same authority over departments under a different head of staff that every head of staff has: absolutely zero. Currently other department heads are well within their rights to tell the XO to take a long walk and come back with orders by the (acting) captain if they try to tell them to do something. With the reg change that completely changes. Heads of staff are expected to comply without undue delay with the orders of the XO as soon as they Mutter the magic words: „I am currently carrying out the orders of the acting captain“. The recitals specifically mention the ability of the acting captain to delegate tasks to the xo without spelling out every detail of it. (For example it can be a „run the ship while I go on a away mission / …“ And with that the XO is effectively in command of the ship. I believe it also needs to be pointed out that there is no requirement, that such orders need to be stated in public or on the command channel for them to be valid. -> if a xo comes up to a head of staff and tells them to do something (because they are carrying out the orders or wishes of the acting captain) the head of staff is expected to execute them without undue delay. (And yes, trying to check with the captain if those are actually their wishes is undue delay)

This is again my personal opinion. I do not see why xeno characters who were XOs cant keep that in their employment history, they are just assigned to another suitable position. In my opinion it is quit obvious that if we expand the XO to have the same access and knowledge of ship systems and quite similar powers to the captain, that the hiring standards/restrictions will also be updated to relect that. It is not possible to explain why we would trust someone with the most guarded secrets of the ship, as well as working in a position that is designed to train captain candidates but never trust them enough to become captain. The hiring policies are already specist. (Not racist, as there is no differentiation between "races" and only between "species"). This has never changed.

I have seen various claims such as this in this topic. Below you can see the number of XO Rounds played per species from the time the topic was created until today. As you can see that claim is not backed up by existing facts.

This is also a TBD, so that is my personal view: Ultimately Service is a department that runs itself. Its rare that the XO needs to step in to actually manage something there. So it could either remain as is or rolled into the OM. I dont think that there is enough content at this time for a dedicated service manager role.

Regarding Xeno XOs: Yes, this is a final decision and we will not make another vote regarding Xeno XOs. Xeno XOs will not happen, as this would open the door to xeno Captains, which is definitly not wanted. -> It is not possible to explain why a Xeno XO is trusted with the self destruct code, the same access that a captain has and to advise other heads of staff in non-standard emergency situations but not trusted enough to be promoted to captain eventually from a role that is designed to train people to become captain.

This is something that we (headmins/devs + lore + ccia) still need to discuss, so the following is only my opinion and might change. There is no requirement that a captain on the Horizon has worked as XO on the Horizon, but it is strongly preferred.

The XO will know about the self destruct and how to activate it.