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BurgerBB

BurgerBB's Developer Application

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Gonna -1 this, you do have a habit of getting hit with something in-game and then suddenly a PR appears that weakens or at least changes that aspect of the game.

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At the time when you asked me to do code for you, I don't even think I was a trial dev

No, but you had an application up to become a dev that was active for a very long time then.



 

Generally I never take suggestions. Sometimes I take suggestions if I feel incredibly motivated, but none of the ideas you presented to me really motivated me to drop everything and get right to it. Reminder that I am unpaid and everything I do is volunteer related so when I'm not staff, or even a trial dev, I'm not going to code something I don't feel motivated coding especially when I have other projects that need attending to, and I feel, aren't important enough to spend time on. Unless I'm being paid real cash money, motivation is the currency in which you pay me in.

No one's here to get paid. We're all here to help each other to make something greater and have fun with the community. I understand motivations. I understand inspirations. God, do I understand. But if you want people to understand and go "oh, okay!" you need to communicate this with them instead of just blowing them off. I'd be far more likely to ask you if you wanted to do something and see if it was something you were interested in and be less offended that you said "no" because I would've understood that you just weren't up for the task and simply leaving it at that.



 

Also life advice. If someone is going up to you and telling you that I'm talking shit about dionaea lore and the state of it, then maybe you need to consider that perhaps the people who are bringing it to your attention are doing so maliciously especially when the screenshot you posted was taken out of context and does not mean what you think it means.

The thing is that I haven't seen any proof of otherwise, I've experienced some of it in person and have read the things following some statements, nor have you shown you want to elaborate on that screenshot either. Which is fine, that isn't entirely what this is about. Like I've said, this is more about the teamwork aspect. And from the above, you've more or less cleared up the hows and whys, and I'm decently satisfied at the answer so I retract my -1 to a more neutral stand.




I can understand the whole motivation/inspiration thing you got going on. But it seems to me you're more than willing to literally drop everything for your own personal projects and work on them the moment you notice something that immediately affected/inconveniences you, such as the parapen fiasco. I get it, the parapen made your experience into something negative and you saw an issue it. You're a volunteer who's unpaid who has difficulty finding the willpower to do things they just aren't interested in. But what about the other projects? What if you were entrusted with something and you dropped it immediately for something that mildly inconvenienced you once in-game? Loredevs and others will come to you for help. As a member of staff, you are no longer working for yourself. You are working with other staff for the community.

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Looks good, people who review PRs are good. +1.


Also, no one has an obligation to code anything for anyone. Be the change you want to see in the game. Coding isn't too difficult. All you need is the right mindset.

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Note:

I did apologise in the Parapen thread as I have misunderstood a previous posts from Burger. That was on my part. Re-reading it, it mostly seems like a pointless change now.


However I still believe there is a lot of agenda pushing behind every 4th to 6th PR made. Mainly the PR's that were so stupid in essence they were shut down immediatly and no drama was stirred around them.

Namely:

Make AI's a % spawn, after playing borg extensively and constantly complaining that AI's don't know what they're doing.

Removing Wizard apprentice contracts after meeting a peacewizard who made apprentices in a round.

Multiple attempts to whitelist antags after each "bad round" even though everyone else might have enjoyed it.

Observing a ninja roundstart, assuming everyone in the round is bored and making thread after thread to remove/turn it into whitelisted antag.


BUT as stated by Skull on the previously made Ban Request thread

45765b3674.png

 


It doesn't matter WHY you code, just that you code. So really these gripes are pointless to hold.

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I'll give Burger a +1. We don't always get along the best, but that really isn't important to the application. He's a good coder, and he probably does more than most devs. I don't see a reason not to give him a trial, at least.


As for what [mention]Neinbox[/mention] said, I would argue that, dev or not, he has no obligation to drop his other PRs and code whatever you want, just because you're a loredev. Being a loredev doesn't give you the ability to control what devs make and when they make it. If you don't like a dev telling you he can't code for you, learn to code for yourself. If you can't get the free time to do that, don't expect a dev to free up his schedule for you every time you ask for something.

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Tbear, he is on trial, has been for like a few weeks now.

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Right here are my thoughts on everything presented.


1. Devs or trial devs shouldn't be forced to code things they have no interesting in coding. While trial devs and devs are part of the team, they shouldn't be treated like tools and thrown away when they don't code things you suggest. However if a dev does literally nothing then ofc action should be taken. I don't think there is anything wrong with refusing a loredev's request to code. Devs do it all the time, I was literally told this by the Dionaea loredev where they told me that most devs turned them down as well. I don't understand why I am special, especially when other devs tend to say "Code it yourself." when people ask them to code things they have no interest in coding.


2. Devs should not be obligated to teach you code. It doesn't matter if I'm a staff member or not, I'm not going to teach you how to code. I can provide you resources but if you ping me daily about coding questions I'm going to refer you to the code dungeon. This is literally standard practice for most non-tutors, I will not show you how to code something, but instead provide you the resources on how to do it if you ask nicely. This is especially true when people act selfishly and try very hard to get my attention.


3. Part of developing is finding issues and then coding fixes to solve them. It's incredibly easy to throw insults around attacking my character or my code when I follow the proper procedure in fixing what I think is an issue. I was under the impression that this is my coding style because it's become a fad where if I start playing a new department, that new department ends up getting sweeping changes. I don't know whether or not things are issues until I experience them or they are brought to my attention.


4. Project priorities are rated based on my interest in coding them. I could act like a goldfish at time and abandon other projects, or be dedicated to one. If you suggest something to me that I think is a really good idea, it can actually sometimes be moved to #1 on my list of priorities. If you ask me to code for a race that is a non-issue in its current state while I have 3 other PRs that fundamentally change the gameplay of the server, then chances are I'm not going to add it to my list. and I will redirect you to another dev.

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There are a few things in this topic that I should address:


[mention]Neinbox[/mention]

The issue you mentioned is very old (4+ months) therefore I do not consider it relevant anymore.

If there are current issues, please bring them up.


[mention]DRagO[/mention]

This issue has also been resolved.

You pinged Burger with a meme shortly after he has been pinged with the same meme and told the person that previously pinged them to cut it out.


[mention]BurgerBB[/mention]

You mentioned that you do not take suggestions and that you do not want to do things that you are not motivated to do.


As a developer there is generally the expectation to equally split your PRs between personal projects, suggestions/assigned projects and bugfixes.

You will definitely get projects assigned to you as a developer.

And there will be the expectation to work on those projects in a timely manner.

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I'll give Burger a +1. We don't always get along the best, but that really isn't important to the application. He's a good coder, and he probably does more than most devs. I don't see a reason not to give him a trial, at least.


As for what @Neinbox said, I would argue that, dev or not, he has no obligation to drop his other PRs and code whatever you want, just because you're a loredev. Being a loredev doesn't give you the ability to control what devs make and when they make it. If you don't like a dev telling you he can't code for you, learn to code for yourself. If you can't get the free time to do that, don't expect a dev to free up his schedule for you every time you ask for something.

 


Not once did I say that I expected this. I understand Burger has other projects. But what I did say was "communication". The first time he did say he was busy and I understood. After time had passed, I was wondering if he had free time and I felt blown off after the conversation. I was fine with the fact that he didn't want to do anything, that's absolutely fine. But going "nah, find someone else" left me feeling brushed off. I didn't understand to as of why. Had he explained then I would've just gone "oh, okay!" instead of feeling dismissed. But because it was explained here, it's all good, I am in understanding, and it's water under the bridge. I no longer care about then as it's been explained.

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There are a few things in this topic that I should address:


@Neinbox

The issue you mentioned is very old (4+ months) therefore I do not consider it relevant anymore.

If there are current issues, please bring them up.

 

The reason why I brought it up is because I've been possibly seeing a few similar things recently and was wondering what was going on with that, if it was repeat behavior, or if there was indeed a problem. I just wanted to make certain that it wasn't what I thought it was and wasn't actually persistent. It's not, so it's fine. But there was one concern about the preference of personal projects over requested ones from Staff that were assigned, as you addressed because that is a persistent behavior, and I was worried there might be a conflict in what is required of him on the team, but you have it from here.

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a bunch of things

Coders are not obligated to code for you. You need to learn to code yourself, this post sounded very entitled. Also, most of that was completely unrelated to Burger's application.

On the contrary. Lore requests are still a request, when you apply to developer you sort of agree to help lore team improve lore through mechanics. I am pretty sure [mention]Skull132[/mention] will confirm that developer s are required to code lore requests if they have nothing else to do. Of course that doesn't that they have to drop PRs they are currently working on. But again it also is just teamwork, a coder who only codes his own stuff are refuses to code lore stuff is a contributor, not a developer.

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For the future, please keep your comments for constructive feedback and about the application, not for some shit dating from some months ago or doing personal attacks.

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Time for a little bit of sandvich input. Burger has improved in my view, and I believe his ideas can really help out the aurora. Burger is always active and if he stays that active, we can see a lot of new things added. So a +1 form me as he has improved so much.

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