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Andrean2017

[Complaint] PratePresidenten - Andrean2017

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BYOND Key: Andrean2017
Staff BYOND Key:  Pratepresidenten
Game ID: bYa-cNyx
Reason for complaint: Being needlessly aggressive
History:
I know I have a history with wrong AI interpretations and I tryto be extra care full to act as realistic as reasonably possible. Sometimes times is of the essence and you simply cant write the RP you want, but I at least want to act as a reasonable station-wide intelligence instead of overlord, which I had the tendency to do earlier.
Situation before admin contact:
I was playing AI and the crewtransfer shuttle was called, as AI I try to be realistic and I like to RP a transfer with a little waiting period and thus the station going into some sort of "standby" mode. 
Which means the engine "spins down", the SMES unit outputs get shut down, the lights get darkened... I think that gives some extra weight even if people miss the shuttle, the station "shutting itself down" all around you.
The engine spindown I do by opening the coolant valves, that sets the output to (almost) 0 and cools down the reactor chamber quite a bit faster. (Only on phoron phoron loops)

Situation when admin contacted me:
I got a message from a moderator "Psst..." right after (max 5 sec) I clicked "offline" at the wrong smes (core), awkwardly right at the same time I noticed the mistake, set it back online and said I indeed made a mistake and fixed it.
Said moderator "Pratepresidenten" started asking why i opened the cooling valves, I explained above RP situation. 
While I was writing an additional scentence saying: "Thats an IC/RP issue and should be put on the forums, if it broke a rule please contact me", He responded with (in short) "don't use those valves it will cause a delamination". The messages crossed each other in a second or so (my experience, should check the logs to be sure, could be more than a few as i was writing).

Here the situation escalates in a way that I find complaint worthy.
Right after our messages crossed eachother I got this reply:
"lmao"
"Ill give you 20 seconds to fix the switches before I ban you, how does that sound?"

While I did as he said, I was totally done with this aggressive threatening dude(ette) at this moment. So I tryed to, rater snarky, try to educate this person that there shouldn't be anyway that would cause a delamination. Something he hasn't cared to explain as of yet.

I tried to reach general ahelp, as previously that would just end up on the ahelp instead of being a respons to the moderator in question, asking for an admin to intervene because I feel abused by threats from a moderator. Seemingly that doesnt work that way anymore, understandbly I wouldnt be the only person doing that ;) 
After which I got a message from this good sir/madam "not be be snarky to administration, my dude", firstoff I am not his/her "dude", never will be nor want to be. I just want pseudo-professional, rule based moderation.

Anyhow that would basically be it, if you asked me. Albeit I still didn't fully comprehend where the need for threats came from.
But after which this admin starts about an issue a previous round this/that day.
In his opinion I had "tampered" with a SMES caused widespread power issues I had no idea what he was talking about and I admit my assumptions about what he meant caused some extra snarky replies from my side. This did indeed escalate things even more. But I did say I was sorry and would call ahelp when I encounter a bug next time, just to get rid of this person which I felt was looking for all sorts of things to blame me on.

But I did want to make clear this person shouldn't start threatening people out of the blue (as he didn't even ask to change it that round before, he just complained about it and asked questions), it really is not okey. even if someone is being a fair bit snarky. 

It escalated even more, by me asking hem again to explain his reasoning behind the need for threatening me (the valves) or at least come up with rules that are broken next time.

He then responded by just quoting the "respect the staff" rule and issuing a ban.
Sadly he has some issues with the second part of that same rule: ". We do our best to be polite and courteous with you" (snark intended this time ;) )

What could I have done better: 
- I shouldn't have scolded  him/her about his ingame know how (no mater if I was right or wrong)
- I could have just asked him/her to explain instead of guessing what he/she meant.

What the staffmember could have done better:
- Not threatening people without clearly stating a request
- Just be clear of someone broke a rule or he/she just has a question
- Not assuming mall-intend from the get-go.


Core issue of the complaint:

- A moderator should be clear if something is a request (please change x) or an inquiry (why did you choose to do x?)
- A moderator should not, without stating a broken rule, start threatening players (I ban you if you don't do x), unless it's overly obvious
- Confronting people this issues from previous rounds that might have happened after said player left, should be met with caution (from both sides!)

Even though I was, admittedly, snarky, the overly agressive and escalating way this person reacted was byond any of my expectations. I didn't expect this person to react friendly to a snarky remark, but I also didn't expect someone to out of the blue threaten me to fix something that wasn't even clearly requested before hand.
In short, I this complaint is not about both sides being snarky, its about me feeling abused by totally unwarranted threats from a moderator that continued to harass me about previous rounds even after I complied.

Evidence/logs/etc: See attachment
Additional remarks: 
This issue also contained a Ban, even though i do not fully agree with that, I do not (fully) contest the ban as I was being snarky. Besides this issue is not resolved before the one day ban ends anyway. 

Closing statements:
It's not my goal to execute "payback" to this moderator for being "unjust" or "wrong" it's my goal for people to learn when it is okey to use threats, when its not okey to use threats and how to issue them. Also I hope someone learns from this how to and how not to reflect on previous rounds in the same ahelp conversation.

This conversation clearly went wrong from the get go and we both had a big part in that. But I would like moderating readers to think about a few things stated under "what * could have done better" above.
In short: be clear what you want (information or someone (un)doing something) and execute caution when issuing threats and reflecting on previous rounds.

log 2019-01-05 (9 28 pm).htm

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Hello again!

Seeing you're after professional and short, Ill make it so.
I wanted to ask you a simple question, and you explain your actions, with the exception of "No rule against it.", which gives me the impression that you're fishing for trouble. I choose to disregard it and give you a pass as your explanation was reasonable.

Then you slap me with "This is IC complaint really and should go to the forums with it." and you basically tell me to fuck off unless you had broken an actual rule.
You do not decide what is and what is not an IC or OOC issue. Staff decides this.

Now, I will admit fault to one thing, and that is not knowing that having both valves enabled is safe, as I was told eons ago that this would cause a delam eventually, and I have operated on this fact since then. I might be on the wrong on that one, but that does not give you the right to belittle and call me ignorant.

I only wanted answers to a few of my questions, but you chose to go the dismissive and snarky route.
I tried breaking it off twice and give you a pass, but you made it difficult. So this is the route I chose to curb your attitude.

Got the snipped set of logs for more neat viewing.

Spoiler

[2019-01-05 20:08:43.515] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Psst
[2019-01-05 20:08:57.875] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Sorry made a mistake with the Core SMES... Noticed fixed
[2019-01-05 20:09:07.345] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Why are you touching the coolant valves though?
[2019-01-05 20:09:44.521] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I am RP'ing an AI shutting down all power generation and distribution systems. No rule against it.
[2019-01-05 20:10:00.008] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : How does no power serve the crew?
[2019-01-05 20:10:44.241] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : The crew is being transfered and the AI is shutting down the station into a state that is similair to roundstart (kinda). Its a neat way of doing things.
[2019-01-05 20:11:22.928] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Right, thats fine then, but dont flick the emergency coolant valves unless there's an immediate need. It will cause a delamination way down the line.
[2019-01-05 20:11:31.107] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Anyhow, this is IC complaint really and should go to the forum if you have a problem with it. If you have a rule thats broken, please contact me.
[2019-01-05 20:11:48.599] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : lmao
[2019-01-05 20:12:09.680] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Ill give you 20 seconds to fix the switches before I ban you, how does that sound?
[2019-01-05 20:12:12.212] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Well you don't know what you are talking about. Soirry those valves would NEVER cause a delam, please read into enginering. No offence intended, but there isn't more or less cooling when enabling those valves.
[2019-01-05 20:12:46.354] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I am getting threatened by PratePresidenten. Please escalate to an admin.
[2019-01-05 20:12:58.249] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Dont be snarky with administration my dude.
[2019-01-05 20:13:17.287] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Oh yeah, I DO have an additional question for you.
[2019-01-05 20:13:34.616] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Why did you tamper with the tesla SMES last round?
[2019-01-05 20:14:07.494] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Tamper? I was upgrading it and wiring it as a backup SMES, but somehow it bugged out and didnt want to bother an admin and never got to it again.
[2019-01-05 20:14:37.731] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Well, your not wanting to bother an admin caused a stationwide powersurge for the rest of the round, blowing out half the APCs on station.
[2019-01-05 20:15:04.919] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : You are looking for things and I am not going to assist in your fishing expedition. You clealy lack the ingame knowhow of enginering to make any valid assesment if you call wiring a backup smes tampering and think hitting the coolant on phoron-phoron could cause a delamination
[2019-01-05 20:15:29.492] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : What power surge? You mean the bugged SMES tripped out? I couldnt have known
[2019-01-05 20:15:54.365] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Thing could bug out ofcourse and I am sorry if it did.
[2019-01-05 20:16:02.074] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : How does the grand know-all of engineering not know if you clip the grounding wire it will cause an volatile discharge?
[2019-01-05 20:16:05.595] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : But you come over as needlessly agressive to me.
[2019-01-05 20:16:28.164] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Ohh you mean earlier, sorry, I didnt get your statement
[2019-01-05 20:16:44.411] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Literally asked you a question, zero hostility. Just a question.
[2019-01-05 20:17:04.862] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I did not cut the wires, but I was indeed trying to figure out why it was tripping as it did. Maybe I caused it but I had been online for quite some minutes after and didnt get any complaint
[2019-01-05 20:17:32.640] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Noone really started looking until half the station was without APCs
[2019-01-05 20:17:42.089] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : But listen. Shit happens.
[2019-01-05 20:18:01.741] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : You are theatening me with abuse of power if I didnt comply. you didnt even ask to change the valves beforehand just complained about them, never stated a rule and started threatening me for not changing it.
[2019-01-05 20:18:37.231] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I NEVER cut the wires
[2019-01-05 20:19:00.031] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Cut, pulsed, often gives the same results. Just ahelp about it next time if you cant patch it yourself.
[2019-01-05 20:19:04.746] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I did look if I could get it to discharge by using a multimeter one time, no wires where cut
[2019-01-05 20:19:27.777] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I will. Just don't threaten me next time. Serieusly.
[2019-01-05 20:19:57.624] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : I wont if you dont snark, deal?
[2019-01-05 20:20:56.773] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : No deal. You still need to explain how the emergency valves cause delams on phoron-phoron. I am snarky when your ignorant and I am free to do so. If you see a rule broken just say so, but don't start threatening me.
[2019-01-05 20:21:29.030] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I don't need nor want (long) chats with moderators. Just state the rule that is broken and what is needed to fix it next time.
[2019-01-05 20:21:58.853] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : next time you start threatening me out of the blue with bans, I wil simply not respond.
[2019-01-05 20:22:14.872] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Here, one for you. A rule clearly stated.
[2019-01-05 20:22:22.352] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : If you are contacted by an admin, you are expected to reply, and communicate clearly and in good will. Failure to reply or disrespect towards admins may be grounds for a ban. We do our best to be polite and courteous with you, and thus expect you to do the same with us.
[2019-01-05 20:22:33.410] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : So, enjoy your dayban.
[2019-01-05 20:22:40.783] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I am in good will to solve thing
[2019-01-05 20:22:49.933] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I did and do still reply

 

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11 hours ago, Pratepresidenten said:

Seeing you're after professional and short, Ill make it so.

  Reveal hidden contents

[2019-01-05 20:08:43.515] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Psst
[2019-01-05 20:08:57.875] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Sorry made a mistake with the Core SMES... Noticed fixed
[2019-01-05 20:09:07.345] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Why are you touching the coolant valves though?
[2019-01-05 20:09:44.521] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I am RP'ing an AI shutting down all power generation and distribution systems. No rule against it.
[2019-01-05 20:10:00.008] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : How does no power serve the crew?
[2019-01-05 20:10:44.241] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : The crew is being transfered and the AI is shutting down the station into a state that is similair to roundstart (kinda). Its a neat way of doing things.
[2019-01-05 20:11:22.928] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Right, thats fine then, but dont flick the emergency coolant valves unless there's an immediate need. It will cause a delamination way down the line.
[2019-01-05 20:11:31.107] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Anyhow, this is IC complaint really and should go to the forum if you have a problem with it. If you have a rule thats broken, please contact me.
[2019-01-05 20:11:48.599] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : lmao
[2019-01-05 20:12:09.680] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Ill give you 20 seconds to fix the switches before I ban you, how does that sound?
[2019-01-05 20:12:12.212] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Well you don't know what you are talking about. Soirry those valves would NEVER cause a delam, please read into enginering. No offence intended, but there isn't more or less cooling when enabling those valves.
[2019-01-05 20:12:46.354] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I am getting threatened by PratePresidenten. Please escalate to an admin.
[2019-01-05 20:12:58.249] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Dont be snarky with administration my dude.
[2019-01-05 20:13:17.287] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Oh yeah, I DO have an additional question for you.
[2019-01-05 20:13:34.616] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Why did you tamper with the tesla SMES last round?
[2019-01-05 20:14:07.494] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Tamper? I was upgrading it and wiring it as a backup SMES, but somehow it bugged out and didnt want to bother an admin and never got to it again.
[2019-01-05 20:14:37.731] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Well, your not wanting to bother an admin caused a stationwide powersurge for the rest of the round, blowing out half the APCs on station.
[2019-01-05 20:15:04.919] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : You are looking for things and I am not going to assist in your fishing expedition. You clealy lack the ingame knowhow of enginering to make any valid assesment if you call wiring a backup smes tampering and think hitting the coolant on phoron-phoron could cause a delamination
[2019-01-05 20:15:29.492] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : What power surge? You mean the bugged SMES tripped out? I couldnt have known
[2019-01-05 20:15:54.365] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Thing could bug out ofcourse and I am sorry if it did.
[2019-01-05 20:16:02.074] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : How does the grand know-all of engineering not know if you clip the grounding wire it will cause an volatile discharge?
[2019-01-05 20:16:05.595] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : But you come over as needlessly agressive to me.
[2019-01-05 20:16:28.164] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : Ohh you mean earlier, sorry, I didnt get your statement
[2019-01-05 20:16:44.411] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Literally asked you a question, zero hostility. Just a question.
[2019-01-05 20:17:04.862] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I did not cut the wires, but I was indeed trying to figure out why it was tripping as it did. Maybe I caused it but I had been online for quite some minutes after and didnt get any complaint
[2019-01-05 20:17:32.640] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Noone really started looking until half the station was without APCs
[2019-01-05 20:17:42.089] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : But listen. Shit happens.
[2019-01-05 20:18:01.741] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : You are theatening me with abuse of power if I didnt comply. you didnt even ask to change the valves beforehand just complained about them, never stated a rule and started threatening me for not changing it.
[2019-01-05 20:18:37.231] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I NEVER cut the wires
[2019-01-05 20:19:00.031] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Cut, pulsed, often gives the same results. Just ahelp about it next time if you cant patch it yourself.
[2019-01-05 20:19:04.746] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I did look if I could get it to discharge by using a multimeter one time, no wires where cut
[2019-01-05 20:19:27.777] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I will. Just don't threaten me next time. Serieusly.
[2019-01-05 20:19:57.624] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : I wont if you dont snark, deal?
[2019-01-05 20:20:56.773] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : No deal. You still need to explain how the emergency valves cause delams on phoron-phoron. I am snarky when your ignorant and I am free to do so. If you see a rule broken just say so, but don't start threatening me.
[2019-01-05 20:21:29.030] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I don't need nor want (long) chats with moderators. Just state the rule that is broken and what is needed to fix it next time.
[2019-01-05 20:21:58.853] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : next time you start threatening me out of the blue with bans, I wil simply not respond.
[2019-01-05 20:22:14.872] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : Here, one for you. A rule clearly stated.
[2019-01-05 20:22:22.352] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : If you are contacted by an admin, you are expected to reply, and communicate clearly and in good will. Failure to reply or disrespect towards admins may be grounds for a ban. We do our best to be polite and courteous with you, and thus expect you to do the same with us.
[2019-01-05 20:22:33.410] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Pratepresidenten/ ->Andrean2017/ : So, enjoy your dayban.
[2019-01-05 20:22:40.783] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I am in good will to solve thing
[2019-01-05 20:22:49.933] bYa-cNyx ADMIN: PM: Andrean2017/ ->Pratepresidenten/ : I did and do still reply

 

Firstoff:
I think that one scentence is clearly enough for everyone that the snark is, still, comming from both sides.

The valve issue:
Well, as you read my complaint (which I quite doubt) it's not really relevant if you where wrong on those valves or not.  Thanks for your apologie ofcourse, it's not really part of the complaint.

The simple question:
I'm forced by those rules to respond to questions, that is already far and byond something I would be personally willing to do, because I find it a gross violation of human rights not to incriminate one self. I'm inclined to say: if you cant come up with a breach without asking questions: Don't ask them.  Sadly enough, I have to comply with the rules and thus have to respond to you. Still I would like to know what breach I am suspected of. As I stated in my complaint, I try to very carefully try to abide by those rules now in regards to AI playstyle and I do take offence in sugestions of being in breach of one.

Anyway, I find it relatively minor to tell a moderator I don't think anything I did has a rule against it. It has nothing to do with being "Fishing for trouble", speaking of fishing you seemed a lot on a fishing expedition in my opinion in this whole mater, that also did indeed influence my snark a lot.
But still, this complaint is not about your/my general choice of words, or the snark. We both did snark a lot and if two people fight there are two wrongs. Complaints, even this one, should not be about who was the culprid but should be about big escalations that are (in the eye of the one complaining) truely unacceptable

Fuckoff statement:
Well it would be nice if you would've "fucked off" indeed, but thats not my call, thats my OPINION. I can have an OPINION in how maters should be solved and I can tell you that. I don't have to agree with you I have to comply why you tell me (not) to do something and I have to answer your questions. I am sorry if I formulated it like it's my call to decide that, I think it's quite clear to everyone that it ain't my call and what I wrote was my opinion.
Again this is quite a minor thing and not really a big part of my complaint, As I stated we both where snarky against each other and it's not worth the trouble of fighting over who was snarking worse.


Breaking it off twice
I doubt your story about trying to breaking it off, I tried twice and got a new rant or complaint from you in return. Including one you fished from another round, which I didnt even know about. Thats not the behavoir of someone who tries to break things off, thats the behavoir of someone thats "trying to get you". Ofcourse I can be wrong and I cant look into your head what you where thinking, but I don't read a real act of trying to descalate and breaking it off.

Dismissive and snarky

You right that it's not okey to be snarky to eachother. However, I can be as dismissive as I want, I don't have to agree with you I need to do what you order me to do. It's something that has annoyed me for some time, You are not opinion police and I can fully dismiss everything you say as invalid while still being willing to follow clear requests you make. 
Simply put: If a police officer says you should remove a car because of rule X, you can tell him he needs to get reeducated and that it's bullshit, but still need to remove the car. He, just as you, is not the one to order you to change your opinion. You want to ask questions, then you sometimes get to hear that people think you are talking BS. 

TL:DR We both shouldn't have been that snarky, but I don't need to be agreeable, I will never voice any form of agreement I do not stand behind, I will instead always dispute what you or any other person is telling me if I don't agree with them. Thats "being dismissive" and that's fine. As long as it ain't too snarky, but it's thin line between disagreeing and being snarky. We both went over that one, but again thats not what this complaint is truely about.



The real complaint
It doesn't look like you understand the complaint, or just didn't really read it. The complaint is mainly foccussed around your choice of threatening a player out of the blue (either because he wasn't nice enough to you or you where a dick*, that doesn't mater really), something you still don't want to take any responsibility for.
I admitted I should/could be less snarky and I expect same could be said for you, but this complaint isn't about two parties snarking to eachother, things hapen.

But the way you escalated it by threatening me, seemingly out of anger and/or out of the blue, and the way you asked the second question as if I knowingly "tampered" with something. I, in my opinion, not moderator worthy. You keep trying to ignore that that was wrong (well you ignore it completely) and escalated things big-time.

In short
This complaint isn't about us being snarky, it's about two things you said that where, in my opinion, far and byond what we should accept from a moderator.
You also did not respond to this essence of the complaint.

I didn't try and cherry pick these things just because those suit my agenda, I picked those because I don't feel complaints should be about "two people being snarkt", thats also why I didn't file a complaint about your ban, as I wrote I undestand what you based it on although I find the way you did it not acceptable, its not complaint worthy. its basically part of "two people being snarky" ;) 

Footnote
* I did not call you a dick, I tried to explain two possible interprentation one could have at this moment.

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After taking in consideration the posts here and checking the logs, we have reached the following conclusion:

That moderation does include investigating and questioning people about what they are doing, and trying to tell them to stop or being snark about it is not helpful. We also agree that asking for you to stop doing something/or do in the case in question was fine, because the moderator was taking in consideration your past notes and the situation.

However, we are also recommending that @Pratepresidenten to be more clear in the future in the requests or questions to the players in ahelps.

No other action will be take as result of this complaint, I will leave it unlocked for 24 hours in case of anyone wanting to add something else.

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