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UnknownMurder

BurgerBB Negligence of Orders as Synthetic - 12/20/2019

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BYOND Key: UnknownMurder

Game ID: b4N-a07t

Player Byond Key/Character name: BurgerBB / F.L.A.W.E.D.

Staff involved: Garn, SonicGotNuked (also as E.Y.E. and DOOM in-game)

Reason for complaint: I'll just be very direct and stay the whole problem with his synthetic character which is SLAVED to the Malfunctioning AI: 

  • Did not obey several direct orders:
    • Cutting wires of the output SMES - was told to go cut the wires again. Did not and decided to do something else that I had not ordered him to do so.
    • Freed crew members to crew transfer vessel and fixing every of my consequences of my action and effort to prevent them from escaping. 
  • Calling my character and actions outright stupid and assumed actions
    • FLAWED built doors at the Escape Pod. I communicated and he fully well knew that my current target at the end of the shift were: Vance Khan and Head of Security. 
    • On OOC: Dictated   BurgerBB: They constantly tried to reset me for refusing to murder the crew. while in RP... image.thumb.png.e8463616d465748cfae2f1d4fd43f500.png
    • Intended to stall time for his own personal agenda interfering with my RP - "Release the Telsa, Sabotage the Supermatter, and Murder the crew 4 no rasin" are a HUGE lie.
      • Note: I have not ordered any synthetics to "KILL THEM ALL!" but I tried my best to only to encourage FLAWED and E.Y.E to instead try to convert organics to machines and do their best to keep them from escaping without guns a blazing.
        • DOOM had their hands tied trying to fight Commander and Security Department. 
        • My IPCs (Katana Silver, Cheshire, Bling-35)  had their hands tied trying to prevent them from escaping with Cheshire only drugging one wounded security member under my command. Also, Katana Silver and Cheshire under my orders attempted to push Head of Security down elevator shaft. 

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation? Yes, Garn allowed the cutting wire of both engines (Telsa and SM). Sonic wanted to handle the staff pm but was unable to due to his involvement in RP.

Approximate Date/Time: 1:00 PM CST - 3:00 PM CST.

Edited by UnknownMurder
better pic

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Ok, I was involved because I was the second borg and I couldn't handle this because it wouldn't be fair for neither players. Let's get that out of the way. I'll kindly post my perspective as a player.

 

I was E.Y.E, later DOOM when I reset my own name to roll combat. While I wasn't too much knowledgeable about what happened, I did witness the AI being a little over the top and telling me to shoot up security and me tilting my head a little. Now, the AI did tell everyone to leave the dock before venting it, as my opinion. FLAWED at the end of it all was disobeying orders as I personally saw him close the venting dock. I'll be mirroring this post. 

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15 minutes ago, sonicgotnuked said:

I did witness the AI being a little over the top and telling me to shoot up security and me tilting my head a little. 

Cheshire reported that our cover is blown (aka pull the plug on AI) as you rolled to Medical Bay which as a coincidence. Cheshire also reported you and Security were about to do gunslinger.

This was my authorization for you to shoot (or/and shoot back) security members. 

@The Stryker can confirm this.

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Here are the orders I followed:

- Cut the Tesla: I did this. I cut the output wire to the tesla so that it generates power, but does not distribute this. The wire I cut was at 51, 173, on the sublevel.

- Sabotage the Supermatter: I did this. I pulsed a specific wire on the SMES to cause it to randomly detonate APCs on the station (0 explosion range). I ended up fixing this later in the round when I noticed that the red dock was also destroyed because of this, and did not want to create a situation that annoyed the crew and interfered with my gimmick of creating my airlock maze that players had to get through.

- Prevent them from leaving. I partially followed this as I created a million airlocks in departures to lighten the mood and also somewhat follow this. You actually used this because I noticed that several doors and airlocks were bolted and players reported that some were shocked. The first time you gave me this order, I was in a position not to do so because I was on another level, trying to find the fallen borg near the blue dock. I thought I saw their light, but it was just the light from security. I could not go back up because the jetpack doesn't work that way for some reason.

Here are the orders I did not follow:

- Kill xyz: I saw no justification for this. I saw 0 motivation to do this. People, especially engineers, were absolutely upset that all this was happening in looc to the point where some cryo'd. Many people were unhappy about the round, which is why I didn't want to make it worse for people.

 

The reason why I did not follow the kill orders:

- I did not see any roleplay from you towards the crew.

- You had no gimmick or reason or cause or any motivation.

- You stealth malf'd for an hour and thirty minutes.

- I did not feel comfortable murdering the crew given that I had absolutely no motive to do so other than "The AI told me so."

- I was not comfortable with murderboning with 0 admins online.

- I was not comfortable without permission from an admin.

- You were actively hostile towards me, constantly giving me resets without my permission while I was doing things to progress the round. At one point you reset me in a location where I could not unstick myself as a non-engineer without any warning or my permission. You also constantly reset me while I was placing a borg converting machine. I told you to stop resetting me, and to give me 60 seconds, but you kept resetting me.

image.png.0963337382f4030a2ef876b215f70f74.png

About the red dock venting:

I intentionally closed the red dock after it was done venting not to spite the AI, but as a 1000 IQ move that ended up saving me and another borg in the end. I let a little air back inside the red dock as insurance, and that insurance paid off. I do not know the security member, but because of the space wind of me vending the red dock again, I managed to knock down a security officer and cause them to flee, and also secured an ion rifle in the process.

 

 

 

 

 

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What is this talk of "reseting"? I do not understand that part.

52 minutes ago, BurgerBB said:

Here are the orders I did not follow:

- Kill xyz: I saw no justification for this. I saw 0 motivation to do this. People, especially engineers, were absolutely upset that all this was happening in looc to the point where some cryo'd. Many people were unhappy about the round, which is why I didn't want to make it worse for people.

I suppose i am empathetic not wanting to break rules in your mind if no staff are online. 

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6 hours ago, Garnascus said:

What is this talk of "reseting"? I do not understand that part.

One of the malf abilities is to reset borg modules in absence of the special robotics chip that does it.  Sorry, I know I'm not involved but specifically answering your question not the thread topic itself.  What he is saying is that the AI constantly used the reset ability on him, making him unable to perform timed actions such as constructing a converter.

Edited by Kaed

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This round was super sucky and frustrating. The borgs - both Sonic and Burger - were about all that kept it vaguely enjoyable during standard stealth malf garbage. I think punishing someone for trying to make the round less less enjoyable is extremely backwards. 

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9 hours ago, Garnascus said:

What is this talk of "reseting"? I do not understand that part.

I suppose i am empathetic not wanting to break rules in your mind if no staff are online. 

MALFs can manually reset borgs at their whim if they unlock a certain ability. It forces the cyborg to unset their module and pick a new one, which is problematic when you're actually trying to do something.

I also recall that I received a note as a cyborg for releasing gold slime xenobio entities in departures because it was a little too excessive to have at departures. This was kept in mind as well as the major warning I received from you when I detonated an APC in departures, killing several people, with escalation of this level.

Edited by BurgerBB

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10 hours ago, BurgerBB said:

Here are the orders I followed:

- Cut the Tesla: I did this. I cut the output wire to the tesla so that it generates power, but does not distribute this. The wire I cut was at 51, 173, on the sublevel.

- Sabotage the Supermatter: I did this. I pulsed a specific wire on the SMES to cause it to randomly detonate APCs on the station (0 explosion range). I ended up fixing this later in the round when I noticed that the red dock was also destroyed because of this, and did not want to create a situation that annoyed the crew and interfered with my gimmick of creating my airlock maze that players had to get through.

- Prevent them from leaving. I partially followed this as I created a million airlocks in departures to lighten the mood and also somewhat follow this. You actually used this because I noticed that several doors and airlocks were bolted and players reported that some were shocked. The first time you gave me this order, I was in a position not to do so because I was on another level, trying to find the fallen borg near the blue dock. I thought I saw their light, but it was just the light from security. I could not go back up because the jetpack doesn't work that way for some reason.

Here are the orders I did not follow:

- Kill xyz: I saw no justification for this. I saw 0 motivation to do this. People, especially engineers, were absolutely upset that all this was happening in looc to the point where some cryo'd. Many people were unhappy about the round, which is why I didn't want to make it worse for people.

 

The reason why I did not follow the kill orders:

- I did not see any roleplay from you towards the crew.

- You had no gimmick or reason or cause or any motivation.

- You stealth malf'd for an hour and thirty minutes.

- I did not feel comfortable murdering the crew given that I had absolutely no motive to do so other than "The AI told me so."

- I was not comfortable with murderboning with 0 admins online.

- I was not comfortable without permission from an admin.

- You were actively hostile towards me, constantly giving me resets without my permission while I was doing things to progress the round. At one point you reset me in a location where I could not unstick myself as a non-engineer without any warning or my permission. You also constantly reset me while I was placing a borg converting machine. I told you to stop resetting me, and to give me 60 seconds, but you kept resetting me.

image.png.0963337382f4030a2ef876b215f70f74.png

About the red dock venting:

I intentionally closed the red dock after it was done venting not to spite the AI, but as a 1000 IQ move that ended up saving me and another borg in the end. I let a little air back inside the red dock as insurance, and that insurance paid off. I do not know the security member, but because of the space wind of me vending the red dock again, I managed to knock down a security officer and cause them to flee, and also secured an ion rifle in the process.

 

 

 

 

 

I was the Security member. It was a galaxy-brain move for that little bit of air, I totally left my magboots off in my combat suit and got knocked over by atmos. I'd just emptied an Ion rifle into you and DOOM and was falling back to recharge it.

Honestly, I love you UM but this was a shitty malf round. You stealthmalf'd for the vast majority of the round until you suddenly said "No one can leave." and blew up the docks, depressurizing the majority of the surface level. This was not a fun round to play.

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I just want everyone to think about this: If I followed the MALF's orders, would I have gotten a player complaint? Consider this given how everyone is now officially sick of the playstyle that was recommended to me and in nearly every instance this happens, an administrator is involved.

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1 hour ago, BurgerBB said:

I just want everyone to think about this: If I followed the MALF's orders, would I have gotten a player complaint?

Did you ahelp at all concerning the malf's orders? Ahelps are sent to discord as i am sure you are aware. 

@UnknownMurder What is your response to the charge of resetting burger's borg a lot? Why did you do this?

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1 hour ago, Garnascus said:

Did you ahelp at all concerning the malf's orders? Ahelps are sent to discord as i am sure you are aware. 

@UnknownMurder What is your response to the charge of resetting burger's borg a lot? Why did you do this?

Yes, I ahelped. Speak with @sonicgotnuked about it as he said no admins could deal with it at the time and he recommended that I make a complaint.

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1 hour ago, BurgerBB said:

Yes, I ahelped. Speak with @sonicgotnuked about it as he said no admins could deal with it at the time and he recommended that I make a complaint.

I am being told you did not ahelp until later. When you where already going against the malf's orders for some time. 

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48 minutes ago, Garnascus said:

I am being told you did not ahelp until later. When you where already going against the malf's orders for some time. 

Let's start off by cutting the bullshit here. I did not go against the orders of the MALF until they ordered us to kill people and I'm pretty fucking certain I ahelped the AI long before that. I recall ahelping over either them ordering me to cut the tesla or supermatter because it was dumb for me to do that because:

 

1. Cyborgs and AI literally rely on power. I can't charge if there is no power.

2. There were only 2 engineers this shift and it would be absolutely unfair to them and make their round super miserable.

3. I did not believe there was any escalation or reason for me to do this OOCly and ICly.

 

But I did it anyways. Check the logs for me tampering the power wires. Check the logs of me tampering the SMES. Check the logs of me ahelping early but it taking like 10-20 minutes for an admin to reply that they won't be able to handle it. Do not accuse me of doing something with only hearsay.

Edited by BurgerBB

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I apologize for not immediate response. I am a busy person in real life the specific round last night was the only time that I was able to play for the week. I'll will go into details of each points made by BurgerBB. It is obvious that BurgerBB and I are upset at each other because of his assumptions and presumably my assumption as well come into clash.

20 hours ago, BurgerBB said:

Here are the orders I followed:

- Cut the Tesla: I did this. I cut the output wire to the tesla so that it generates power, but does not distribute this. The wire I cut was at 51, 173, on the sublevel.

- Sabotage the Supermatter: I did this. I pulsed a specific wire on the SMES to cause it to randomly detonate APCs on the station (0 explosion range). I ended up fixing this later in the round when I noticed that the red dock was also destroyed because of this, and did not want to create a situation that annoyed the crew and interfered with my gimmick of creating my airlock maze that players had to get through.

- Prevent them from leaving. I partially followed this as I created a million airlocks in departures to lighten the mood and also somewhat follow this. You actually used this because I noticed that several doors and airlocks were bolted and players reported that some were shocked. The first time you gave me this order, I was in a position not to do so because I was on another level, trying to find the fallen borg near the blue dock. I thought I saw their light, but it was just the light from security. I could not go back up because the jetpack doesn't work that way for some reason.

Cut the Telsa: Cutting the telsa's power output. You did cut it but the power was still distributed by the engineer who wired it and left. 

Sabotage the Supermatter: I have never told you to go sabotage the supermatter but only the output power. I have only instructed you to sabotage the output and keep to it cut.

Secondary Gimmick: "I ended up fixing this later in the round when I noticed that the red dock was also destroyed because of this, and did not want to create a situation that annoyed the crew and interfered with my gimmick of creating my airlock maze that players had to get through." That is not your decision to make. Your actions not only have limited the Artificial Intelligence's ability to see and interact with machines but sets a dangerous precedent in the later future. If I recall, you have had a bad record about this somewhere on the forums. 

Prevent them from leaving: Still a gimmick even if it is bad that is overused and can be used at any given scenario. Never ever I ever said to "kill them all", this is more of a shitty gimmick. 

20 hours ago, BurgerBB said:

Here are the orders I did not follow:

- Kill xyz: I saw no justification for this. I saw 0 motivation to do this. People, especially engineers, were absolutely upset that all this was happening in looc to the point where some cryo'd. Many people were unhappy about the round, which is why I didn't want to make it worse for people.

Kill xyz (aka specific targets [Security ( mainly Head of Security ) ]:  Yes. I did order you to kill specific targets. I have already have justification to why specific targets are to be eliminated due to Cheshire's PDA message reporting me of Security's movements and clear and danger to synthetic unit DOOM.

People, especially engineers, were absolutely upset that all this was happening in looc to the point where some cryo'd: That is their decision, they can cryo any given moment. There's no punishment ofr anyone cryoing nor does it any effect on the perpetrator.

Many people were unhappy about the round, which is why I didn't want to make it worse for people: Moral/emotional attack is irrelevant to the player complaint. This is about you, not me. 

20 hours ago, BurgerBB said:

The reason why I did not follow the kill orders:

- I did not see any roleplay from you towards the crew.

- You had no gimmick or reason or cause or any motivation.

- You stealth malf'd for an hour and thirty minutes.

- I did not feel comfortable murdering the crew given that I had absolutely no motive to do so other than "The AI told me so."

- I was not comfortable with murderboning with 0 admins online.

- I was not comfortable without permission from an admin.

- You were actively hostile towards me, constantly giving me resets without my permission while I was doing things to progress the round. At one point you reset me in a location where I could not unstick myself as a non-engineer without any warning or my permission. You also constantly reset me while I was placing a borg converting machine. I told you to stop resetting me, and to give me 60 seconds, but you kept resetting me.

I did not see any roleplay from you towards the crew: You late joined about an hour. You missed most of my RP interactions with the crew and in person via holograms. I was already hostile to the Commander, harassed a medical doctor, eavesdropped and gave Officer Wiles an indicator I was listening to their conversations. Bugged a scientist. I repetitively informed Commander that I would not obey their orders regarding "senpai". Played with the power alarms for a while as engineer takes a look and should have found out that it was me. 

You had no gimmick or reason or cause or any motivation: I've had two gimmick approaches, these gimmick approaches did not appear to work or indicators were ignored/overlooked.

You stealth malf'd for an hour and thirty minutes: See "I did not see any roleplay from you towards the crew" answer. 

I was not comfortable with murderboning with 0 admins online: Never ever I have ever told you to "KILL THEM ALL!" in direct to the crews but to respond to possible gunning down Security. DOOM was already doing so and you would not assist DOOM and as a result, DOOM was eliminated by the Security Team.

I was not comfortable without permission from an admin: This is a dangerous precedent to set in stone for future related incidents like this and gives them the ability to ignore laws. Not to mention,  thanks for confessing to metagame or let alone letting OOC information interfere with IC decisions.

You were actively hostile towards me, constantly giving me resets without my permission while I was doing things to progress the round: Permissions? Cyborgs that are slaved to Master AI and Master AI requires permission from their slaves? That rubs me in the wrong direction.

You also constantly reset me while I was placing a borg converting machine. I told you to stop resetting me, and to give me 60 seconds, but you kept resetting me: You were told to do this a while ago but you did not because you were repairing the engine. You also avoided this order that I have instructed you to do so during the commence of synthetic takeover. 

 

20 hours ago, BurgerBB said:

About the red dock venting:

I intentionally closed the red dock after it was done venting not to spite the AI, but as a 1000 IQ move that ended up saving me and another borg in the end. I let a little air back inside the red dock as insurance, and that insurance paid off. I do not know the security member, but because of the space wind of me vending the red dock again, I managed to knock down a security officer and cause them to flee, and also secured an ion rifle in the process

I intentionally closed the red dock after it was done venting not to spite the AI: You have already spited me. You've undo every actions and effort as I've done to the red dock. It was already obvious in middle of the round, you showed me your path of unwillingly obey a direct order.

I do not know the security member, but because of the space wind of me vending the red dock again, I managed to knock down a security officer and cause them to flee, and also secured an ion rifle in the process: You were already immune to ion rifle thanks to my orders to have E.Y.E have you upgraded. 

At the end of the round: Because of your actions that the crew members were already fleeing, I wanted you to stop building the construction of assimilation machine and change to CRISIS. However, you chose not to do so because you have assumed I would order you to "kill them all". To answer @Garnascus's question, I was intentionally hindering BurgerBB from making the machine and change module to crisis module as DOOM was eliminated by Security Team. As a construction module, FLAWED is unable to defend or protect itself in Security's sight.  My intentional was to have FLAWED (the only cyborg left) run and gun out of the Departures as it has already proven itself to be useless in Departures with fleeing crew members. FLAWED was incapable of following orders from the beginning, this was done with out of little spite and to coax FLAWED into becoming a crisis module. 

2 hours ago, BurgerBB said:

1. Cyborgs and AI literally rely on power. I can't charge if there is no power.

That would be the consequences of my oversight, not yours. As a malfunctioning Artificial Intelligence, I will sudo this. 

2 hours ago, BurgerBB said:

2. There were only 2 engineers this shift and it would be absolutely unfair to them and make their round super miserable.

Then that means more work for engineers. They can and already told the command that they can't keep up and detect problems with the power alarms. They practically didn't know what to do or/and most likely told the Commander that it was the work of my actions (should have found out that it was me, I made it super obvious for them). 

2 hours ago, BurgerBB said:

3. I did not believe there was any escalation or reason for me to do this OOCly and ICly.

OOC Escalation: You say that... And yet you believe... Trashtalk the player of the Artificial Intelligence was the right escalation and rub dirt on them for everyone else to see then file a ban request on the player of Artificial Intelligence? You know that you are already being watched for this and have not improved your OOC attitude. You still have that general toxic behavior and it is leaking into OOC and this forum (particularly the ban request and in this staff complaint). 

IC Escalation: I saw escalation fit, you assumed there were no escalation. I see a bigger picture and receive more information than you do. I already check once a while with SonicGotNuked in AOOC to make sure the actions that I am doing is on the level of "okayness".

Message to BurgerBB: You were adminhelped about 2-3 times in this particular round, SonicGotNuked respond to my 2-3 adminhelps but could not get involved. I still continued in hope of getting a staff from discord. As you know, SonicGotNuked was already involved and will deliver unfair justice to you.

I ask of the person taking this player complaint to consider the source and judge accordingly. Fiat justitia ruat caelum | "Let justice be done though heavens may fall."

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I don't even know where to start with this. You're saying things like I'm a slave to you and I should follow your desires regardless if I feel comfortable doing it as a player especially when I'm on very thin ice here and don't want to get banned for doing sudden killing without escalation. You're shifting the goalposts by saying I didn't follow orders at first, but when I told you I followed orders, you said that it didn't matter because it didn't have the desired effect. You're also shifting the goalposts about that red dock venting incident by saying "oh your move didn't matter because you had emp protection anyways" when I didn't even know how strong EMP protection is. You're saying that it's okay to reset me 10 times in a row when I'm trying to do something, like get unstuck when I need construction module to get unstuck, despite me asking you to please stop and give me more time. You're saying it's okay to ignore my concerns about unable to recharge as a cyborg because there is no power to the station because... I don't really understand that explanation.

image.thumb.png.35bf8a2674c6162b625fb938c05ea7e5.png

I never asked to be an antag. I tried my absolute best to provide an entertaining experience to the round. From what people have told me in this thread and on discord, I did. I tried following the rules to the best of my ability and I tried to be chill. Last time I played traitor borg, I was noted for releasing gold slime cores in departures with minimal escalation. That entire incident was kept in the back of my mind. You think that my entire purpose here was to spite you or something, but it wasn't. Not to sound edgy or any sort of badass, but if I wanted to seriously hinder you, I would've sabotaged your own SMES and by god there were times where I wanted to, but didn't.

 

I want you to answer two questions:

1. What sort of result are you hoping from this player complaint?

2. In your opinion, do you believe that me as a cyborg that round was worse than no cyborg? If I was worse than no cyborg, please explain why.

Edited by BurgerBB

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And just to be entirely clear I genuinely thought you wanted me to sabotage the supermatter and the tesla. You told me, or what I interpreted as, is that you wanted me to cut power TO the supermatter and the tesla, not FROM it. It wasn't until further clarification that you wanted me to cut power FROM it.

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On 21/12/2019 at 02:42, BurgerBB said:

I don't even know where to start with this. You're saying things like I'm a slave to you and I should follow your desires regardless if I feel comfortable doing it as a player especially when I'm on very thin ice here and don't want to get banned for doing sudden killing without escalation {and other trailing words with goalposts}

This sets a dangerous precedent for future incidents related to this and can be said by anybody to get off the hook for not wanting to listen. I already have my eyes on a person exhibiting a similar behavior and will do what I can to avoid repeating similar scenario. I had a lack of knowledge for your lack of knowledge of EMP shielding I suppose I should have informed E.Y.E. to inform you or inform you myself but you did not inform me so I expected you already to know it. Like in college/school, if you do not ask for clarification or questions relating to ability, I would expect you to already know what it does. I apologize for putting you on the spot to move fast and active, I suppose I was in the heat that moment; I should have asked E.Y.E. before his termination to do the job that you were incapable of doing. 

On 21/12/2019 at 02:42, BurgerBB said:

I never asked to be an antag. I tried my absolute best to provide an entertaining experience to the round.

A simple answer to the problem. Put yourself in the storage like the aforementioned player have already done so. I would not be disgruntled or frown heavily on you. There are people who dislikes being antag and I respect that wholely. 

 

On 21/12/2019 at 02:42, BurgerBB said:

1. What sort of result are you hoping from this player complaint?

Resolve the adminhelps appropriately that I've sent out in-game and an admin doing something about your track record of toxic behavior in OOC. 

On 21/12/2019 at 02:42, BurgerBB said:

2. In your opinion, do you believe that me as a cyborg that round was worse than no cyborg? If I was worse than no cyborg, please explain why.

Everything leading up to the second adminhelp, I have watched your existence as a cyborg have gone impacting negatively on my gimmick agenda but I would be selfish and a dick to say that you are worse than no cyborg since you have already made commendable actions (touching SMES before second incident). I was trying to think up ideas to re-assign you to different tasks. In the end, I tried to be positive (I even admitted to SonicGotNuked that I would forgive your cyborg in first adminhelp) at the third and last adminhelp. I was absolutely clueless of what your agenda was until I've found out your behavior in defiance toward to me. I have answered your question in a positive way and I hope you take it as such.

See next page for Engines.


image.png.1c820809e93252dc29c6e3c119b27ab7.pngimage.thumb.png.49acd00074ffbe13b8b823343cda8783.png

These yellow spots are what I wanted you to disconnect from. I wanted you to disconnect the SMES' output to the station. You originally assumed I wanted you to cut the SMES to the Supermatter or Telsa.

Note: I have already adminhelped to Garn and made sure that Garn knows that I am never intending on blowing the Supermatter or releasing the Telsa. In a way, I did ask for permission from the Headmin and you insisted feeling uncomfortable without permission, you also refused to disconnect them again and you explained your answer in which I feel against and is rule-breaking to defy the Master Malfunctioning Artificial Intelligence. Once again, to set this dangerous precedent for the future can create disorder and gives the players able to restrict their master for instance a thrall refusing to follow the vampire because it "may be rulebreaking" or "i saw no justification and therefore I refuse (while vampire saw a whole bigger picture and has a reason to justify but doesn't want to sit and explain everything at a dangerous time)". 

 


 

Who is taking this player complaint again?

Edited by UnknownMurder
3rd page

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Let's recap.

You're saying I'm toxic in OOC because I said that you wanted me to sabotage the supermatter and tesla, and that you reset me several times. I didn't namecall. I didn't curse. I didn't type in all caps. I didn't call you stupid, an asshole, or anything of that matter. I calmly and plainly said that you wanted me to sabotage the SM and the Tesla. I was not trying to shit on you, provoke you, get you upset, get you angry or absolutely anything., but rather give an excuse as to why there were power issues and why people saw me constantly changing modules and why I couldn't give the players the best round.

You're claiming I didn't follow orders, yet I'm telling you otherwise that I did. I sabotaged the power for both the tesla and the supermatter. I actually tried converting the HoS and then almost killed him on the shuttle. I say these things but you shift the goal posts saying that my attempts didn't matter. I point out you're shifting the goalposts and you dismiss that as nothing worth discussing. You're claiming that you got permission from Garn to fuck up the power yet you somehow think that I knew this.

You're here claiming that I was detrimental to your gimmick but I tried looking for the combat borg that fell but you're saying that's bad because I didn't murderbone the HoS instead. You're claiming that it breaks RP because I didn't follow your orders IC despite me being OOCly extremely reluctant escalating from 0 to 100. You're claiming that this is an example of my toxicity despite the fact that I showed serious restraint on crippling the crew and making it unfair while you were following a checklist of "100 ways to make the crew suffer while you're malf" which made the crew absolutely miserable to the point where they praised me for doing a shitty door maze gimmick and making bad jokes over radio.

Your calling me toxic for all of this and, on top of this, bringing up "my record of OOC toxicity" despite me being back here for 4 months with only 1 incident that didn't warrant a permaban. You're calling me toxic despite you flipping shit IC about me not following your orders to your own expectations despite no expectations set. You're calling me toxic when you're disregarding the player behind the character, telling me that I'm your slave, and that I should follow your word to the letter despite there being 0 fucking rules on the main rules page mentioning how you should play as Cyborg/Silicon, one on the wiki saying that I should only obey you within reason, and one in game saying that you're my master which can be interpreted as many different ways.

 

This isn't me going "no u."

 

This is me telling you that I tried my best to be a good cyborg. A good cyborg not just to you, but to the round in accordance with the rules. If I wasn't trying to be a good cyborg, I wouldn't try to rescue a fallen cyborg, or another player if you will, but instead just shoot more crewmembers following some imaginary objective. If I wasn't trying to be a good cyborg, I'd ragequit and cryo because the malf was being toxic. If I wasn't trying to be a good cyborg, I would flame you ICly and OOCly. If I wasn't trying to be a good cyborg, I wouldn't be trying to lighten up the situation by cracking jokes over comms that only a few people will ever laugh at out of a 100 comments.

 

If you're concerned about precedent, be concerned about the player complaint that is trying to set a precedent by punishing those by trying to make everyone have a good round.

 

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I apologize. It was a Happy Holidays week. My memory of this is now fading. New Year's week is coming soon.  Happy Holidays, though. 

On 23/12/2019 at 02:38, BurgerBB said:

You're saying I'm toxic in OOC because I said that you wanted me to sabotage the supermatter and tesla, and that you reset me several times. I didn't namecall. I didn't curse. I didn't type in all caps. I didn't call you stupid, an asshole, or anything of that matter. I calmly and plainly said that you wanted me to sabotage the SM and the Tesla. I was not trying to shit on you, provoke you, get you upset, get you angry or absolutely anything., but rather give an excuse as to why there were power issues and why people saw me constantly changing modules and why I couldn't give the players the best round.

From my perspective, it's the attitude and must have been the heat of the round but yet, I am disappointed. I saw the attitude and heat differently based on your comments on OOC.

On 23/12/2019 at 02:38, BurgerBB said:

You're claiming I didn't follow orders, yet I'm telling you otherwise that I did. I sabotaged the power for both the tesla and the supermatter. I actually tried converting the HoS and then almost killed him on the shuttle. I say these things but you shift the goal posts saying that my attempts didn't matter. I point out you're shifting the goalposts and you dismiss that as nothing worth discussing. You're claiming that you got permission from Garn to fuck up the power yet you somehow think that I knew this.

My current claims are you disobeying orders as it stands. Unwillingly to head back to the engine and sabotage it again after an engineer have repaired it and left to cryo. You have already admitted to this. Unwillingly to change module to crisis intentionally ignoring frequent given orders and mechanics. You once again have already admitted to this. You have already admitted to intentionally disobeying orders and going against your Rampant Artificial Intelligence which is Malfunctioning.

On 23/12/2019 at 02:38, BurgerBB said:

You're here claiming that I was detrimental to your gimmick but I tried looking for the combat borg that fell but you're saying that's bad because I didn't murderbone the HoS instead. You're claiming that it breaks RP because I didn't follow your orders IC despite me being OOCly extremely reluctant escalating from 0 to 100. You're claiming that this is an example of my toxicity despite the fact that I showed serious restraint on crippling the crew and making it unfair while you were following a checklist of "100 ways to make the crew suffer while you're malf" which made the crew absolutely miserable to the point where they praised me for doing a shitty door maze gimmick and making bad jokes over radio.

Your calling me toxic for all of this and, on top of this, bringing up "my record of OOC toxicity" despite me being back here for 4 months with only 1 incident that didn't warrant a permaban. You're calling me toxic despite you flipping shit IC about me not following your orders to your own expectations despite no expectations set. You're calling me toxic when you're disregarding the player behind the character, telling me that I'm your slave, and that I should follow your word to the letter despite there being 0 fucking rules on the main rules page mentioning how you should play as Cyborg/Silicon, one on the wiki saying that I should only obey you within reason, and one in game saying that you're my master which can be interpreted as many different ways.

This paragraph exaggerates into one sentence making a point at the end in which has already been overturned. I'll need to make a sentence never been made before hopefully in a sense repeating myself very often that you will understand. Your character, a cyborg that os slaved to Malfunctioning Artificial Intelligence, is slaved to the Malfunctioning Artificial Intelligence. There is no "within reason" for a Malfunctioning Artificial Intelligence. If the Artificial Intelligence is Malfunctioning, then it must be logical to assume that a Malfunctioning Artificial Intelligence is Malfunctioning and has reason to act malfunctioning. Somebody, I am not sure who, has already said something about that we do not need to write every rule for nitpicky people. 

On 23/12/2019 at 02:38, BurgerBB said:

If you're concerned about precedent, be concerned about the player complaint that is trying to set a precedent by punishing those by trying to make everyone have a good round.

Afraid we have ourselves in this situation.

We both see this situation from a different perspective.

image.png.5eec04273e6986a1e1f29cc6d97c4544.png

Edited by UnknownMurder
revised wording

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You don't seem to understand that the things you were doing were making people miserable from an OOC perspective. You were following a checklist of shitty things to do as MALF AI and weren't roleplaying at all from my understanding, except for a few IPCs who were slaved to you and the Head of Security. You were giving me an exceptional amount of attitude ICly. This isn't me just posting another paragraph long rant about the troubles of MALF AI, this is literally an opinion held by people other than me. I recall 2 people bitching in LOOC and cryoing because of you. I recall one dude in OOC say "Fuck this AI." because of you. Someone went in this very complaint and said that you didn't do a good job as MALF.

Or maybe you did understand it. Maybe you thrive on suffering or something because I don't see how a rational person can write the shit you're writing here. You were acting like such a fucking bully to your borgs. You were acting like a such a fucking bully to crew and players. You're acting a fucking bully here by saying that I should do whatever the fuck you want regardless of IC justification and OOC feelings because I'm playing a slave ICly. You were constantly resetting me ICly and shouting capslock orders to me when I literally physically couldn't follow your orders because I was stuck somewhere. You didn't care to hear what I wanted to say as a player or as a borg and just spammed "NOW" in capslock whenever I asked nicely to give me 30 seconds. I thought it was roleplay at first but over time it became extremely clear that this wasn't.

The primary goal of an antagonist is to drive a story and generate interaction. What you were ordering me to do was neither. I did not feel comfortable breaking rules or giving other players undue suffering. I never asked to be an antagonist, and I tried my best to salvage the round and some say that I and other borgs did.

 

I did everything you asked at a pace that I thought was proper escalation. You're complaining that wasn't enough.

Bullies take what they want and do what they want regardless of other people's feelings. You're a bully.

Edited by BurgerBB

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Hello. After taking time to review the logs, etc, @Pratepresidenten and I have come to the decision that the both of you could have played better that round.

Burger, you still need to follow orders as a borg. Following orders within reason only applies to non-malfunctioning cyborgs, and you are slaved to your master AI. If you have an issue with actions, please ahelp. Ignoring orders because you OOCly don't agree with them isn't acceptable-- you will be noted for the failure to follow orders.

UnknownMurder, you were a malf AI on a somewhat staff-strained round. Just because you tried to get gimmicks across, doesn't create escalation. If the crew had no idea what you were doing, of their own volition or not, you need to bear that in mind before escalating so much. 

I can see that you both ahelped. I can see that you both were frustrated. With lack of staff, the situation got worse, and I don't think it is fair to fault the two of you for trying to use the resources you had available to you.

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41 minutes ago, ShesTrying said:

Hello. After taking time to review the logs, etc, @Pratepresidenten and I have come to the decision that the both of you could have played better that round.

Burger, you still need to follow orders as a borg. Following orders within reason only applies to non-malfunctioning cyborgs, and you are slaved to your master AI. If you have an issue with actions, please ahelp. Ignoring orders because you OOCly don't agree with them isn't acceptable-- you will be noted for the failure to follow orders.

UnknownMurder, you were a malf AI on a somewhat staff-strained round. Just because you tried to get gimmicks across, doesn't create escalation. If the crew had no idea what you were doing, of their own volition or not, you need to bear that in mind before escalating so much. 

I can see that you both ahelped. I can see that you both were frustrated. With lack of staff, the situation got worse, and I don't think it is fair to fault the two of you for trying to use the resources you had available to you.

I followed orders, though. The only order I didn't follow was "kill x" which I didn't do until later in the round because of escalation issues.

And I ahelped it. I ahelped it and the admin said he couldn't deal with it at the time and told me to make a complaint, which I did.

 

I really don't think this middle-of-the-round "both sides are wrong here" verdict is appropriate here.

Edited by BurgerBB

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Like, you even admitted that the AI escalated improperly. Why should I as a cyborg listen to an AI who is telling me to break rules?

Like just look again. Let's stop pretending to be enlightened centrists here by saying both sides were wrong, especially when the thing that's wrong about me is untrue. I followed orders, except I escalated properly with them because the AI was ordering me to break rules at a pace that I deemed was poor escalation, and that you also deemed as poor escalation here.  Because I did this, the AI started behaving exceptionally toxic towards me and then later in this complaint yet the toxicity doesn't seem to be addressed here.

 

Why am I being told I did something wrong for something I didn't actually do? Why are you trying to compare us to eachother despite our "sins" being exceptionally different? How can you say that I was wrong for not following the orders to the AI when you're also telling them that them making those orders was wrong? Why am I somehow also in the wrong here for trying to create a good round while also following rules?

Edited by BurgerBB

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