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Ron

Character Complaint - Klaus Eliade

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Posted (edited)

BYOND Key: Printer16

Game ID: b7B-cheu

Player Byond Key/Character name: XanderDox

b]Staff involved:[/b] N/A told to make this into a complaint.

Reason for complaint:

I'm making this complaint against Klaus Eliade for what I believe to be poor RP and portrayal of a Head of Security character.

To start, this isn't an isolated event. This behavior is common for Klaus Eliade in every round he is in. The following evidence is just one round.

 

I'll give an objective background of the round. The round was wizard/ninja. The wizard dies before the HoS arrives and there are 2 ninjas, with security believing one was dead. Klaus arrives on the station and is briefed with the information. The security line-up was as follows:

 DZopk4k.png

The HoS proceeds to go to his office and get geared up. He gears up with the following and wears this the rest of the round:

RrvbSDg.png  

 

The following with my my subjective reasoning as to why his behavior is simply unacceptable. Eliade was front-lining the entire round and looking for valids.

He would frequently run around in maint looking for antags. 

FfXoXga.png

Run into cargo at the report of a ninja. fIq9olS.png

 

Eventually a call came in to robotics, he sprinted to be first on scene before even dispatching one of his many able-bodied security officers.

When the antag wasn't at robotics and was at the security lobby, he sprinted there to confront the antag head-on. (note that he didn't ask for a single backup officer) Z1we63P.png (Dead chat was omitted to preserve the privacy of some members of dead chat. If staff want an unedited copy please tell me.)

 

Eliade did all of this with not one, but two long weapons and he had full armor and Columbo in tow. To me, this behavior from a whitelisted HoS seems completely unacceptable for what the HoS role is supposed to be and how it's supposed to be portrayed. I do not believe it is acceptable for a whitelisted player with higher expectations to be acting in this manner as an HoS. He had a beefy security roster and had no business being first on-scene (Without dispatching a single additional security officer) over and over again while walking around with full armor and 2 long guns.

 

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation? Yes. Told to make this complaint.

Edited by Ron

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As a note, there is an active staff complaint regarding Klaus Eliade's judgement and actions as an HoS. The complaint is regarding a Staff Member who made a ruling on Eliade's behavior that I disagreed with.

 

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Posted (edited)

I was going to make my own thread, but I was advised to add my experience here.

This incident with Klaus Eliade occurred at around 10pm-12am 6/11/2020, round ID b7C-ayMX.

As a traitor in that round, I arranged a situation that would give me a plausible reason to get engineering to give me insulated gloves (I got a sympathetic doctor to agree to back me up that I was delivering them for medical because I kept burning my hands and having to come back to medical).  When I arrived at engineering, no one responded to the ringer, so I being an antag and having recently heard someone breached the vault and thus security were probably distracted, I broke in to check around where everyone was.  The engineers came out about 30 seconds later, and we started to talk about the gloves before our HoS in question rocketed into engineering, telling me that the AI had reported me as having broken in.  I did not deny that I had, and he began throwing his weight around, saying he could arrest me for this, but engineering was also not having his guff and backed me up that I was here on business and that I was not unwelcome.  Eliade began insisting that as a visitor I had no right to be in engineering and that performing 'assistant duties' like fetching supplies was 'not allowed'.  When the engineers ignored him and handed me a requisition form to fill out for insulated gloves, Eliade 'denied' the request, and had to be reminded by the engineering team that he had no authority to give orders to people not in his department.  He stomped out shortly after.  

So, as a summary of this:
-During a much more serious situation of the vault being raided, Eliade felt the need to respond personally to an AI report of a visitor breaking into the engineering lobby

-Threatened to perform an arrest in person, when that is the sort of thing he should be getting his officers to do, especially for low-level infractions like trespassing

-Attempted to exceed his authority by giving orders to the engineering team orders on how to dispense their own supplies.

-While I'm specifically sure if it was hot air or not, it seems to me to be carrying the idea that visitors can't perform official job duties a little far to say that also covers doing a 'favor' for someone and fetching supplies, which was the pretense I was getting the gloves under. I don't think that delivering an item counts as an 'official job duty' just because it's something assistants do.  It's an unskilled labor and is as silly as ordering a visitor mopping a dirty floor to drop the mop because 'that's janitor's job, ur visitor'

Edited by Kaed

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Couple things. I play Genevieve.

-  Emily wasn't in round; she'd cryod earlier. 

- Everyone was just as armed at that point. I had a rifle, carbine, and most the lethal ammo. The cadet had similar, albeit with an ion instead of a rifle.

- I was calling out issues over camera and people were responding, given that was like...ya know..what we were doing. There was nobody else to dispatch, unless you wanted the cadet to go alone..? He could have asked me to come though. I suppose, but that seemed line an unwritten issue.

- There is nothing wrong with hos' frontlining? Provided they're making sensible calls and communicating, and all.

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Posted (edited)

I will respond to the first actual complaint from Printer with exactly ONE line:
Look at the manifest you just provided. It has two officers and a cadet. Shortly after joining, one of those officers left and while I was there, pretty sure they were in Medical most of the time. That is not enough to be covering an entire station for an active threat.

When I Head of Security, I DO get out there and help search, especially if I'm low on officers. While I do this, I actively organize my team and direct them to locations and I was check cameras over a wrist computer that I change out for my gloves every now and then. When I have a lot of officers, whenever possible I try to keep on cameras and stick to the main areas of the station in my hunt. Do I sometimes get sidetracked? Yes.

In response to Kaed's thing
 

Quote

The engineers came out about 30 seconds later, and we started to talk about the gloves before our HoS in question rocketed into engineering, telling me that the AI had reported me as having broken in.  I did not deny that I had, and he began throwing his weight around, saying he could arrest me for this, but engineering was also not having his guff and backed me up that I was here on business and that I was not unwelcome.  Eliade began insisting that as a visitor I had no right to be in engineering and that performing 'assistant duties' like fetching supplies was 'not allowed'.  When the engineers ignored him and handed me a requisition form to fill out for insulated gloves, Eliade 'denied' the request, and had to be reminded by the engineering team that he had no authority to give orders to people not in his department.  He stomped out shortly after.  

So, as a summary of this:
-During a much more serious situation of the vault being raided, Eliade felt the need to respond personally to an AI report of a visitor breaking into the engineering lobby

-Threatened to perform an arrest in person, when that is the sort of thing he should be getting his officers to do, especially for low-level infractions like trespassing

-Attempted to exceed his authority by giving orders to the engineering team orders on how to dispense their own supplies.

-While I'm specifically sure if it was hot air or not, it seems to me to be carrying the idea that visitors can't perform official job duties a little far to say that also covers doing a 'favor' for someone and fetching supplies, which was the pretense I was getting the gloves under. I don't think that delivering an item counts as an 'official job duty' just because it's something assistants do.  It's an unskilled labor and is as silly as ordering a visitor mopping a dirty floor to drop the mop because 'that's janitor's job, ur visitor'


1. Visitors are not to be working. This includes doing clerical work, running supplies, or any other such thing. This is per station directives. How Eliade considers this ICly is frankly up to him, and when it's being an inconvenience to him and his team in an elevated alert, he'll probably interpret it in a way that he can tell you to not.

2. I did not threaten to arrest you, that's completely asinine. I came into engineering, told you to leave and said I COULD arrest you for vandalism and trespassing, I said that I could because you were caught on camera hacking into engineering. I was actually being kind to give you a verbal telling off and then left you to it.

3. I was quite aware of the vault situation, I had a full response checking it out, and the Captain was checking it out, and we already had the location on some of the supplies - they were teleported around the station.

4. I did attempt to exceed my authority and order engineering not to provide those gloves. There is no reason for a visitor to have industrial insulated gloves as they have no work duties. Considering you had already hacked into somewhere, it was no longer appropriate for you to even consider getting those gloves. Now, what could I have done instead of saying "Dont give those gloves to him engineers, that's an order." ? I could've went to my office, writ an injunction, slapped you in the face with it, and the brigged you five minutes later when I found you TWICE getting denied by people trying to get them to sign off on your gloves.

What did I do instead? I fucking enabled you. I knew from that singular moment at Eng that you were a traitor, and I made the conscious decision as a Head of Staff Whitelistee to back off from you, not arrest and not search you for vandalism/trespassing, and to give you a reason to hate me by being the big scary asshole. Better yet, I didn't even tell Security Officers that I had warned you, told you off or told you not to get those gloves so THEY wouldn't have a reason to be heavy on you.

If the thanks I get for not ending your round in engineering is a complaint, then damn, I MUST be playing command wrong.

Edited by Azande

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Azande said:

If the thanks I get for not ending your round in engineering is a complaint, then damn, I MUST be playing command wrong.

Your choosing to concede the issue in engineering and enable me (while appreciated) does not absolve you of the issue stated in this thread, which is that you play Eliade as an better armed and more authoritative officer, and struggle with the idea of having to be on the back lines, delegating, except when there is an emergency.  You could easily have sent an officer away from the vault and examined it yourself, with the captain, if you needed to, but when I hack open one door and am faced with the Head of Security themselves less than a minute later, while the vault has been recently breached, it is very jarring and does not present a reasonable escalation of conflict.  

Frankly, you seem to struggle with this idea regardless of what command member you are playing.  I seem to remember that you had the same issue with that female captain character whose name I can't remember right now. The command roles are not intended to give you access to better equipment and more authority to push your way into conflicts so that you can face the antags down as a super-officer, they are so you can run the department you are commanding.

Edited by Kaed

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Posted (edited)

Your issue essentially boils down to not liking how I delegated which is frankly, not up to you. Officers were dispatched to check things out, and when a call came out, I made up for their pre-occupation at the vault by heading to engineering to check on you.

Nothing at all prevents me from going and talking to a petty criminal while my officers handle something more serious, if anything - your logic suggests I should NOT be on the super important front lines that are uber dangerous, I'm sorry that I don't agree with you.

Edited by Azande

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Azande said:

Your issue essentially boils down to not liking how I delegated which is frankly, not up to you. Officers were dispatched to check things out, and when a call came out, I made up for their occupation at the vault by heading to engineering to check on you.

Nothing at all prevents me from going and talking to a petty criminal while my officers handle something more serious, if anything - your logic suggests I should NOT be on the super important front lines that are uber dangerous, I'm sorry that I don't agree with you.

Which is why your judgement has been called into question pending review by staff in this complaint.  Either they agree with us that you need to dial back your frontline behavior, or they will tell you what you did is okay.  This is the purpose of these complaints, to correct or absolve player behavior.  

We're not here to start a fight with you, just express our concerns over your conduct in server.

Edited by Kaed

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I also need to clarify something about arming up.

If there is four officers, then each rifle and carbine goes to an officer.

The only time I take one of these guns for myself is if an officer is indisposed, or not present. I do not arm Cadets, CSIs or Detectives because these roles tend to get in trouble if they are engaging in serious security work, so unless we're being overrun by a cult or something, I don't hand them a lethal-capable weapon.

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Hello. Sorry for the long wait. Both me and Flamingo have been rather busy this week. In any case, I am going to address the points here.

1)

Quote

The HoS proceeds to go to his office and get geared up. He gears up with the following and wears this the rest of the round:

Considering there were spiders and an unknown threat on the station, and how understaffed he was, that seems fine, even though I'd personally question why you need both the tranq and the rifle, but that is rather arbitrary in the scope of this complaint.

2)

Quote

Eventually a call came in to robotics, he sprinted to be first on scene before even dispatching one of his many able-bodied security officers.

As was noted previously, there was only a cadet and an officer by this point. And the officer was watching the cameras for the most part, coordinating.

With all that said, we have concluded that Xander hasn't done anything wrong here.

Anything unrelated to this incident should be posted in a separate complaint thread.

Will lock and archive in 24 hours unless there is anything else to add.

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