Heads of Staff Step it Up

(IF YOU DIDDNU DO NUFFU That I list, then I'm not talking to you, and you can spare me the hate filled comment.)

I've noticed a steady increase of Heads playing to win lately, calling ERT the second an antag appears, jumping straight to red and authorizing lethals, Captains literally chasing down heisters themselves on their own.

You are there to improve RP for EVERYONE, this includes the Antags, stop dogpiling on Antags to prevent them from doing anything. Not to mention that Heads sometimes grab their department's weapons and start fucking shit up. E.g. RD's using force gloves to shove Antags/people, RD's making force gloves and leaving science with them. HoS allowing Officers to arrest people over the AI's say so, CMO not enforcing strict uniform regulations in Medical/During Operations. Other stuff I don't feel like mentioning.

TD;LR, Lighten up, remember what we are here for, refresh yourself on your department's references.

I agree to an extent, but I do think the issue is a bit more nuanced than just "Heads of Staff want to win". I think the server could benefit from a discussion on why red is raised and lethals distributed early as opposed to just saying stop, that way people can come to a consensus and move forward with a plan to make the server better.

Antagonists generally play to win, which isn't a bad thing since they have objectives they want to accomplish. I'm not really partial to let go of my enjoyment but by saying this, I don't intend of depriving people of their enjoyment. Maybe I'll bow down or let things go by for the sake of the narrative, but there are limits to that. If a nuke team attacks the station and my security team is attacked without a word, I'll use every asset I need to contain the situation. They rush bomb security and are hunting them actively? I'll add crisis Borgs to the mix. Still can't contain them and more people are dying? Call ERT.

Wizard with a peace gimmick but teleports to steal the spare? He's going to be arrested to make sure all contraband returns. He flees? Security will escalate accordingly. He uses lethal force to stop his arrest? Security will escalate accordingly.

An important thing to keep in mind is that people have different perspectives of how the round goes. John Doe won't see the same things Jane Doe see, so it's expected they'll be acting differently. But with saying all that, if you do want to improve and deal with this issue, you're better off in my opinion to either contact said players and provide criticism while understanding how things are going from their perspective and/or you can report said players to those responsible of command whitelists.

I'm still not entirely sure why every head of staff thinks security is their personal little army...

Because Security enforces corporate regulation. Not the other departments.

Security IS Station Commands personal little army. They exist to enforce regulation, and the orders of the Heads of Staff. They are there to protect and serve the heads of staff, they are there to protect you as long as you are not a threat.

If you are a threat, well.

Heads of Staff have no obligation to play into antag spiels and bullshit. Antags need to get good, I'm not having my round ruined because I'm expected to play dumb and let some ninja or ling kill me in a maintenance tunnel.

Heads of Staff have no obligation to play into antag spiels and bullshit. Antags need to get good, I'm not having my round ruined because I'm expected to play dumb and let some ninja or ling kill me in a maintenance tunnel.

You're not expected to play dumb. You are expected to drive a narrative, and make the round fun for everyone else, as one of the most powerful people in the game. Just because you don't personally like the antags gimmick, if it is making it fun for everyone, as long as it is somewhat believable, you shouldn't be shutting him down ASAP. You need to have the attitude of "I am a head of staff, I need to make it fun for me, but I also need to make it fun for others. If I cannot be bothered doing that, I can play a job with less responsibility."

I don't wanna shit talk while being sneaky, but I won't name names because I'll get in "trouble"

GINGER HOS LADY, why did you authorize THREE FUCKING COMBAT BORGS because there was a single "automata" breaking walls on the surface level. There was literally an announcement at the time that there were unidentified lifeforms around the station, and instead you and your detective jumped to the conclusion that the juggernaut must have been summoned to assassinate people by some kind of religious group. wtf.

Heads of Staff have no obligation to play into antag spiels and bullshit. Antags need to get good, I'm not having my round ruined because I'm expected to play dumb and let some ninja or ling kill me in a maintenance tunnel.

That's what you agree to do when you apply for a head of staff whitelist. Don't be dumb, but be a good sport.

I have a sneaking suspicion this might be some sort of self-destructive cycle that generates lots of salt. Security, AI, or Command Staff are far too vigilant, and punitive towards antagonists seeing their pursuit of goals destructive to HRP or, ruining the fun of others. As a result, antagonists have to use more savage, and brutal methods to counteract this, thus reaffirming the former's issue with antagonists. So, assuming my theory is correct, it seems that the only way to heal this situation is for Heads of Staff to take on more responsibility, and to be the better player. I don't know how exactly this tenuous relationship could be fixed, but I would suggest showing more faith, and being more respectful to other players or playing antagonist more often, so you can show more sympathy in dealing with antagonists. Personally, as a non-antag I nearly entirely avoid conflicting with antagonists, opting more often to run and avoid the situation. Mind you, I have not played a Head of Staff for a while, I tend to be a one-trick pony exclusively playing one character, with a few no-name spares in other departments. thanks guys that is all

Heads of Staff have no obligation to play into antag spiels and bullshit. Antags need to get good, I'm not having my round ruined because I'm expected to play dumb and let some ninja or ling kill me in a maintenance tunnel.

 

That's what you agree to do when you apply for a head of staff whitelist. Don't be dumb, but be a good sport.

No, they don't. They agree to be competent (or at least mediocre) heads of staff and not abuse their whitelist.

Being a good sport is important but it doesn't override other priorities of a head of staff, which is to at least do their job to an acceptable standard.

Heads of Staff have no obligation to play into antag spiels and bullshit. Antags need to get good, I'm not having my round ruined because I'm expected to play dumb and let some ninja or ling kill me in a maintenance tunnel.

 

That's what you agree to do when you apply for a head of staff whitelist. Don't be dumb, but be a good sport.

 

No, they don't. They agree to be competent (or at least mediocre) heads of staff and not abuse their whitelist.

Being a good sport is important but it doesn't override other priorities of a head of staff, which is to at least do their job to an acceptable standard.

Watch your tone with your lore master, small moderator.

I agree with Hackie, however I think the problem is mostly with security mains, AIs, and HOS players. Ill explain soon. I'll explain how antags could do a bit better but like I said, its mainly on the AI and heads.

This last week I have been antag three or four times. The first of those three times, as a ling, I handcuffed someone. Within seconds the AI said "well look at what youre doing." And i had to sprint into maintenance and wordlessly cut his head off because sec was instantly rocketing down the halls at me. They never found him, but I was instantly permabrigged and only managed to solve my predicament by killing all of security in one clean sweep with my arm blade when trying to get their attention for the entire round failed.

In the next instance, there was a juggernaut breaking walls on the surface during an unidentified lifeforms event, and the HOS' first instinct was to elevate to red and activate three combat borgs. Then they went over to a doctor and asked her why her "religion" she was talking about over comms wasnt listed in her records, and then started very fakely 'putting the pieces together' on comms like so: "guys.... anyone think its weird that... all of these people are religious.. but dont have notes of it...? I feel like that one creature was created by them to assassinate people and theyre a religious cult... just a hunch?" In response to this, I purposefully let them cult me and started killing officers because the entire cult was dead, in permabrig, or so scared of secs meta that they had to be passive or even act against fellow cult members to hide.

The next instance I was a cultist. There was a lady on fire in the medbay. I went to pull her towards a medkit in the cargo bay and she was too drunk to consent. Security stopped me with five officers saying I was abducting her, pulling her around the central hall unrestrained, and stunned me with gloves. All of a sudden they circled me and told me they wanted to search me (obviously they wanted to see my cult papers) and instead i walked off and told them to get a warrant. When the AI bolted open all the doors for them I sprinted in mining, snatched a hardsuit and forced the external airlock and fled into open space. The fucking officers, hell bent on catching the guy who "didnt submit to a search", chased me into space trying to arrest me. I thought this was pretty bloodthirsty and obvious metagame so I ahelped and then killed them with my pickaxe.

Inversely to that, I saw a wizard hand the Captain a spellbook upon introduction and tell her to "go ahead and read it" and when she did it did its purpose, and exploded her into a husk, on fire, with no arms, in a single tick. I went ahead and (accidentally) executed that one on the spot as the responding officer.

I could go on and on, but the point is that there is a stupidly ridiculous precedent that the other side will kill you the second you turn your back or cease harm batoning everything in sight. I believe the first responsibility lies on sec and the heads of staff to get their stuff in control instead of sending bloodhound officers into open space in standard gear to shoot at someone who might be a traitor because he pulled somebody in a circle. Who cares if you lose a round. If the antags are all in permabrig in straight jackets 10 mins into the round, wtf are the rest of us supposed to do with the round?!?!! When that no longer happens, the antags will stop killing all of you with no words.

I agree with hive, security is getting a massive trend. Now, that can be understood because new people and all. Now if the HoS does this, they need to be slapped hard.

Antagonists generally play to win, which isn't a bad thing since they have objectives they want to accomplish. I'm not really partial to let go of my enjoyment but by saying this, I don't intend of depriving people of their enjoyment. Maybe I'll bow down or let things go by for the sake of the narrative, but there are limits to that. If a nuke team attacks the station and my security team is attacked without a word, I'll use every asset I need to contain the situation. They rush bomb security and are hunting them actively? I'll add crisis Borgs to the mix. Still can't contain them and more people are dying? Call ERT.

Wizard with a peace gimmick but teleports to steal the spare? He's going to be arrested to make sure all contraband returns. He flees? Security will escalate accordingly. He uses lethal force to stop his arrest? Security will escalate accordingly.

Basically this.

Back off the Security witch-hunt; it's literally their job to keep crew safe from threats and ensure regulations are enforced. Within reason. And those players who pre-empt threats rather than react to them should be spoken to on an individual level.

That said, I will agree that Science needs to stop being Research Militia every chance they get.

I think both sides could afford to be less overzealous. Security players should respect that antagonists are trying to pull something off one way or another but they shouldn't hand the experience to them. Interacting even in small ways can make the experience leading up to the shootout fun and engaging if done right. Likewise, antagonists should at least respect when security doesn't seem to be hunting them and not aim to permanently take them out of the round unless absolutely necessary. Death is a plot device and a tool, but like any plot device or tool it is important to not just use it correctly but also use it sparingly enough that it is not wasted effort to massacre a bunch of people who will be unable to interact with you after you are done killing them. People cannot roleplay with you if they are dead.

It's just a game, but nobody enjoys validhunting.

Just my two cents, i've been aggressively stalked as antag vamp multiple times by AI, once i believe it was [REDACTED], who decided to follow me from the halls, through maintenance and bust me stealing blood somehow from the medbay blood bank. their reason for it was that i was under suspicion from an attack earlier, even though i was acquitted of the attack and wasn't found wearing any of the clothes, hairstyles, or tools reported, just after the attack. i'm not sure if that was him or not, it's happened a few times. Point is, i find that i'm very aggressively stalked by AIs 90% of the time as antag, and when i report it, i'm told it's a dick move but it's not breaking any rules. ive been a vamp id say.... 7 times, maybe less, and the other day was the first time i wasn't locked up within 15 minutes of round start and actually got to do something.

Other stuff I don't feel like mentioning.

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