Remove IPC Whitelist Restriction for Unbranded IPCs, adjust Unbranded IPCs to make them serve the AI.

I think positronic brains/cyborgs should have the option of either becoming a cyborg or an NT-IPC. NT-IPCs are basically unbranded IPCs with a lawset and inherit access to the binary channel. They serve the AI and have the AI's laws, but they are the IPC type and use the unbranded model. This is perfect for some jobs such as chemistry and medical in general as it allows you to have proper actual manipulation as opposed to the annoying to use grippers.

NT-IPCs won't be super OP and will be subject to limitations. NT-IPCs cannot fire guns as their fingers are too thick to pull the trigger. NT-IPCs cannot hit people. with fists or weapons, as their general shape and structure of the arm prevents them from able to exert force. NT-IPCs cannot throw items for more than 1 tile for the same reasons. Due to legal, safety, and ethical, and mechanical limitations, NT-IPCs cannot be assigned engineering or security roles. They are built for fine manipulation of objects such as chemistry, medical, and service jobs.

Generally, cyborgs should not have to rely on grippers to hold thing. They're poorly implemented and poorly thought out. Being a borg chef, chemist, or surgeon is just nightmarish and makes you wish that you just played a human instead.

I was opposed to this when spoken of on Discord, but when laid out in a suggestion, it seems a lot more reasonable. I apologize, Burger, and I'm onboard with this.

I had an idea in the past for a 'Chemistry Module' that did something similar to this, but this expands on that concept in a much better way. I wish I had a decent suggestion to add on, but I don't, so I'm just offering my support.

Last time I checked, Ipc's don't have the ability to transmit signals so they can't be on binary and they can't be law synced. They are isolated individuals not connected to any network.

What this suggestion seems to be is an attempt to make Borgs less difficult to use. This should be a suggestion to correct Borg not to change the fundamental nature of a player race to make something slightly easier for you.

I can't get behind this idea, and I really think it's poorly thought-out and you should be looking at this issue from a different angle than changing a player race into a makeshift Borg

I'm waiting to see what the loredev has to say before I deviate from the proposed plan.

In terms of lore, there is 0 distinction between IPCs and Borgs beyond that "Uhhh....they're different!". There is no reason why an IPC chassis could not behave like a borg chassis, and indeed vice versa. They are just physical shells.

That said, if you want to play a borg with hands, then you should just consider getting an IPC whitelist. The limitations of borgs and IPCs are at least somewhat designed to follow a certain direction.

Any form of unwhitelisted IPC is probably not going to sound like a good idea to me. I don't like the sound of it now, and it probably won't change no matter how it is spun differently. Slaving them to the AI makes little difference to me in that regard, and all of those restrictions? Playing a borg would honestly be better at that point. Even borgs have the ability (even if they are not allowed to do it) to hit people with any of their tools. With all of those "limitations" for the only justification really being "they can finely manipulate objects," really just sounds like the idea of a ridiculously balanced (imbalanced not the right word to use here) change needs to be kept from being used the way it is not intended to be used.

Any form of unwhitelisted IPC is probably not going to sound like a good idea to me. I don't like the sound of it now, and it probably won't change no matter how it is spun differently. Slaving them to the AI makes little difference to me in that regard, and all of those restrictions? Playing a borg would honestly be better at that point. Even borgs have the ability (even if they are not allowed to do it) to hit people with any of their tools. With all of those "limitations" for the only justification really being "they can finely manipulate objects," really just sounds like the idea of a ridiculously balanced (imbalanced not the right word to use here) change needs to be kept from being used the way it is not intended to be used.

I like to suggest underpowered ideas and then work upwards as we go. Perhaps the idea can change now that your input is here; make the unbranded IPC whitelisted, but have mechanics/restrictions that make it behave differently as it's still enslaved to nanotrasen. Remove all the use restrictions that I suggested.

When you say 'unbranded', you don't mean 'baseline', right? If so, I don't see any immediate issues with this, because that was my biggest concern. My second issue is the balance, I suppose, but Cake already addressed that.

It seems, though, that your main suggestion is "let IPCs be slaved to the AI", which... ehh? Sure, but it sounds like a pain to get it to work properly-- what if there's not an AI when you join? What if the AI leaves? What if a new AI latejoins? Is it possible for antagonist NT-IPCs to be de-synchronised, emagged, etc.? Is there (should there be) a way to link these IPCs to the AI via a console?

When you say 'unbranded', you don't mean 'baseline', right? If so, I don't see any immediate issues with this, because that was my biggest concern. My second issue is the balance, I suppose, but Cake already addressed that.

It seems, though, that your main suggestion is "let IPCs be slaved to the AI", which... ehh? Sure, but it sounds like a pain to get it to work properly-- what if there's not an AI when you join? What if the AI leaves? What if a new AI latejoins? Is it possible for antagonist NT-IPCs to be de-synchronised, emagged, etc.? Is there (should there be) a way to link these IPCs to the AI via a console?

Not baseline, but these things:

The only way to obtain this model is if you build a cyborg with unbranded parts and put the head in IPC mode. I figured since these look more like cyborgs than actual IPCs, why not make this an option for cyborgs? A lot of jobs like chemistry, construction, and cooking would benefit from the ability to use two humantype hands.

Man, if the majority of station bounds looked like that and had access to arms, it'd be great. Maybe update the department specific sprites as well, so they're more obviously belonging to each department.

Man, if the majority of station bounds looked like that and had access to arms, it'd be great. Maybe update the department specific sprites as well, so they're more obviously belonging to each department.

They're entirely able to wear human uniforms. They can wear and use anything normal IPCs can do so it would be easy to just get them to move to a department and take the uniforms from there. Module resets won't be necessary either because it just means returning the uniform and tools and just getting a new one.

IPC's are a different field from regular bound synths. By being IPC, we have a visual shorthand that this unit is not bound to an AI. The distinction is necessary from at the very least a visual perspective. If we start making synthetics interchangable like this, then it will be utterly incomprehensible to decipher what is bound to what and what synth is what model or type. Veterans and coders will know, but this is still pretty bizarre.

It is also an intentional design choice that androids and cyborgs cannot interact with things via hands. Their lack of fine motor skills is a debuff for their other endless buffs from being integrated into the station's systems.

-1

I support this entirely. There is nothing I want more than to see proper cyborgs waltzing around.

Opposed. I fail to see what this actually aims to change and accomplish.

The outline is very very clear in the OP in the thread, but I will repeat the points since it's easier for people to access.

1. Stationbounds now can choose a model with hands instead of having to deal with the incredibly buggy and poorly implemented grippers. There are a lot of things that cyborgs can't do because of mechanical limitations and other bullshit, such as:

- Unbuckling mobs.

- Carrying certain items.

- Unwrapping crates.

- Getting the CMO coffee from the coffee vendor.

2. All of the modules are VERY limited. For example, there is no lethal form of defense for security borgs, except for the crowbar. The science borg is actually the most lethal cyborg for emergency situations, save for the combat module which is usually overkill.

3. Flexibility. Most of the time there isn't a roboticist to change your module. With a universal module, you can just change your uniform and change your tools. Good for lowpop rounds.

The outline is very very clear in the OP in the thread, but I will repeat the points since it's easier for people to access.

1. Stationbounds now can choose a model with hands instead of having to deal with the incredibly buggy and poorly implemented grippers. There are a lot of things that cyborgs can't do because of mechanical limitations and other bullshit, such as:

- Unbuckling mobs.

- Carrying certain items.

- Unwrapping crates.

- Getting the CMO coffee from the coffee vendor.

2. All of the modules are VERY limited. For example, there is no lethal form of defense for security borgs, except for the crowbar. The science borg is actually the most lethal cyborg for emergency situations, save for the combat module which is usually overkill.

3. Flexibility. Most of the time there isn't a roboticist to change your module. With a universal module, you can just change your uniform and change your tools. Good for lowpop rounds.

all this is intentional... save for weird gripper issues. even then, those are a whole different subject and need a whole degree of balancing if you intend to have them act as hands.

why does a security module not equipped to repel boarders require lethal forms of defense? why do any stationbounds require lethal defense, save for the combat module, which should literally never be activated outside of borderline nuke scenarios?

Cyborgs are not meant to be as 100% convenient as carbon mobs with hands and feet.

Their limitations in regards to interacting with certain things are intentional, as cyborgs are quite strong in their own ways.

Service cyborgs can already transport food and coffee.

Making another IPC-but-totally-a-cyborg race will simply remove the distinction between carbon mobs and cyborgs.

This is power creep, plain and simple. It is unnecessary.