[Resolved] Player Complaint - ArmoryBlaine

BYOND Key: CommanderXor

Game ID: Various Rounds

Player Byond Key: ArmoryBlaine

Staff involved: Multiple members of staff after multiple ahelps over the past few days. No exact ones recalled.

Reason for complaint: Excessive validhunting and poor security play. Excessive aggression in LOOC and Discord, metagrudging. Insulting players in LOOC and DMing them to personally insult them.

He's been generally rude and does nothing a majority of the round but stand around until an antag appears, and then tries to kill them. He has frequently harmbatoned people, including handcuffed individuals. Has a habit of rushing for lethals when possible and an excessive amount of force. Has claimed he finds it funny when his character 'snaps'. Unbelievable/unrealistic standards while playing security. Often speaks over the radio seemingly enjoying violence and death to unnatural lengths.

Has a habit of metagrudging and insulting anyone who disapproves of his gimmicks/actions/characters, going as far as insulting them personally in LOOC and Discord. General toxic behavior.

These things have become worse and worse over the past week and a half. I've had to ahelp something about his actions at least once a day for the past three-four days straight. He seems to play to win rather than to drive any sort of story, both as an antag and security player.

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation? I've ahelped multiple times and been told he was talked to and if I want to take things further to lodge a player/character complaint, thus here I am.

Approximate Date/Time: The past week or so. 7-7-2018 to 10-7-2018.

Additional Notes:

I don't have any evidence for his powergaming/validhunting behavior and would like staff to possibly glance over the logs in regards to this issue. However, I do have screenshots of his aggressive behavior in LOOC and Discord, albeit only of a single incident. They are seen below in the spoiler.

So, I'll comment. I have no Game IDs, because I'm not that active a player, but I'll note my experience as best I can. I recall several rounds in which I felt this to be an issue, but I cannot recall the specific details of those. A round took place (I would approximate: 09/07 1:00ishEST) in which CommanderXor, as well as two others, played a Merc team. AmoryBlaine and I (playing as Officer Daniel Carmichael and Detective Fabe Dante) composed the entirety of the Security team. I, being the first to take notice of the merc team, reported it over the radio. The round progressed. And the "situation" amounted to the AI (the player of which I am uncertain) informing us the "intruders" were by the library. Coming from two different directions Carmichael (accompanied by two combat borgs) and I surrounded them, at which point, without word, he opened fire. Realizing that the chance for interaction had been eliminated, I began to open fire on two of the merc team members, while the third (CommanderXor) fled into the maintenance tunnels. At this point, multiple explosions occurred (origin of which I am uncertain) resulting in the tunnels being vented, and my character (Dante) being incapacitated.

Later found by an EMT, my character was revived, at which point I discovered Carmichael was bragging about massacring the merc team over common comms. An action which I would think borders on OOC in IC, but nonetheless, would be unfitting of a Security Officer. When my character prompted him to cease this conversation, Carmichael ignored the advice and continued his bragging.

In reference to the round mentioned in the OP, which just previously occurred, I cannot much comment, as an issue still unknown to me occurred, resulting in little interaction with the antags.

All that, I suppose, is to say that I agree that there seems to be a constant issue of "play-to-win" with this player.

- Do you have proof of me spending my rounds waiting for Antagonists to pop up?

Most rounds, I patrol around, or try to find someone to RP with. If that does work, and I'm feeling lethargic, I'll sit in a chair for a few minutes and go for a physical walk or watch a video on youtube.

- Valid-hunting

I have a record of getting kills, and being good at combat. Just because you, an active antag player, meet the business-end of my baton/shotgun/carbine/rifle often, does not mean it is valid-hunting. Most rounds I meet you, it's with express orders to engage you, or after you've made threats against my life, or the integrity of the station.

- Meta-grudging

What meta-grudging? Even with how heated I get, I never act on how I actually feel, and it's something I'm really glad I can control, because I admit, I have issues with anger, and being extremely emotional- as is known, and was a factor in my Head of Staff whitelist removal and going back on my Mod applications.

- Toxic behavior in OOC

I was taken aback by your actions, as was I of the other Raider's. Both of you abused the fact that there was a freshspawn, who was easy to catch, and force your will upon them. His was stuffing them in a cell, your's was shooting them with your shotgun. [see my complaint: https://forums.aurorastation.org/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=11487 ] If you can't take a few harsh words, that were stopped when the Staff member requested them to, then I suggest you get some thicker skin.

- Toxic behavior on Discord

Seeing as this was between you and I in private messages, I'd consider that to be private as in separate from the server, as they do not oversee it. What is said there can surely be used against someone, but what you have shown is me being heated towards you concerning your actions as a player. If it bothers you to recieve DMs from me, in any nature, block me.

- Character Behavior

I can't think of much to add here, so I'll wait for responses.

[mention]Kolthoff[/mention]

"And the "situation" amounted to the AI (the player of which I am uncertain) informing us the "intruders" were by the library. Coming from two different directions Carmichael (accompanied by two combat borgs) and I surrounded them, at which point, without word, he opened fire."

A keen observer would have heard the first responder, the other stationbound yell on comms something close to, "UNIT IS IN PROGRESS OF BEING COMPROMISED." and their hatch being opened. A keen observer would have also seen the multiple empty casings of 10mm ammunition around the Central halls. I opened fire and it was entirely justified, given these facts, and the fact the CMO had given me express authority to carry out lethal force against the self-admitted thieves with intent to kill, and nuke the station given we didn't pile into their shuttle.

"Later found by an EMT, my character was revived, at which point I discovered Carmichael was bragging about massacring the merc team over common comms. An action which I would think borders on OOC in IC, but nonetheless, would be unfitting of a Security Officer. When my character prompted him to cease this conversation, Carmichael ignored the advice and continued his bragging."

- It's almost as if he, the Director of Research and yourself just thwarted a Code Red, pending full blown Code Delta, disaster with zero casualties on the station side, and a quick clean-up. As an addition, see my point about him snapping.

"All that, I suppose, is to say that I agree that there seems to be a constant issue of "play-to-win" with this player."

I'd have to disagree there, as it was only with the express orders given by Command that allowed the killing of the mercs to take place. Before that point, I was almost entirely for just surrendering as I was pretty sure any resistance would have been swiftly put down, but thanks to the Station bounds, we stood a chance.

I guess I will also attempt to break your post down bit by bit, Armory.

- Do you have proof of me spending my rounds waiting for Antagonists to pop up?

Most rounds, I patrol around, or try to find someone to RP with. If that does work, and I'm feeling lethargic, I'll sit in a chair for a few minutes and go for a physical walk or watch a video on youtube.

A majority of the rounds - About 85%, excluding when you get an antag role - I see you standing either outside the brig, in the brig, or by the camera console. You rarely move from there unless an incident is reported or you're interacted with in some way. You rarely interact with the crew outside of security manners/combat/action. I've never seen you go down to the kitchen unless it's to regen your stamina, nor head to the bar or interact with anyone outside of the ISD.

- Valid-hunting

I have a record of getting kills, and being good at combat. Just because you, an active antag player, meet the business-end of my baton/shotgun/carbine/rifle often, does not mean it is valid-hunting. Most rounds I meet you, it's with express orders to engage you, or after you've made threats against my life, or the integrity of the station.

Every time we've interacted while I was an antag and you have been security, or when we are both play security you seem to always try your hardest to shut down the players regardless of what gimmick they run. I've seen you multiple times rush on to the scene and start going straight for stuns/aims. A recent Feeding-round the other day is proof of that. I and a Ling had cornered someone and stunned them. You ran up on the spot and attempted to start harmbatoning me. Eventually, you had me cuffed and when I tried to escape you attempted to break my skull by repeatedly harm-intending my head with a baton despite the fact I was blocked and handcuffed. Yesterday you wordlessly opened fire on two mercs, one of them being an unarmed medical character. Also, 'being good at combat' and 'record of getting kills' isn't exactly a good thing. You shouldn't be proud of your officer murdering every antag they meet.

- Meta-grudging

What meta-grudging? Even with how heated I get, I never act on how I actually feel, and it's something I'm really glad I can control, because I admit, I have issues with anger, and being extremely emotional- as is known, and was a factor in my Head of Staff whitelist removal and going back on my Mod applications.

I suppose I could mark this down and file it away but you seem to have an issue with Richter for no apparent reason, same with many of my antag characters but that can be chalked up to past situations and past IC experiences.

- Toxic behavior in OOC

I was taken aback by your actions, as was I of the other Raider's. Both of you abused the fact that there was a freshspawn, who was easy to catch, and force your will upon them. His was stuffing them in a cell, your's was shooting them with your shotgun. [see my complaint: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=11487 ] If you can't take a few harsh words, that were stopped when the Staff member requested them to, then I suggest you get some thicker skin.

- Toxic behavior on Discord

Seeing as this was between you and I in private messages, I'd consider that to be private as in separate from the server, as they do not oversee it. What is said there can surely be used against someone, but what you have shown is me being heated towards you concerning your actions as a player. If it bothers you to recieve DMs from me, in any nature, block me.

I'll be grouping these two things together since they're practically the same. You saw fit that because of my (antag) character's actions - which are totally justifiable given the situation and the nature of the character - to personally insult me. This wasn't an insult to the character, but rather the actual player/person behind the character. Along with that, is when you were asked by staff to stop insulting people via LOOC, you opted to then privately message me to bypass their instructions and to resume flaming where no one else could publically see it.

I find it grossly unacceptable for a person to attack not the character, but the player themselves for in-character actions, and then when asked to stop by others to resume your personal vendetta against them.

"I'm aggressive as fuck when you say I'm valid hunting.": What that means is when you perceive me to be validhunting, I'm just getting into the game, and as a result, I usually bring Daniel Carmichael, my character, into a state of aggression. There was an issue here when I said "I'm" because I meant to convey, "When I'm playing him in these scenarios..." Again, 3:19AM.

Perhaps then you shouldn't be getting so in to a game to the point where the lines of IC and OOC aggression get blurred and your character comes off as generally dislikeable and aggressive?

"Pretty much any antag that shows Daniel respect and doesn't try to fuck him over, is fine, unless ordered to fuck them.": Pretty self-explanatory. Your issue is Daniel shooting things until they're horizontal, he doesn't do that unless they've actively provoked him, the station or Command. Even then, it's situation. So no, don't really validhunt there, just sorta play the character like they're a normal person who doesn't want to kill everything that is listed as an antagonist.

The issue stems from the fact that you claim he doesn't start shooting until the suspect 'provokes' the station/command/him. By your own words, he will shoot anything 'until they're horizontal' if they provoke the station. This means 99% of antags barring peace antags will be shot to death by him since they dared to attempt to progress the round, or in your words, 'provoke command/him/station'. You're basically saying you're going to shoot anything that poses an issue to station integrity. Which isn't a bad thing per-say, but you've done it to a far more aggressive state than any other officer recently.

"And yeah, I get kills, I know what I'm doing.": I've been playing Security for like nine months straight, I think I'm like 8/10 at playing the role. Just because I'm getting kills and, as some say, disabling the antagonists, does it mean I go in validhunting.

Boasting about killing antags both ICly and OOCly isn't good behavior and is downright unrealistic with the amounts you do it ICly. You rarely make any attempts to RP with the antagonists of a round outside the barrel of your gun or the hum of your stunbaton. You have a very aggressive 'play-to-win' behavior in both your antag and non-antag rounds.

"Daniel screams threats and shit because it is catharsis or however it is spelt. Also, because I find it fucking hilarious to watch him snap.": Daniel is almost always a reserved and quiet character. For most rounds, he chooses to dick with people via playing a game of minor inconveniences and whining to Command, in order to get back at people. He doesn't challenge people to fistfights, it's not his character. But when put under the stress of coming up against Mercenaries, Raiders, Cultists, Vampire, Changelings- all of whom usually are covered in blood and trying to kill him, he snaps and begins to scream obscenities over comms to taunt them. As a result of this, he almost always dies minutes later, or lives and spends the rest of the round recuperating in quietness. And yes, I find this amusing. It's changing the expectation of what you would assume that person would do, with the opposite. ICly; it's a man with well-established issues losing his shit- OOCly; it's funny.

If you want to sit around and play a quiet character, that's fine by me. But the sudden shift from quiet and reserved to homicidal screeching over the comms and excessive bloodlust and murderous rampage is just not realistic in my eyes and is downright bad security play. There is no real reason for your actions besides 'it's funny'. Non-antagonist characters need to be sane and believable. An officer who remains quiet and suddenly starts screaming he's going to murder someone violently and starts bashing skulls in of a handcuffed prisoner isn't exactly sane. There are ways to play it correctly but you've approached it in the wrong manner, and it's even more concerning that you do it purely for the 'fun of it'.

In the end, I think ultimately you need to take a step back and re-evaluate how you approach security and how you play your characters. You don't need to get so into it and start thirsting for blood.

A lot of what you being up has no basis in fact, and is just your opinion on what I've done with my own character in antag situations of dire stress and rapid action. The most you can lay at me is that I'm heated and sometimes baton stuff too fast- not applying to any situation involving you.

I know I'm in the right for almost everything I do ICly because almost everything I do ICly is directed by Command, or questioned by ahelps which are then settled. If I was in the wrong with either as much as you claim, I would not still be playing here. Most every situation I'm in that is ahelped, is entirely legitimate and approved.

You can say you don't like it when I prod you for Vamp-Stunning me, or that you don't like it when I shoot your Merc after they are very vocal about their intentions, but that does not change the fact that I am allowed to act as I do, by testimate of the ahelps leveled against me and my reasoning for my actions.

A lot of what you being up has no basis in fact, and is just your opinion on what I've done with my own character in antag situations of dire stress and rapid action. The most you can lay at me is that I'm heated and sometimes baton stuff too fast- not applying to any situation involving you.

I know I'm in the right for almost everything I do ICly because almost everything I do ICly is directed by Command, or questioned by ahelps which are then settled. If I was in the wrong with either as much as you claim, I would not still be playing here. Most every situation I'm in that is ahelped, is entirely legitimate and approved.

You can say you don't like it when I prod you for Vamp-Stunning me, or that you don't like it when I shoot your Merc after they are very vocal about their intentions, but that does not change the fact that I am allowed to act as I do, by testimate of the ahelps leveled against me and my reasoning for my actions.

You can claim that you're in the right for your actions because they were 'ordered' but a lot of the time even without orders you still leap the gun and go straight for lethals/valids. The Vampire incident, for example, the Head of Security wasn't able to communicate with you, yet you still went straight for harmbatoning.

The merc round earlier you were given permission to use lethal force if needed against the antags. Yet the moment you saw us for the first time you didn't say anything but began wordlessly shooting them both until they died. You didn't roleplay with them at all besides killing and then gloating about it over the common channel like Daniel is a psychopath.

In regards to the ahelps, they're commonly 'handled' and then I am informed to make a player complaint if the behavior continues or if I disagree with it, hence why I am making this complaint because it has become a recurring issue.

Hey, Rosetango here! I was present for both Merc/heist rounds and a vampire round that involved Sean Richter and Jasmine Bullard.

For the first merc/heist round, I remember as Willow I walked up on Tin (yonnimer) and Voxxe(?). Tin was administering first aid to Voxxe after tinkering with a combat cyborg slightly. When I approached, neither of them were hostile to me at least openly, such as pulling a gun out and aiming at Willow. Willow, feeling sympathetic, stayed by and watched. All of a sudden, Daniel Carmichael walks up either from the lower side of the holodeck or from behind me (the mercs were by the display case in the library) and without saying literally anything he just opens fire on the mercs, killing both Tin and Voxxe right before Willow. He then went on to brag about it on comms, which I find that unless Daniel is psychopathic or something, he shouldn't find enjoyment in taking two lives even if it's to protect the crew. The ISD's whole thing is to de-escalate things without lethal force or force at all if possible which was definitely possible in this case.

In the second heist round, the one from last night, I can't really say much. Power was out for a majority of the round and we were all using station bounced radios. I literally didn't even know we had intruders until about an hour in, when Observo, the RD at the time, actually told Willow. Judging from an outside standpoint on the whole killing a newbie thing, and although I know my opinion isn't required, I just wanted to say this. Sure, it may have been a poor decisions to kill the newbie assistant, but he had actual reasons to do so and was doing it in the interest of not only himself, but his team and gimmick. I can verify that Xor apologized in OOC about it directly to the new guy, who actually seemed okay about it and even made a jest saying that he had come back and the most SS13 thing happened: random violence on an assistant.

The last one probably deserves a complaint on it's own, but I would like to say that I have experienced similar behaviors to what seems like metagrudging. Me and Amory recently had a little falling out, because I didn't like his behavior, which I considered powergamey and validhunters. Being tired of his generally negative behavior towards other players, I told him that I didn't want to talk to him any more and blocked him.

After this, Daniel went from talking/waving to Harper in the halls and asking to see her after work, to suddenly and without reason hating Harper violently, no longer talking/waving to her, and even calling her nosy and annoying which he has never done before. He got physical and borderline violent with Harper when she admittedly trespassed, but she trespassed into the front desk area to comfort the detective who had several burns all over, was starving, and even broke down crying whilst cuffed. At first, I thought that Amory had just been having a rough round, so he vented a little on Harper, which would have been explainable /if/ Daniel had gone about it a different way instead of doing a complete 180. It didn't occur to me until after the round, when I was talking to the player of the detective (RTNP) that Amory might have been metagrudging me. Daniel also kept shoving Harper and telling her to look at a wall which I just found kind of...bizarre and unexplainable?

Anyway, that's just my two cents on this whole situation.

A keen observer would have heard the first responder, the other stationbound yell on comms something close to, "UNIT IS IN PROGRESS OF BEING COMPROMISED." and their hatch being opened. A keen observer would have also seen the multiple empty casings of 10mm ammunition around the Central halls. I opened fire and it was entirely justified, given these facts, and the fact the CMO had given me express authority to carry out lethal force against the self-admitted thieves with intent to kill, and nuke the station given we didn't pile into their shuttle.

I'm glad you used that word. Because, in my opinion, it's the root of the problem with how you play all of your characters. Everything you do is justified by the words "authority" and "snapping." In regards to the abuse of authority you enact so often, it doesn't just apply to Carmichael. Your other officer character, who I feel is intentionally named in a confusing manner, is perhaps worse for this. This idea of "I have a badge, so I can do what I want."

Re: "following orders," I'd argue that I've seen several rounds where you, mostly playing as Carmichael, receive an order you don't like and proceed to ignore it.

Re: "Snapping." This is exactly what I meant when I said "unfitting of a Security Officer." If Carmichael can't help but "snap," can't contain his emotions, can't act in a professional manner...he would fail his evals. And wouldn't be cleared for duty. The excuse of "I have anger issues" combined with "I want to play Sec" isn't made acceptable just because you can vaguely admit to the former.

[mention]Kolthoff[/mention]

You've disregarded the rest of my argurment and fall back on pointing out one single word and it's exagerated importance. You don't know half of my characters, or what their thoughts are on authority, or orders, or utilitarian thinking, so at this point you're just grabbing at the air.

Concerning orders, yeah, when given orders it's situational. When all the female crew are being stuck with service jobs, he's not going to enforce that. Had there not been extra units present during that merc round, Daniel would have just surrendered.

[mention]Rosetango[/mention]

Your character sticks their nose into places they shouldn't be, your character actively gets in the way of both Medical and Security situations to 'help' and all it does is create issues. When you come inside Security to comfort someone who just shot Sean Ritcher five times in the chest, and is now dead, he'a not going to be cool with you doing that. He's going to want you out. And at large, you actively disobey requests and orders to remove yourself from Security and Medical. You seem to force your character into literally every single situation, and constantly fight over comms with people who slight you. Don't be surprised when he attempts to physically remove you for disobeying orders to remain away from the murderer.

There's also a lot that Daniel has heard through other Security characters that has influenced what he thinks of her. I'm not going to spoil any of it, nor name any names, for the sake of RP and fairness.

On another note, during yesterday's heist round, while an ahelp was made concerning who had shot first, and we all waited together- [mention]CommanderXor[/mention], [mention]SeniorScore[/mention], [mention]Kolthoff[/mention]

Willow Harper decided to pop up, and insert herself, disregarding that he situation was being handled OOCly with the ahelp, as I had told her in LOOC, and dragged Kolthoff's Detective away, I was given an opportunity to shoot them both, but decided to remain waiting for the ahelp response. All the while he was LOOCing about wanting to be killed because we didn't RP to his standard before shooting him. And with these new developments, I may make a complaint on that as well, and Rosetango.

Phone responses are shit, so I might edit this into looking nicer. Probably not though.

You've disregarded the rest of my argurment and fall back on pointing out one single word and it's exagerated importance. You don't know half of my characters, or what their thoughts are on authority, or orders, or utilitarian thinking, so at this point you're just grabbing at the air.

Concerning orders, yeah, when given orders it's situational. When all the female crew are being stuck with service jobs, he's not going to enforce that. Had there not been extra units present during that merc round, Daniel would have just surrendered.

You rambled on in a vague response with no real point, so I focused on the part that was somewhat relevant. Stand on your soap box, Amory. I really don't care what you have to preach about how right you think you are. An opinion was brought up, and I gave my viewpoint.

I'm done with this exchange.

I rationalized what I did with facts from the round that came before me shooting anyone. If that's 'rambling' and 'vague' I don't know what you want.

A lot of what you being up has no basis in fact, and is just your opinion on what I've done with my own character in antag situations of dire stress and rapid action. The most you can lay at me is that I'm heated and sometimes baton stuff too fast- not applying to any situation involving you.

You want basis? I got basis.

I will only make mention of one round I wasn't very happy with Carmichael's actions. Admittedly, I wasn't in the stated round however this is very relevant to your behavior as Daniel Carmichael. There was this round 1-2 days ago in which I will be presenting as a whole evidence for making this post (Game ID: bVg-axe8) where I was Head of Security Drake Bond as Officer Daniel Carmichael. I am going to snip your character behavior as you mentioned, [mention]ReadThisNamePlz[/mention] was the investigator of the adminhelp that I had adminhelped on Daniel Carmichael. However, it was "IC Action" and no further explanation were provided. I did not want to doubt the investigator's decision because I had trusted the investigator so I decided to keep quiet until Xor posted this character complaint which shows that this Carmichael's common behavior.

- Do you have proof of me spending my rounds waiting for Antagonists to pop up?

Yes. This round alone is a proof. A proof that you went against my orders and attacked an antagonist in which the antagonist went full destruction on the station furthering you have failed to do your duties as a Security Officer. I don't know why the antagonist here was punished but not you. People were injured because of Carmichael's actions, Head of Security Drake Bond almost nearly popped his lung over this because he was close to the breach while saving a person while you didn't care.

I know I'm in the right for almost everything I do ICly because almost everything I do ICly is directed by Command, or questioned by ahelps which are then settled. If I was in the wrong with either as much as you claim, I would not still be playing here. Most every situation I'm in that is ahelped, is entirely legitimate and approved.

This is the attitude I don't like seeing nowadays. Why do you think you're having a player complaint now with including four people (including myself) pointing fingers at you?

Daniel is almost always a reserved and quiet character. For most rounds, he chooses to dick with people via playing a game of minor inconveniences and whining to Command, in order to get back at people.

This is a lie. You screamed over the security channel and face to face with other officers and attempted to order security officers to seize the wizard's staff in a presence of a Head of Security who tried to coax the wizard to calm down and discuss. I've seen you using vulgarities when you're not an antagonist, confronting an antagonist, or confronting a non-antagonist. Stress is not a good reason.

"And yeah, I get kills, I know what I'm doing.": I've been playing Security for like nine months straight, I think I'm like 8/10 at playing the role. Just because I'm getting kills and, as some say, disabling the antagonists, does it mean I go in validhunting.

I've been playing Security for like two years on and off. I've seen some good and bad officers come and go. I bet you're gonna say it doesn't mean a thing, right? You shouldn't always be focused on killing antagonists as Security Officer, that is not the very basic foundation of a Security Officer. The foundation is to be protecting the crew now I know that means you'll have to out your way to find and deal with the antagonist. From what I've seen, you're always trying to chase after the antagonist like in the round I've mentioned.

Let's go to the OOC side now. You also complained in LOOC. I cannot bear seeing more of this when I just want to play my game focusing on IC and not seeing LOOC or OOC. The only salts I ever want to see is after the round but not in the middle of the round. I do not want to see something like this "this person did this and is a bad player". I've started increasing my tendency to adminhelp on those who complain in LOOC. This is not acceptable and is never acceptable. It clearly violates the server's main rules. I am not going to disable my OOC/LOOC.

In Discord, I can tell you are very rude to other people even to me and becoming obnoxious to speak to which is why I had started avoiding having a conversation with you. I avoid plentiful of people who behaves in this similar way.

I'm going to address the one specific point that I know the most about. I can't give my opinion on the salt in LOOC or OOC, or his behavior on Discord. I do witness him in round enough to call out the claim he "sits around and waits for antags." I spend a lot of rounds playing on station when Carmichael is around. Most of them are as Security, but there's times when I'm a character I know for a fact Amory has no clue is me. He has never once denied my unknown characters roleplay if initiated with, even if he is in the middle of chasing someone down. When I play my more well known ones, it takes minimal effort to pull him into dialog.

There's a clear inner-working to the character that Amory is trying to convey, and people tend to get very upset if they don't get it. Daniel's a bit.... off. Well, not mentally, but he's not the social butterfly. He won't start up a conversation unless he knows you really well. The sheer amount of people like this in real life is astonishing. And you might be wondering how that comes into play. It means you will see him sitting there quietly doing his job, or watching cameras. (Which, I'd like to point out, sec gets ordered to do a lot on code green. I gripe about it constantly.) You will see him wait, because Daniel's not very sociable and won't go out and try to make friends. He does patrol, and he does talk on the Security radio.

In fact, Amory lately has been RPing Daniel with some sort of stomach ache (dunno the reason ICly). I believe this is his attempt at going AFK for a moment. We're all human. It's hard to tell when he's just being silent Daniel or he's gone off for a private break, but that doesn't mean he's just "sitting around, waiting to valid salad the antags." There's absolutely no real way to prove this other than "yeah, I totally saw his character sit in a chair for fifteen minutes, talking on the radio, and just waiting for the antag to arrive.". I sit around for fifteen minutes, talking on the radio and I've never been called out for "waiting on an antag". Are bartenders "waiting on an antag" when they stand at the bar, silently, waiting for something to go on at the bar? It's a very hard claim to prove, and one that falls a bit flat.

Like I said, I cannot vouch for any of the rest of the complaints. I believe that private messages between two people can't cross into a player complaint. I wouldn't pull my own disagreements with players from my private chats into the Aurora forums. Aurora cannot police what people do off their server. Period. They can discourage the two players from speaking and put a sort of hold against the players while on Aurora moderated platforms (discord, game, forums etc etc). If you believe someone might about to chew you out on Discord, inform them "I don't wish to discuss this here. Please handle it in a publicarea." and block or ignore them. It's what I do. I enjoy taking the higher road in things. Was he salty in LOOC? yes. An ahelp should have been made and I'm sure the mods on at the time would have been more than willing to handle it.

You may have valid complaints about the validhunting (I don't know, I am neutral on that due to lack of knowledge.) and about his hostility in Aurora moderated Discord chats/LOOC/OOC. But, as someone who plays more than they should, first point is a little startling to see in a complaint. And Rose, yes, Daniels character does have IC reasoning to start to dislike Willow. So that gets tossed out a bit.

[mention]UnknownMurder[/mention]

Your orders were followed, in fact, but as I was leaving to patrol, the Wizard engaged me immediately. Read can confirm this, as I sent a screenshot of it, and the logs will back this up.

"You shouldn't always be focused on killing antagonists as Security Officer, that is not the very basic foundation of a Security Officer. "

This implies that's what I do, which it isn't. The wizard did something extremely out of place and un-natural, converting a crewmember into another human being. The crew member, the bartender, was moved to the brig on grounds that they were no longer crew, and had unknown properties that should be looked at by Research. The wizard was also going to be detained, but I was not able to handle them alone. Given Daniel's stance on DNA manipulation into a different being voiding your employment with NT, and creating an unknown, the Wizard used this to threaten him with the staff, something that neither you, nor [mention]kyres1[/mention]'s Officer heard apparently, even though it was said right in front of Processing One, where you all were. When you ordered me to leave, I did so, and, as I already said, they decided to engage me. The issue was cleared up by Read, and I decided to cryo as the ahelp allowed the Wizard to get the drop on me while I responded.

Yeah, I bitched in LOOC after being dicked by the wizard while trying to answer an ahelp. They teleported to where I was and immediately used magic missle, just as they had at the Security lobby. Not the best move on my part, but I stopped after realizing that.

I play as Head of Security, and I play as it a lot. Even though I don’t personally interact with Carmichael very often outside of issuing orders and commanding situations, I can vouch for him doing more than just standing in the lobby and waiting. Even if Amory did have him stand there for half the round, they’d be doing the same thing several other officers do, and I don’t see any complaints being made about them.

On another note, I think it is perfectly acceptable for people to be opened fire on without any words, provided that they have already been known to be openly hostile and are armed. Once someone has opened fire on crew/security, lethal force is authorized, and that doesn’t end just because they aren’t actively firing anymore, or they escaped custody in that situation. They’re still armed and dangerous

Hello, [mention]Alberyk[/mention] and I will be handling this complaint.

Vouching for AmoryBlaine. I don't believe he plays security in a malicious fashion, having played alongside him as a peer and also above him as a superior to give out orders.

Cherrypicking 1-2 rounds out of a larger sample size that the player actually engages in (hell, somebody bring up a count for me in how many rounds he's played this month) is probably a sketchy proposition to skate your butt across because shit happens in rough rounds and nobody is gonna be happy when the shit hits the fan and their precious character dies/gets their ass kicked because of it.

The highlight of this thread, of course, has to be whatever UM's latest over-dramatized response is looks like it belongs on TMZ more than it belongs in this particular thread. It's just absurdly silly to read his response and I don't think it really dignifies an actual point-by-point answer, I'd suggest the person being complained about and the staff flat out ignore it.

It's interesting to see what kinds of attitudes the forums bring out.

Furthermore, it is not against the rules to roleplay a mean, rude or ill-spirited character. If you honestly take a character's actions against your own character as a personal offense/attack then you genuinely need assistance to help you understand how to separate reality from fiction.

Carmichael is not a perfect character by any means. I don't find the OOC statement by Amory to be particularly damning, as anyone who has ever played security or antagonists admits to liking the power dynamic involved. It's absolutely no secret that security/antagonist players play for action and conflict. I guarantee I'd have complaints this year about it if I played more regularly. It's easy to get very angry about being put in a losing position in a multiplayer video game, and everyone falls into that pit once in awhile.

I feel bad for the staff member that has to look over this because there hasn't been a single inkling of proof provided aside from gameIDs being linked with little indication or context as to what the staff should be looking for. Hear-say and over-dramatization make this a thread really difficult to browse.

I honestly do not expect a staff member to go out of their way to get what needs to be done in a timely fashion when little tools have been given to them to help them succeed in resolving whatever issues are outlined throughout this thread.

Bloody hell, what the hell happened to this thread while I was asleep?

I don't have any issue with Daniel ICly with what he does non-antagonist involved wise, but the moment an antagonist is involved he starts hunting for em. Maybe I don't see him interact with people a lot because I patrol a lot more than I stand around the brig, but I'm leaving this to the staff to look over the various logs to try and pinpoint anything concrete at the moment to help with this complaint. Several people have testified on my points, albeit there are others who have testified against it as well.

Right now, I'm concerned with the valid hunting and his toxic OOC behavior rather than the sanity/believability of his character.

Probably best to let the staff handle it from here on out.

[mention]Kryostro[/mention]

EDIT: His post was deleted, but it was not nice.

Harper and Carmichael were both 'vigilante's' with Harper basing her kills off the exploitable info, and Carmichael off whatever minor infractions were being commited. Your character is a massive prick, screams constantly, and always toes the line of misuse of communications and hooliganism. Daniel took the fact you sexually harassed the Technician as reason enough to lure you into Maintenance where he could kill you. It worked and you went to LOOC almost immediately. Your body was left in maintenance and was found not long after as I didn't bother to turn off the tape recorder you always carry and have on, and turned your sensors up to max.

And he took me into a private location and started killing me, and I noticed it started getting.. really edgy so I asked him to tone it down because it was making me uncomfortable, and he proceeded to be toxic, I can't remember the conversation, but I explained how the shift frustrated me, but he found my argument stupid, and more shit went on until I realized I should just let it happen after I did some Buddha Monk techniques, and beat the shit out of my keyboard But sometimes I delve into discord and watch him like a stalker, waiting for my moment to strike.

You have such a poor recollection of the events, that I request someone log dive for this to even be given any credibility. You claim it was toxic and edgy but at the same time cannot recollect any of it, all the while also making yourself out to be in the right. What happened was you were being killed, went to LOOC, I told you to RP, you didn't particularly want to, then I killed you as you acted LRPly. As I said before, I gave you the benefit of the doubt and did not turn off or take your tape recorder, and I turned on your foolishly off sensors so you wouldn't remain there for the rest of the round, and so I would be caught, pushing more events in the round.

Your language, and general behavior OOCly in this post alone is almost mirrored with that of your 'experiment' character Shane Castralo. I suggest you take a look at your own character, and self as well as how you carry yourself from a gameplay perspective; ie: having a recorder on you at all times making most any interaction with you by an antag that is audible- that is to say RP'd- incrimination.

I don't think Daniel Carmichael is roleplayed as a validhunting killing machine. And as far as salty anger, it seems to be in every direction here. All of my interactions with Daniel have largely played out as a carbon copy of when I play a security officer. He's just patrolling around, he can't get in deep with chair RP at the bar or anything- because he's security on the job. He responds to disturbance calls and handles the situation (me, with my various gambling shenanigans or war PTSD flashbacks across my various chars) and then goes back to patrol. Now there is a major difference in that Daniel can actually robust an antagonist when combat breaks out, and I can't, but the blueprint for professional detachment and being on the job is there. Now it's not like I have had access to security comms any time recently, so I can't really attest to how Daniel might cooperate and work with the rest of the security team and command. Namely, I stopped playing sec because it's a pretty hostile environment for the unrobust as security officers will salt if you easily get robusted, or god forbid, run in fear from situations above and beyond the call of duty. But within the past few weeks I have ventured to play security a scant 3 times or so, and what really stuck out to me was that each of these times Daniel was the only other person in security who was really willing to RP with me in any way at all that wasn't "Let's go get the bad guy" "fuck yeah." The conversations weren't extensive chair RP, but they were pleasant and lead me to believe that Amory's character was a level headed normal guy who was decently sociable.

I'm just going to say this. The next post that violates forum rules isn't being met with a warning, but a forum ban, temporary or permanent.

While I feel that ArmoryBlaine can be a bit validhunty at times, I genuinely think he's able to roleplay. I remember having a more than pleasant interaction with his character, Carmichael, when I did something antag related.

@Kryostro

EDIT: His post was deleted, but it was not nice.

Harper and Carmichael were both 'vigilante's' with Harper basing her kills off the exploitable info, and Carmichael off whatever minor infractions were being commited. Your character is a massive prick, screams constantly, and always toes the line of misuse of communications and hooliganism. Daniel took the fact you sexually harassed the Technician as reason enough to lure you into Maintenance where he could kill you. It worked and you went to LOOC almost immediately. Your body was left in maintenance and was found not long after as I didn't bother to turn off the tape recorder you always carry and have on, and turned your sensors up to max.

And he took me into a private location and started killing me, and I noticed it started getting.. really edgy so I asked him to tone it down because it was making me uncomfortable, and he proceeded to be toxic, I can't remember the conversation, but I explained how the shift frustrated me, but he found my argument stupid, and more shit went on until I realized I should just let it happen after I did some Buddha Monk techniques, and beat the shit out of my keyboard But sometimes I delve into discord and watch him like a stalker, waiting for my moment to strike.

You have such a poor recollection of the events, that I request someone log dive for this to even be given any credibility. You claim it was toxic and edgy but at the same time cannot recollect any of it, all the while also making yourself out to be in the right. What happened was you were being killed, went to LOOC, I told you to RP, you didn't particularly want to, then I killed you as you acted LRPly. As I said before, I gave you the benefit of the doubt and did not turn off or take your tape recorder, and I turned on your foolishly off sensors so you wouldn't remain there for the rest of the round, and so I would be caught, pushing more events in the round.

Your language, and general behavior OOCly in this post alone is almost mirrored with that of your 'experiment' character Shane Castralo. I suggest you take a look at your own character, and self as well as how you carry yourself from a gameplay perspective; ie: having a recorder on you at all times making most any interaction with you by an antag that is audible- that is to say RP'd- incrimination.

You know what? The recorder part is something I'll take a look at. Criticism is a good thing to have, and also I never think I said Shane Castralo was an experiment? But, you make some good points.

And yes, I found making a character that seems to be a idea that I know lots about, easy enough to use. Until I really get a good idea of a character that is original, I just go with something easy enough.

I can pitch in and say that I've had plenty of unpleasant moments with Amory using "authority" or "emotional instability" as an excuse to kill an antag beyond what is. One such incident that comes to mind is when I detained an antag (vampire or heister/merc, I think?) who had attacked multiple crew, including Amory's character Carmichael. While dragging him to processing to lock him away for the rest of the round, Carmichael comes wheeling in to the brig spamming in all caps and doing everything he can to stomp them to death and using the fact that he was attacked previously as an excuse. It got to the point where another sec officer and I had to beat him down to get him to stop.

However, I can say that I've never seen Amory explicitly going out of his way to kill antags beyond what is reasonable for the situation and his character. Honestly, it's easy to shit on security for doing their job if you've never even played a round of security and put yourself in their shoes, like Rosetango regularly does. Just play sec for a week and you'll slowly start to understand why they make the decisions they do when they're put on the spot. It may not always be the best decision, they're only a human behind the screen, but it's a decision they think is the best. Remember that sticking to a character and preserving a semi-realistic setting is more important than mollycoddling antags. I can personally assure you that no one, especially Amory, is going out of their way to ruin your round because "haha fuck you".

It's easy to sit back and whine about shitcurity and validhunting security when you've never bothered to put yourself in their position. If you're wrong about security being as bad as you say, then so what? And if you're right about sec being the big bad boogeymen you claim them to be? Then you have insider knowledge of how they work and can actually do something to try and change the way it works internally without whining on discord and making forum reports.