Re: Burger's Developer Application

#11
Given that you can already contribute to the code (and do so, extensively), why do you want to be on the dev team?
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Re: Burger's Developer Application

#12
+1 Burger is always coding new interesting features and is fixing bugs. It is funny that lots of his PRs made people scream, causing either extreme happiness or uhm hatred.
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Re: Burger's Developer Application

#13
Synnono wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 1:35 pm
Given that you can already contribute to the code (and do so, extensively), why do you want to be on the dev team?
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Re: Burger's Developer Application

#14
Oke, well, this has sat for a bit. I'll pester the developers to provide concrete input over the next few days.

My general opinions at the moment are a :+1: though. Burger is active and has a drive, which is needed. Also writes decentcode. There have been minor issues in the past with him, but I hope we can overcome them and that they won't pop up again.
"Homo homini lupus est," for more often than not, we forget to act human towards others.

Still, despite our forgetful nature, there will always be the next day.

Re: Burger's Developer Application

#15
I was on the fence for a while, even with the previous controversy, but as of now after some stuff i've read, I don't think Burger is a fit for Aurora staff. The level of stone cold disrespect he's shown to people offering feedback on his additions is appaling. I can't trust him to respond in good faith or treat the Aurora playerbase with any modicum of decency-- He's shown that he has little to no regard for anything people say, he doesn't even take his 'feedback' threads seriously, instead saying they're a waste of time and only dev opinion matters. He can't be trusted to act in good faith in regard to the community.
Spoiler:
BurgerBB wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 2:24 am
I'm not going to code something that I have 0 motivation to code for. That's how it works when I'm not getting paid to do any of this. I think a lot of people here are forgetting this.
BurgerBB wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:26 pm
I've repeated this several times to several people who brought up the same depressing point; which is something along the likes of "Miners are selfish/dumb this is bad for those poor poor miners, science is smart make them involved instead :("
I'm just going to start ignoring bad posts that paint miners in a negative light. Honestly I prefer posts that just saying "-1 retard addon" because it's faster to read and doesn't contain a very depressing viewpoint of our community.
BurgerBB wrote: Then perhaps when the pr gets merged (it will) you can modify it to your liking :)
BurgerBB wrote: Scientists are spoiled brats as it is,
science would constantly cry over common about materials like a spoiled child whose mother told them they can't go to mcdonalds every day.
BurgerBB wrote:If you're a science player and you feel left in the dark because of this, then tough titties.
BurgerBB wrote:Okay so the beauty of being a contributor is that I get to code whatever the heck I want unless the developers find that the code I produce is unsatisfactory
I don't think he can be trusted to work in a team, nor would he paint the devs in a decent light. These are all snippets from a recent feedback thread on Asteroid dungeons.
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NT-ROBO 486 (Formerly NT-A)
Spoiler:
(Previously an Android, it has recently been 'Upgraded' to a modern Robotic Computing Circuit. While it now lacks the ability of complex thought, it has been improved in multiple other ways.)

You see what seems to be a Robotic model before you. It looks very minimal but polished, mostly an Endoskeletal vibe with a new coat of paint. It'd have added plating and the regular core Modules as normal. It sounds very Monotone. It'd have writing on the center panel, "Now Improved!" Could be seen in bold.

Starting at the Chassis headplate, the optical sensors shine a blue, glowing light. The Opticals would be very visible in darkness, though they wouldn't emit much light beyond a glow. It could be distracting for onlookers, but never blinding.

Below the headplate, the 'Shoulders' of the Endoskeleton and some of the 'Lower body' have been re-enforced with Steel plating. This plating is usually replaced at the end of the Units work-cycle, or in the event of extreme damage. It's Spray-painted with bright colors depending on the Units current designation.

As for movement, the Unit has a pair of relatively light high-traction treads, very resistant to displacement, unless pulled. It tends to make little noise, one of the few boons of the model.

Elsewhere, on the front of the Unit, below the plating, it would have writing on the center panel, symbolising the Unit model and callsign: NT ROBOT 27-NT-U-486

When it speaks, it is rather monotone, hinting that the on-board Voice Modulator is also less-than-current.
Other characters that I play: Orbul Qablri'Tri-Qyu, To Journey Past The Known, Those Who Brave The Dark, Pe n %^ Y.
Junked characters I no longer play: Gale Russel, Isaac Einsley, Walks With The Rootsong, Penny (The Android), Warmth Of a Candlelight.

Re: Burger's Developer Application

#16
A lot of those require context of the attitude of the thread. It's best to read the context of those posts in the meantime.

Regardless, I am unsure if this is allowed to be made public or not, but Skull took serious note of my behavior and said that they would most likely do a trial run where I'm on the jedi council but I'm not the rank of master I will be granted "Trial Developer" for a period of 3 months to see how well I work with others. That might've changed, I'm not sure as Skull is dealing with some unrelated issues and still likely waiting for feedback.

I'm speaking as a living, breathing, human being when I say all those things. My absolute #1 pet peeve as a contributor is people forgetting that I'm doing all this work for volunteer. It gets absolutely irritating when people act like that I'm supposed to obey people when they suggest changes that I do not agree with, especially when they're suggesting it maliciously. I'm not ashamed to admit that everything I make benifits me, however that doesn't mean I'm not willing to do things that may not affect me, such as a science rework or fun antag stuff like chainsaws. Those issues won't pop up when working in a team because I'm sure everyone is on the same page. As far as I know, developers here don't get paid and will only do things that they feel like doing, which is incredibly fine and normal. The head developers aren't dicks, so I doubt that they would be demanding me to work on implementing 6 million different floor length braid hairstyles.

However, if people see how I express annoyance an issue, that's fine by me. I will continue to contribute to aurorastation no matter what my current rank is. Unless it's permabanned, in that case I will make a PR that rebases to vorestation.
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Re: Burger's Developer Application

#17
Objectively? Looks like you've opened some good PRs, and you describe them nicely. You should review other PRs. Developers do a lot of that.
Subjectively? Dunno the guy so can't say.

So :+1:.

Re: Burger's Developer Application

#18
In my opinion, Burger has decent code. I've seen some issues mainly with his attitude and with the... scope? Of new features he tries to add. Like many of our developers and contributors (some notable ones are Fowl and Pacman, as well as Burger), he seems to prefer the stick to the carrot when trying to impact player behavior. However, in the instances where he has tried to catch flies with honey instead of vinegar, I've seen some very good results- notable examples are the upcoming modular kinetic accelerator and mine ruins PRs.
In terms of player attitude, I have some gripes regarding behavior in OOC and with specific character. However, it's nothing that I think will impact Burger's work as a dev.
Honestly? I feel like Burger would do well as a dev, though maybe he needs to re-examine what direction he takes his development in (I think his recent work showcases what he can do if applied in the right way very well), or perhaps instead be put on a shorter leash regarding what contributions will and won't be accepted.
A notable example of the 'stick instead of the carrot' behavior is the vendor food change that was both widely disliked by players as well as game breaking. I heard an alternate proposal, also by Burger (to my knowledge), that involved foods made on-station being buffed/more beneficial, while keeping vendor food the baseline. Without commenting on the balance or feasibility of that specific proposal, I think that the kind of logic demonstrated in that suggestion is more of what we need to see. I already see this with how, in order to make modular KAs interesting and useful, they were buffed instead of nerfing the non-modular KAs.
I think Burger would do well on the development team (with some personal reflection), and I look forward to seeing what he has to offer Aurora, as after a while of gaining experience he seems to be moving in the right direction.

EDIT: Given recent events that show that Burger hasn't changed at all, I retract my +1.
Last edited by MoondancerPony on Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Burger's Developer Application

#19
Burger's like a chimp with a machine gun. A lot of power and no restraint. He's going to put in whatever he wants, and he doesn't care if you or anybody else likes it. As soon as you elevate him to the status of developer, you're going to make him think that he's got a blank check to do whatever he wants to Aurora code. He already displays this behavior, so I shudder to imagine how bad it could get once you all let him think his opinion is intrinsically more valuable than everyone else's. I know you're all desperate for the rapidity of changes he offers, but I feel some of you are going to get serious buyer's remorse on this one.

And it would be one thing if he only acted with callous disregard for the desires of the Aurora community, but even worse, he is extremely bloodthirsty and pedantic about it. As has been observed on multiple occasions, if you disagree with one of his suggestions, then he treats you like a personal enemy and quickly resorts to mockery and mudslinging to try undermining anyone who's not on board with his changes. And if that doesn't work, he just wipes his hands and says, "Oh well. I'm the guy who makes the changes, so you're gonna have to deal with it :)"

It is my observation that Burger doesn't have a suitable temperament to act as part of the development team. You might like a lot of the changes he will make to the game. But then, you also might not - if you don't, you're going to be shit out of luck. We would get better results by just letting him continue to code as an independent contributor. He's going to be coding his pet projects either way; it's better that he have more, rather than fewer, checks and balances.

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Re: Burger's Developer Application

#20
I initially gave a +1 to this thread when it came out, but I've decided to remove it after having followed a few suggestion/feedback threads. I'm not switching it to a -1, I'm just neutral now. He seems to do good work and arguably quite fast, which is nice, but I don't think fast is always needed.

Like some others I'm worried by his behavior. I don't hold the mercenary attitude of a contributor he has against him, it is a perfectly reasonable attitude, but he follows it up with a short fuse and/or hostility.

Would you becoming a developer change your attitude or behavior in some way? Your answer to Synnono's question
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doesn't make much sense to me since as a contributor you have all the say in your projects and you don't seem to enjoy at least the discussions here on the forums?
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