Staff Complaint - TBear

#1
BYOND Key: Rosetango
Staff BYOND Key: TBear13
Game ID: bVj-dsAn
Reason for complaint: I disagree with my warning. It implies that I'm trying to get around the CCIAA suspension Harper has, which I am not. I'm playing Harper as a clean freak and germaphobe. She does not like dirty environments as I've explained here, and I'm playing Harper as she is meant to be played. I had been around since round start and did not start cleaning up until around 30 minutes before round end, after Harper literally observed the janitor stand in a bunch of dirt and not clean, and even went off to the bar to have a drink.
Evidence/logs/etc: https://imgur.com/a/S9M4Z66
Additional remarks: None, right now.
Leah Siskin - NSS Aurora Quartermaster
"I have a right to be heard, to be seen, to be loved, to be free, to be everything I need, to be me, to be safe, to believe in something." I Have A Right, Sonata Arctica

Willow Harper - NSS Aurora Janitorial Staff / Civilian Staff
"They heard me singing and they told me to stop, quit these pretentious things and just punch the clock. These days, my life, I feel it has no purpose, but late at night the feelings swim to the surface. 'Cause on the suburbs the city lights shine, they're calling at me, 'come and find your kind.'" Sprawl II, Arcade Fire

Re: Staff Complaint - TBear

#2
Rosetango wrote:
Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:38 am
BYOND Key: Rosetango
Staff BYOND Key: TBear13
Game ID: bVj-dsAn
Reason for complaint: I disagree with my warning. It implies that I'm trying to get around the CCIAA suspension Harper has, which I am not. I'm playing Harper as a clean freak and germaphobe. She does not like dirty environments as I've explained here, and I'm playing Harper as she is meant to be played. I had been around since round start and did not start cleaning up until around 30 minutes before round end, after Harper literally observed the janitor stand in a bunch of dirt and not clean, and even went off to the bar to have a drink.
Evidence/logs/etc: https://imgur.com/a/S9M4Z66
Additional remarks: None, right now.
Hi there. So, yeah, the warning was applied for two major reasons. The first reason being that your janitor character, who is currently suspended, was going around the hallways and the sec lobby, cleaning all the floors with a bar of soap. To me, that seemed very much like you were trying to bypass the suspension, and even if that wasn't the intent, it essentially does. I understand that Willow is a germaphobe, but if my engineer got suspended, he wouldn't still be patching breaches and wiring the solars, no matter how much he dislikes leaving parts of the ship vented, y'know? As for the second reason, this isn't the first time you've been contacted by staff about, and been asked to stop, this sort of thing.

Re: Staff Complaint - TBear

#3
And I explained both times, that Willow hates unclean surroundings and will take it upon herself to clean. The suspension itself is not related to whether or not Willow can clean, it's related to the fact Willow punched a captain in the face. To me, it seems like you're trying to tell me how to play my character and trying to justify it with something of an unequal proportion. And as I said, Willow literally watched the janitor of the time stand in a hallway full of dirt, and accept an invitation to go to the bar.
Leah Siskin - NSS Aurora Quartermaster
"I have a right to be heard, to be seen, to be loved, to be free, to be everything I need, to be me, to be safe, to believe in something." I Have A Right, Sonata Arctica

Willow Harper - NSS Aurora Janitorial Staff / Civilian Staff
"They heard me singing and they told me to stop, quit these pretentious things and just punch the clock. These days, my life, I feel it has no purpose, but late at night the feelings swim to the surface. 'Cause on the suburbs the city lights shine, they're calling at me, 'come and find your kind.'" Sprawl II, Arcade Fire

Re: Staff Complaint - TBear

#4
Just chiming in here as the person who applied this suspension:

The disciplinary action taken was due to Harper's assault of a Head of Staff during a lore event. As far as CCIA is concerned, being suspended means she is not allowed to come to work and get paid for it until she's satisfied the requirements imposed by the suspension. If the character joins as a Visitor and does not access areas or equipment that they should only be accessing on the job, then the character probably isn't violating the suspension.

If the mod team wants to interpret someone cleaning the floor with soap for free as "playing Janitor" when the character is not taking up the Janitor job slot, then that is a separate issue. In terms of IC rules, though, Harper probably would have been okay in this instance.

As an afterthought, when attempting to enforce these CCIA actions at the OOC level, I feel that there's an appreciable difference between someone who's been restricted from a largely-roleplayed job slot, and one with a job that tends to have a significant impact on the flow of a round, like one in security or engineering. In my opinion, a warning would be appropriate for a suspended officer who grabs a security headset and goes on patrol for antags while visiting the station. In this case though, I think the character's behavior deserves a closer look.
Player of: Zahra Karimi - Jennifer Beal - Rez Adesida - Reina Kikuchi - Reza El-Tahir
Have questions about CCIA? Feel free to ask!
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Re: Staff Complaint - TBear

#5
I'll be taking this complaint.
Tbear13 wrote:I understand that Willow is a germaphobe, but if my engineer got suspended, he wouldn't still be patching breaches and wiring the solars, no matter how much he dislikes leaving parts of the ship vented, y'know? As for the second reason, this isn't the first time you've been contacted by staff about, and been asked to stop, this sort of thing.
While Tbear does make a good point here in that a character's backstory and etc. cannot justify them breaching a judgement like this, my judgement here lands in a similar place to Synn's:
Synnono wrote:The disciplinary action taken was due to Harper's assault of a Head of Staff during a lore event. As far as CCIA is concerned, being suspended means she is not allowed to come to work and get paid for it until she's satisfied the requirements imposed by the suspension. If the character joins as a Visitor and does not access areas or equipment that they should only be accessing on the job, then the character probably isn't violating the suspension.

If the mod team wants to interpret someone cleaning the floor with soap for free as "playing Janitor" when the character is not taking up the Janitor job slot, then that is a separate issue. In terms of IC rules, though, Harper probably would have been okay in this instance.

As an afterthought, when attempting to enforce these CCIA actions at the OOC level, I feel that there's an appreciable difference between someone who's been restricted from a largely-roleplayed job slot, and one with a job that tends to have a significant impact on the flow of a round, like one in security or engineering. In my opinion, a warning would be appropriate for a suspended officer who grabs a security headset and goes on patrol for antags while visiting the station. In this case though, I think the character's behavior deserves a closer look.
I'd take the time to word my entire statement separately, but most of what I would say was already nailed here. There's a big difference between picking up a piece of soap as a suspended Janitor and fixing breaches as a suspended Engineer. This is an IC issue, and I'll be speaking with Tbear about expunging the warning soon.

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Re: Staff Complaint - TBear

#6
SirCatnip wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 5:50 pm
-snip-
Alright, I can't say I disagree with the ruling here, based on what Catnip and Synn said, and I apologize for overreacting about the cleaning, so, sorry about that. I'll get that warning removed in a bit.
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