On the subject of security

[Cassie]

Being able to do shit like that is hilarious. I enjoy both sides of the spectrum, that of upholding and maintaining order, and wreaking total havoc and perpetuating chaos. I love doing crazy shit that makes people laugh. But hey, I have a serious side too, and I won't tolerate stupid shits that are shits for the sake of it, either.

 

The problem I have here is that everything believe everyone not agreeing with sec is into chaos, and there's only two ends of the spectrum that everyone lingers. Some people have been tossed into the brig for having tasteful, mild roleplay, and sometimes good roleplay - and being judged for that. Some people have been thrown in the brig for false charges because the sec officer was too busy judging to actually have the situation investigated before assuming stuff.

 

Because I have done both. I happen to find the most success and least damage out of playing an intolerant, by-the-book security commander that doesn't take shit from people anymore. Unless they had a perfectly justifiable reason to do what they did, they're still going to be put into a cell, whether they surrendered/fessed up to it or not. But it's really obvious when people are in the wrong. But I do this because people act shitty for the sake of being shitty and try to make other people's experiences full of unnecessary, completely avoidable grief. I deal with non-antag regulars more than I do antags as security, which is bloody appalling.

 

"More success" in what? RP, or "winning", because I'm confused of what you are trying to succeed in here.

I am not saying no one can be arrested for crimes, because they can. But the following issues need to be realized.

1. Low risk or harmless fluff crimes (like someone sneaking whiskey out of the bar) can be ignored during, say, red alert on a nuke round when there's more important matters at hand. If security are going to stress to people about how they're horrible because "they've got so much to do", they need to prioritize.

2. Security can be a drug for some people. You can hate a certain person so much, that you're willing to crank up the charges, be hostile, and then brig them longer if they bite back. Security can be the perfect department to enact a metagrudge or gang up on someone, and get away with it for this reason. This is why I say security has a lot of power, and needs an equal amount of responsiblity to balance that. If people can't handle this, they should just admit it.

3. I'm not talking about griefers, this is not the conversation. I'm talking about roleplayers, roleplaying fluff crimes. Situations and times that are obviously roleplayed. There's a huge... huge difference. Whenever I have this conversation people instantly jump to the stereotype of the worse crime committed and goon-originate asshole you can imagine.

 

I happen to find the most enjoyment out of being a very assault-heavy antagonist. I don't like peace-like antagonists, because I know I'm going to get meta'd either by: 1) "holy shit you're not actually a trader are you, what are you, some kind of SYNDIECATE?" *pulls out katana* 2) "Oh hahaha you're a trader with lethal weaponry and paramilitary gear, that totally makes sense,

 

I don't actually have a problem with this, never said I did. I hate peaceful antags (though I don't police them), please understand that not ganking is not the same as being peaceful. Yes, that's an issue, but my complaint was ganking, not non-peaceful antags.

Okay, to wrap this up.

Here's the issue: I too believe in freedom on how people should roleplay; until it starts pressing on people's toes. I'm not even here criticizing every aspect of security that I do not like; there are plenty - I am only bringing up stuff that affects the RP of people who are not security. It's not like security are some secluded role on the station that hardly interacts with anyone else, they have an active part in shaping the round for everyone else, so please, please please just tone down the shit. Allow antags to breathe a bit, roleplay sec a bit more realistically - you're not army commando for gods sake... not on extended anyway.

[VoltageHero]

Here's the issue: I too believe in freedom on how people should roleplay; until it starts pressing on people's toes. I'm not even here criticizing every aspect of security that I do not like; there are plenty - I am only bringing up stuff that affects the RP of people who are not security. It's not like security are some secluded role on the station that hardly interacts with anyone else, they have an active part in shaping the round for everyone else, so please, please please just tone down the shit. Allow antags to breathe a bit, roleplay sec a bit more realistically - you're not army commando for gods sake... not on extended anyway.

 

See, no, this is the issue.

While I've stated that Security shouldn't just flashbang antags, or rush in rambo style, this is also annoying, they also aren't at fault for everything.

 

Tone down the shit

This is an issue. As you yourself state, people's experiences with Security vary on a case-to-case basis. You can't tell somebody to "tone the shit down" just because you've had a bad experience. Would it be justified for somebody, who had a crappy CMO, to tell medical to "learn to do their jobs"? No, because this doesn't happen to everybody, and they can't speak for the entire group. You are, and have been, picking sour apples to represent a group, and acting as if they were the majority.

 

Roleplay sec a bit more realistically - you're not army commando for gods sake... not on extended anyway.

This is also an issue. Judging from what you've said earlier,

Cassie wrote:

Especially when I've seen security overreact to small regulation breaks, I'm thinking "Mate yes, it's written in the books. But pick your battles smart on this one if you have more serious stuff to follow up on.", and there's no need to be stressed. Unless the floor is literally coated with blood, everything is tg/goon tier, chaotic, no RP hospitable environment, and the station is about to blow up, it will be okay (OOC'ly) if you don't catch them all. It's not Pokemon.

 

it seems that you just want Security to ignore 'small' issues on one-hand, but want them to be played more realistically on the other? You can't have your cake and eat it too. It seems like, you're more or less annoyed that Security is arresting people for "minor crimes". Mind you, I've had people scream and rant at me in LOOC for having contraband. People get angry when they get told they can't draw on the floors. People get angry when they get told to leave a department that isn't theirs, even after being told by department staff to leave. Are these the "small issues" you want security to ignore?

If that is the case, then the station would have a good deal of it's crimes ignored, and I believe, more people would be angry with Security for that, than they are for arresting people due to these crimes.

That said, what is "more realistically"? They act just as realistic as a lot of other departments. Like I said, you can't have them set to a higher standard, and let everybody else do whatever. They aren't police officers. They aren't robots. You can't act more realistically than security already plays. Why? People respond in different manners. People behave in different ways. Maybe what may not be realistic to you, is what somebody would really do in real life.

[Filthyfrankster]

ll I can say is if you haven't played Security, do so, on a messy round too.

[Cassie]

Okay, bit of an old topic to bump up?

But yes, I stealthily play three different sec officers on this server - to note, I only play on peak hour. My conclusion is that other servers way more chaotic than Aurora. That's why I roll my eyes when people say they're getting irl stressed from the most mundane things because they stack sec every round. Hypatia and Paradise have it worse than you lot, that's chaotic. Not saying that you should let the server degrade to their poor RP standards, but seriously - they really do. I've played on them.

I too have experienced the angry self-antagging asshole who doesn't format their sentences, shouting shitcurity, and trying to bash me with a crowbar, it was something but I don't think my blood pressure ever rose.

[Guest Menown]

Look at it this way.

Lots of security players don't want to arrest you. They don't want to have to ruin somebody's day. They don't want to go toe-to-toe with armed hostiles. We just want to RP. We talk with people, (mostly other security because everybody else hates us). We try to RP with people.

But when all of that is torn apart because Chuckle McCatbeast or John Doe BitchFuck decides to steal/vandalise/generallyruineverything, we sometimes don't enjoy what we do. Because while we're trying to keep /the crew/ having fun and preventing them from being griefed (which a lot of us do), we end up getting these threads, with people bashing every little thing we do.

You people say you want smaller crimes left alone, but when somebody's trespassing in your department or stealing something from you, who do you call? We're the people you go to in order to keep the round sane, and in that same venue, we're thrown aside when you're in our target, all because you decided that you don't like us because we /did our job./

It's a never ending battle between you wanting us, and you not wanting us. All I know is, it'll keep going and it's forcing a lot of us become jaded. We'll help you, but we'll do it begrudgingly, because enough of 'omg shitcurity y r u arresting me' to 'omg r u serious?' to these threads here, drains on us. It quickly becomes 'why do we even bother helping, they just hate us anyway.'

[Cassie]

Meowy, when Voltage replied he missed the context of what I said. What I actually said was "Hey guys, you know you can prioritize? So, if there's a nuke round going on and ops are shooting people, you can forget about the vandal and chase the op instead. We don't blame you.". I'm not saying "Ignore vandalism forever!".

I didn't clear it up because I did not have the energy to (I hate misrepresentation of my viewpoints), hence stopped replying.

I think security is essential part of the station, a very needed part of the station; but often abused. When abused, it can easily become the thing they're IC'ly supposed to defend against. I do remember one of your characters being a "sociopath" security officer, if I recall. I can name five security officers that I enjoy interacting with and are quite pleasant examples of security done right - so I know that attitude is purely choice.

Lastly, if you see what the actual complaints made on security lately, it's not "Oh, you're arresting over every little thing." it's over actual misuse of the role, including "You didn't process them when you should because you were angry", "You deliberately mischarged me", "This person harmbatoned my character's ribs for insulting them back", and antags going "You found a way to kill me even though I was not even hostile". etc.

And the reason there's a bit of anger towards the department is because most of those situations were gotten away with or excused, and it would seem that a majority of security members do not care and will not bother to check if they or other sec officers are treating crewmembers as they should - causing resentment.

[Guest]

Welcome to security; you will never win, even if you try your best to lose.

[Cassie]

Ehh, can we transfer any points people want to make about security onto the other thread? Arguing about security should be someone else's problem now.