yeehawguvnah Posted October 20, 2022 Posted October 20, 2022 (edited) BYOND Key: Yeehawguvnah (action taken on Discord) Staff BYOND Key: Unsure (action taken on Discord) Game ID: N/A (action taken on Discord) Reason for complaint: Yesterday, there was a discussion in the Aurora Discord's code_dungeon channel about Bieselite Consulars and how they would be seen by the SCC. I and several others disagreed with Cybs, and after a while this was said (I am "Weakest Dominian Exile"). Cybs makes a remark about arguing that to the lorestaff. They did not tell us to take it to the lorecord at this point. A minute later, they tell us to take it to the lorecord - and I do. I made one post after that, which was a few seconds after Cybs' and was appended to my last one. To emphasise, their post and mine were moments apart, it's not like I continued to argue after they said it. As soon as they actually said "take it to the lorecord", I left the discussion, and I did actually take it to the lorecord. Despite this, I was issued a strike several minutes later. I believe this strike was unnecessary. I did exactly what I was asked to do, when I was asked to do it ("you can try and argue that to the lorestaff on the Discord" was not clearly an instruction at all - it comes across as "don't argue with me, argue with lorestaff" not "don't argue here, argue in the lorecord") The fact that I did do exactly as instructed after Cybs clearly said "take that to the lore discord" is evidence that I'm more than willing to follow the instructions of staff, that I was acting in good faith, and that a strike was not needed or justified. Evidence/logs/etc: Included above. Additional remarks: Maybe it's petty to appeal a Discord strike, but I don't want an unjustified strike on my record. All I want is for it to be ruled invalid, not for Cybs to be punished. Edited October 20, 2022 by yeehawguvnah fixed a bracket again
WickedCybs Posted October 20, 2022 Posted October 20, 2022 You leave out the part where after I had to strike Ben for continuing and then temp banned them for trying to be funny about it, you got on my case and much like they did, began trying to get the last word in about my conduct. This was all the same situation. So. You were adequately warned. You saw how I had to deal with Ben. You then continued on to post weird criticism defending a guy who posted a funny gif (which was deleted) then said "uh oh stinky". I don't believe that wasn't you effectively trying to continue things by framing it in a different way, especially after I was practically begging you two to stop and reinforced that I wasn't trying to be an asshole, I just wanted things moved to a different channel. So like I said there. Please give me a break here instead of doing this, because I really shouldn't have to say "Do not do this thing" without striking you and then deal with the upset when you do that thing and I finally issue the strike. Dreampixl was also partly in that conversation, but they instantly stopped as soon as I said again to stop talking about it in the code channel. So they were the only one who went unstriked there. For the future if you want to be sincere, you can always DM one of us if there's questions regarding something that happened. In this case though? You were rude even if you didn't intend to be and you didn't follow the instructions.
yeehawguvnah Posted October 20, 2022 Author Posted October 20, 2022 (edited) 58 minutes ago, WickedCybs said: You leave out the part where after I had to strike Ben for continuing and then temp banned them for trying to be funny about it, you got on my case and much like they did, began trying to get the last word in about my conduct. This was all the same situation. If the strike was because I said this Why doesn't the text of the strike reflect that? Also, I didn't dispute the ban; I criticised engaging in a debate and then striking the other person in the debate, on the grounds that the debate was in the wrong place - it takes two to tango. Once again, I did follow the instructions. I did not engage in the debate after you made it clear we shouldn't, even if I later posted about a different topic (the strike) in that channel. You say "I don't like the idea of you two not going to the proper channels for this" but I literally did. 58 minutes ago, WickedCybs said: Dreampixl was also partly in that conversation, but they instantly stopped as soon as I said again to stop talking about it in the code channel. So they were the only one who went unstriked there. no Dream was participating longer than I did. I'm sorry, but it is absurd to frame this as "practically begging" us to stop. You said, and I quote "take that to the lore discord". And I did. Edit: I won't be further addressing Cyb's responses to this until another staff member has been able to weigh in. I don't want to argue over this when the facts of their response are demonstrably not accurate. Edited October 20, 2022 by yeehawguvnah expanded on wording
WickedCybs Posted October 20, 2022 Posted October 20, 2022 31 minutes ago, yeehawguvnah said: If the strike was because I said this snip Why doesn't the text of the strike reflect that? "I switched topics" is an excuse, it's effectively the same conversation and I noted along with the strike (where staff can read the background) that you were dragging it out. This isn't a strong point to hinge anything on. 32 minutes ago, yeehawguvnah said: Also, I didn't dispute the ban; I criticised engaging in a debate and then striking the other person in the debate, on the grounds that the debate was in the wrong place - it takes two to tango. Once again, I did follow the instructions. I did not engage in the debate after you made it clear we shouldn't, even if I later posted about a different topic (the strike) in that channel. You say "I don't like the idea of you two not going to the proper channels for this" but I literally did. You're just reframing what you did here, which is pretty dishonest. Trying to say "It takes two to tango" when I'm essentially making it known there is no "debate" anymore and that it should be moved while you two still don't stop at all. Let me be clear. I didn't want to deal with you or the other person at that point and was cognizant that this excuse would be used. On the discord we're not going to waste time trying to get a second staff member in while someone keeps going off in the chat just because they're invested and unable to drop a topic, or want to disguise their indignation with "criticism" over a staff action. 48 minutes ago, yeehawguvnah said: no snip Dream was participating longer than I did. They commented mid-conversation there and dropped it promptly when I gave them the heads up, then thumbs upped my comment to presumably let me know they acknowledged it. So not only did they not keep continuing the conversation, they were far more courteous and respectful overall. 52 minutes ago, yeehawguvnah said: I'm sorry, but it is absurd to frame this as "practically begging" us to stop. You said, and I quote "take that to the lore discord". And I did. It's absurd that I have to deal with the dogpile, Ben shitposting in response to me repeatedly saying to just move things elsewhere and then you haranguing me after for dealing with it as if I deserve to get put down by either of you in a conversation that initially had far more polite people that I was talking to. Ultimately it was your choice. You just reasoned that there would be no consequences.
Peppermint Posted October 20, 2022 Posted October 20, 2022 Hello, I'll be taking this. I should have a resolution tomorrow, given it looks like everyone has had their say.
Peppermint Posted October 21, 2022 Posted October 21, 2022 Okay! So I’ve looked through this and the logs and I agree that a strike was fine, though I also agree it could have been worded better. As in, instead toward your attitude after being told to stop, though it was originally the wrong channel thing that caused it so I therefor have no real problem either way. If anything, it’s the ‘softer’ approach than striking for a shitty attitude toward staff, which would be looked upon a lot less favourably should there be a follow up. I also really don’t think there was a conflict of interest here, especially as feedback was asked for in the staff discord by Cybs as to breadth of punishment anyway. It’s something of a myth that staff should never ever touch anything to do with themselves, and more so better practice not to if there’s another option - and this was such a minor issue that dragging someone else in would have been silly. I agree that you had plenty of reasoning and forewarning given someone else was dealt with prior, and then then the continuation after of following up as to being unhappy how it was handled - just go straight to the complaint next time if there’s a problem like this. To my mind Cybs took the ‘gentlest’ punishment option available to him when it came to the wording. However given complaints are a review of both parties, I’ll be sticking a note on the strike to better represent what happened and to add more context, given I believe the attitude issue was just as much of a problem. That’s all from me. Will be locking and archiving unless there are any new developments.
yeehawguvnah Posted October 21, 2022 Author Posted October 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Peppermint said: That’s all from me. Will be locking and archiving unless there are any new developments. I can live with that outcome. One question, though - when do strikes expire?
Peppermint Posted October 21, 2022 Posted October 21, 2022 I’m not sure they expire per say. They’re also not really like notes in the fact that they’re recorded concisely. As I was saying about them being the gentler approach, you’ll be entirely fine unless you pick up an absolute ton or continue one specific issue - they are really not a big deal at all.
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