Being non security

[Last_stand_crew]

It's not much of a complaint, rather a question, though i'm still sad that it happened somewhy, but on the one before round with ID cAJ-dzKM there was situation like this:
somewhat 12 people, and maximum 8 joined at the start, there was no security, i mean, really, no one was playing on sec, and i was on character Amy Veir, surgeon resident, next, our miners get on aim of a random with their gun and this assailant wants bluespace drive, what do i know right now? one of miners called for help through main channel and didn't say anything else, while second didn't know what happened to first and got hostaged too, so no more info, all crew thought it's just miners got hurt so i went for captain's spare ID card, knowing that it should be somewhere around his office, to gain access, then i take paramedic's RIG and ask what's up, go to hangar and see a random pointing his gun at engineer, what next, you ask? now fun begins: i ask A-help whether i can scare antag away with a big gun i could find in armory... just to rescue hostages, nothing else, while he says: "want to do something like this, play security", well, i knew that i would be probably rejected with some reason like i (somewhat) quoted, but then happens something i am pissed about! there's still no security, no, only a cook, cargo tech and yet another engineer joins round (maybe someone else, but no security, at least from start of the round and till the end of story i'm telling, i mean, after last event i told ya somewhere around end of round one officer joined), but atmos tech (i don't remember his name) asks for that spare cap's ID card i had, and with Radiance (R&D worker) engages! they take a gun with something like tranquiliser and handcuff him, though first attempt was unsuccessful and he drawed not just a revolver type pistol, but a rifle, other stuff i'm furious about is already IC issue so i won't go into much detail here, the main POINT is that players, who have chosen jobs that aren't connected to security by any means did something i wanted to do, but got rejected because of playing job that's not connected to security!
Now, what the question is? can players do security job if there's no security on shift? at least to save other crew or whole ship??? because it feels like some admins just don't understand situations or something like that, OR any player who do this just get noted or even banned! i just want an answer, because i don't understand what's going on now...

[Last_stand_crew]

i do not know if i chosen the right topic to ask this, i do not know if i even had a right to write something like this, but i will be happy if there would be answer from at least five admins which are pretty much same with the idea: "yes", or "no"

Edited Thursday at 09:27 by Last_stand_crew

[Loorey]

I've moved the topic into the General board for you since this is not a staff complaint and does not belong in that subforum.

On the note of what you actually wrote:

7 hours ago, Last_stand_crew said:

Now, what the question is? can players do security job if there's no security on shift? at least to save other crew or whole ship??? because it feels like some admins just don't understand situations or something like that, OR any player who do this just get noted or even banned!

To answer this, no, you cannot blatantly do the job of security. And I can assure you, we do understand. You've been talked to by both me and another Modmin that round, the other Modmin being Jasorn, who told you that self-defense in any case is totally acceptable, but you are not to blatantly hunt down the antagonist(s). That's not okay.

This is a very situational thing, which is why you should always Ahelp before doing anything. You did Ahelp and it was explained to you to only act in self defense, as the antag was not really escalating strongly at all, you were told to let the gimmick play out and if something happens to you that you can defend yourself. 

[dessysalta]

Hi, I was the secoff during the latter half of that round.

To add onto what Loorey said, acting as security while non-security is reserved for the worst of circumstances, and generally requires a good in-character reason to do so regardless. Situations that aren't mass-cas(ualty) often don't warrant a citizen's arrest unless you have strong reason to believe there's going to be mass-cas in the very near future with no one to stop it—even so, you need to get into the logistics of it. Medical student is presented with a hostage situation, decides to break into the armory or find a gun, go gung-ho around the antagonist to scare them off? Even in a hypothetical scenario where this works and no shots are fired, this is stretching the limit of what a reasonable person would do, particularly one with so much to lose and not a whole lot to gain. Hostages are already a huge bargaining chip that stops normal security from antagonizing them without a well thought-out plan, factoring in power armor and military-grade weaponry and even common sense and it's no contest.

When there doesn't exist any security on or off-duty, there's usually slack given in order to interact with the antagonist; this more means you can act with hostility towards them, not that you can gear up past bare essentials (which usually means what's on your person/what a reasonable person would take with them to minimize injury to themselves). Hostages, like the ones mentioned during the round (though I don't have the full story), can organize break outs particularly in severe circumstances like this. I've been spoken to a few times about acting as security in non-security positions, and it really is highly situational. Off-duty Vedhra warrior for hive K'lax, sees horrorform changeling and thinks its Lii'draic? Feel free to engage, but be on the defense more than offense. On-duty bartender with security too busy to handle what might be a vampire? Put down the bat and get some fear RP going on. When red alert is called, that usually means all bets are off and you can assume that things are about to be fucked if they're not already, but still try and wait for guidance from your other crew members, if not a head of staff (and as Loorey said, ahelp to be sure).

More OOCly, it's just not a good idea to play the hero as medical, especially if you're the only one in the department. People, including antagonists, rely on you to make sure no one dies or is kept out of the round for too awfully long. This doesn't mean you should be a doormat, but think of a scenario where another non-security character might pick up a weapon, and restrict yourself to something twice that severity before you opt into that kind of play. You'll eventually learn to play it by ear and figure out when it would be reasonable to rush into the defense and blast them to bits, but it's exceedingly rare and needs to be justified up the wazoo before it can be considered.

[DatSamTho]

Honestly, in my experience, it's best to err on the side of caution until you can get a pretty good sense for this type of thing. It took me quite a while until I got out of my "MUST KILL ANTAGS" phase and actually got enough experience to know when it's okay to act as non-security crew.

Though generally what I can think of as tips:

- Your sense of preservation is the most important thing. Try to keep that in mind at all time.

- If there is security, unless your life or health is in danger, leave it to them. The only caveat for this is, if security has been broken after an engagement, and it seems pretty clear that the antags have won over them, in which case:

- If there is no command, or security (Or most of them are dead) and there is a clear threat to the ship, or your safety, it's probably pretty safe to arm up. Now, this doesn't mean that you should go and hunt down the antag. What I've seen happen most times, during things such as lowpop vampire rounds, and such, is an impromptu crew militia forming, as it's generally safest to be in a large group.

- Every round is unique, and there's no real one-fits-all solution to every single one, in the end you'll have to use your best judgement depending on the current situation, your character and job. And always ahelp when in doubt.

[Last_stand_crew]

On 24/07/2025 at 19:50, Loorey said:

I've moved the topic into the General board for you since this is not a staff complaint and does not belong in that subforum.

On the note of what you actually wrote:

To answer this, no, you cannot blatantly do the job of security. And I can assure you, we do understand. You've been talked to by both me and another Modmin that round, the other Modmin being Jasorn, who told you that self-defense in any case is totally acceptable, but you are not to blatantly hunt down the antagonist(s). That's not okay.

This is a very situational thing, which is why you should always Ahelp before doing anything. You did Ahelp and it was explained to you to only act in self defense, as the antag was not really escalating strongly at all, you were told to let the gimmick play out and if something happens to you that you can defend yourself. 

well then why did other players do what i asked if i can? yet again (i won't get tired to say this) they were not security, it was not self-defence, but still they risked their and others lives (hostages) to stop the criminal, though they did it without casualties there was a possibility of someone getting hurt (and one of the crew eventually died because we didn't at least check for all of his pockets so that he wouldn't get out but it's not the topic), the topic is: are they going to be banned for their activities, @Loorey
some more: i mean, seriosly, i even asked in A-help if they asked to get permission do something about this antag, admins said that they never got permission
oh, one last thing: i guess i probably look like i want to talkshit or something, but the problem is i'm so confused, i wasn't permitted, they did what i wanted probably without permission and i wonder if they even never got warned that they broke game rules... i just need an answer

Edited 11 hours ago by Last_stand_crew

[Loorey]

3 hours ago, Last_stand_crew said:

well then why did other players do what i asked if i can?

You asked to get weapons from the armoury to hunt down the antag, they did not do this.

3 hours ago, Last_stand_crew said:

the topic is: are they going to be banned for their activities

No.

3 hours ago, Last_stand_crew said:

i wasn't permitted, they did what i wanted probably without permission

Once again, they did not. It was them ultimately managing to disarm the antag in a self-defense scenario, then arresting them. Which is totally fine. There were no weapons from the armoury involved like you wanted them.