Absolute Unfair Ruling - Pratepresidenten, ShesTrying

[BurgerBB]

 

BYOND Key: BurgerBB

Staff BYOND Key: Pratepresidenten, ShesTrying

Game ID: b4N-a07t

 

Alright. So here is what happened in full.

I join mid round as a cyborg. Code green, but my laws were overridden. The AI asked me if I knew my updated laws and I said yes. I asked them what the plan was and they said they didn't really have a plan and that I should act normal. Another cyborg chimed in and offered gimmick advise, and the AI followed that. It was very clear the AI didn't know what they were doing and I genuinely thought they were new.

A MALF AI later orders me to cut power to the SM. I am extremely hesitant to do this as sabotaging power is against the rules without escalation and I saw 0 escalation from the AI's part. I also initially thought they wanted me to cut the main APC that was in charge of powering the high volume pumps, as there is quite a big difference to cutting power TO and FROM the supermatter. I cut power from the supermatter, hoping that is what they meant. Later in the round they wanted me to cut power to the Tesla. I was also hesitant at first because again, another act of power sabotage that I didn't really see any escalation for. It's against the rules to do it without proper escalation so I put it low on my priority list, but eventually did it.

APCs started to explode all over the station, and power was failing quickly because of my sabotage. However, I noticed that because of this, the departures APC exploded which is a serious APC that may or may not have affected the AI's gimmick later down the road as well as a potential rule violation as I have been noted in the past for sabotaging the APC. In the meantime, the AI was constantly bitching at me for not cutting the power despite me actually cutting the power. I told them that I did indeed cut the power but they did not seem to believe me. I discovered that RCON was setup properly very early in the round, which mean that cutting the main power did nothing. I decided to then sabotage the security SMES without anyone asking me to as they were starting to get suspicious of the AI and I needed to keep them out of the armory.

When the crew shuttle was called, the AI asked me to go into a combat module. I asked the AI to hold on because I needed to rescue another cyborg who fell in a hole. They did not respond back, from what I recall, so I kept on as a construction module (needed for repairs), trying to find the fallen borg. I fell in a hole, thinking it was the cyborg's light, but it was just the training wing for security. I tried getting back in by carefully screwdriving EVA open as I did not want to cause any alarms, but the AI kept resetting me despite my plees to ask them to stop. I told them that I was stuck but they ignored me and kept trying to reset me which prevented me from getting unstuck for a bit as there was an indestructible nanotrasen flag in the way and a table I could not shoot at.

When I managed to to get to departures, they wanted me to be a combat borg and prevent people from leaving and kill the HoS. I didn't see any need for this, as I was just as capable of preventing them from leaving as a construction cyborg and I thought it was excessive that they wanted me to murderbone people trying to leave despite them not really being involved at all in the round. I don't remember exactly, but I ahelped this or the order to kill the HoS, and said the admin couldn't deal with it, so I didn't do it in fear of breaking rules. I compromised by placing a human-to-cyborg machine in the bridge in order to convert crew. The machine was placed oddly, so it didn't work as planned, so I engaged in combat with the Head of Security, trying to place them on the machine. I failed as they had a fire axe.

A complaint was made against me for not following orders. I defended myself saying that I wasn't acting malicious at all, trying to help improve the round, and that I actually followed the orders, except the Head of Security order because I could not successfully kill him and at the time, there was no escalation for this. The complaint was ruled against me because I didn't follow the orders to kill crew who were either not present on the shuttle or they weren't involved at all in the round. I didn't want to risk a murderboning ban, so instead I tried to roleplay it out by making a machine converter on the shuttle and making people enter the cockpit, which as I said failed.

I don't think this is fair to me or anyone who plays on the server. I don't think the admins in question did not look at the logs close enough and did not really consider intent. This is what the admins had to say.

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Burger, you still need to follow orders as a borg. Following orders within reason only applies to non-malfunctioning cyborgs, and you are slaved to your master AI. If you have an issue with actions, please ahelp. Ignoring orders because you OOCly don't agree with them isn't acceptable-- you will be noted for the failure to follow orders.

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So the ugly truth of malf is that you, as a borg, can go fuck yourself half the time. The AI is the primary antagonist, and as such, it can use its unquestionably loyal slaves to further its goals without much care for their well-being. Now, that doesnt mean it can just order you to your death 4noraisins, because that would break rule #1.

A slaved malfborg should only care what its master wants, and execute its command to the absolute best of its ability. And I fail to see this happen here at all.

It is NOT your job to provide interesting roleplay and fun for people. That is on the AI, and you should enforce its will.
It is NOT your job to question if an order from the AI is valid. You are its slave, do as you're told.
It is NOT your job to circumvent your orders and do what YOU think is best. Again, do as you're told.
You are NOT the judge of what gimmick is good or valid. You sit on a FRACTION of the information the AI does.
The AI does not need YOUR permission for anything. Slaves have no rights, do as you're god damn told.

That being said, I get the festering shitpool of distress and worry that might have happened as no staff was there to help you out, but I find it greatly concerning that you find it hard to follow basic rules of escalation with each order given without being given explicit permission by staff to do things the AI told you to.

I really dont know what else to tell you here. If shit like this happens and staff is fucking gone, go to cryo. Noone will fault you for dodging an unnecessary shitfest and dumbass complaints such as this one.

If everything is shit, and noone can help you. Walk. Away.

 

Perhaps UM was a shitmalf, but not shit enough to warrant administrative action.
You, however, broke the rules, and for such, you will recieve a note.

 

The complaint is considered resolved, and I will axe it tomorrow.
If you disagree with it, you know the way to the staff complaint section.

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You must maintain character at ALL TIMES. No suiciding to leave the round (ghost or use cryogenic storage), and no random grief at round end. Avoid chucklefucking. You are slaved to the AI. Do as you're told.

Additionally, keep your character's goals in mind. For example, as security, during a traitor round, your goal is not to catch traitors, but ensure the safety of the station and provide assistance as needed. Again, slaved to the AI. Do. As. You're. Told.

And from the synth wiki:
As a Cyborg, you are a type of Station-bound synthetic designed to serve the crew of the NSS Aurora, much like the station's AI. You are an extension of the AI and are required to do anything it asks (within reason). <---- The "Within reason" part does not apply to malfborgs.

 

 

Like none of what is posted here is sane or rational. They're saying I didn't ahelp but I did actually ahelp. Twice, but an admin wasn't online.

"You must maintain character at ALL TIMES." was cited as a rule break despite me doing that, giving the AI advise, doing things as they asked to the best of my ability. If I was a rogue borg of a rogue borg, I would've completely ignore the AI, which I didn't. I did what I was told but at a pace that showed that I had good intentions.

"Additionally, keep your character's goals in mind. " same as above. My goal is to serve the AI and I don't think I'm serving the AI when I'm cutting their main source of power, but I did it anyways because that is what I was told. I tried killing the HoS at the end. I tried preventing people from leaving by spamming as many doors that the AI could interact with as possible in departures. I followed the AI's goals.

"As a Cyborg, you are a type of Station-bound synthetic designed to serve the crew of the NSS Aurora, much like the station's AI. You are an extension of the AI and are required to do anything it asks (within reason)." was also cited as a rule break because apparently the "within reason" does not apply to rogue borgs despite that not saying that literally anywhere.

 

And the worst part about this all is that I think the handling admins had 0 empathy really. They didn't give a shit that the AI was acting like a total dick to their cyborg and causing them issues. They didn't give a shit that they were constantly acting like a dick in the complaint thread. They just echoed the sentiment that I'm a slave and that I should do whatever the AI tells me to do regardless if it breaks OOC rules.

 

And honestly the passive aggression from the staff was just fucking awful.

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So the ugly truth of malf is that you, as a borg, can go fuck yourself half the time.

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If you disagree with it, you know the way to the staff complaint section.

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The AI does not need YOUR permission for anything. Slaves have no rights, do as you're god damn told.

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I find it greatly concerning that you find it hard to follow basic rules of escalation with each order given without being given explicit permission by staff to do things the AI told you to.

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I really dont know what else to tell you here. If shit like this happens and staff is fucking gone, go to cryo. Noone will fault you for dodging an unnecessary shitfest and dumbass complaints such as this one.

 

I saw people miserable in a round. I tried my best to escalate every order because it is my responsibility as an antagonist to do this. I got praise here and elsewhere for escalating properly and trying to make the round fun and creative for others. This wasn't me hijacking the AI's gimmick, I was doing what they were told but I was applying more to it. Despite my good intentions, I'm getting a note and a berating from staff because I didn't do things fast enough and I was questioning the AI's decision.

 

I think there is a problem here. The problem is that the staff in question are forgetting that there is a player behind the screen. There is a player who has all antagonist preferences off and isn't used to playing an antagonist. Despite being here for 2 years, I still have a lot to learn about this game and I am still learning yet apparently when a player who doesn't play antagonist that well, does something good for the crew at the expense of a player who is upset because I didn't do things fast enough in the last few minutes of a round.

 

It's honestly an extremely sad state when you have a MALF who admins said didn't escalate properly and "perhaps played a shitmalf", but deemed there was no punishment needed. They did deem there was punishment needed to the player who doesn't play antag on a regular basis, who tried their best to help the round for others, and allegedly broke the rules for not doing things fast enough because they were extremely concerned about escalation in a round with no staff.

Edited December 31, 2019 by BurgerBB

[BurgerBB]

I also take issue with the fact that they prematurely closed the player complaint thread after saying the last word, but I guess that's not really a problem since this thread exists now.

Honestly it would be nice if the HoS of that round could comment on whether or not they felt that they were going to lose the fight we had in the cockpit at any point. From my perspective, it feels like I did almost get them a few times even with a screwdriver. I don't know if anyone knows this, but screwdrivers are pretty robust.

[Cnaym]

@ParadoxSpace and I will handle this one. It's a long one so please give us a bit of time.

 

[Cnaym]

On 31/12/2019 at 01:44, BurgerBB said:

A complaint was made against me for not following orders. I defended myself saying that I wasn't acting malicious at all, trying to help improve the round, and that I actually followed the orders, except the Head of Security order because I could not successfully kill him and at the time, there was no escalation for this. The complaint was ruled against me because I didn't follow the orders to kill crew who were either not present on the shuttle or they weren't involved at all in the round. I didn't want to risk a murderboning ban, so instead I tried to roleplay it out by making a machine converter on the shuttle and making people enter the cockpit, which as I said failed.

Think that explains the point rather well. You tried to follow the order in your own way, without getting permission from the malf itself. That is the main thing that went south in this case. If you as malf borg have a better idea you can discuss it with the malf, if they like it they can allow it, else you are still slaved and have to follow their original order.

On 31/12/2019 at 01:44, BurgerBB said:

Like none of what is posted here is sane or rational. They're saying I didn't ahelp but I did actually ahelp. Twice, but an admin wasn't online.

Let's condense it down to the gist of it:

Making the story of the round is job of everyone, the gimmik however is for the actual antag to devide. In this case the malf.

You are slaved to the antag, that means a) you have to follow their orders and b) can act as bad as they order you to.

If you get the order to kill every crewmember and think that it lacks escalation, announce it over the radio and start following the order. The crew will win in this case, you can ahelp the malf for wasting you without good reason, you can ahelp before that and have staff decide if it makes sense to follow that order, but

and that's a big but:

As long as an ahelp does not tell you otherwise, you have to follow the orders. If you fear that you'd get in trouble for doing so, you can always cryo and make a player complaint. In this case, the part of escalation was for you to do, the order was as clear as it gets.

On 31/12/2019 at 01:44, BurgerBB said:

There is a player who has all antagonist preferences off and isn't used to playing an antagonist.

That is an issue I see in the style malf selection is handled, and that the borgs are forced into an antag role. However by staying in round, you agree to playing team antag. There is nothing forcing you to do so and a player moving to cryo to avoid being forced to antag a round which they did not want to antag will not yield staff action against you.

I get that it sucks to be a forced antag, however the decision to stay in round and go through with it was alone yours to make.

On 31/12/2019 at 01:52, BurgerBB said:

I also take issue with the fact that they prematurely closed the player complaint thread after saying the last word

This happens when they discussion is most likely not going to yield anything usefull from that point on. This thread will now serve as a place for further complaints and two other staff members have to handle it. A new staff complaint is exactly the place to take things if you disagree with a prior staff ruling.

 

Onto how the situation was handled itself: 

The malf was deemed not great, a lot of malfs aren't. The staff members in question also deemed the malf not rule breaking, so they did not see the need for staff to step in and pace a note or warning on them.

You as the borg went against the malfs orders, did not discuss the idea with them, but instead forced your own way of doing things. That is not acceptable for a borg. You received a note for doing so.

The note itself displays this: You did not intend to do any wrong OOCly, but still failed to follow an order ICly.

That is really as harmless as it gets and describes quiet well what happened. Even if you did not mean any evil by it, you still failed to follow proper (slaved) cyborg play.

For the future, please go to cryo and file a player complaint. If the ahelp is not handled in a timely manner during round (that is our fault) do not decide to handle it yourself (that is your fault).

This was not formulated as a result however, to give you the chance to respond if there is anything you'd like to add. It's just my two cents for now, reformulating a lot of what was said before to condense and maybe better explain the thought process behind it.

[BurgerBB]

I suppose agree with the ruling as long as the note fully reflects my intentions. I didn't discuss the orders with the Malf because I genuinely thought they were a new, and they were being hostile towards me. To me it was a player who didn't really have a plan in mind and it was a player who wanted me to kill everyone in departures. It was wrong of me to assume that, but I don't think you can blame me for doing so.

[Cnaym]

Spoiler

As a result of this (link) complaint, a note is placed denoting their failure to follow the orders of their malf AI. Although their intention was to help out a new player and improve the overall round, they will ahelp or cryo next time instead of ignoring an order from the malf they are slaved to.

Made a couple of small adjustments, but this will be the note on your record. There is nothing really wrong with it from my point of view. If you want to add anything, feel free to do so or let me know if this complaint can be considered handled.

[BurgerBB]

That seems fair. The only reason I appealed is because notes mean something. I don't think an admin can look at this note and say that I'm one to cause shit.

[Cnaym]

In that case I consider this handled and will close it within 24 hours.