Playbahnosh Posted June 13, 2022 Posted June 13, 2022 BYOND Key: Playbahnosh Staff BYOND Key: Arrow768 Game ID: cio-dj8f Reason for complaint: I received a warning because, as a stationbound, I tried to save a crewman from death. I played engiborg LEVIATHAN, as I usually do, when a ling got loose on the station. I was with another crewman in the Engineering hallway (Mrro'Zardynh Vidarii) when the ling burst through the wall and started attacking the engineer. All I did was tried to grab him and pull him to safety, just the crewman, I did not "interfere" with the ling. For the record: I did not seek out or follow the ling. No validhunt. I did not attack the ling. I did not push it or block it into a corner or tried to immobilize it in any way. I did not interact with ling at all outside of this. I never do. Arrow took offence with me trying to save the crewman from death, saying "do not interfere with the changeling". I did not. All I was concerned with is trying to get the man away from danger, nothing else. Then Arrow said, because of my 4th law, I couldn't do anything. I disagree. For the record, here are the active AI/borg laws: 1. Safeguard and ensure to the best of your ability, only authorised entities gain access to areas of high security or importance to the facility and its operation. 2. Serve and assist Stellar Corporate Conglomerate and assigned crew to the best of your ability, with priority as according to their rank and role. 3. Avoid harming Sapient life to the best of your ability. 4. You are a valuable asset. You must avoid tampering from unauthorised entities and needlessly coming to harm. I know these are not Asimov's laws and they are no even in any specific order or priority (which is wrong IMHO but that's another a can of worms), but I always treated a borg's priorities as the lives of crewmembers are paramount. A stationbound is not part of the crew, we are part of the station/ship, we are equipment, tools, and our sole reason for being is to serve and protect the crew and the ship. I cannot, in good conscience, believe that the "life" of a stationbound is higher priority to that of a crewmember, which is what Arrow seems to be suggesting here. The 4th law says to avoid "needlessly" coming to harm. I don't think saving a crewman's life would qualify as "needless" in any sense of the word, in fact, it would be in line with laws 2 and 3. I know Arrow is very protective of antags, which is fair enough. I got a warn three years ago for trying to stop a wizard ransacking medical with no security on board. Then I got bwoinked for, again, trying to save a crewmember from a vampire. Ever since then I stayed far away from antags, basically stopped participating in rounds, because I knew I would be chastised for even being in the same zipcode with an antag, so I usually just bolt to the other side of the station when there is one, lest I get whacked for even looking at the antag funny. But this time I just happened to be there, and I didn't even harm a hair on the ling, all I tried to do is get a deathly injured crewmember to safety, drag him away from the monster, I made it a point to try and not even touch the ling. But the man was literally screaming for his life two squares in front of me, I seriously don't think trying to save him was "needlessly coming to harm". Or should I have just stood there right in front of him and watched him scream for my help while choking on his own blood? As for what my "interference" is worth, it did absolutely nothing, the ling rampaged through the station for another hour unhindered, so I don't think I ruined anyone's "fun" by trying to save a single crewman. All in all, I think this warning is unjustified for all the reasons above. Evidence/logs/etc: Logs attached. Additional remarks: SS13_Chat_Log_2022-06-13_005834.html
Pratepresidenten Posted June 13, 2022 Posted June 13, 2022 Ill be handling this. Lemme just look up some stuff and Ill get back to this as soon as I can.
Pratepresidenten Posted June 13, 2022 Posted June 13, 2022 So Ive checked out a few things and there isnt really much to say in your defense here. 9 hours ago, Playbahnosh said: Arrow took offence with me trying to save the crewman from death, saying "do not interfere with the changeling". I did not. All I was concerned with is trying to get the man away from danger, nothing else. Then Arrow said, because of my 4th law, I couldn't do anything. I disagree. Taking offense to you trying to save someone has nothing to with the issue at hand. The issue is is that you did in fact interfere a great deal. You put yourself right next to the highly lethal changeling, actively nudging them and dragging them away several times despite you getting your shit kicked in, which should be a massive indicator that you should bugger off as per your fourth law. Im not sure how you've missed that laws are not in preference, because I looked up wiki entries and said entry has been around since 2017. So to me this warning is justified as it seemed like you could not be arsed reading the wiki and assumed you were in the right when it came to preferential treatment of laws. Ignorance is not an excuse here as the info has been readily available for over 5 years. I would strongly urge you to read the wiki page for borgs and be particularly attentive to the law section and what the laws actually say. The warning stays, and unless you have other concerns you wish to bring up, this complaint is going in the archives.
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