The Life Expectancy of a Human.

[George VI]

There are many different feats in medical technology presented before the player in SS13. The ability to heal a third degree burn in an afternoon, the ability to cure sepsis with a few injections, the ability to restore the dead; all amazing things. This also makes one wonder how long an average, healthy human with an average diet would live?

Seeing as we are reaching 85 in 2015 and in 1915 we were at about 50, should it be expected that people would live easily to 100+? Could it be assumed that at some point between 2015 and 2457, humans found an answer to the malignancy of the human cell? We're expected to find a perfect prevention by 2030, so I can't see why not.

Is it unreal that someone who is 45 could still look like they are in their 20s? Let's hear it.

[Jakers457]

I've heard life expectancy goes to 200 or more apparently. So aging, aesthetically speaking, could depend on your lifestyle.

[Guest]

Well, this is from the Wiki:

Inner Colonies - 210-250.

Mid Colonies - 190-230

Outer Colonies - 160-200

Frontier - 130-180

It was never explained how and why, but I'm guessing it is by gradual genetic modification of populations and improved medicine.

However, I think no one in game actually has a character that is nearly as old, but not senile, making the unatural lifespans pointless in the long run.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

I found the prospect of doubling lifespans a little strange, especially because it's not at all replicated IC'ly, so I've always just isolated myself from this part of the lore, pretending it didn't exist and that everyone lives up to 90 and dying before hitting it is like dying before hitting 40 IRL but 110 is the median age we kick the bucket due to 'natural causes'.

The people I can (sorta) mentally justify living longer are the ones that replace literally everything with mechanical parts, but even then the brain itself is subject to entropy or gradual decay, then there are the commonplace accidents...

In my head, and with no obligation for you to follow, I've always roughanded death from natural causes being around

Core worlds - 100~110

Inner Worlds - 90~100

Outer worlds 80~90

Frontier Worlds 70~90

[Jakers457]

Though I believe a human brain has a shelf life of 150 years? I don't know, I will have to do some looking into that.

[Erik Tiber]

I found the prospect of doubling lifespans a little strange, especially because it's not at all replicated IC'ly, so I've always just isolated myself from this part of the lore, pretending it didn't exist and that everyone lives up to 90 and dying before hitting it is like dying before hitting 40 IRL but 110 is the median age we kick the bucket due to 'natural causes'.

The people I can (sorta) mentally justify living longer are the ones that replace literally everything with mechanical parts, but even then the brain itself is subject to entropy or gradual decay, then there are the commonplace accidents...

The current average lifespan is 85 in many first world nations. Current projections put us at having a lifespan of at least 90+ in first world nations by 2100, not accounting for technological advances. You'd realistically be able to easily see people living well over 120 years, even without replacing literally all their parts with mechanical replacements.

You can clone any bodypart you need. Organ replacement should be as casual as something like, say, getting a hip replacement. We have regenerative membrane too, alkysine, cryotherapy, MMI's and the ability to create fully prosthetic bodies... this implies an in-depth knowledge of the workings of the brain and the human body. If all else fails, you could just excise the brain of the patient anyway and put it into a new body. The extent of the cloning and gengineering tech implies a level of knowledge of human anatomy such that they could easily be made to produce stem cells for people and use that to help prolong their lives. Just produce new stem cells from the patient's body, you could probably use that on so many different injuries to help them recover.

How are these people dying anyway? Looking at a chart on Wiki, 29.4% of deaths are from cardiovascular disease, 23.04% from infectious and parasitic diseases, 12.49% from cancers, 6.49% from respiratory diseases, 6.23% from unintentional accidents, 3.45% from digestive diseases, 2.84% from intentional injuries, and a bunch of others.

You can grow a new heart. You have centuries of research into infectious diseases and should have a very in-depth understanding of virology by this point, you'd almost certainly see a major drop in mortality there. Cancers, you can clone new organs entirely and even then people have likely developed vaccines for many major varieties of cancer. You can replace any part of the body, or even all of it. Just take out the patient's brain and put it in a new body. Brain cancer would be the major threat there. Respiratory diseases, you can create new lungs entirely, or use prosthetic lungs.

We basically have the capability, in game, for non-destructive mind uploading. People can scan brains and make new copies of that brain. That implies an immense amount of knowledge regarding neurology and how the brain functions. We can create an entire prosthetic body, see cyborgs. We have alkysine and other medicines. And we can clone literally any part of the body which is damaged beyond repair, or just replace it with a superior mechanical prosthesis. These prostheses, also interface with nerves and the brain. We have MMI's too. So really, the question is "How would people manage to die so early?"

It's also pretty heavily implied that we're using some form of nanotech in medical on a routine basis. Bone gel, regenerative membrane, nanopaste. Some of the medicines from chemistry function as nanotech in all but name, like alkysine, or cryoxodone, or dylovene, or peridaxon.

This is centuries in the future, with people colonizing multiple star systems, with massive advances in worker productivity to boot. The primary limiter to lifespan would be expense, not the science. With enough money you'd probably be able to make someone functionally immortal with this level of tech, or at least give them a long enough lifespan that you won't be finding out what their 'expected lifespan' is for the next couple centuries.

In my head, and with no obligation for you to follow, I've always roughanded death from natural causes being around

Core worlds - 100~110

Inner Worlds - 90~100

Outer worlds 80~90

Frontier Worlds 70~90

 

 

Though I believe a human brain has a shelf life of 150 years? I don't know, I will have to do some looking into that.

Well, in this case you already have genetic engineering, augmentaiton to extend shelf life, nanotech, various other tech advances. You'd reasonably be able to extend the shelflife of the brain by a significant amount.

Edited April 28, 2015 by Guest

[George VI]

I think it'd be common to see people in their 40s, 50s, and 60s looking and feeling 20 years younger then they really are. Maybe we could just have it so characters can be as old as they like without having to carry around a cane and be angry grandpa.

[Erik Tiber]

I think it'd be common to see people in their 40s, 50s, and 60s looking and feeling 20 years younger then they really are. Maybe we could just have it so characters can be as old as they like without having to carry around a cane and be angry grandpa.

I'd certainly imagine. I have a 62 year old security officer who looks like he's just on the cusp of middle age and is able to act just fine as a fit security officer, and his only augment is a pacemaker.

We have had people naturally live to 120 years of age. We'd have had centuries to research how the genetics of that works, identify how various genes could contribute to lifespan. We're already identifying several genes which correlate with significantly lengthened lifespan, and in game you have supercomputers, AI's, computation technology which is certainly advanced enough to significantly contribute to genetics research and research in general. You wouldn't need to resort to distributed computation schemes like the protein folding distributed supercomputer run by Stanford. You could run something with maybe even a million times the power of that on the highest-end supercomputers in-universe.

You'd be able to get probably at least a thousand times as much computing power out of silicon, maybe even ten thousand, and then there's quantum computers (which Positronic computers are IIRC), there's light-based computing, there's graphene, diamondoid materials... and you have so many more resources now anyway, so it's not like you'd be wanting for space.

EDIT:

Really, you may well see 40 year olds be considered 'young adults' similar to modern 30 somethings or late 20 somethings. 50 and 60 year olds could be considered the equivalent of 30 somethings, and when you hit 70 you're now considered 'middle aged'.

In my opinion, such a different society could be very interesting to consider. That's part of why I like science fiction, because you get to look at a world different from the modern day and see how such a society functions. How would you respond to such a society? How would you act? There is an awful lot of talk about making things more interesting for kplayers, or less boring. It's why we have the alien species. What about making humans equally interesting?

[Tainavaa]

So without the expensive health care, do you think we could say that the average human being lives to what Jackboot outlined and it could be changed to varying ranges of age and even different media of life depending on someone's wealth and preferences?

If that were to happen then people are free to continue their characters as they are and it's also possible to do what Erik did and have a much older adult who might look as young as someone 20 years his junior, among other things.

[Rusty Shackleford]

When it's all laid out like this, it actually does make sense to drastically increase the lifespan of the average person in the SS13-verse. Cloning and prosthetics would already ensure a few more decades tacked onto one's life on their own, and the possibility that the medicines used have nanotech incorporated into them would actually add several more.

[Erik Tiber]

So without the expensive health care, do you think we could say that the average human being lives to what Jackboot outlined and it could be changed to varying ranges of age and even different media of life depending on someone's wealth and preferences?

If that were to happen then people are free to continue their characters as they are and it's also possible to do what Erik did and have a much older adult who might look as young as someone 20 years his junior, among other things.

Well sure, if they're a bioconservative they could just forgo certain treatments on philosophical grounds and end up choosing to die early. Or perhaps they could have a kilswitch installed to cause their own deaths once they reach a certain age, like you can get in Eclipse Phase.

For others, you could give them the option of living much longer, yeah. On a related note, you'd probably see some treatment or other for menopause, which combined with iron wombs really removes the age limit on having children, as well as many of the limitations associated with it. For example, you can still go to work on the rather hazardous work environment of the Aurora without putting the fetus in danger.

As for varying media of life, Lockie is sorta an example of one possible variety. She had a good portion of her brain replaced with mechanical prostheses, somewhere in the ballpark of half, in addition to having all her major sensory organs replaced as well.

You could also have stuff such as, say, a person in a fully prosthetic body (likely designed to appear outwardly human), or a person with a fully prosthetic brain in a (mostly) organic body. Such a person could originate as either someone who opted for a gradual destructive upload, or a synthetic who opted for an organic body.

When it's all laid out like this, it actually does make sense to drastically increase the lifespan of the average person in the SS13-verse. Cloning and prosthetics would already ensure a few more decades tacked onto one's life on their own, and the possibility that the medicines used have nanotech incorporated into them would actually add several more.

Cryoxodone and clonexadone would make so much sense as nanotech. They only activate at low temperatures. Temperature is the primary limiter on how quickly nanobots can operate. If they move too fast, heat builds up to the point where they shake themselves apart. Therapeutic hypothermia is already used to prolong the life of cardiac arrest victims, and it would also cool down nanomachines, letting them operate more quickly.

[Tainavaa]

You could also have stuff such as, say, a person in a fully prosthetic body (likely designed to appear outwardly human)

 

Like Katelynn McMullen.

[Erik Tiber]

You could also have stuff such as, say, a person in a fully prosthetic body (likely designed to appear outwardly human)

 

Like Katelynn McMullen.

That's what she has? I didn't know we already had players doing this. That's pretty cool!

[Rusty Shackleford]

You could also have stuff such as, say, a person in a fully prosthetic body (likely designed to appear outwardly human), or a person with a fully prosthetic brain in a (mostly) organic body. Such a person could originate as either someone who opted for a gradual destructive upload, or a synthetic who opted for an organic body.

 

I started watching Ghost in the Shell today. And suddenly I'm starting to feel really hype over the prospect of this being a thing.

[Tainavaa]

You could also have stuff such as, say, a person in a fully prosthetic body (likely designed to appear outwardly human)

 

Like Katelynn McMullen.

That's what she has? I didn't know we already had players doing this. That's pretty cool!

 

Yep. But that's another thing people have a problem with for some reason. No idea why.

[Jakers457]

Because if it's different it's snowflakey, and we don't like snowflakes here. -hocks one up into a spittoon- We only accept edgy ex militants, upperclass women and angsty xenos around here.

[Jamini]

Because if it's different it's snowflakey, and we don't like snowflakes here. -hocks one up into a spittoon- We only accept edgy ex militants, upperclass women and angsty xenos around here.

 

B-b-but I-I-I d-d-don't h-have any of those.

My Xenos aren't angsty.

My women are mostly middle-lower class.

I don't have ANY ex-militants.

... AAAAAAAAAHH

/fleestheantisnowflakepitchforks.

[Tainavaa]

Damn... Tina is upper class... brb retcon

[Erik Tiber]

You could also have stuff such as, say, a person in a fully prosthetic body (likely designed to appear outwardly human), or a person with a fully prosthetic brain in a (mostly) organic body. Such a person could originate as either someone who opted for a gradual destructive upload, or a synthetic who opted for an organic body.

 

I started watching Ghost in the Shell today. And suddenly I'm starting to feel really hype over the prospect of this being a thing.

I know that feel. I know that feel so bad, bro.

Yep. But that's another thing people have a problem with for some reason. No idea why.

Bah, those people are excessively silly and their arguments are excessively silly. There's no question that they can make prostheses which appear outwardly human (and if someone argues otherwise I will lol so hard). And it bugs me that I am thus unable to play my character in a consistent manner, because she has, in the past, very much wanted to conceal the prostheses, and is still self-conscious of them to a degree, so to have her decide to not use these organic-looking prostheses is out of character for her.

The impression I get is that so many people would very much like something like, say, prostheses, or augs, or other transhumanist elements. Or that, at the very least, the vast majority of people will not be bothered by the addition of these, or that the annoyance of this minority would be small enough as to be outweighed by the massive improvement this could mean for so many people's roleplay, by allowing them to play in an actual future society, with actual futuristic attitudes and technologies, rather than just 2015 in space.

From my experience on the lore team (before Jackboot became the head, so note that this isn't commenting on how the current one conducts itself), it seemed like there was more of a lowest common denominator view towards this matter.

Because if it's different it's snowflakey, and we don't like snowflakes here. -hocks one up into a spittoon- We only accept edgy ex militants, upperclass women and angsty xenos around here.

Oh, and people covered in scars, which they could easily and cheaply fix but voluntarily choose not to. You know, I should totally have one of my characters ask someone about why they chose to get those cool-looking scars.

[Jamini]

Oh, and people covered in scars, which they could easily and cheaply fix but voluntarily choose not to. You know, I should totally have one of my characters ask someone about why they chose to get those cool-looking scars.

 

Actually, far as I am aware having scars removed is not mentioned as expensive or cheap. Generally, however, cosmetic surgery is an expensive, painful, ordeal.

If we are talking about cloning, I tend to consider the cloner closer to a 3-d printer. It takes a snapshot of your character when they are scanned in for a backup (and clones from a deceased person use the last backup on ODIN) only filling in severe and life-threatening injuries. (Such as organs or missing limbs).

What does this mean? Any scars one has when they are scanned in would remain. Unless someone 1. pays a geneticist to remove the scar from their backup or 2. Gets expensive cosmetic surgery.

Unless a lore-master directly counters this view, I will retain it AND my characters' scars.

Plus I enjoy scars. Scars tell stories.

[Erik Tiber]

Oh, and people covered in scars, which they could easily and cheaply fix but voluntarily choose not to. You know, I should totally have one of my characters ask someone about why they chose to get those cool-looking scars.

 

Actually, far as I am aware having scars removed is not mentioned as expensive or cheap. Generally, however, cosmetic surgery is an expensive, painful, ordeal.

Eh, I'd think that it's probably gotten quite a bit cheaper over time.

If we are talking about cloning, I tend to consider the cloner closer to a 3-d printer. It takes a snapshot of your character when they are scanned in for a backup (and clones from a deceased person use the last backup on ODIN) only filling in severe and life-threatening injuries. (Such as organs or missing limbs).

That's completely my perspective with respect to flash cloning. I'm not so sure that they wouldn't be able to just print a body free of scar tissue. If they really wanted to, they probably could do just that.

I like to imagine that the new body is basically combining the last body-scan and the newest brain-scan, and filling in the blanks on the brain with previous brain-scans.

What does this mean? Any scars one has when they are scanned in would remain. Unless someone 1. pays a geneticist to remove the scar from their backup or 2. Gets expensive cosmetic surgery.

Unless a lore-master directly counters this view, I will retain it AND my characters' scars.

Plus I enjoy scars. Scars tell stories.

There's nothing wrong with a character having scars. Like you said, they tell stories. Characters might choose to retain their scars as a reminder of said stories. The fact that they chose to maintain said scars would tell a lot about their character.

I personally would find it interesting to interact with characters who voluntarily keep scars and are proud of doing so. I think that would be more interesting than, say, someone who has scars and wants to get rid of them, but can't.

I'm just gonna go on a lark and guess that the scars are probably easiest to avoid when you have immediate proper medical care, and that you'd see a very, very small amount of scar tissue from surgery normally (because it's probably minimally invasive). If I were to blatantly pull an estimate out of my ass (because really that's what I'm doing), I'd probably just say that it's probably affordable enough that just about everyone could deal with something like serious disfigurement or if the scar is seriously debilitating or painful, but if a scar is just a minor annoyance, not all that noticeable, or easily covered by clothing then most people probably wouldn't bother. That is, unless they like their scars and such.

[Jamini]

Honestly, considering we have a looooot of people with scarring, I'd actually edge towards removal of scars remaining prohibitively expensive and probably quite painful. While it is something a person from a rich or upper class family could afford, it isn't something that everyone can simply shell out the money to do. Doubly so if an injury remained untreated long enough to become seriously infected, happened in the absence of Aurora medical care, or simply wasn't treated much at all.

Basically, I think you are trying to make cosmetic corrective surgery cheaper than a great number of players actually want it to be.

I don't mind corrective surgery being a thing for the rich and well-off, but I don't really think it should be available to "just about anyone." And honestly, a reaction to a scar probably shouldn't be "Oh, you should get that fixed." but rather, "Oh, you couldn't afford to get that fixed."

Using Nasir as an example, 'cause I like examples.

As a CE with more than five years of experience, he would be a Tier 11 pay grade employee. As Tajara, he would probably get a slightly smaller paycheck.

He has three notable clusters of scarring.

A severe burn on the back of his head, acquired when he was a Tier 2 Apprentice.

A severe burn on his face, acquired when he was a Tier 6 Engineer.

Multiple small burns on both hands, from numerous numerous electrical shocks (and a few other things), aquired from nearly thirteen years in the field.

The first and second I would argue, he did not have the money to pay to have the scarring fixed. While at this point in his life he probably could, he has other things he is spending his money on, (Ship ownership, other projects etc) and as a whole the scars do not inhibit his work. Ergo he hasn't bothered to spend the time to get it fixed. Doubly so since his spouse doesn't care about the scars.

I would say it is most likely that you would need to be a Tier 8/9 or so pay grade to reasonably be able to afford cosmetic surgery. Excepting people who are VERY determined to get so or have other means to acquire the money.

[Erik Tiber]

Honestly, considering we have a looooot of people with scarring, I'd actually edge towards removal of scars remaining prohibitively expensive and probably quite painful. While it is something a person from a rich or upper class family could afford, it isn't something that everyone can simply shell out the money to do. Doubly so if an injury remained untreated long enough to become seriously infected, happened in the absence of Aurora medical care, or simply wasn't treated much at all.

That would mean restricting absolutely everyone who would like to give their characters more options. Like getting the surgery.

Given that we have stuff like nanotech, stem cells, regenerative membrane, prostheses, all that stuff. I'd say it's quite reasonable to say that cosmetic surgery could theoretically be afforded by most people. Just expensive for poorer people. Possibly out of the reach of the poorest.

The more extensive the disfigurement, the more you'd need to pay to get it fixed.

Basically, I think you are trying to make cosmetic corrective surgery cheaper than a great number of players actually want it to be.

I don't mind corrective surgery being a thing for the rich and well-off, but I don't really think it should be available to "just about anyone." And honestly, a reaction to a scar probably shouldn't be "Oh, you should get that fixed." but rather, "Oh, you couldn't afford to get that fixed."

That's entirely dependent upon whether it is actually affordable to get that fixed.

Another reaction might be "Oh, you didn't want to get that fixed." Which again, leads to questions. Or "Oh, you got some scarring there". Scarification is a thing that people do right now. I dunno, maybe it's a fad.

Using Nasir as an example, 'cause I like examples.

As a CE with more than five years of experience, he would be a Tier 11 pay grade employee. As Tajara, he would probably get a slightly smaller paycheck.

He has three notable clusters of scarring.

A severe burn on the back of his head, acquired when he was a Tier 2 Apprentice.

A severe burn on his face, acquired when he was a Tier 6 Engineer.

Multiple small burns on both hands, from numerous numerous electrical shocks (and a few other things), aquired from nearly thirteen years in the field.

The first and second I would argue, he did not have the money to pay to have the scarring fixed. While at this point in his life he probably could, he has other things he is spending his money on, (Ship ownership, other projects etc) and as a whole the scars do not inhibit his work. Ergo he hasn't bothered to spend the time to get it fixed. Doubly so since his spouse doesn't care about the scars.

So you do not need to have removal be prohibitively expensive to justify him having the scars. He just didn't care or didn't mind. Going and getting surgery would be pretty inconvenient. Plenty of people put off doing things because it's inconvenient or a hassle already. This example is actually proving my point; that you can justify characters having scars without the need for arbitrarily increasing the cost of cosmetic surgery.

From your description, he may even wear the scars as a badge of honor or something. Or they might have sentimental value to him, who knows. Either way, it says far more about someone's character if that character chooses to voluntarily forgo treatment, than if that character was unable to afford treatment.

I would say it is most likely that you would need to be a Tier 8/9 or so pay grade to reasonably be able to afford cosmetic surgery. Excepting people who are VERY determined to get so or have other means to acquire the money.

I'm not so sure. Incomes are way higher than today anyway, and medical care should be cheaper. Your own example demonstrates that it's perfectly possible to justify having scars without making cosmetic surgery be prohibitively expensive, thus restricting the options which players have. In fact, you are even able to have Nasir afford a spaceship. That's like having a private jet. From what you're saying Nasir is just flat-out loaded. He could buy a 7 foot tall golden statue of a phallus and stick it outside his office if he wanted to (though admittedly the price of gold would be much lower than today due to space mining ). He's not an example of someone who'd be affected by differences in price here, and is a very explicit example of how being able to afford the surgery does not mean he will necessarily get it.

I don't think we should needlessly restrict players when characters with scars can already perfectly justify having the scars. And simply making it inconveniently expensive to receive such a surgery seems good enough for pretty much every single person with scars, while still giving people the option of playing characters that let them explore concepts like body autonomy and body modification, because seriously, it's boring to role-play someone from a society that can be summed up as "2015 plus spaceships".

[Jamini]

That would mean restricting absolutely everyone who would like to give their characters more options. Like getting the surgery.

Given that we have stuff like nanotech, stem cells, regenerative membrane, prostheses, all that stuff. I'd say it's quite reasonable to say that cosmetic surgery could theoretically be afforded by most people. Just expensive for poorer people. Possibly out of the reach of the poorest.

The more extensive the disfigurement, the more you'd need to pay to get it fixed.

 

The stuff like nanotech, stem cells, regenerative membrane, prothesis, and such exist on-station because Nanotrasen is historically a medical research company. What we have on-station is not indicative of what everyone has and can afford. In fact, quite the opposite has been stated multiple times by lore devs.

 

Scarification is a thing that people do right now. I dunno, maybe it's a fad.

Using Nasir as an example, 'cause I like examples.

As a CE with more than five years of experience, he would be a Tier 11 pay grade employee. As Tajara, he would probably get a slightly smaller paycheck.

He has three notable clusters of scarring.

A severe burn on the back of his head, acquired when he was a Tier 2 Apprentice.

A severe burn on his face, acquired when he was a Tier 6 Engineer.

Multiple small burns on both hands, from numerous numerous electrical shocks (and a few other things), aquired from nearly thirteen years in the field.

The first and second I would argue, he did not have the money to pay to have the scarring fixed. While at this point in his life he probably could, he has other things he is spending his money on, (Ship ownership, other projects etc) and as a whole the scars do not inhibit his work. Ergo he hasn't bothered to spend the time to get it fixed. Doubly so since his spouse doesn't care about the scars.

So you do not need to have removal be prohibitively expensive to justify him having the scars. He just didn't care or didn't mind. Going and getting surgery would be pretty inconvenient. Plenty of people put off doing things because it's inconvenient or a hassle already. This example is actually proving my point; that you can justify characters having scars without the need for arbitrarily increasing the cost of cosmetic surgery.

 

Except you are the only person I see wanting cosmetic surgery to be cheap here.

I was actually talking to my grandparents, just last night, about cosmetic surgery. How expensive it is, and how likely it is you are actually going to come out of it with any real immediate and long-term benefit. Long story short: If you don't put a lot of money into cosmetic surgery today, you generally get very little out of it.

I don't see why this should change.

 

From your description, he may even wear the scars as a badge of honor or something. Or they might have sentimental value to him, who knows. Either way, it says far more about someone's character if that character chooses to voluntarily forgo treatment, than if that character was unable to afford treatment.

 

If he did I would have said so. No. Part of his story is that he was too poor at the time to have them fixed (and now he doesn't care enough to fix them)

 

I'm not so sure. Incomes are way higher than today anyway, and medical care should be cheaper.

 

You have no evidence to support this statement.

 

In fact, you are even able to have Nasir afford a spaceship. That's like having a private jet. From what you're saying Nasir is just flat-out loaded. He could buy a 7 foot tall golden statue of a phallus and stick it outside his office if he wanted to (though admittedly the price of gold would be much lower than today due to space mining ). He's not an example of someone who'd be affected by differences in price here, and is a very explicit example of how being able to afford the surgery does not mean he will necessarily get it.

 

A ship built over several years of funds that functions as his home and a private business. While certainly expensive to hell, the latter isn't too far from what some private jet owners do to help offset the cost of the jet. Not to mention part of the agreement he has with the people who rent from him is free labor/maintenance for the ship.

 

I don't think we should needlessly restrict players when characters with scars can already perfectly justify having the scars. And simply making it inconveniently expensive to receive such a surgery seems good enough for pretty much every single person with scars, while still giving people the option of playing characters that let them explore concepts like body autonomy and body modification, because seriously, it's boring to role-play someone from a society that can be summed up as "2015 plus spaceships".

 

There is nothing stopping someone who explores concepts like body autonomy and body modification from doing so, while still having cosmetic surgery expensive and difficult to obtain. Ultimately however, we are not playing Eclipse Phase here.

[Guest]

The stuff like nanotech, stem cells, regenerative membrane, prothesis, and such exist on-station because Nanotrasen is historically a medical research company. What we have on-station is not indicative of what everyone has and can afford. In fact, quite the opposite has been stated multiple times by lore devs.

 

Tau Ceti is the crown jewel of the Nanotrasen trade empire.

If there's any place in the universe where Nanotrasen and Zeng-hu's best medical technology is widely distributed, I'd place my bet on Biesel.

 

If you don't put a lot of money into cosmetic surgery today, you generally get very little out of it.

However, the game takes place in year 2457.

 

I don't see why this should change.

Why not?

I enjoy the idea of moving things into a more futuristic sci-fi setting.

To be honest, I previously held on to the belief that snowflakes with odd hair colours and prosthetics should be frowned upon, but come to think of it, it should be the other way around.

For all intents, Scar covered commandoes and cane clutching old men should be considered more unusual and snowflake-y than your garden variety stuttergirl.

 

You have no evidence to support this statement.

Even if we dont get into a deep analysis on the society of 2457, there's still two clear facts which support that statement :

1. Aurora is in one of (If not the) richest systems colonized by humanity, healthcare and augumentations/surgery would certainly be more affordable and widely spread on the surface of the galaxy's richest Glitterworld.

2. We're working on one of Nanotrasen's newest, shiniest high security research facilities. Glimpses into the randomly generated in-game employee accounts reveal that even your average cargo technician is on four figure salary.

 

Ultimately however, we are not playing Eclipse Phase here.

But why not?

In my personal opinion, things focus too much on armies we're never going to see fighting battles we're never going to see for causes we're never going to explore or really care about. I'd argue that exploring transhumanism and futuristic society fits much better in the environment of a private civillian research station, than the military conflicts of unrelated government factions.

I wouldnt say everyone should be an aug, there's the less developped rimworlds for all your gritty largehuge crude mechanical prosthetics and scars. Tau Ceti however, should be eclipse phase as fuck.

But really, this thread is less about augumentations and surgery and more about lifespans.

We need those to be higher, maybe push the maximum character age up to 150 years? We'd have to balance the skill system, of course.