Player Complaint: TechnoKat

[Susan]

BYOND Key: SueTheCake

Player Byond Key: TechnoKat

Staff involved: VoltageHero

Reason for complaint: Repeated bad antagonist play.

Approximate Date/Time: 5/28/25 Approx 6-7~ PM Central.

It is autotraitor. TechoKat rolls traitor and buys a chameleon kit and a pair of force gloves. Dons random costumes and generally is annoying. Wears a chicken suit and throws people around. Mmkay.

Gets arrested near the end of the round for fucking about in costumes. Crew transfer is voted, I go to escape. Sit around, someone says something about Lauren and Centurion in science maintenance.

I walk in and passively observe the two talking with another scientist present. Centurion is RPing an arrest I guess, he shows her some cuffs. Immediately when TechnoKat sees me, still wearing his chicken suit head, he runs up with his spare pair of force gloves and in a few seconds spams my face into the wall enough times to send me into crit before anyone can react. Then just runs off dragging me behind, still slamming my head into the wall with his third hand I guess.

 

Usara Miharil asks, "You are insssulting me?"

Derrick Johnson says, "I will report all of you, I say."

Katana Delta states, "Derrick, Roy was not referring to Miharil"

WINSTON [security] states, ""Bolts" had better be Centurian..."

Centurion holds up the handcuffs. Take a closer look.

Centurion says, "Hands behind your ba-"

Lauren Blade has grabbed Ana Roh'hi'tin passively!

Lauren Blade has grabbed Ana Roh'hi'tin aggressively (now hands)!

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Your head hurts badly.

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

The wound on your head widens with a nasty ripping noise.

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Something feels like it shattered in your head!

Ana Roh'hi'tin screams!

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Ana Roh'hi'tin screams!

Your face becomes unrecognizible mangled mess!

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Lauren Blade says, "Bastards,"

Unknown (as Ana Roh'hi'tin) screams!

Lauren Blade slams Unknown (as Ana Roh'hi'tin)'s face against the reinforced wall!

Lauren Blade slams Unknown (as Ana Roh'hi'tin)'s face against the wall!

Something feels like it shattered in your chest!

Unknown (as Ana Roh'hi'tin) screams!

Please, just end the pain!

 

No provocation. And then TechnoKat proceeds to gloat about how he,

 

LOOC: TechnoKat: and i murdered 4 ppl

LOOC: TechnoKat: in a chicken suit

 

So for no reason other than to probably feel accomplished he attacks me despite only being wanted on minor costume-related charges when I just walk in and witness him and Centurion.

[Jboy2000000]

Since this has something to do with the same round, Ill just copy this from one of Techno's other complaint threads.

 

Here to add on about Lauren Blade and Techno. This round, still going on, Lauren was a tator, I assume, and used a camileon kit and force gloves to go around throwing and strangling people, dressed as a giant chicken. After getting caught, Lauren Blade was terminated and she started yelling and complaining when she had her engineering equipment, including her force gloves, taken away. After that, in LOOC when Vira walked away from the cell, Techno said "Delta being a twat as usual." For taking their ID to be terminated as per head orders on code blue, and then taking and searching her equipment.

[Hycinth]

At this point in the round, Blade was actually wanted for at least one murder, fwiw. Found chicken suit fibers on a door leading to port solars access, where a body was discovered. I relayed this to security as the CSI.

[Frances]

The chicken suit shenanigans I couldn't care less around (the idea has some potential).

But grabbing a random security officer and repeatedly attacking them while running away and dragging them has to count as ganking. I can see how injuring someone in your escape can aim to create chaos and make you harder to catch (by forcing others to prioritize helping the injured), but the way this was executed was more careless than anything.

[VoltageHero]

Techno was given a warning on this behavior. I can't speak for the rest of the round, as I wasn't active until the rear end.

The player stated that they feared being arrested, and believed this was the only way to avoid being captured. I raised the point of non-lethal methods, but I cannot recall the response Techno sent me.

As I told the player, sometimes being arrested can make the round more enjoyable for both of the parties involved.

[Frances]

The player stated that they feared being arrested, and believed this was the only way to avoid being captured.

Honestly, though, there's two things Techno could've done. Injured someone and fled (though I feel most players would prioritize the culprit over the injured), or take a (mostly unharmed) hostage. The combination of the two (running away with someone while beating them to death) doesn't seem to achieve anything.

Given that this wasn't someone Techno had any particular reason to kill or harm to that degree, doesn't that action seem more like a random "lolkill" attempt than an escape one?

[Susan]

The reason I made this topic is that 'a warning' isn't good enough for me. This is an unsatisfactory response especially given the recent complaints against him which are numerous in kind and showcase similar behaviors.

[Guest]

The player stated that they feared being arrested, and believed this was the only way to avoid being captured.

 

What?

It was the fucking end of round when this occurred. Three, possibly four minutes prior to the shuttle arriving. The round was right about to be over.

Time was up when the CT was scheduled. They had their chance as an antag, they were done. They had 2 hours to do what they needed to do. They squandered it.

All they fucking had to do at the end of the round was to sit down, shut up, and await the shuttle to arrive and a new round to begin.

Instead they immediately go for ganking an uninvolved and otherwise unsuspecting officer who was checking up on another officer's status. Centurion themselves was even RPing an arrest, but instead Techno just brushes right past Centurion without a care, grappling another officer who was not even a tangible threat in the moment and then practically beating them into crit, dragging their corpse in maint and then finishing them off wordlessly and completely ignoring the fact they were interacting with an officer prior to these events.

This is a disgustingly unacceptable show of behavior from someone who has already 'reassured' an admin they would not self-antag nor continue with their chucklefuck characters and make an attempt to display much better roleplay than what was shown.

[EvilBrage]

I'm afraid I have to agree with Susan on this one; I'd just like to point out that there are three active complaints with TechnoKat taking a prominent role for being arbitrarily rude (or, in the words of Rule #1, "a dick") to other players - and none of them seem to spark a desire on their part to improve.

[Eliot Clef]

I was there when this happened, playing Scavenger at the time. Can confirm that it was basically the end of the round, and all other details.

To be frank, Lauren was pretty much cornered no matter what she did. She was wanted for murder (which I overheard from sec's radio and I suspect she did too), Centurion was there and ready to arrest her, I think there was a security borg nearby. Grabbing Ana and beating her to (near) death removed an obstacle, but she ran into escape -- then filled with people -- and got caught pretty immediately.

Admittedly, Ana is extremely dangerous. Probably one of the most dangerous members of Security to have to fight. If I were going to prioritize taking down a member of security pending a potential combat situation, Ana probably would be at the top of my list.

[Filthyfrankster]

I would like to note that TechnoKat/Lauren Blade is notorious for their self-antagging habits as a non-antag.

Which usually range from almost murdering an officer while she was brigged for.. Roughly 5~ minutes, In after un-cuffing her, She grabbed onto the officers head and SLAMMED it into the wall until said officer was in crit, basically killing them and giving them brain damage beyond all fuckery. Even times where she committed a little crime spree as a non-antag, which resulted in her being straight jacketed for being a threat to security and the station itself. Who also made a few rude comments in OOC for being detained/straightjacketed/muzzled after calling the head of security/warden a bitch.

(Quite a few people have an issue with their IC actions.)

In short, Lauren is a huge liability to the company and SHOULD be fired.

For this incident, isn't there anything against killing non-targets/non-threats to your own objectives? If the statements they made were true, this could be just them going a 'Lolkillingspree' which is not very fucking cool.

As for the tajara, Grabbing, repeatedly slamming their head on the wall while running away is quite the gank.

[Jamini]

This complaint isn't about general behavior. This complaint is about actions taken while Lauren was an antagonist. The presence of force gloves, and her prior murders, both highlighted this.

In this instance, an officer was arresting Lauren. Who was a traitor who had committed murder as well as several other crimes throughout the round. The logs themselves very clearly state that Centurion was attempting an arrest prior to the shuttle. Her reaction was to initiate a fight with security, which as an antagonist she is in the right to do.

Ana is a member of security. Virtually always an armed and dangerous one. As investigator she has a lethal weapon, and if a security officer she would be armed with a taser. Not only this, but Ana is notorious for shooting to kill in altercations.

Ana was a clear and present threat in an antagonist-related fight, and Lauren removed her from play due to that fact.

I see no grounds for this complaint being valid. It is not a gank to defend oneself from security as an antagonist, doubly so when the person in question is not only well-known for killing antagonists but often gloats about it.

While I do agree that Lauren's non-antagonist play needs work, in this situation she was a traitor. She killed an officer/detective who was responding to an arrest. There was nothing wrong with what she did in this instance.

[Guest]

Usara Miharil asks, "You are insssulting me?"

Derrick Johnson says, "I will report all of you, I say."

Katana Delta states, "Derrick, Roy was not referring to Miharil"

WINSTON [security] states, ""Bolts" had better be Centurian..."

Centurion holds up the handcuffs. Take a closer look.

Centurion says, "Hands behind your ba-"

Lauren Blade has grabbed Ana Roh'hi'tin passively!

Lauren Blade has grabbed Ana Roh'hi'tin aggressively (now hands)!

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Your head hurts badly.

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

The wound on your head widens with a nasty ripping noise.

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Something feels like it shattered in your head!

Ana Roh'hi'tin screams!

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Ana Roh'hi'tin screams!

Your face becomes unrecognizible mangled mess!

Lauren Blade slams Ana Roh'hi'tin's face against the reinforced wall!

Lauren Blade says, "Bastards,"

Unknown (as Ana Roh'hi'tin) screams!

Lauren Blade slams Unknown (as Ana Roh'hi'tin)'s face against the reinforced wall!

Lauren Blade slams Unknown (as Ana Roh'hi'tin)'s face against the wall!

Something feels like it shattered in your chest!

Unknown (as Ana Roh'hi'tin) screams!

Please, just end the pain!

 

Assuming these logs are correct, there was no provocation. All there was, was a wordless killing that contributed nothing to the spirit or flow of roleplaying. They completely ignored that Centurion and their cuffs even existed, and then went for an 'easy' kill. That's it. No words. No interaction besides a random traitor going from 0 to 88 in a matter of seconds because they 'were afraid of getting arrested'.

Like... what? Why? Who in their right mind would even silently do this?

I'm not asking for a fucking year long bond villain monologue. A simple "No, I'm not coming with you" or any other short quip would've been sufficient.

[Jamini]

Centurion had held up cuffs and stated she was under arrest. That is pretty exactly provocation.

[Susan]

3 minutes to transfer shuttle, a total existence of perhaps 6 minutes left, and so the logical, obvious response is to grab an officer and repeatedly face-slam them while you run away so no one can stop you.

Yeah, okay. Sure.

No. Lauren spent the entirety of the round in a chicken suit or other outrageous costumes and just used force gloves to abuse and beat up people. Did you catch that part? A chicken suit. The traitor whose objective is to make the round interesting just put on a costume and manhandled people. And then at the end when the CSI was like 'guys the guy in the chicken suit who is in an engineer left fibers on an engineering door' which is probably the worst evidence I've ever heard Centurion goes to RP an arrest and Techno totally disregards him to start face-slamming me the moment I show up for no reason.

If you wonder why security doesn't RP arrests, this is why, because when we do people immediately take an unfair advantage of that. Grab, clickspam wall while moving away because logic (how do you repeatedly slam someone's face into the wall while running exactly) without a single word being said. Getting arrested at the end of the round on obviously bogus charges is not something you need to 'defend yourself' from. It's not EoR grief, it's 2 minutes in a cell until restart.

[Jamini]

3 minutes to transfer shuttle, a total existence of perhaps 6 minutes left, and so the logical, obvious response is to grab an officer and repeatedly face-slam them while you run away so no one can stop you.

Yeah, okay. Sure.

 

The round had not yet ended. The shuttle had not arrived. An antagonist is not obligated to roll over and be cuffed just because they are in escape. By attempting arrest, Centurion opened the opportunity for conflict. By being present and armed you were de facto involved with the arrest.

 

No. Lauren spent the entirety of the round in a chicken suit or other outrageous costumes and just used force gloves to abuse and beat up people. Did you catch that part? A chicken suit. The traitor whose objective is to make the round interesting just put on a costume and manhandled people. And then at the end when the CSI was like 'guys the guy in the chicken suit who is in an engineer left fibers on an engineering door' which is probably the worst evidence I've ever heard Centurion goes to RP an arrest and Techno totally disregards him to start face-slamming me the moment I show up for no reason.

 

She also sabotaged several areas and killed a few people, according to what she said. She was the antagonist, and she was creating conflict. She had been doing so most of the round, and it persisted while the shuttle had not yet docked.

 

If you wonder why security doesn't RP arrests, this is why, because when we do people immediately take an unfair advantage of that. Grab, clickspam wall while moving away because logic (how do you repeatedly slam someone's face into the wall while running exactly) without a single word being said. Getting arrested at the end of the round on obviously bogus charges is not something you need to 'defend yourself' from. It's not EoR grief, it's 2 minutes in a cell until restart.

 

When you attempt arrest, you open yourself to conflict.

To repeat:

1. The shuttle had not yet arrived. EoR does NOT apply until the shuttle has docked. Your complaints on EoR grief have no grounds.

2. Centurion, and by extension you (by your presence) had attempted arrest. As an antagonist TK was within their rights to resist. You were also armed with lethals by virtue of your job. Your complaints on gank have no grounds.

I will not argue that TK is the best player in the history of ever, or that their antagonist play is flawless. However, No rules were broken in this instance. You are mad that you got killed.

Man up. Deal with it.

[Susan]

I was not part of any arrest. I did not vocalize any intent. TechnoKat was standing right next to Centurion in the cramped research shuttle dock entrance and would have heard him call for back-up. I walked in and there was no more than a two second delay before TechnoKat immediately jumped me, including the time period before and after Centurion tried to RP his arrest.

There was no provocation. It wasn't a desperate antag fighting for his life. It was TechnoKat indulging in the same sort of behavior complaints about him noted.

I'd also like to note I wasn't armed. It has been stated before security officer's gear isn't considered high-risk enough to be 'armed', something I know entirely well because admins were displeased with the no-nonsense stance I take dealing with officers, treating them as armed 'when they aren't. Now it extends both ways. I had no lethal weapon to use.

I didn't even die, so your argument there is pretty pointless. What I'm 'mad' about is repeated poor antagonist play by a player multiple people have an issue with that 'warnings' is doing nothing to help.

[Jamini]

I was not part of any arrest. I did not vocalize any intent. TechnoKat was standing right next to Centurion in the cramped research shuttle dock entrance and would have heard him call for back-up. I walked in and there was no more than a two second delay before TechnoKat immediately jumped me, including the time period before and after Centurion tried to RP his arrest.

Sit around, someone says something about Lauren and Centurion in science maintenance.

I walk in and passively observe the two talking with another scientist present.

 

You had no reason to be in that area, except that there had been mention of an arrest in maint. If you were going to back up centurion, that is fine. However once again: You became an active participant in the arrest by virtue of your role and department.

 

I'd also like to note I wasn't armed. It has been stated before security officer's gear isn't considered high-risk enough to be 'armed', something I know entirely well because admins were displeased with the no-nonsense stance I take dealing with officers, treating them as armed 'when they aren't. Now it extends both ways. I had no lethal weapon to use.

 

Were you an officer, or an investigator? As the latter, I sincerely doubt you did not have your gun holstered on your person. As the former you had ample tools on your belt to fight back with as well.

As any other role you would have more of a leg to stand on for gank accusations. However frankly, you were a security member involved with an arrest. You were a valid target. The fact that you were not killed weakens your stance even further.

[Susan]

I was an officer with non-lethal weapons, and as I've been told before that isn't to be considered armed. I typically considered security officers armed and would employ equal force to arrest them but admins indicated standard security equipment isn't dangerous enough to use threats of lethal force. But I guess antagonists are part of some double-standard or something, so indiscriminately murder blueshirts on the premise that they might possibly somehow in someway here or in the future present a threat to you.

I had actually gone in there to tell Centurion to cool it because the CSI's evidence was ridiculously circumstantial and to let the Odin handle it, yet I didn't get to say anything and was in the middle of typing when TechnoKat ran up and started randomly slamming my face into the wall. He did it so fast Centurion didn't even get to finish his sentence, as you can see.

However, I am mostly done arguing this with you. Staff on at the time believed it was wrong and a warning was given. The existence of this complaint is because I am dissatisfied with this response given TechnoKat's history and Baka's words,

 

I will also be speaking in this topic about the issue too, since it seems to lump together.

TechnoKat, the staff team have noticed that your character Lauren Blade has been disruptive, and not in a good way. You really need to shape up your character, because the hooliganism that you are doing is passing the point of self-antagging and breaking the "don't be a dick" rule. Yes, you were an antagonist on this specific occasion, but this did not bring roleplay as an antagonist as it was more going out of your way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

You need to seriously slow down on the hooliganism. Consider this your last and final warning before action will be taken if you do not cease.

I will be leaving this open for 24 more hours before archiving and closing this topic.

 

 

Yes, you were an antagonist on this specific occasion, but this did not bring roleplay as an antagonist as it was more going out of your way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

 

Exactly what happened in this scenario. Didn't say a word, didn't register any outside forces, repeatedly face-slammed an officer while dragging them along into a room full of people where they knew they'd get caught for nothing but the sole purpose of going out of his way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

I don't know how you can see it as anything else.

[Jamini]

I was an officer with non-lethal weapons, and as I've been told before that isn't to be considered armed. I typically considered security officers armed and would employ equal force to arrest them but admins indicated standard security equipment isn't dangerous enough to use threats of lethal force. But I guess antagonists are part of some double-standard or something, so indiscriminately murder blueshirts on the premise that they might possibly somehow in someway here or in the future present a threat to you.

 

She was being arrested. Ergo, security was a threat to her.

 

I had actually gone in there to tell Centurion to cool it because the CSI's evidence was ridiculously circumstantial and to let the Odin handle it, yet I didn't get to say anything and was in the middle of typing when TechnoKat ran up and started randomly slamming my face into the wall. He did it so fast Centurion didn't even get to finish his sentence, as you can see.

 

You could have done that on :s, there was no need to be directly present.

 

However, I am mostly done arguing this with you. Staff on at the time believed it was wrong and a warning was given. The existence of this complaint is because I am dissatisfied with this response given TechnoKat's history and Baka's words,

 

I will also be speaking in this topic about the issue too, since it seems to lump together.

TechnoKat, the staff team have noticed that your character Lauren Blade has been disruptive, and not in a good way. You really need to shape up your character, because the hooliganism that you are doing is passing the point of self-antagging and breaking the "don't be a dick" rule. Yes, you were an antagonist on this specific occasion, but this did not bring roleplay as an antagonist as it was more going out of your way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

You need to seriously slow down on the hooliganism. Consider this your last and final warning before action will be taken if you do not cease.

I will be leaving this open for 24 more hours before archiving and closing this topic.

 

 

Yes, you were an antagonist on this specific occasion, but this did not bring roleplay as an antagonist as it was more going out of your way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

 

Exactly what happened in this scenario. Didn't say a word, didn't register any outside forces, repeatedly face-slammed an officer while dragging them along into a room full of people where they knew they'd get caught for nothing but the sole purpose of going out of his way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

I don't know how you can see it as anything else.

 

The hooliganism quote is irrelevant as Blade was not self-antagging here.

The second quote was in a complaint about GIVING A pAI A SHITTY DIRECTIVE, it is not relevant here as you were on a force directly opposing her

She was an antagonist. Centurion was trying to arrest her (abeit, peacefully). You were present as another officer, and thus part of the arrest (abeit, not intentionally on your part.) You got beat up because she is an antagonist doing what antagonists do when someone tries to arrest them.

Had I been present as Nasir, I'd not have objected had she done what she did to you to me. I have a history of taking Lauren down, and my character is often armed or able to arm himself very quickly. Part of the risk of playing a security, command, or vigilantie character is that you will occasionally be taken down in an unfair way.What she did was not a gank, nor EOR grief. It may have been excessive force, at most, but as an antagonist her job is to create conflict.

[Susan]

Antagonists throw a tantrum and start randomly attacking people?

Your logic thereby states that since security is the meta-force opposing antagonists all gloves come off the moment they so much as show a slight interest in said antagonist. So I guess then by that extension since the crew is the meta-force opposing security I need to start lasering people more for minor crimes into submission because you are basically saying complete, total overreaction is fine so long as your sides 'oppose' each other. "If I'm going down I'm going to take as many people with me" mentality. There was no attempt to escape and no possibility of escape.

I'm not arguing this with you further. My entire point is summed up in,

 

Yes, you were an antagonist on this specific occasion, but this did not bring roleplay as an antagonist as it was more going out of your way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

 

Exactly what happened in this scenario. Didn't say a word, didn't register any outside forces, repeatedly face-slammed an officer while dragging them along into a room full of people where they knew they'd get caught for nothing but the sole purpose of going out of his way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

I don't know how you can see it as anything else.

 

which you have utterly ignored by going off on some random tangent about pAI directives which is irrelevant to what I am trying to say. My inclination is you choose or simply don't want to read what I'm saying so I have no interest in repeating myself. People in staff positions with more authority than you obviously felt it was wrong enough to give him a warning, which I am dissatisfied with given his recent history of the same type of behavior. You've also chosen to ignore Jboy reporting TechnoKat's other behavior in the round, so I really don't know how to respond to you.

You can continue arguing by yourself if you'd like. I'm only interested in what the staff have to say.

[Jamini]

Antagonists throw a tantrum and start randomly attacking people?

Your logic thereby states that since security is the meta-force opposing antagonists all gloves come off the moment they so much as show a slight interest in said antagonist. So I guess then by that extension since the crew is the meta-force opposing security I need to start lasering people more for minor crimes into submission because you are basically saying complete, total overreaction is fine so long as your sides 'oppose' each other. "If I'm going down I'm going to take as many people with me" mentality. There was no attempt to escape and no possibility of escape.

 

Your illogical thought process and hostility is dumbfounding.

1. She was antagonist, who had provided conflict for the entirety of the round.

2. Security (Centurion) had moved to arrest her.

3. She responded to the arrest attempt by attacking you, using what tools she had on her person.

It isn't even an overreaction, it was a natural progression. Escalated quickly? Perhaps. That said, she was in her right to resist arrest. It is unfortunate that you were injured by an antagonist during this resisting.

 

Yes, you were an antagonist on this specific occasion, but this did not bring roleplay as an antagonist as it was more going out of your way to ruin someone's enjoyment.

 

which you have utterly ignored by going off on some random tangent about pAI directives which is irrelevant to what I am trying to say.

 

A mistake, actually, I was looking at the wrong thread. Either way, this still is not the same. She was actively resisting arrest in this case, as opposed to beating up someone who was letting her out of the cell. You were simply unfortunate enough to be targeted during that resisting.

I do not agree with or like many of TK's actions, but in this case they simply didn't break any rules.

[Frances]

If I may cut in (not staff, but I think I remember the general basis of conflict-creation as an antag),

So about murder/attempted murder:

There are two criteria that must be present to a degree to justify a murder, antag or not: believability/realism (how much sense does it make to kill this person?), and RP potential (is the situation created by killing this person worth taking them out of the round?)

The two can somewhat fill in for each other. For example, even if it doesn't create much additional RP (antag trying to kill you and you killing them in self-defense), if it would be outright nonsensical for you not to kill someone ICly, then you have decent grounds to kill them (and though my respect goes to people who can work themselves out of situations like this while keeping all players in the field, there's nothing wrong with acting in a way that makes sense IC.) Conversely, even if you might have no particular need to kill someone, if the killing can create an interesting situation (for the player and for others), then there's nothing wrong with murder either. (You need a much better justification as a non-antag than as an antag, though, else everyone would be murdering each other all the time.)

Looking at Techno's actions here, I fail to see either of the aforementioned criteria being really met - which is why I have an issue with their play, even as an antagonist. Running around while dragging Ana and repeatedly hitting her didn't accomplish anything interesting for the crew, nor was it something Techno needed to do, or had much IC sense in doing.

-If the purpose was to take a hostage, Lauren wouldn't have to repeatedly hit Ana's face into a wall while running away once Ana was clearly incapacitated.

-If the purpose was to incapacitate Ana to create a distraction, then Lauren would've had to leave her somewhere, instead of dragging her along with herself and giving the rest of sec an even bigger incentive to hunt her down.

-The only purpose left to Lauren's actions (that I can see) was that she was motivated by the desire to outright kill Ana.

At which point, I'm gonna ask: what are you doing? It's five minutes to the end of the round, and you're running around while bashing the head of a member of security you don't even know along the walls in what might be the most unrealistic fashion possible. There is no potential for additional roleplay to be created by your actions, and you gain nothing by killing another member of sec besides the ability to gloat about how bloodthirsty of an antag you are. If you get caught in the middle of a crew transfer, you should either accept your fate and turn yourself in, or attempt to escape by a way that is slightly less ridiculous and doesn't involve wordlessly killing someone you had no prior interaction with in the most OOC and mechanically-driven way possible when you had no particular reason to kill them at all.

 

---

---

It's not something I would've done. I don't think it warrants a heavy punishment either (well, maybe save for the fact that Techno seems to be notorious for going to extreme lengths to try to escape from security no matter what), but quite simply, I think it's bad antag play and deserves to be called out.

If anything, antagonists should be held to a higher standard than regular crew, as it is their responsibility to create situations that are interesting for others first and foremost, not only for themselves.

[Jamini]

Looking at Techno's actions here, I fail to see either of the aforementioned criteria being really met - which is why I have an issue with their play, even as an antagonist. Running around while dragging Ana and repeatedly hitting her didn't accomplish anything interesting for the crew, nor was it something Techno needed to do, or had much IC sense in doing.

-If the purpose was to take a hostage, Lauren wouldn't have to repeatedly hit Ana's face into a wall while running away once Ana was clearly incapacitated.

-If the purpose was to incapacitate Ana to create a distraction, then Lauren would've had to leave her somewhere, instead of dragging her along with herself and giving the rest of sec an even bigger incentive to hunt her down.

-The only purpose left to Lauren's actions (that I can see) was that she was motivated by the desire to outright kill Ana.

 

I would disagree slightly. Taking Ana could very well be classified as taking her hostage depending on TK's intent, which hasn't been commented on by the player in question yet. Leaving Ana behind would have opened her to getting taken down by a full-out manhunt. For all we know she did not intend to kill, but to incapacitate. It can be quite difficult to tell if someone is going into paincrit or not without a HUD.

Also as far as I can glean, she attempted to run through escape (which is very close to where the fight started) and was downed there. TK could have intended to leave Ana as soon as Lauren was clear of persuit. We simply cannot assume to know what was intended.

 

At which point, I'm gonna ask: what are you doing? It's five minutes to the end of the round, and you're running around while bashing the head of a member of security you don't even know along the walls in what might be the most unrealistic fashion possible.

 

If I'm reading correctly, she had force gloves. Essentially power gauntlets that drastically increase the force a person can apply to a target. I don't see it terribly unrealistic for someone equipped as such to be smashing another against a wall as the run.

 

There is no potential for additional roleplay to be created by your actions, and you gain nothing by killing another member of sec besides the ability to gloat about how bloodthirsty of an antag you are. If you get caught in the middle of a crew transfer, you should either accept your fate and turn yourself in, or attempt to escape by a way that is slightly less ridiculous and doesn't involve wordlessly killing someone you had no prior interaction with in the most OOC and mechanically-driven way possible when you had no particular reason to kill them at all.

 

I cannot disagree more with this sentiment. Until the shuttle docks, it is fully within an antagonist's rights to resist incarceration. Once the shuttle docks then all conflict ceases and both sides need to stand down completely (No arrests for security, no fighting for antags). Neither side should special dispensation simply because the transfer is happening soon

 

It's not something I would've done. I don't think it warrants a heavy punishment either (well, maybe save for the fact that Techno seems to be notorious for going to extreme lengths to try to escape from security no matter what), but quite simply, I think it's bad antag play and deserves to be called out.

If anything, antagonists should be held to a higher standard than regular crew, as it is their responsibility to create situations that are interesting for others first and foremost, not only for themselves.

 

I wouldn't do so either, but I disagree with holding a normal player to a higher standard. Unless antagonists are whitelisted (something I am vehemently against!) holding them to a higher standard is simply unacceptable. Doubly so if security is not held up to the same standard. Setting a double standard is perhaps the least honest thing one can do when on is dealing with a player vs player situation.

[Frances]

-Agreed on your first point, that it can be quite hard to tell if a target is incapacitated. However, shouldn't the combat messages (damage such as disfiguration is announced to all) as well as Ana's repeated screaming and the knowledge that slamming someone's face into a wall with force gloves is relatively damaging prove enough of an indication that the player is in crit? It's serious damage we're speaking of here, like 8-10 shoves. Additionally, while I don't want to make assumptions, due to Lauren's multiple previous killings (as well as Techno's gloating in LOOC, though it doesn't necessarily indicate intent but merely results), I really wouldn't be surprised if the intention here was to kill and not merely incapacitate.

-Running away from security while shoving someone you're dragging along into walls is incredibly silly. I've got no issue with it for it simply being a possible mechanic (sometimes, when you have to fight you need to use what you're given), but under the presented circumstances, this was not a case where everybody was going all out, nor where there was a clear gain for Techno to keep slamming his victim into walls as he made his escape.

-About the end of round part, I'm simply looking to bar off any other possible justifications for Techno's actions which can be ignored. Being violent and trying to kill a member of sec could paint you as an extremely dangerous and unscrupulous character, but doing so five minutes before the end of a round doesn't help you establish your character (it's a bit late for that) and doesn't justify killing someone alone. (Which is why I'm saying it can't have been because of that.)

-Everyone should be held to a higher standard relative to the job they're expected to perform. Security players and antagonists should be evaluated on different things, as their roles in the round are different. They're both there to partake in roleplay (like everyone else), but the tools and responsibilities they're given to create roleplay are not the same. I hope this clarifies a bit what I meant, as I realize it wasn't terribly obvious which "standards" I was referring to (I don't mean they need to be plain better.)