OOC Mistrust resulting in IC death

[HighAdmiral]

BYOND Key: James View
Game ID: One round before b3Q-aIUI

Player Byond Key/Character name: Neith Mekesatis

Staff involved: I Ahelped, don't recall the name but he literally just said to make an IR. Feels completely inappropriate since my evidence against him was in LOOC as justification for why he wouldn't give me the drugs I asked for.

Reason for complaint: Neith refused to produce two of the four medicines I requested at the start of the round (Risperidone, and two 5u Autoinjectors of Chloric Hydrate), he stated in LOOC that I wasn't trusted enough for my role, which is fine but when you're not giving anti psychotic drugs to the one person who deals with psychotic people you cross a line by impeding my role, and breaking RP with drugs my character is trained and experienced in using.

Later in the round I had a patient roleplaying as low IQ and mentally insane. It took a few tried, starting with ruling out depression, then ADHD, eventually I caught on he was experiencing multiple personality disorder. Since none of his personalities he'd displayed seemed hostile, I wanted to prescribe Risperidone. I asked over medical radio for the drug, and Neith said he was unavailable. The only person with access had fucked off, I had a patient in mental distress at this point hiding in a closet while I slowly deescalated. I tried to reach Neith several times while I worked on my patient with words, knowing I couldn't get him to isolation (couldn't even get him comfortable with leaving the closet) Eventually he had a break, he needed pure oxygen to feel safe. I didn't feel I had further options so I retrieved an emergency O2 tank, which after a few minutes of very calm behavior he started beating the everliving shit out of himself with. Because I wasn't given the other drug I asked for, the two 5u Autoinjectors of Chloral Hydrate, I was unable to stop the patient from beating himself until he'd beaten himself unconscious, at which point I kept him out with 15u of Soporific and brought him down to the main level, where it took two surgeons half an hour to repair the damage, but by which point he'd reached brain death.

After making this complaint originally on the 22nd, I withdrew it and gave it to the head CMO, Fernando Gonzales, who said he'd talk to Neith. I was ghosted by Fernando, and am now resubmitting this complaint today following continued behavior by Neith to impede my job.

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation? Yes, the staff did not help.

Approximate Date/Time: 10/21

Edited November 1, 2019 by HighAdmiral
Fixing Staff Involved

[Garnascus]

I can take a look at this sunday morning.

[VisVirific]

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he stated in LOOC that I wasn't trusted enough for my role,

This is incorrect. What I said in looc specifically was

 

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[LOOC] Darell Brown: Ingame mechanic things require pills to fix though.
[LOOC] Neith Mekesatis: Not really?
[LOOC] Neith Mekesatis: You have a bunch of equipment to fix traumas mechanically
[LOOC] Darell Brown: I have one machine, and a room that fixes multiple personalities.
[LOOC] Darell Brown: I dunno, I am pretty new to the role. You're probably right though.
[LOOC] Neith Mekesatis: The thing about Psych
[LOOC] Neith Mekesatis: It's that it's primarily sort of RP heavy
[LOOC] Darell Brown: How RP intensive it is, is exactly what I both love and hate about the role.
[LOOC] Darell Brown: I guess my intended playstyle is currently drug heavy.
[LOOC] Neith Mekesatis: It's drug heavy since you rely on it
[LOOC] Darell Brown: But yeah, I love how interactive it is, I just hate how infrequently I get to do stuff.
[LOOC] Darell Brown: Yeah that's what I said.
[LOOC] Neith Mekesatis: That's how it usually goes
[LOOC] Neith Mekesatis: And a lot of people here tend to err on the side of caution when it comes to RP heavy roles
[LOOC] Darell Brown: I guess my thinking is as a learn the role, I use drugs heavily after other methods fail. I haven't actually been handing out pills much.
[LOOC] Darell Brown: Being an antag was an absolute mistake. God that round sucked.
[LOOC] Neith Mekesatis: Because more often than not you either tend to get folks who are just here to troll or folks who don't know even basic psych concepts, which end up ruining the rp

Radio Chatter and OOC remarks snipped. This is the LOOC conversation we had. At no point I claimed him to not be trusted enough for the role. I only said that a lot of people err on the side of caution.

 

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I asked over medical radio for the drug, and Neith said he was unavailable. The only person with access had fucked off

That same round there was another Biochemist (Moira O'Malley) was active, as she was announced as Cryogenic Revival at the start of the round and was still active by the time Darell Brown started to ask for the drug.

 

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where it took two surgeons half an hour to repair the damage, but by which point he'd reached brain death.

Technically it was only one surgeon (Alex Greene) with an aide/Medical Intern (Clarence Loretta), both who didn't know that the Bone Repair wouldn't stick if the Head had over 30+ Brute and thus kept breaking whenever he did the Bone Repair. And the Patient (Nelly Smith) who went into self-harm mentioned they were talked to, but we couldn't get him to wake up with over 1000sec of Paralysis in the Body Scanner, and he mentioned he had to go so SSD it was, not Brain Death

James View, the player, has been informed to both of his Psych Characters (Darell Brown and James View) why Neith would not be making the Risperidone and the Chloral/Paxazide, and Neith had tried to explain once (in another round) to him even if made the Paxazide, it would not be leaving the Pharmacy lab unless he was informed ahead of time that View was getting a patient.

I'll also note that James View has threatened IR in LOOC to Faith Windsor when she refused to make the Chloral/Paxazide and Risperidone, and he threatens and then immediately Cryo's. The most recent round with this behavior was b31-cEwR

In the same mentioned round (b31-cEwR), he tried to change Neith and Faith's IC behavior with LOOC Quotes from Discord

 

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[LOOC] James View:11:57 AM] Resi: It’s hard to make so you’ll need a good cooperative chemist. If you tell them Gonzales told you 10 units was safe and ok MOST chemists will listen because metaclique. But I can’t promise it.
[LOOC] James View:11:55 AM] Resi: Security would almost definitely arrest you for contraband. I suggest paxazide.

 

And once Faith and Neith refused, he simply went

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[LOOC] James View:Right, IRs then.

And then Cryo'd.

 

I do not have an OOC problem with James View/Darell Brown, and at most I think the Chloral and Risperidone to be powergaming, but Chloral/Paxazide autoinjectors have been requested before and Neith made it after explaining they wouldn't leave the Pharmacy lab unless he was informed by the Psych they would be having a patient, and that the Psych understood that.

And finally, the round which the complaint happened is b3Q-aIUI, not the round before.

[HighAdmiral]

You are an IC asshole, an OOC asshole, a smug asshole, and you make good points.

You seem to think I know what tool I will need when I'm taking someone down, the reality is you put a lot of time and effort into making sure this heavy RP role has not a single ingame tool to fix issues.
Psych in itself is not a well balanced role, and we are not given the tools we need to control patients if they're in a mood to put up any kind of fight, or cause any kind of harm. I still don't understand why you feel it's okay for you to say "yeah this is powergaming so you can't have it", when in reality how it's used is "I don't want to fucking die, heres a 50/50 chance I inject you before you disarm me" in any robust combat.

You've also made it quite clear you're unwilling to discuss this, which is why I've had to resort to LOOC. Honestly, I've just taken the route of not playing Psych when you're around because you make it no fun at all, knowing if I get someone down there who is in such a state they're ready to hurt themselves or me that it'll just happen kills the role for me entirely. So yeah, if I can't get the tools I need, why continue the round at all? 

Your job isn't to decide what tools are given, it's to make them and assure they're given to those who have a need for them. Obviously giving CH injectors to a greytide assistant with yellow hands is going to be different than giving it to a psychiatrist, who explains "hey it's better they sleep than I die". But even then, I agreed CH was pretty overpowered and discussed with several other people in the NT-MED discord options. One was Paxazide, which I then got Fernandos permission for, as well as putting Soporific in donuts and trying to convince them eating works better than anger. Faith actually tried to convince me that she understood the mental trauma a patient would go through better than I, which still astounds me.

So whatever, you will without a doubt win this case thanks to your well made points, and frankly without a resolution to my issues I'm just done with the medical side of SS13 I think.

[Garnascus]

Ok sorry i am finallly over a cold so i can take a closer look at this.

So, i feel like this is unfortunately an IC issue. I do not feel that the logs say that the chemist denied them based off of OOC mistrust. It might even be fair to say that asking for these drugs at round start would be a little powergamey. Realistically i think i would have preferred an ahelp but that is a minor issue.