frankynb - THE REQUEST OF AMNESTY

[kait]

BYOND Key: frankynb
Total Ban Length: unknown (assuming, permanent) 
Banning staff member's Key: alberyk
Reason of Ban:  
Reason for Appeal: So let me, explain.

The reason for this to be written in the first place

First, i do not belive that the ban shouldve been permanent if it did took place, and i could argue about what i was saying as not being racist, tho i understand at the time i did put it blunt.
Second, i really do care and want to play, being permanently blocked without a word (only being called out by an admin), from the game and the discord of the community i invested months and wanted to keep being a part of, for something that was done in discord seems to me like an overkill. 

The "meme"

So after a conversation with a guy in #general regarding soviet union i started to explain my opinion on it, which was pretty negative, and blunt about a sensitive subject (just a reminder, that if that was brought to my attention instead of what follows, i would've totally agreed with that), then i have mentioned the Jews, after i think, mentioning the genocide of the Russian people. Can't say for word what have ive said, but from memory:
I provided the list, of which shows the main commissars of the USSR, which all of them mostly being jewish. This looks awful for me. But then i also mentioned that the people, in this case, the electorate from OUTSIDE the Russian Empire arguably wouldn't give a shit about an another nation coming in. But thats where i was arguably wrong.

History class

So, with all of that, and now knowing more, i do not think that my idea at the time was really fair, with the knowing of what the Jewish culture is and how it was integrated and especially with like, 1 in 6 people in Israel being Russian.
But, at the moment of the time frame i was referring to, the Jewish population was around 4.15%, and i had an idea, that the minority of the country, but the majority of the electorate couldn't represent the interests of the rest. Which didn't seem to be the case, and following the Stalin's hate for Jews also does not look good.

In conclusion

To start off, i was blunt. And to clarify if its still not obvious, i am not hateful or racist or whatever. Understandable that this might gave the impressions i am, since like 90% of anyone who ever mentions the Jews follows some insane hateful shit. If it been brought to my attention, i would've apologize, but that opportunity is gone.

The ban itself, it my humble opinion, was weird. By my reaction of "yeah right", after being called an antisemitic by the admin was a knee jerk reaction, cause of course, i didn't think that i was. But the following, being blocked from everywhere PERMANENTLY, and being called a racist left me feeling honestly misinterpreted. 
I genuinely do not that think, that what i have done by talking about a sensitive subject deserved a permanent ban. I dont remember a political channel existing, otherwise i would've moved there. But again, its not fair to permanently ban somebody who didn't even knew what for. If you do consider that sort of phrasing possibly racist which i already expressed i never intended as, then i would be totally okay for a proper heads up, a warning or a timeout ban for like a day or two, to prevent this from happening again and me knowing the boundaries, sounds better, right? Then outright DELETE the person from the community. Especially without targeting any users or anybody mentioning in the moment to be offended by this.


I DO MEAN EVERYTHING I WROTE HERE
I could've make it much shorter, but i felt the need to explain the situation as a whole, being a sensitive subject, that cant really be easily judged. Preventing misunderstanding and feeling like just "sorry" wouldn't feel genuine. 

P.S the ban was applied in , so i think i did serve my sentence in the case that did deserve a ban.

Kisses and smooches my dudes.

Edited December 26, 2020 by kait
forgot to mention again

[Alberyk]

For reference to what happened:

Spoiler

 

 

Now, no one was talking race during the discussion before this, you went out of nowhere into some rant (alongside with a prepared table to serve as some kind of evidence) about some kind of evil jewish plot. The word jew also being behind a spoiler also kinda gave me some dog whistling vibes. Besides, no one said anything about anti-semitism, yet you went right away claiming that they were accusing you of being one. I later said; "Yes you are" and then applied a ban. 

In regards to the ban, I am not really interested in having people in the community that believe in this kind of stuff and are eager to prove their point. So, I also applied the ban from the server as well. Reading this appeal, feels like more you are trying to argue that you weren't really being racist, that just going out of nowhere into that angle should have just been handled by a mod telling you to knock it off. If you did think at the time that you were not being racist, you would have not tried to preemptively defend yourself of accussations that were not even raised against you. 

Sorry but I am not buying into the whole "I was not being racist or I did not intend to sound racist".

[kait]

7 hours ago, Alberyk said:

Now, no one was talking race during the discussion before this, you went out of nowhere into some rant (alongside with a prepared table to serve as some kind of evidence) about some kind of evil jewish plot.

Okay this whole thing is really weird, since we have been already talking about the USSR and things regarding it, also the people in charge. Of course i would have things on that subject. I already explained why i felt the need to give an honest explanation because as ive said i dont get the whole racist part, and i knew where i might have fucked up, not the exact PIN POINT understanding.


So regarding this, i already went over it in my explanation and its blunt but cause of my autism it wasnt INTENDED AS WELL THE JEWS ARE EVIL AND BEHIND THIS. It was an obvious generalization, for me at least. The word "jews'


This supports what ive said above, and what i already explained, that it was the idea of mine at the time and i provided "History class" paragraph for it.

 
Well, it was implied by the reaction and later supported by my ban, that it was seen that way. Like where am i wrong here.

At this point i dont feel the need of apologizing and saying what ive already said, but this reply seems like none of that was literally acknowledged because well, i was blunt and i do not think that commissars being jewish affected anything really, like what do you want from me i already went about this.


Believe what? Do you even know what i believe? What is this supposed to mean.


Here i acknowledge my misinformed opinions and literally say that i was wrong. And i even provide the context for why i brought up an another race and explain my reasoning. 


This prevents me going on 10 more replies then already needed and providing all the information needed for context and explaining how and why. If simply feeling genuine about something, and mentioned before, i didn't really know what was wrong, i couldn't point my finger on it. Now that you phrase it like this, This seems to be the combination of autism and then interrupting it as me defending against WHO I TRULY AM! Honestly, what the fuck.

Also i literally said this to prevent you from falling into that train of thought but you still gone there, like youre reaching for it.


Oh right, thats whats making me look guilty. Did you forgot the fact that its a P E R M A B A N ? And instead of telling me and going about this in a more you know, i would even say liberal way, instead of just BAM, GONE.

I brought up the fact that if thats something that deserved a punishment in your community then it should've not been a perma ban, simple as that. And then i was also every time using wording suggesting that it might not have deserved the punishment from my prespective.

I have a feeling that you went out of your way to literally interpret everything as ive said in the most dishonest and awful way. Like i have a feeling that i need to point thing you just missed out didnt bother taking into account while replying. If the whole verdict is up for your senses if im being honest or not, its quite actually sad that everything seems to be like that, and gives me the impressions of an obvious bias. 

Please follow up with a more sensible reply that does no rely on "I just dont trust you". If you are taking that route well we might as well just have a conversation with literally the half of my friends being Jewish Russians living in Israel. If thats what you are going for.


oh yeah, if you referring to the name of the thread, it was a joke dude. Obviosly refering to the "The Jewish question" debate. I just thought that being banned over apparently anti-semitism, it would be quite appropriate to just do J, you know. Sorry if its inappropriate. 


 

 

Edited December 26, 2020 by kait
oh yeah and that

[Scheveningen]

I was present for this guy stating what he did and getting the immediate ban thereafter. Their initial reference to 'evil jews' was a bit of a shock to me, I'm present in the screenshot alb posted. The comment had me taken aback, it was odd the conversation developed that the subject matter gravitated to that.

Seeing as how there are repeated references to anti-semitism (i.e., the title of this thread - It'S JuSt AaAa JooOOkE DuDe), it doesn't really seem this person is being legitimate. I don't personally want to have this person around if what they said/did before is left to slide and they know what they can or can't get away with.

[kait]

So lets give the benefit of the doubt to the person in the unban thread after me, who had history of repeating some shit for like years lol is given MORE liberty then me just explaining myself in THIS AMOUNT. I have a feeling if i just had come out saying sorry i didn't mean it, there wasn't such a fuss about it. Like what do you want, say sorry to someone who it might've touched or what. I already said that i do not hold the same view i already explained in the post. How many times do i need to repeat that i didnt mean what it came off as and why i then went for the things i went for. Holy shit. This got so personal to the point that "WELL YOUR SORRY DOESNT SEEM GENIUNE" WELL SHIT. I GUESS THE PERSON JUST WRITES ESSAYS TO FUCKING GO GET EM JEWS AND BE ANTISEMITIC AND IS BEING NOT LEGIT!

Like if it all comes down to "I dont trust you are actually sorry for this or didnt mean it" well lets have a conversation, again, if you go THAT FAR to literally take everything i say IN THE WORST POSSIBLE WAY
If its the thing that "If you say anything weird that can be bad - permaban" then thats a whole another problem. I had tendency to get into rants that are really sometimes emotionally fueled, but never received any warning or whatever. And once i make a fucking retarded mistake and then get defensive because i knew by the reactions that what i just said was seen like that probably, thats the virtue signal to totally permaban me
.
Okay yes a joke, do we now even hold jokes as the overall verdict to the whole ACTION of the person. I can change the tittle if it really bothers everyone but thats legit just a joke since i already thought that the immediate action against me as like being antisemitic was really fucking harsh and unforgiving. Since when courts operate of feels.

Im sorry that im quite upset but holy shit. This is literally lets take everything that is written AS THE WORST CASE POSSIBLE SCENARIO and as BEING DISINGENUOUS.
I had no history of that sort of shit and had no slips like that before never warned for saying shit in general never signaled to stop and now its like everybody always knew that i was an antisemite and its a well known thing and like i have history of that shit. What the fuck.


WHAT EVEN IS THIS IM PERMABANNED DUDE. MAYBE A GOOD IDEA TO LET PEOPLE KNOW IF THEY SEEM TO BE REALLY OUT OF TOUCH OR SAYING SOMETHING REALLY FUCKED LIKE I WAS IN THOSE SCREENSHOTS?


I already admitted that it wasn't appropriate and wrong, what else do you want,



YES IT WAS BAD AND BLUNT AND NOT WHAT I MEANT 
I can say that literally to anyone.
Lets take an example a group of like a 100 people and like crime statistics and lets say 60% of crimes were committed by Russians in that group. (Even tho its not entirely a race, but a group and a generalization) 
If i say "those fucking evil Russians decided they could kill and steal shit"
Doesn't sound that impactfull, right?
BECAUSE I WENT OVER THIS


Im sorry if its been too emotional to be appropriate but i have never thought that a ban appeal when im being 100% clear would be called not legitimate and disingenuous. I just actually cant believe how fucking hard everyone is reaching out several comments so far to just dismiss everything.

[Alberyk]

Anyone spewing racist/hateful rhetoric should also be permabanned, it is not something acceptable and not the kind of stuff I want to see in this community. The fact that you keep arguing that what you said was not racist at all is the big reason I don't think I should lift this ban. If you can't see how saying that the jews/foreigners were actively fucking with some country while abusing a position of power is racist, I don't think you understand what exactly you did. Sorry but this was not a blunt comment or an emotional, you even had some kind of proof ready to try to justify your point.

From the discord rule section:

Quote

Staff is under no obligation to strike you first. They may ban at their discretion.

 

 

Rule 5: Do not post obscene, pornographic, or otherwise offensive content. We have people of different ages and backgrounds, be considerate. Nude stuff counts and cropped count works.

 

I was not under any obligation to warn or tell you that you were wrong.

Appeal denied.