[Resolved] Player Complaint - 7/24 5:45-8:30pm EST

[SinfulBehaviors]

BYOND Key: SinfulBehaviors

Game ID: It was the round directly before ci6-agKw

Player Byond Key/Character name: I don't know either of their CKeys, but their characters are Hannah Yeo and Ester Viera

Reason for complaint: Alright, so, I made a new XO for my whitelist trial in order to try different vibes in the same job. It turned out to be a ling round, and, clearly, shit hit the fan. During a radstorm where I was sheltered by science since a scientist and I were moving an SSD ling there. During that duration, I believe another one revealed himself and sec had their hands full. They asked me to open their armory, and I believe I asked them to give me a moment. I ran up to the bridge to bring myself to Interim Captain status (mostly because I had forgotten the laptop upstairs,) so I could actually get in there and let them in, which I had the AI announce so I didn't keep stopping to type. During all of this, sec was yelling at me to go faster and open everything up. Immediately upon doing that, I sprinted down to sec and opened the armory and made sure they were armed. 

All of this is really just setup. I admit that I was slow. I'm new to command, and I didn't make the best decisions in leaving essential items elsewhere, and I don't begrudge security for being pissy with me in that moment. The issue is that that pissiness lasted the entire rest of the round, sorta harming my want to keep playing. 

Sec got their guns, pasted the ling, I apologized for being so slow and then as I was putting crew armory weapons away, I overhear that a machinist had shown up, tried to grab Yeo's shotgun, and it went off and hurt the machinist. I, due to tons of people all yelling at once, dropped in and asked what the hell was going on. I got quite a lot of flak for asking who shot the machinist, and once I was told it was an accident, I didn't press the issue further. However, an argument started to break out with Mobius and a few members of sec due to him needing repairs, and I told them all to disperse and go back to their departments, then told Sec they were to turn their weapons in. They showed up and just...chucked their guns and armor on the ground. When I asked if anyone was going to help me (since there was SO MUCH) the only person who helped was a single white Taj. The rest just ditched.

Once I finished, I left and they were standing around in  and when I asked for who pasted the ling and they started waffling around about it being a team effort despite (IIRC) them literally naming someone earlier. After that, eventually, they faced off against someone who was THOUGHT to be a ling. Three sec officers had guns drawn, ready to move in. I, based on the AI's recommendation, went in to make sure the machinist wasn't dead since all of sec seemed to have left them there in poor health. This got sec on my case because I wasn't giving them orders. Yeo and Viera in particular were caustic, with Viera blaming me for someone's death earlier, calling me braindead, saying "is the captain's braindead-ness spreading" and just over all being shitty. Someone eventually shot the possible ling in the face, and he was carted off to medical. Turns out, yes, he was a ling, and sec had to shoot him. When I asked why there was shooting, Viera cussed at me and Yeo essentially told me to keep my nose out of it. Because, sure, that's reasonable when the interim captain is asking what's happening. 

This all culminated in Viera losing her fucking mind on comms and essentially blaming me for everything. Since she'd been doing this for so long and just wouldn't stop, I suspended her as I threatened to earlier. The aforementioned machinist decided to attack me and just...no one tried to help. Viera is understandable since she was, well, suspended and let me know it, but Yeo was there and chimed in with Viera's "so sorry" as I was literally dragged away.

I'm not begrudging them for being antagonistic toward me. Hell, Felix Fleeter also did the "so sorry" stuff since I had issues with him earlier, but I don't care because it seemed reasonable. I understand why he'd do it. Problem is that Yeo and Viera specifically had no reason to be as antagonistic as for as long as they were. We had maybe 30-45 minutes where everything was fine, but after my slow response to opening their armory they were just really shitty to me for the rest of the session, to a degree that feels almost ridiculous from an IC stand point. At some point, it just started to feel bitter and mean. It's really sucked the want to play outta me for the moment since I was trying my best and I apparently ended up crossing some people who decided to be shitty for the rest of the round. 

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation?: No, because by the point that it felt irredeemably shitty, the round had ended, and when I realized no one was coming to help me, I just said fuck it and left since the round was going to end in a few minutes anyways.

Approximate Date/Time: 7/24 5:45-8:30pm EST

Edited August 9, 2022 by Faris

[WickedCybs]

I'll be the main handler of this complaint. @Faris is assisting.

From what I recall, the main reason security was ICly upset isn't specifically that weapons were delayed, it was that you being late (by roughly 20 minutes was repeated) caused a few people to die due to a lack of those weapons. I can't say it isn't understandable they would carry that with them throughout the entire round. It's not something you can expect anyone to get over, It put you in the crosshairs of security and the delay put security in the crosshairs of the crew over those deaths to the point where things like the roboticist rushing an officer to disarm them or an engineer stealing a pistol and drawing it on security happened. For them, you were late every time and it led to serious concerns the crew might end up attacking them. In this regard, I think the why behind why you weren't treated well in the round checks out. 

With that in mind, I'll be focusing on the how exactly they treated you.

18 hours ago, SinfulBehaviors said:

We had maybe 30-45 minutes where everything was fine, but after my slow response to opening their armory they were just really shitty to me for the rest of the session, to a degree that feels almost ridiculous from an IC stand point. At some point, it just started to feel bitter and mean. It's really sucked the want to play outta me for the moment since I was trying my best and I apparently ended up crossing some people who decided to be shitty for the rest of the round. 

I'll be looking through the logs either way, but to better pinpoint things for me, do you have anything else that comes to mind of something particularly bad that was said, or would you say it was overall, their actions throughout the entire round? 

[SinfulBehaviors]

1 hour ago, WickedCybs said:

From what I recall, the main reason security was ICly upset isn't specifically that weapons were delayed, it was that you being late (by roughly 20 minutes was repeated) caused a few people to die due to a lack of those weapons.

Thing is, I wasn't THAT late. Part of the reason I WAS late was that, IIRC, he revealed himself during a radstorm. I could not get to security without harm, and even if I did I wouldn't have had the ability to even enter the armory. There was literally nothing else I could have done in that situation without giving myself major radiation sickness. Yes, someone died, but to my knowledge he was the one of the first one attacked. Even if I had ran through rads and done what I needed to, I'm fairly certain he STILL would have died. I told them why I was delayed, AND I apologized. 

1 hour ago, WickedCybs said:

to the point where things like the roboticist rushing an officer to disarm them

Again, why did I get flack for this? I was dealing with things on deck 3, and a machinist rushed them on deck 1. There is NOTHING there that has to do with me. In fact, when I got down there to deal with the shooting, I asked who was responsible and when I was told what happened, I just dismissed everyone and left. I didn't press the issue further, I didn't say Yeo was on thin ice, nothing.

2 hours ago, WickedCybs said:

or an engineer stealing a pistol and drawing it on security

I wasn't even aware that they were close to rioting because I was being bombarded by insults and questions of what I was doing, despite me literally telling them I was checking on the injured machinist. Could I have handled the situation better? Definitely, but when it feels like every other message was an insult, I'm not exactly going to be understanding what's going on.  And considering security just stood around, taking my "hold on a moment" as literally as possible, it almost like they were setting me up to fail.

[Montyfatcat]

1 hour ago, SinfulBehaviors said:

Again, why did I get flack for this? I was dealing with things on deck 3, and a machinist rushed them on deck 1.

Just as an input, I'm the machinist in question. The reason security was giving you so much flak was that the machinist was the girlfriend of the paramedic that the delay got killed, this is fairly well known amongst a fair few of the security involved in the incident and likely why they understood it to be your fault. This would also be why, after visiting the machinist and asking "Why am I here?" while she was sobbing in her cell about the loss of her girlfriend, the majority of the security team had no qualms about leaving you out to dry. As far as perceptions went for the crew, the XO didn't care about the death at all and handled it to such a poor degree that they had no reason to back them anymore.

[WickedCybs]

19 minutes ago, SinfulBehaviors said:

Thing is, I wasn't THAT late. Part of the reason I WAS late was that, IIRC, he revealed himself during a radstorm. I could not get to security without harm, and even if I did I wouldn't have had the ability to even enter the armory. There was literally nothing else I could have done in that situation without giving myself major radiation sickness. Yes, someone died, but to my knowledge he was the one of the first one attacked. Even if I had ran through rads and done what I needed to, I'm fairly certain he STILL would have died. I told them why I was delayed, AND I apologized. 

It's just what I saw. It was enough to matter. People were clamoring for something to be done. In the end, you were the only member of command, someone died and the blame became divided between you and security. A death is still a death even if you apologize. I get how it feels like there's nothing you could have done but there was nothing unexpected there to me from how everyone ICly responded. You are going to be held responsible. They did hold you responsible.

25 minutes ago, SinfulBehaviors said:

Again, why did I get flack for this? I was dealing with things on deck 3, and a machinist rushed them on deck 1. There is NOTHING there that has to do with me. In fact, when I got down there to deal with the shooting, I asked who was responsible and when I was told what happened, I just dismissed everyone and left. I didn't press the issue further, I didn't say Yeo was on thin ice, nothing.

You are the sole member of command. The crew is unruly and blaming security, who firmly believe there might be retaliation against them. You came in at the wrong time, when that reality became manifest and they felt, perhaps justifiably so or not that you were not listening and that you were the cause behind the whole mess to begin with. The crew in general eventually came around to this line of thought too. I can certainly see why, it was a combination of the delays, reactions, consequences. Nobody helped you, since things became extremely antagonistic at that point.

33 minutes ago, SinfulBehaviors said:

I wasn't even aware that they were close to rioting because I was being bombarded by insults and questions of what I was doing, despite me literally telling them I was checking on the injured machinist. Could I have handled the situation better? Definitely, but when it feels like every other message was an insult, I'm not exactly going to be understanding what's going on.  And considering security just stood around, taking my "hold on a moment" as literally as possible, it almost like they were setting me up to fail.

I understand that. You were on trial. You were the only member of Command. I've had rounds like this too, and It's frustrating but the tone of a round potentially going against you is something that can always happen. Mistakes or not, everyone responded in character from what I can tell. Nobody belittled you in DCHAT or in LOOC. There wasn't even any bad blood between the crew and sec OOCly from what I can tell despite it even resulting in the machinist getting hit with buckshot. I don't have any reason to think anyone intentionally wanted to hurt you or each other OOCly. Security and Command are always going to be under the magnifying glass. They may not have had the full picture, but they will examine what you've done regardless.

So in conclusion, I don't believe the overall situation was going against any sort of rule. The main thing I'll be looking at is exactly how the in-round issues were voiced to you and whether or not it could have been done better.

[SinfulBehaviors]

I'll be real with you, OOC I've never met either character, nor was I aware of their relationship. ICly, with the character being literally BRAND NEW to the ship, she wouldn't have known either. From there, no one actually informed me of why she attacked Officer Yeo. I lacked quite a lot of context, in part because no one seemed to want to tell me. I understand why the machinist had beef with me now, at least.

Had I been aware of the relationship, I'd've had XO Abadi apologize profusely give her condolences at the very least. Abadi isn't supposed to be cold, in fact, she's supposed to be antithetical to my OTHER XO who is more cold and calculating. That sort of got degraded by the round because I was just getting tired of being shit on throughout the round. 

[SinfulBehaviors]

4 minutes ago, WickedCybs said:

A death is still a death even if you apologize.

Because of all of the berating and people being mad, I wasn't even aware someone had died until Viera used it as proof of me being inept. 

6 minutes ago, WickedCybs said:

It's frustrating but the tone of a round potentially going against you is something that can always happen.

And that's fine, but with the last issue with a potential riot, I didn't know that was happening. I was barely told what was going on, and considering the literal next event we me getting told to get fucked when I inquired why I heard shooting, it started to feel less IC, at least imo.

[WickedCybs]

On 25/07/2022 at 20:22, SinfulBehaviors said:

And that's fine, but with the last issue with a potential riot, I didn't know that was happening. I was barely told what was going on, and considering the literal next event we me getting told to get fucked when I inquired why I heard shooting, it started to feel less IC, at least imo.

I'll definitely make sure to take a look at exactly what was said. Assuming things stay on track, my next post will be on Sunday.

EDIT: It'll be a little later, but not too long hopefully.

Edited August 1, 2022 by WickedCybs
Very late edit

[Faris]

We apologize for the delay, we’re both varying degrees of busy recently. 
 

We’ve investigated the round in question and we found that there was no OOC malice involved. It was a hectic round with both sides seemingly hostile to each other to varying degrees over the course of the round. Breakdown in communication and relations can occur during the more hectic rounds. 

No one is really in the wrong, the round is just a result of unfortunate things happening to the involved characters.