Traitor - IPCs and Other Species

[EJJ]

As a traitor, seeing sec being majority IPC really sucks. I've played IPC-sec, I've played against them as antags, this isn't about power gaming or how they have an unfair advantage, it's about how dealing with them can hard round-end someone if there is no Machinist aboard. Dealing with human sec you can fire on someone enough to get them to back off, whereas IPC-sec it tends to be fire until they're dead and pray a machinist is on to fix them or a scientist is willing to fix them; or spend TC on EMP/Ion weapons.

This also extends somewhat to Diona, but obviously Diona in sec is less of an issue.

My suggestion for improving on this is giving traitors some cheaper but more close quarters ways to deal with IPCs and a temporary battery drain value to IPCs. Give traitors a special IPC prod that takes either two whacks to turn an IPC off for a few minutes or an IPC-flavored parapen that knocks you to zero power for a few minutes. Items that could deny areas to IPCs and other species could be interesting as well, something that effects power and batteries in a small area, tossed in a hallway behind a running antag would get people to stop chasing when their battery begins to rapidly drain.

The temporary part being the most important part. Heck, certain items or an effect could be applied that gives some sort of forgetfulness text; "Your system was shut offline suddenly, you can't remember the details of your shutdown!"

The idea behind this is to mitigate having to straight round-remove an IPC character because they're in your way or trying to stop you. Many times we either don't have a machinist on to fix IPCs or if we do it still takes a while to print a new shell for them.

[Carver]

I like the idea, particularly the prod.

[Boggle08]

For the Parapen idea, it might be better to take the normal parapen, reflavor it as magical bullshit nanobots that attack both flesh and steel, and have them be able to perform in the exact same way you're describing. It'd be less strain on the TC that way. Make the prod cheap too, or give it an option that works on people. The sec baton already does the exact function you're describing when  you power it up on harm intent, a juiced up version for traitors would be good.

Edited August 7, 2022 by Boggle08

[WickedCybs]

Temporary memory removal should not be the most important part of your proposal and I simply can't support this at all due to that. I would not want my round effectively griefed by being targeted with an item that has no organic equivalent in this case, because the parapen doesn't do that. The only memory removing thing in the game comes from a voluntary augment or the vamp drain, and the vamp drain is already contentious as many don't find the memory removal interesting. Just having a parapen-esque long stun might be fine, though that's still not particularly enjoyable.

For the rest, due to the binary nature of IPCs, I don't really think the rest of your proposal will accomplish your goal as well. Rapid battery reduction can be hard to notice until it's too late, and you are either powered or you aren't. If you become unpowered, you're at the mercy of an antagonist and that's that. These tools won't be used to temporarily bypass an IPC. It'll just be used to destroy them with no resistance and round remove them in other ways as is already done with EMPs. Harm batonning also apparently already removes battery rapidly, so the uplink so could just get a stun baton added if it has none already.

What IPCs really need is a rework so they aren't the equivalent of walking terminators a plan needs to hinge on removing. It has to be remembered that they feel no pain, they don't slow down after taking damage, their limbs are hard to hit and even if they are damaged, that don't contribute to the shut-off state (only torso and head damage do) plus the limbs don't even break, they malfunction depending on the amount of damage and that means if the IPC is combative, it will never stop resisting until it is taken offline or stunned.

With that in consideration, I don't think it matters if a machinist is on or that an IPC is "round removed". People playing the organic races can't be brought back at all, that IPCs can even come back into the round is a luxury and they rarely pay for the consequences of their damages as is. Despite any additions to mitigate it, IPCs are pretty much always going to be able to walk up to an antag and annihilate them. If they actually bite off more than they can chew and don't retreat? That's on them. They should be more cautious without a machinist on.

Edited August 7, 2022 by WickedCybs

[niennab]

IPCs against a laser will very quickly just melt and die but if an IPC is approaching you and taking damage, that is a self preservation issue and very ahelpable. Although in regards to a potential para-pen, I do think having Overloaders added into the game would be interesting.

I am however wary of what changing the dynamic could mean, since for about 3 years IPC antagging was made impossible by the ion rifle and in how you could suddenly die because someone off screen spammed EMP grenades.

[Carver]

2 hours ago, niennab said:

I am however wary of what changing the dynamic could mean, since for about 3 years IPC antagging was made impossible by the ion rifle and in how you could suddenly die because someone off screen spammed EMP grenades.

I believe this suggestion is entirely in the context of traitors, so barring antag v. antag the dynamic likely wouldn't change.