Staff Complaint: TishinaStalker

[The Storyteller]

BYOND Key: AbandonedScholar

Staff BYOND Key: TishinaStalker

Reason for complaint: Giving me a warning when I did nothing wrong. (How heartless.)

Evidence/logs/etc: http://vvcap.net/db/IaJQPg5U4ig2z4d2voz6.htp

Additional remarks:

 

You are free to make a staff complaint if you believe my actions were wrong.

 

I have been informed that it is my duty as a member of the community, and as a member of society with an active moral compass, to report any incident that I feel is unjust, and requires further exploration.

PG-13 indicates there's material in the film that may not be suitable for children under the age of 13. A PG-13 movie could go "beyond the PG rating in theme, violence, nudity, sensuality, language, adult activities or other elements, but does not reach the restricted R category." The MPAA will give this rating to films with drug use or more than brief nudity, although the nudity in a PG-13 is not sexual in nature. In addition, the MPAA states "there may be depictions of violence in a PG-13 movie, but generally not both realistic and extreme or persistent violence. A motion picture's single use of one of the harsher sexually-derived words, though only as an expletive, initially requires at least a PG-13 rating. More than one such expletive requires an R rating, as must even one of those words used in a sexual context."

I already responded with why my warning was ill-suited on the other post. The mix-up here is that PG-13 is being confused with G, and I've already made the points I wanted to make. If you want to see what I already said, look at the other thread. I'm too lazy to link it.

Take that, #thesystem.

Edited July 8, 2015 by Guest

[TishinaStalker]

Please use the format located here. http://aurorastation.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=22

[Tenenza]

Edit: Damn it tish, you ninja.

[The Storyteller]

Fixed it. #inflatingmypostcount

[TishinaStalker]

Alright, now that, that is in order... I am enforcing not only rules, but also a small set of rules also imposed on us by RKSZone for administration to enforce in exchange for the fact that they are hosting Aurora for us. Not only extends to the server, but forums as well. Every time people start talking about genitalia they are shut down because it's in violation to forum, server, and RKSZone rules. I'm not here to render a verdict (as that will be handled by another staff member), but those are the reasons why. Along with that, I was acting under orders if the he administrator to apply the warning. That's really all I have to say on the matter. Furthermore, a level if seriousness and maturity is expected here. Myself or another admin will be scrubbing posts like that from the thread if we deem it right.

[nanotoxin]

Is there a link to the definition as to what pg-13 for PKSZone? Because according to

http://filmratings.com/downloads/rating_rules.pdf

Section 3, subsection C3 and subsection C4, A lot of goings on on aurora are either not pg13 but in fact rated R.

There are a number R rated characters, IE drug abusing characters, intense and persistantly violent characters, a number of R rated topics like brothels/harems.

Going back to subsection C3 here, "A motion picture's single use of one of the harsher sexually-derive words, though only as an expletive, initially requires at least a PG-13 rating." Which means that explaining the body of a species, would be allowed, provided, of course we follow a national standard.

If we follow some personal/made up definition of PG-13, that's fine, at least link it somwehere. But I'm just putting in my two cents.

[Guest]

As the RKS Contact, I have a few things to clear up. First, the rule you are quoting is for the Teamspeak server:

6. You may not discuss morally inappropriate topics when minors are in the same channel that you are in! Minor refers to a person who is 17 years old, or younger. Topics which are forbidden refers specifically to those of sexual nature.

This rule is clear and followed quite a lot of the time, slip up's happen but that is unavoidable. This rule doesn't apply in this situation.

Second, the server

-Keep the OOC chat PG-13. Violence is expected in-game; this is SS13. However, avoid bringing up hateful or overly sexual topics.

This is the rule of the Aurora Server, this one could apply to this situation.

Last the Forums

- Keep the discussions PG-13 (no NSFW content)

This rule does apply, it's in the forum rules.

This post is not saying if the warning was justifiable or not, it is to clear up what can and can't be used when challenging the warning.

RKS has nothing to do with the forums, they are hosted in a separate datacenter.

[nanotoxin]

Perhaps his original post could've been worded better, but the debate in xeno genitalia has been censored purely because some people are uncomfortable with it.

Having it for educational and rp purposes wouldn't be against the rules. Having harems and brothels would be an R rated topic however, and a handful of characters are allowed to have those. So either we have rules and follow them, without having these exceptions, or just don't have rules at all.

Its weird rping without that knowledge cause you don't know if that Tajara winking at you has a sentient scorpion down his pants or iced coffee. If aurora is going to be high rp, it should be discussed in a professional manner. Maybe if Tish had requested more professionalism instead of downright locking the thread, this complain wouldn't exist, but with the dismissal of the topic before, its to be expected.

But yeah, I think all that really should happen is the warning removed and a topic is finally brought up about this, in a behaved, professional manner by our ever so creative lore team. But hey, I'm just some guy, so doesn't matter eh.

Edited July 8, 2015 by Guest

[Frances]

Hello. I wrote the rule you seem to be asking about.

Back then, there was no precise definition of PG-13. Rather than going by some exact guidelines set by the MPAA or whatever (that would precise exactly how much of a boob can be shown, and so on), I figured the rule could simply be understood as "try to abide by some general sense of internet decency/decorum". "Internet" PG-13, in my experience, generally means to avoid explicit sexual conversations (simply mentioning sex is okay, going into detail about sexual acts or having crude sexual conversations is not), as well as discussions on irl illegal activities (including drugs, pirating, and any more serious stuff).

I can try to come up with a very basic list of this, off the top of my head:

• Don't talk crudely about sex (saying - or joking - that X and X Aurora characters have banged is fine - having an elaborate conversation about sex acts isn't)
• Don't discuss how to commit irl crimes (some people will obviously say that they're stoners, but we don't wanna know how exactly you want to blaze it up, or where you go to torrent your latest warez)
  
• Don't say stuff with the sole (or main) purpose to offend - including off-taste jokes, whether they be racist, sexual, etc.
  
• Don't engage in hate speech (venting about something random that frustrates you is fine, going on a rant about how you hate everyone of a certain race is probably not a conversation for Aurora)

 

Things you can discuss (that wouldn't be PG13 in a film)

• Extreme violence in the game (since it already happens in SS13)
• People engaging in illegal acts in the game (fictional, no problem)
  
• Religion, politics, whatever else you like to debate, as long as you remain civil

[TishinaStalker]

I didn't lock the thread. That was Baka.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Okay first off the MPAA is a joke. The ratings are given on the basis of how big an influence weenie the producers of the film in question have. There is a reason that the creators of South Park admitted they were flabbergasted that their major films only got an R rating instead of an X, and that the regular series is even allowed to air what they do nowadays. And there was even one movie who's name escapes me (the one where all the celebrities die) that had a giant macro literal Satan with a CGI dingaling swinging around that is then severed by a light from God, where Satan then holds it up to the camera screaming "WHYYYYYY". This is after a Devil Sodomy scene. Rated R. I could go into a lot more detail (with cited sources) but c'mon please don't make me.

Second off, the administration's hands are tied even if everyone was a-okay with crude talk of genitalia going on in the forum. If RKS gets annoyed, they won't host us anymore. I don't want to have Aurora cease to exist because the forums wanted to keep talking about weiners and fannies everywhere.

 

Having it for educational and rp purposes wouldn't be against the rules.

 

We already have very brief descriptions of the reproductive habits of the aliums in our wiki. I talk about this server to my co-workers and advertise it to people IRL. I refuse to incorporate wieners into official lore because I absolutely do not want to IRL defend why there are descriptions of 2D alien genitals on the wiki and in the game.

The warning was completely justified, with all this taken into account.

[Guest]

it is a 2d spaceman game why the fuck do you care about genitalia

[nanotoxin]

Okay first off the MPAA is a joke. The ratings are given on the basis of how big an influence weenie the producers of the film in question have. There is a reason that the creators of South Park admitted they were flabbergasted that their major films only got an R rating instead of an X, and that the regular series is even allowed to air what they do nowadays. And there was even one movie who's name escapes me (the one where all the celebrities die) that had a giant macro literal Satan with a CGI dingaling swinging around that is then severed by a light from God, where Satan then holds it up to the camera screaming "WHYYYYYY". This is after a Devil Sodomy scene. Rated R. I could go into a lot more detail (with cited sources) but c'mon please don't make me.

 

Second off, the administration's hands are tied even if everyone was a-okay with crude talk of genitalia going on in the forum. If RKS gets annoyed, they won't host us anymore. I don't want to have Aurora cease to exist because the forums wanted to keep talking about weiners and fannies everywhere.

Like I said, it's been dismissed purely because people are uncomfortable with it, and that's fine too, you know, we gotta keep the server pg-13 for a reason, children to come to this server, we do accomodate you Jackboot. But if the loremaster has problems talking about, you know, something that would/should be in the lore in a professional, non crude manner, then why the hell is he loremaster?

 

Having it for educational and rp purposes wouldn't be against the rules.

 

We already have very brief descriptions of the reproductive habits of the aliums in our wiki. I talk about this server to my co-workers and advertise it to people IRL. I refuse to incorporate wieners into official lore because I absolutely do not want to IRL defend why there are descriptions of 2D alien genitals on the wiki and in the game.

The warning was completely justified, with all this taken into account.

 

It's not like the specific dimensions and what each skin cell looks like is being asked of you bud. Just a confirmation on what X has. Just because you're to afraid to have an awkward conversation, doesn't mean the loremaster shouldn't be putting in lore.

 

whatever delta said

Because RP. Like I said, how are you supposed to know if that Tajara across the bar has websters dictonary or a waterbuffallo down his pants.

[Susan]

There is no reason for there ever to be a discussion involving the intricacies of alien genitalia and until further notice all Tajaran have poison-spitting scorpions on their pants.

There is literally no reason to talk about alien genitals. There is no reason to need to know about alien genitals. Use your imagination, and do it in private.

[Guest Menown]

Basically what Sue is saying, no official canon, since there doesn't need to be. If /anything/ comes up regarding it, it should be done in private, and not officially established.

They're mammals. Assume they have mammalian parts. That's how I've gone at it.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

If you think I need to resign as loremaster because I won't put dicks in the official canon then you're an extremely unreasonable person and I"m not participating in this conversation.

And as to the sources:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/bully-director-slams-mpaa-great-hypocrisy-307290

https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110420/17472113979/mpaa-hypocrisy-we-must-protect-culture-were-not-interested-protecting-culture.shtml

http://movieline.com/2010/12/06/today-in-mpaa-hypocrisy-good-vs-bad-oral-sex-kids-with-weapons/

Now I take my leave.

[Frances]

But if the loremaster has problems talking about [skrellian vaginas] then why the hell is he loremaster?

hear, hear

[Guest]

But if the loremaster has problems talking about [skrellian vaginas] then why the hell is he loremaster?

hear, hear

 

You should not be encouraging this, this kinda discussion really doesn't matter. He has problems with it because its against the rules. PG 13 discussions do not include discussing the intricate details of alien genetallia so people's ERP can be more in depth.

[Frances]

I was obviously being sarcastic.

I mean, I think someone being mad at the loremaster because he doesn't want to detail alien genitalia is kinda ridiculous. I can think of many in-depth sci-fi -verses that have little to no info on sex (unless it's somehow plot-relevant), and encouraging a bunch of horny teenagers on the internet to create their weird canon for it is... probably not a really great idea overall.

[SgtSammac]

I was obviously being sarcastic.

I mean, I think someone being mad at the loremaster because he doesn't want to detail alien genitalia is kinda ridiculous. I can think of many in-depth sci-fi -verses that have little to no info on sex (unless it's somehow plot-relevant), and encouraging a bunch of horny teenagers on the internet to create their weird canon for it is... probably not a really great idea overall.

 

Sarcasm does not translate well in text. Especially if all you posted is "hear hear"

[Frances]

Sarcasm does not translate well in text. Especially if all you posted is "hear hear"

I would've very, very honestly hoped that most people were capable of assuming that I wasn't particularly interested in the specifics of Skrell genitalia at this point.

However, I have already been proven wrong on at least two accounts.

All that I can say is ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[SgtSammac]

I'm not saying you do care. I honestly couldn't give a flying fuck.

I am just saying that text does not convey emotion well. Especially if someone doesn't know you, so get off your high horse Frances.

[Guest]

whatever delta said

Because RP.

 

[nanotoxin]

But if the loremaster has problems talking about [skrellian vaginas] then why the hell is he loremaster?

hear, hear

 

You should not be encouraging this, this kinda discussion really doesn't matter. He has problems with it because its against the rules. PG 13 discussions do not include discussing the intricate details of alien genetallia so people's ERP can be more in depth.

 

Like, can you not read Xander? I had said that there doesn't have to be/shouldn't be intricate detail, just a mention of the breeding habits. In addition, I also have never erp'd.

But if the people of the server aren't mature enough to discuss basic biology in a professional manner, than that's fine. We were fine without the information and can keep going without it. But to give the guy a warning, and then eventually ban him from the forums because of this was silly.

[Guest]

But if the people of the server aren't mature enough to discuss basic biology in a professional manner, than that's fine. We were fine without the information and can keep going without it. But to give the guy a warning, and then eventually ban him from the forums because of this was silly.

 

...Uh, no, the forum warning was issued because discussing skrell 'vaginas' in an inappropriate fashion is stupid.