[RESOLVED] Abendroth - Nia Snyder (A BIT LATE)

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

BYOND Key: Jackboot

Player Byond Key: Abendroth

Staff involved: I made an incident report but Sierra-kun said to make part of it a complaint

Reason for complaint: Metagaming, "dont be a dick" violation

Approximate Date/Time: ~8pm, mountain time, April 9th

The IR in question for full context.

 

Overview of the Incident: Nia Snyder detained Jason Guess, a fellow security officer, for abusing evidence, and organizing a break-out. I stumbled upon her and various security staff as well as the Head of Security discussing it just outside interrogation. I asked what was going on and Nia was snide in commenting that she had already mentioned it over the security radio. I apologized and said that I had been SSD, and asked for more clarification. It was explained that Guess was accused of the above, which he denied. I then activated my personal recorder and asked her to repeat just his specific charges, after which she insulted me for being deaf and not listening, all while raising her voice and at one point screaming.

She still managed to explain through her hissy fit that she found a book on Jason Guess that other individuals involved in security incidents over a new-age religion had also been in possession of, and claimed it was evidence. When I questioned further, she admitted that the book wasn't part of any specific criminal investigation. When I remarked that books themselves are not contraband, she became belligerant again, and the resulting argument had the Head of Security order her to calm down.

She refused, and walked away making snide comments and flipping off all present. The charges against Jason Guess were dropped and made invalid by myself and the Head of Security and Jason Guess served no time or punishment, though he proceeded to request a transfer out of security, which was not possible due to the lack of a HoP. His later neglect of his duties out of bitterness for this are not justified but these extend beyond the scope of this complaint. In addition, I want it clear that the invalid arrest is secondary to her behavior.

Later, after continued security incidents, Nia Snyder made the following remarks on the security radio:

[security] Nia Snyder says, "Too bad the fucking cat has such a big paperwork dildo shoved up his arse."

I then requested she be brigged or demoted for her behavior, of which the barely-joined AI Esra advised against due to the elevated security situation.

[security] Nia Snyder says, "Even the AI realises how dumb you people are being, that's fucking sad."

The Captain intervened as the HoS was tired and unavailable, and immediately demoted Nia Snyder.

It is my opinion that Nia Snyder's childish behavior and flagrant disregard for corporate regulations and her uniform are abhorrent embarrassments to this corporation and that she should be temporarily relieved of her role so that she can go through the training and conditioning that she seems to have already disregarded. Insulting Internal Affairs or even another person in such a childish way is not something that this Agent feels should be permitted by officers.

 

The metagaming aspect here is that Abendroth tried to throw the book at someone for possessing a cult book, I believe Nia called it contraband as well as evidence but that might be a mistake. During the round at the time the cult books weren't considered themselves evidence of anything. The cultists were part of a "new age religion" or something and we had even asked CC about when it was acceptable for them to draw runes in their own blood. CC was weirded out but said it was a health issue so to not do that. The only part of the cult that was worth brigging at the time was committing an actual crime or drawing runes in blood.

The security officer Jason Guess, was apparently detained for trying to break out another cultist. That's fine, but the book he had on him was used by Nia Snyder as an excuse to increase the severity of his charges. When Houssam, IAA, and even the HoS started questioning her, she got belligerent and started screaming in all caps. Later on after storming off she kept insulting Houssam over the radio and saying he had paperwork dildos shoved up his ass. She ended up getting demoted at the end of the shift but she's still a sass storm.

Abendroth has a history of behaving this way with Nia Snyder and I don't really want to trust them to play in security, especially with their frequent, ceaseless, repeated metagaming, IC screaming, insubordination, etc etc etc. I was already told by DO's that my IR against Snyder would take ages because there's a huge backlog of IR's to do. So I'd like to see a jobban from security for any duration of time.

[SierraKomodo]

A quick note that when this IR was first posted up, I double checked with admins. The above /is/ an OOC issue, not an IC issue, and is why Jackboot was recommended to post a player complaint. So, let's not bring up 'But this is an IC issue' or anything like that please. Thank you.

[Dreviore]

I wish to add to this. I was a ghost this round, and I watched the entire thing.

Nia Snyder took the book out of their backpack, and claimed it was specifically contraband in order to prolong their sentence.

[Garnascus]

Been trying, and failing to get ahold them to direct them to this complaint. we need their side of things before i issue any sort of judgement.

[Abendroth]

AAAGGHH, I WROTE SO MUCH AND IT GOT EATEN BY SPACE CARP. Fuck it, re-typing from scratch.

Hello, again, this is my second attempt. My last attempt was a lot more elegant, but now I've annoyed myself.

So the situation with the book, the Cultists all had books and we knew they all had books. When the prisoner was claiming the Officer in question helped her escape, we were of course suspicious. When we asked him about it, and if he'd be willing to be searched as a sign of good faith, he went very defensive and tried to get out of it. Naturally Security are a suspicious lot, so we got him on the floor and took a gander through his bag.

What we found was a Cultist book. Now, this was either one of two things: A book belonging to a Cultist (Still incognito as new religion) and was taken from evidence without permission, and thus was tampering with it. Or it belonged to the Officer, and it was a new copy. Now, at the time, I admit I was suspicious. So I began connecting the dots in my head as to why an Officer would help the prisoner, seemingly of their own free will, and have this book on them.

The connection was he was a member of their religion, and was helping the prisoners try to escape out of religious ties. This is why I proclaimed the book as evidence regardless if it was already or not, because it was now. I had been explaining this over coms the entire time, which the IAA has access to. This is where the "Do you not listen?" thing comes in, because it irked Nia that her explaining was completely ignored and then she was asked to repeat it again anyway.

Now, after Nia did try to explain everything again, the IAA in this situation began to act like he was the HoS himself. Even the HoS made a slight comment on this if I recall correctly, as the IAA began questioning my ability to do my job, and acted as if he were in complete control of the situation and knew everything regardless of not actually listening to Nia's earlier explanations.

So yeah, Nia decided she didn't like this IAA. However she was quite happy to leave him alone, except for a few harsh words here and there. Now, later in the round where the comments posted in the spoiler are stated, the entire station was in a crisis. Madmen with robes were killing innocents, swords and cultists armour was abound, and we were in a lot of trouble. In this situation, we Officers were trying to contain the problem, negotiate if possible, and ultimately put a stop to this.

But what was the little voice in our ear? The IAA demanding he have all of his paperwork all written out and tidy before we lifted a finger, while innocents were being killed that very instant. The general response by Security? "Fuck that, we're gonna save these people." Now that's where the first comment comes in, which prompted the threat of demotion, which the Borg at the time (who I mistook for the AI) agreed that this was a very stupid course of action considering the current crisis. Thus leading to the second comment.

Now, was Nia perhaps out of line with her comments? Yes. But she was stressed and isn't a very nice person sometimes to people who annoy her, and is still very human regardless of her profession. (Dude, I've met some Security guards IRL, they were very rude people even during their jobs due to stress.) Now this stress is kind of doubled by the fact people are being killed, and this IAA catman is demanding she not do anything unless HE says she can? Yeah, not gonna fly with her in this situation, there are lives at risk. So what does she do? Make a few petty comments to help relieve a bit of that stress and get back to work.

Now, if these comments offended the player of the IAA OOC? I'm very sorry, that was not intended, I was merely playing my character. However I must point out Nia is usually NICE to people, and if she is using insults it's more in a jokey manner for some good chuckles. She is by far not the worst personality on the station, which is filled with flirts, idiots at times, and over-serious assholes who'll fire you for looking at them wrong. Nia's not gonna change her ways very easily, hell I'd say she has improved over time, mellowed out a lot from when I first started playing her. She only ever really becomes an asshole when her life is on the line, people are being HUGE assholes to her in the first place, or she is heavily stressed by the situation. Being a dick at times is how some people deal with anger and stress, instead of whipping out the harm baton and caving in a few skulls.

Anyway, sorry if I'm rambling. This is my second try time typing this out as I said before, and I've kind of neglected the round I'm currently in. Sorry it took a while to respond, but I only just learned about this, and I usually have a gap in my playtime due to my job and real life. I don't get on enough to keep up with this, and it annoys me.

Thank you for reading my shitty second attempt, it's not as good as the first by far, but fuck it.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

If someone that commits a crime happens to have a bible, you do not start detaining everyone in town that has a bible, nor consider all bibles as evidence.

 

Now, later in the round where the comments posted in the spoiler are stated, the entire station was in a crisis. Madmen with robes were killing innocents, swords and cultists armour was abound, and we were in a lot of trouble.

 

The rioting and chaos had not taken place during your arrest of the officer. A long bit of time, actually.

 

This is where the "Do you not listen?" thing comes in, because it irked Nia that her explaining was completely ignored and then she was asked to repeat it again anyway.

 

He had activated his recorder to ensure your statement was recorded and he could make sure he had the story straight.

 

Now, after Nia did try to explain everything again, the IAA in this situation began to act like he was the HoS himself. Even the HoS made a slight comment on this if I recall correctly, as the IAA began questioning my ability to do my job

 

Questioning you is literally his job.

 

Now, was Nia perhaps out of line with her comments? Yes. But she was stressed and isn't a very nice person sometimes to people who annoy her, and is still very human regardless of her profession.

 

I'm fine with that, but you should also accept the consequences for acting this way. Telling an agent of internal affairs that he has objects shoved up his ass is extremely offensive. You would be immediately fired if you did this outside a videogame environment.

 

The IAA demanding he have all of his paperwork all written out and tidy before we lifted a finger, while innocents were being killed that very instant.

 

It was code green. And again that's literally his job.

 

and this IAA catman is demanding she not do anything unless HE says she can?

 

Houssam did not press any authority over anyone in security. He repeatedly only made sure to remind everyone that warrants were necessary on code green. It was code green. Later it was code blue. He no longer asked for warrants. He offered to stamp warrants to make them more official.

The arrest that you made was questioned and so he questioned you about it. The head of security also questioned you about it. You then screamed in all caps and flipped off both your superior and an agent of internal affairs.

The behavior is not acceptable even with your explanation. You're extraordinarily defensive with Nia Snyder being justified and "otherwise a nice person!!" but I don't accept the arguments. If Nia had not thrown a big fit and stormed off dramatically she would have been able to answer another question or two and get to brig the officer for his break-out attempt, but your behavior and refusal to even acknowledge the agent's authority to question your arrest lead to the entire thing being voided. That is in addition to your metagaming with the cult book.

[Abendroth]

You completely missed the point of what I said. The book was being used as a connection as to WHY he had been helping them try to escape, and thus subject to suspicion. And we may have been code green, but that was because nobody updated the code while people were being killed. It's called understanding the situation as a human being instead of going "Code green? People are being actively murdered? Time for everyone to stop and write out paperwork before we save them!"

And you may have thought you were not pressing any authority, but you were very much acting like it. Also the arrest was not questioned until you questioned it, as every officer there at the time was on the same page until you turned up with the HoS, having not paid attention to coms as previously mentioned as being what irked Nia. And when she repeated things to you anyway, you began being rather rude in general to her.

But regardless, Dum vivimus, vivamus. Lets just move on, it's long since passed and I doubt anyone from the round actually cares anymore.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

I care, which is why this complaint exists.

I have nothing more to add and haven't changed my stance, it'd be great if an admin could weigh in now.

[Abendroth]

I care, which is why this complaint exists.

 

Yeah but... Why? It literally doesn't matter anymore.

[Garnascus]

Unfortunately, it does matter. According to you have a bit of a history doing this kind of thing. You aggressively searched and arrested someone when they chose to decline a search. At best that is straight up illegal IC and powergaming OOC. There is no such thing as a "search in good faith" you either have orders/code blue power to search someone or you dont.

Not liking someone IC is fine, you do however have remain professional to someone who can /make your life miserable/. IA arent just desk jockies with comms access. They have status and answer to centcomm. your argument with the agent can mostly be attributed to an IC issue, however we do have to enforce SOME standadd for security even OOC. you're a trained professional, not a mall cop.

Finally, we could chalk this situation up to a warning if this wasnt indicative of your usual MO. in the past three months you where warned for firing on your HoS after being demoted. An offence i would have job banned you on the spot for. You where also noted for beating someone into crit when an arrest was technically possible.

The point is you seem to go over the line in aggression as security quite often. When questioned IC you get defensive and even resort to insulting your superiors. Its unfortunately too egregious of a history to ignore with a warning. We feel a week ban from security is appropriate here.