ADHD0ug Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 BYOND Key: ADHD0ug Total Ban Length: Can't find it/unstated. Permanent? Banning staff member's Key: "This ban was applied by alberyk on 2016-07-22 15:45:29" Reason of Ban: "For trying to vent the central ring as an atmos tech, messing with the alarms, also the player has a long history of warning with several ckeys, which does lead the staff to believe he is ban evading" Reason for Appeal: Hi, uh, this is only my... third(?) time playing on Aurora? Unless I played once on my other BYOND account that I barely used years ago that I can't use because the account was deactivated from disuse and I don't have access to that email service anymore. I'm new to Spacestation 13, BYOND in general, and therefor also new to being banned. I'm still learning how to play and may make some mistakes related to that, but this is way beyond my scope of understanding. I only figured out what ckey means when I found the form to fill out this appeal. I've never heard of an "awakenedfear" and refuse to ever utilize a name so ridiculously edgy, and nobody else could have played from this connection. I could not have been banned for being an atmos tech, venting a central ring (whatever that is), or messing with alarms when I was playing a JANITORIAL CYBORG doing my very best not to get involved with the cultist craziness that just occurred. On top of all this however I just noticed the date of the ban application was July of last year? So now I'm not so much upset as I am just confused (as you probably will be) as to why this is affecting my brand new account after my first few rounds. I'm sorry this has to be my introduction to the forums, but now that I'm here I'll see about locating an intro thread (if you have one) once I know we have this issue settled.
Scheveningen Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 A few things to keep in mind when someone gets banned for ban evading is a few variables: IP and computer ID. Our player notes and ban system runs cross-reference checks for similar patterns in IP and CID. This requires extra effort for some people to ban evade without being noticed + their notes being transferred to the new ckey when they first log into the server. Do you have any family, house-mates, roommates or people you know that would've played at your computer to potentially break rules on our server in the past? Have you always played at your IP? Is the computer you have the same you've owned for some years or did you buy it off someone else in the recent past?
ADHD0ug Posted March 17, 2017 Author Posted March 17, 2017 Yeah, I've had this computer for several years now. This is embarrassing to admit but I never really learned how IP works, among other technical gaming basics. As long as the IP stays the same while it's in one spot then yes, I've always played at this IP for BYOND since I only reinstalled it recently. If you're counting over multiple accounts then like I previously mentioned, I had an account I used maybe two or three times many years ago in a different location. That has since been deactivated for inactivity. The account name was ADHDoug (hence the 0 in this one) if that helps. At the previous location I suppose my little brother may have been able to sneak on my computer on rare occasions (since I practically live on it), but he had his own. He was also here last summer with a couple friends, but again, opportunities to access my computer without supervision would have been scarce. My brother and his friend both brought their computers with them, and if either of them played SS13 at the time that might explain the IP issue, but not the computer ID issue. That part is new and concerns me. One of my friends said I should mention I have people who can vouch for me but those are my friends and I realize they could hardly be trusted as unbiased witness. Plus I'm afraid to bring my friends into this as out of several, one is a... well a wildcard who honestly may have to submit his own ban appeal soon enough. I'd go into detail but this probably isn't the place.
Skull132 Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 Okay, so here's le story. A few days ago, I think it was like. Wednesday? Catnip asks me to investigate a string of mirrors which concern the very pleasant individual known as Tamassran. Also known as Corgilover69 and probably Awakenedfear. To cut a long story short, they play, get stupid, do stupid shit, get banned. They were given two chances. Anyways, I investigated and then very specifically purged all CIDs in the bans involved, as it might have been a conflicting hash. Mittensthefeared trips a wire on the 16th (which shouldn't have happened after my purge if it was purely a CID hash conflicting! As your CID and that of Mittens' was not mentioned in the database once!). Then you trip the same wire a few hours later. Point one. The chances of 2 players actively playing at one time having the same CID are pretty fucking slim. While hash collisions are a thing, believing that that is the case is becoming harder and harder specially as we take point two into consideration. Point two being that your CID changed from one stable run to another overnight. Literally 22 hours before one connection you had identifier X, and then later on you had identifier Y, which tripped the alarm. This does not happen on its own like that. If that story was confusing, then that's because it indeed was! But the last point kinda points you out as someone who's been banned here and either forgot, or neglected to mention that. Anyways, I'll leave you and the admins to knaw this shit out. I'm just the code monkey here.
ADHD0ug Posted March 17, 2017 Author Posted March 17, 2017 Yeah it's confusing, but mostly because I literally have no clue what you just said. Sent it to one of my friends for potential translation, now he says he's gonna get involved to "chew some ass and kick some bubblegum". I'm already banned, I guess he can only make it better?
AllyBearsley Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 Howdy dowdy everyone. I'm not actually here to start any mess. I'm just here to reiterate that this is a good friend of mine, who I've known for years, and we've only just got back into SS13 after years. We played once long ago and I'm almost totally sure we didn't play on Aurorastation. I do like the server, but I've already had admins question me about things I haven't done. Like RPing a crippled war-veteran with no ability to drag people away and being asked why I was dragging someone away after beating them over the head with a bottle. I did accidentally smash a bottle against my chair when trying to unbuckle myself (I'm an idiot with the hands menu and am learning) then was dragged away by a friend. Just saying I've seen issues arise from confusion on the admins part, but server gets crowded and people can have similar names. It's not unheard of. Now I'm going to reiterate something: We do not know what you are talking. Use simple terms and language to us. Explain what something does so we can maybe figure out ourselves what went wrong. Just throwing around things like "CID conflicting" means nothing to me. How likely two people having the same CID key means nothing to me. How his CID changed from X to Y in less than 22 hours when he's done nothing to do that, means nothing to me. How can someone change that accidentally or intentionally? Like can he have a Windows Update one day and this trigger some issues? Can he have something running in the background or have run something like bitcoin. To be honest I'm surprised Doug remembers how to turn on his computer, so I doubt he'll be able to ban evade. So just step back and explain clearly what's going on so maybe we can help understand what went wrong.
ADHD0ug Posted March 17, 2017 Author Posted March 17, 2017 Should probably mention we're in near constant contact, we're talking on Discord right now and I assure you there is much debate about the problem and banter about me NOT KNOWING HOW TO PUSH THE BUTTON ON THE TOP OF THE COMPUTER.
Skull132 Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 Extremely simple language: Doug used two computers to play on our server within the last 72 hours. One of those computers is banned from our server. Thus, in accordance with our policy, he is banned until the original ban for Tamassran/Awakenedfear/Corgilover69/Mittensthefeared is lifted. Or until the admins deem the bans to be the result of a system's glitch/irrelevant enough to not bother theory testing. Though, as the system maintainer, I am now adamant that Doug is not giving us the full story.
AllyBearsley Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 I'm actually pretty sure he hasn't used two computers though.
Skull132 Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 And I have data to prove otherwise. Unless he tampered with files and data that a "computer noob", as you phrase it, wouldn't even know were tamperable, he had to have used at least two different computers (or VMs, though, again, unlikely according to your story). It is impossible to generate such data otherwise.
ADHD0ug Posted March 17, 2017 Author Posted March 17, 2017 I don't even have access to two computers. And I thought I was probably giving TOO much information, what constitutes a full story? I don't know how to talk in code. But basically what you're saying is that I definitely love to 69 with corgies and if this is a case of mistaken identity it isn't worth looking into?
Skull132 Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 There exist roughly two possibilities: You lied about not using two computers, which would also lead us to you potentially having been banned from here before. BYOND fed our system conflicting data, and the ban you're running into is erroneous. Â For reasons explained in the initial post, I am inclined to believe the former, at least in part. As for what'll happen from here on out. That's up to the Administrators. While you and your friend cannot fully understand the tech speak, the administrators are familiar enough with the system to draw reasonable conclusions based on the information in there. So we'll see! I'll make sure to post it on Discord. For data, I'll discuss the matter with the Head Admins. Though it's as simple as him logging 2 unique values in 72 hours on our database, when a person using one computer would log only 1 unique value. Unless they do other tampering with it. And the latter of those 2 values (specifically, the latter) ended up matching a value logged by a user who is banned. Thus, Doug is now banned by proxy.
Skull132 Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 Pop-quiz question in the mean time. Is ADHD0ug the only ckey you've been playing with as of recent? If not, please list out all of the ones you've been using.
ADHD0ug Posted March 17, 2017 Author Posted March 17, 2017 It is, I literally just made the account within the last week and played a few rounds.
ADHD0ug Posted March 17, 2017 Author Posted March 17, 2017 It has been mentioned the mistake is possible but slim to the point of not being worth checking. I usually put my faith in the computers making no errors as well but assuming you guys are willing to give it a shot I hope it allows no room for error. At this point I'm almost more interested to see how I got tied up with this other guy than being unbanned. Edit- Where'd Scheveningen's post go?
Skull132 Posted March 17, 2017 Posted March 17, 2017 Edit- Where'd Scheveningen's post go? Â It was deleted by my request. As a Trial Moderator he overstepped his bounds by making that post. I apologize for that. As stated, I have raised the matter for the Head Administrators to review. Please allow them a day or so to have a look over the thread and the information.
ADHD0ug Posted March 17, 2017 Author Posted March 17, 2017 Oh, I didn't even notice they WEREN'T an admin. Bleak as the outcome looks I'll thank you for the time you've put into the matter and apologize if either of us seemed to get too defensive. I'm in a sort of panic state over what I guess is... reverse identity theft? Since I guess I'm technically the one that stole somebody else' identity somehow. Anyway, I'll stop bloating the thread now and try to be patient.
Skull132 Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 Spoke with Itzal. Going to paste here the same thing I wrote to him and Garnascus: Tuesday, someone with the ckey timebomb46 connects and asks Catnip to unban CID XXXX (belonging to his friend, mittensthefeared). I do that. I forget to lift the mirror for mittensthefeared and he gets rebanned last night. And then this guy gets banned due to them having the same CID. Questions to ask: - What the absoloute fuck are the chances of 2 pairs of friends playing on the server at the same time (the same week), where one of each pair has the same CID as Tamassran. Despite any of them sharing an IP (5 unique IPs, with both Timebomb's and Ally's being geographically close to each other). - How does someone generate two unique CID logs when supposedly playing from the same computer (pro-tip, they don't). - Why are you lying to us about point two? See, there's enough evidence to keep the bans active, but there's also some bits of data saying, "Huh, this might be a really freak coincidence." Minus the last count of you lying to us. Which is something I can claim with absoloute certainty. And it all leaves us scratching our heads a little. One thing that could be done is Ally connects to the server over the next 48 hours and replies back here. I've modified some datafeeds to be more visible, and we'll see what we can confirm and rebuke off of that. Though I'd also very much like an elaboration on the having two computers/using a VM/something else not allowed when you're potentially banned. Unless you, Doug, completely rebuilt your PC within 20 hours, before the ban. Or reinstalled Windows. Or something else very extreme like that.
ADHD0ug Posted March 19, 2017 Author Posted March 19, 2017 The main problem now seems to be the CID thing. I'm glad you found traces of it being a coincidence, but all I can do is promise you I don't have two computers and didn't do anything TO my computer even though I know there's no way to prove it. I just know we played a round, and when the round restarted I got a ban instead of connecting. Definitely didn't reinstall Windows, and I barely know how the inside of my computer works. It's an Alienware, but I am proud of the fact I've at least been able to put another hard drive and new video card in it (not when this incident occurred). There's nothing less extreme that could cause something like this? No programs? A virus? Maybe something like Hamachi? I ask because I can't seem to get it to stop launching on startup and I usually close it, but I may have forgotten. Remembered because I restarted my computer last night. There are maybe three other computers in the house but they barely get used for solitaire and mahjong, but that wouldn't matter if they've never been used to connect to the server would it? I also have that second hard drive I mentioned, and sometimes the computer decides to boot from that for no reason, but that just results in a bootup loop until I do the F12 thing and switch it back manually because it doesn't have an OS installed. I dunno, I'm throwing everything I can think of in desperation. Spent a couple minutes googling hoping to find things that can cause it but I don't really understand much of it. WAIT! Found something that says something called a virtual network adapter can change the code and lists off phone stuff, I do leave my phone plugged in and sometimes it does weird stuff for no reason. I'll experiment some.
AllyBearsley Posted March 19, 2017 Posted March 19, 2017 Alright I'm hopping onto the server now, if I need to do so some other time let me know. Also I'd like to speak to an admin personally.
Skull132 Posted March 19, 2017 Posted March 19, 2017 WAIT! Found something that says something called a virtual network adapter can change the code and lists off phone stuff, I do leave my phone plugged in and sometimes it does weird stuff for no reason. I'll experiment some. Â A link would be nice, though as far as we're aware, this doesn't affect the CID. A phone being plugged in doesn't generate a vnet adapter either. It's just another USB device that does nothing to the files/registries BYOND reads from. Â Also I'd like to speak to an admin personally. Â I can be found on the public discord, here: https://discord.gg/N2efpC4 Look for King Buttebot, with the rank of Grandpa. And no, I'm not joking.
Eltuen Aristol Posted March 19, 2017 Posted March 19, 2017 Hello, I'm Doug's brother. I can verify that Doug does not have two computers that he could play on. I know it might be a bit much to ask on my part, as it seems you really don't want to take the chance with him, but could you see about putting him on a sort of trial period to make sure? On the few times he has played so far he hasn't done anything close to griefing as far as I know and if he doesn't cause any big problems then would it be fine? Until recently the last time he played was likely years ago, so he's still trying to actively learn the game.
ADHD0ug Posted March 20, 2017 Author Posted March 20, 2017 http://support.accountedge.com/kb/general/what-is-a-machine-id-and-why-would-it-change Considering I don't really understand any of it I can't promise it actually applies, but it sounded like it might. I tried unplugging my phone and joining the server but I was still banned, that's about all I could garner to try. I followed the guide to bring up network adapter info though and I do have several tunnels but I think they're all listed as Microsoft stuff so I don't know if it's a good idea to mess with those.
Skull132 Posted March 20, 2017 Posted March 20, 2017 Okay, bans lifted. I managed to miss one ban while building my dossier, a very recent one, which also showcased Tamassran having been actively used in December. So it basically turned into me lifting this appeal with full admittance that you are most likely lying and are Tamassran/mittensthefeared/whoever the fuck. As such, the condition for lifting this appeal is as follows: if you get banned again for being stupid, we will not consider any further appeal from this CID, ever. No matter how convoluted of a fuckfest you manage to conjure up, and all other evidence be damned. And for ref, you are lying about your computers, and what you linked has little to nothing to do with how BYOND manages its CIDs. With that said, you should be able to play on the server again. Do not fuck up. Also, apologies if I sound bitter. This is the first time in my three years of doing this that I've been presented with a case as absurd as this.
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