BurgerBB Posted May 1, 2018 Author Posted May 1, 2018 Delta has a slight point in that, our players visit le reddit. And they will discuss and respond to what's posted on reddit. Ergo, if you make a post, it can be brought up for discussion. It is your business not to take it personally for as long as the discussion isn't made personal. (Something which Coalf kinda voided in that one example, buuuuut Abo will probably get to that.) Though saying you contribute to drama is dumb, [mention]Scheveningen[/mention], because one could say that you're contributing way more to drama by being the peanut gallery for this thread. Anyways. I kinda wanted to address this bit in specific. And I'll preface this with stating that GarnAbo have final call on this, as handling administrative punishment is their call. Unfortunately, I'm starting to get paranoid when it comes to this complaint when it comes to the overall reaction. I've seen this sort of thing happen in communities where they bring up the faults of both sides and using those faults try to find some common middle ground in this situation instead of actually addressing the problem. It really makes me believe in this theory as first the response to the problem was "I don't see some actual issue with any of this." and now it's "Alright both sides have a problem now." which frightens me. But, the thing you have to note is. At the moment, the best that could probably be done is a wrist slap given to Coalf. There's absoloutely not enough evidence to do anything else, nor the precedence for it. We usually expect our staff to learn from their mistakes and shortcomings. However. I have literally spoken to both of you over private channels. And I know that you both have a problem with each other. Coalf has an issue with the way you've implemented some features and your conduct around feedback, you have an issue with criticism and conduct. Both are more-or-less valid to a similar degree. Though yes I suppose that Coalf's handling of the issue could be more civil, but the issue would still be there. So the more positive outcome is for you two to find common ground and to figure out how to better get along and communicate with one another. As that would hopefully leave both of you off on a more constructive note and avoid future issues like this more easily. I'm not calling for coalf to be banned or demodded as I am not the judge, jury, or executioner. I don't care what happens exactly to coalf because I do not care about coalf in the way everyone thinking I care about him. I legitimately could not give a right shit about what he thinks about my addons or anything else, the issue here is that he went out of his way, to put it bluntly, be super rude. I don't have an issue with criticism. My addons have in the past, been criticized and I appropriately addressed them. I only have an issue with people who overreact (See: Peanut Gallery) and people who don't contribute anything at all to the conversation. Like I mentioned earlier, my only sin is attempting to speak to idiots who contribute nothing to the PR itself or make stale, overused memes. Skull, you're a decent guy, but I don't know where you're getting this idea that I dislike coalf. I don't know how I could convince you that I simply don't care about him, just what he says.
Skull132 Posted May 1, 2018 Posted May 1, 2018 wat. I'm kinda confused. Point one, I never implied you dislike Coalf. Read my posts. I said, and let me quote myself, "You have an issue with [his] criticism and conduct [around that criticism]." That is comparable to, "[ I have an issue with] just what he says." So there really is no misunderstanding here on this part, I assure you. And you can see for yourself as well. I will elaborate further by saying that I assume no malice, which hating someone is, until proven otherwise. As for the rest. Apparently Coalf has apologized a few times over specific incidents. And did attempt to speak to you about this complaint in private. I suppose he could say a final sorry here as well, but I'll leave that GarnAbo and Coalf to decide on how they want to act. Outside of that, like, figure out what the purpose of this complaint is. Because you're now also speaking against yourself: "25% of the intention of this thread is to see what standards the admins are held at and if there is no issue then I suppose I will support that decision." This thread will be made note of for future reference regardless of what explicitly is done about it, and I hope that this jabbing doesn't repeat itself. I guess if we can all agree to not do the jabby bits over discord, we'll be good?
BurgerBB Posted May 1, 2018 Author Posted May 1, 2018 Oh, I understand now. I thought "And I know that you both have a problem with each other." meant there was some personal issues that we had with each other.
Faris Posted May 1, 2018 Posted May 1, 2018 My opinion boils down to you two clashing. Contrary to the sentiment here, I had always intended to have you two speak, I still suggest for you two to do so, Burger speaking to me only gave me more insight on the matter. In fact, I can't help but feel Coalfs willingness to speak when you weren't so interested an indication on things, even though you could've just asked to speak at another time, instead of what seems like dismissing it. So let me touch on things for the two of you. [mention]BurgerBB[/mention] , you're very wishy washy when it comes to discussions. You take a serious posture and then jump to "don't take this so serious" to serious and variations, it's hard to get a proper bead on you. [mention]Coalf[/mention], honest joe or not, reign it in. Just because you feel they deserve it, doesn't mean you should jump into a situation like that. Frustration may get to the best of us but you still need to better control it. If I'll be direct. Block each other or make up. This feels more of a dispute between two people than extreme issues with a staff member. I'm not doing any major reprimands from this, I've already touched on the points before. None of you hate each other, so just try to be cordial to each other. As for the official statement. Coalf is being told to better control himself when it comes to sniping at people. He's always shown himself to be reasonable and I've never seen him shy away when he's been at fault, though that's not to say that faults happen often. In short, he's a reasonable guy and I trust that he'll be better about this in the future.
BurgerBB Posted May 2, 2018 Author Posted May 2, 2018 My opinion boils down to you two clashing. Contrary to the sentiment here, I had always intended to have you two speak, I still suggest for you two to do so, Burger speaking to me only gave me more insight on the matter. In fact, I can't help but feel Coalfs willingness to speak when you weren't so interested an indication on things, even though you could've just asked to speak at another time, instead of what seems like dismissing it. So let me touch on things for the two of you. @BurgerBB , you're very wishy washy when it comes to discussions. You take a serious posture and then jump to "don't take this so serious" to serious and variations, it's hard to get a proper bead on you. @Coalf, honest joe or not, reign it in. Just because you feel they deserve it, doesn't mean you should jump into a situation like that. Frustration may get to the best of us but you still need to better control it. If I'll be direct. Block each other or make up. This feels more of a dispute between two people than extreme issues with a staff member. I'm not doing any major reprimands from this, I've already touched on the points before. None of you hate each other, so just try to be cordial to each other. As for the official statement. Coalf is being told to better control himself when it comes to sniping at people. He's always shown himself to be reasonable and I've never seen him shy away when he's been at fault, though that's not to say that faults happen often. In short, he's a reasonable guy and I trust that he'll be better about this in the future. "In fact, I can't help but feel Coalfs willingness to speak when you weren't so interested an indication on things, even though you could've just asked to speak at another time, instead of what seems like dismissing it." Abo you're giving me clinical depression. I was going to let this go but now I just have to talk about it now. This is the conversation that went down: https://i.imgur.com/xSaoIXn.png I told him I was busy playing 2D spessmens, now, this wouldn't have happened if you'd let me do my thing and speak to him at a later date when I don't have things planned, like I said I would, instead of on a saturday morning when I was out, and a saturday afternoon while I was relaxing. https://i.imgur.com/tWMReCf.png There was some pretty gross miscommunication here, it would've been better if I approached him with things to say instead of being put on the spot in the middle of an AI round. While I appreciate your willingness to become a mediator, this doesn't help. Please don't do this in the future because it doesn't help.
Faris Posted May 2, 2018 Posted May 2, 2018 -snip- "In fact, I can't help but feel Coalfs willingness to speak when you weren't so interested an indication on things, even though you could've just asked to speak at another time, instead of what seems like dismissing it." Abo you're giving me clinical depression. I was going to let this go but now I just have to talk about it now. This is the conversation that went down: https://i.imgur.com/xSaoIXn.png I stand corrected. The way it was described here to me was different from how it is. This is my mistake and I do apologize for it. Edit: Going to consider this resolved now and lock it. Don't think there's much more to be said now.
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