EvilBrage Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 BYOND Key: EvilBrage Player Byond Key: Alberyk, OneOneThreeEight Reason for complaint: Instant rambo on code delta. Approximate Date/Time: 2/6/15, approx 6:30pm EST The moment Code Delta was called and my Hack Intercept module failed to work, Aaron Hawkins (played by Alberyk) almost instantly used a RIPLEY (that could not be EMP'd) to begin drilling right into the back of the core from the public hallway. In addition, Talia Verick (played by OneOneThreeEight) began to assist him after his mech had been destroyed, throwing EMP grenades obtained from the derelict and pulling him away when the turrets had begun to kill him. By the time I had stopped typing to the rest of the crew, it was way too late to stop them - the RIPLEY had gone through the wall and an EMP grenade took my turrets and cyborg out of commission. I'm not sure how a shaft miner and a plasma researcher put together knowledge to break into the back of the core and start hammering away at me - but seeing as I didn't want to create an atmos issue by filling the place with plasma, I just let it happen. I think I've established a fair record of involving the crew in my dastardly antagonistic schemes, but things like this really drain my enthusiasm for the role - I'm hoping we don't just let this slide, because it's indicative of a larger, "win mentality" based problem.
Guest Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 A miner would know how to utilize a mech to take down a wall... And a scientist would know how to use an EMP grenade... And you had been declared malfunctioning anyways, so they knew you needed to be stopped, I admit it was poor form on their part, but nothing I see as overly punishable...
EvilBrage Posted February 7, 2015 Author Posted February 7, 2015 To take down a wall at the exact point of weakness at the very back of the AI core? They knew the AI core inside and out without any logical reason for knowing the layout of the core - for all they knew, they were drilling into a random reinforced wall. Never mind why in the world their bloodlust would lead them to do that, charge into an AI core full of turrets and bash the AI core to death with all the fury of Khorne's Berserkers, shrugging off the whir of the turrets and the blaze of laser fire and the borg spewing polytrinic acid that melted the remains of the very walls they had to dig through.. We obviously have very different opinions of what's sensible and what's not.
Guest Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 To take down a wall at the exact point of weakness at the very back of the AI core? They knew the AI core inside and out without any logical reason for knowing the layout of the core - for all they knew, they were drilling into a random reinforced wall. Never mind why in the world their bloodlust would lead them to do that, charge into an AI core full of turrets and bash the AI core to death with all the fury of Khorne's Berserkers, shrugging off the whir of the turrets and the blaze of laser fire and the borg spewing polytrinic acid that melted the remains of the very walls they had to dig through.. We obviously have very different opinions of what's sensible and what's not. Sensible is subjective after all, while it is slightly power/metagamey to have gone right for the AI's weak point... Most crew would know that it leads to the AI core, and a scientist may know the AI core layout. While fearing turrets should have kept them away, perhaps they had a reason not to fear them? Such as the EMP grenades that can disable them.
Guest Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 hi By the time code delta got called, ICly, my character knew something not good was going to happen. I heard cargo was going to send their shuttle to the outpost, so that's where I went. once i reached the cargo lobby, I noticed a ripley with a diamond drill marching straight out, tearing down the wall. Aaron said, "hey, girl, help me out here," along with other people attempting to take down the wall. Given the tension of the moment, I honestly thought the player of that character had a legitimately good reason to be apparently killing the malf ai. i had reservations against it, I just wanted to survive and not bother interacting with the antagonists at all. I ended up deciding, "well, I guess you have a good reason to be killing the AI", and tossed in the classic EMP grenade I was originally intending to break down in R&D before C:D got called. The girder gets taken down leading to the back-facing AI and then I hit the AI a few times with a baton. I get out of the firing line and let security finish the AI off. Actually, you know what, I'm not going to finish. I'm done. It comes to an absolute surprise to me that none of my behavior has been properly curbed, despite my insistence I can do better. IT's utterly fucking stupid that I am not being punished properly for this. I have been a consistent issue since day-fucking-one and not a single one of the staff member has even given a single shit about enforcing the rules the way they were meant to be enforced. I do not deserve lenience. I do not deserve ANY of this unnecessary 'kindness', that you all call it. This is fucking favoritism, and I'm not going to be enabled as a fucking hypocrite any longer. And I'm fucking done.
Alberyk Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 Well, the wall I was drilling was the one before the cargo, also, when the ripley was destroyed, i slipped inside core and the emp grenade tore off my right hand, I did not stay there, I fled to the mining station. Also, with mesons you can see the layout inside the core. When the delta code was called and people were screaming on radio about robots attacking them and carps from the holodeck I was just finishing to smelt the plasma at the outpost. And since Aaron have a great distrust about artificial intelligence beings he would suspect that the AI, which was showing signs of not working properly, could be behind it. But, I agree it was a rash action, but since it was code delta it would mean that the station was going to explode. And I think you can destroy the exosuit using the console at R&D.
Chaznoodles Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 I really don't see why this is a complaint. Two people took down a malfunctioning AI using the respective knowledge of their occupations.
EvilBrage Posted February 7, 2015 Author Posted February 7, 2015 I really don't see why this is a complaint. Two people took down a malfunctioning AI using the respective knowledge of their occupations. Probably because you weren't playing during that round, no offense. When Scopes and others who were observing chime in, maybe they'll be able to fill in those details I seem to be missing. I also wasn't aware that non-command staff had access to an AI and intricate knowledge of its core - if it had been the chief engineer and the research director, that would be an entirely different scenario (though no less ganky) but the lack of knowledge that these characters would have on the subject in particular is just icing on the proverbial shit cake. It would have been far easier to go off to their respective outposts rather than take advantage of a design flaw in the mapping and a bug that prevented me from stopping the break-in before it started, but from what I saw, they just wanted to kill themselves an AI and found the perfect excuse to do so. And I think you can destroy the exosuit using the console at R&D. [...] Aaron Hawkins (played by Alberyk) almost instantly used a RIPLEY (that could not be EMP'd) [...] It's a known bug that the EMP button does nothing.
Guest Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 If they didnt know about the layout, the fact the miner had his Mesons on, that let him see through walls, probably gave him the layout, and the Scientist would know an EMP or electrical shocks would take an AI out.
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 It doesn't matter if the scientist and miner had knowledge of the lay-out. They played to win, and their characters showed no fear or desire to remain alive in a fanatical robust frenzy.
Guest Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 It doesn't matter if the scientist and miner had knowledge of the lay-out. They played to win, and their characters showed no fear or desire to remain alive in a fanatical robust frenzy. Brage was kinda playing to win to as the AI... He released Carp, slimes, I walked into the Bridge and he blew up the communications console in front of me, he blue up genetics and chemistry out the blue. Then again, this is always how Malf AI has gone.
TishinaStalker Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 I do not deserve lenience. I do not deserve ANY of this unnecessary 'kindness', that you all call it. This is fucking favoritism, and I'm not going to be enabled as a fucking hypocrite any longer. And I'm fucking done. Hooooooooold on. This isn't favoritism. This is simply a result of how our MO goes when I first talked to you so long ago during that one alien event. Potentially to be stripped of his whitelist if more negative reviews on him come in after consideration with other active staff (Pump, Jenna, Sue, Valkrae, and FFrances) on his behavior as Captain. by TishinaStalker (TrialModerator) on Sat, November 8th of 2014 Prior to this, you were talked to twice about powergaming. This was the third issue, and it meant harsher action was to be taken on next offense. On your next instance, your whitelist was removed, and you claimed you were "exiling yourself" from Science until you believed your behavior was fixed. We saw no reason to ban you from the server and/or Science, and believed that removing something you need to apply for again was punishment enough. In conclusion, there was no favoritism, just escalation of force. Get me?
K0NFL1QT Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 If they didnt know about the layout, the fact the miner had his Mesons on, that let him see through walls, probably gave him the layout, and the Scientist would know an EMP or electrical shocks would take an AI out. I was going to raise this point. Mesons would let them see the layout of the interior, but the placement of turrets wouldn't be visible. And seeing as neither a scientist or a miner have regular access to Security cameras to have feasibly known the turrets location, or even existance, then simply having mesons shouldn't have lead them to breach through the wall right behind the SMES. It smells of metagame. But ultimately, I have no sympathy for any Malf AI that calls code Delta.
EvilBrage Posted February 8, 2015 Author Posted February 8, 2015 Brage was kinda playing to win to as the AI... He released Carp, slimes, I walked into the Bridge and he blew up the communications console in front of me, he blue up genetics and chemistry out the blue. Then again, this is always how Malf AI has gone. Short of saying "bzzt, I am malfunctioning," how would you recommend I approach the situation? I involved the crew in unorthodox ways - blowing up the communications console was a method to stop the escape shuttle from being called; your positioning had very little to do with it. I tried to hack APC's in very obvious areas, but the power was going out, so no one was really paying any attention to that. Eleven APCs flashing blue and not one person stopped to ask why; the crew was, in general, headed towards killing themselves from a lack of competence, and there's precious little I can do if someone doesn't want to play along.
Guest Posted February 8, 2015 Posted February 8, 2015 Brage was kinda playing to win to as the AI... He released Carp, slimes, I walked into the Bridge and he blew up the communications console in front of me, he blue up genetics and chemistry out the blue. Then again, this is always how Malf AI has gone. Short of saying "bzzt, I am malfunctioning," how would you recommend I approach the situation? I involved the crew in unorthodox ways - blowing up the communications console was a method to stop the escape shuttle from being called; your positioning had very little to do with it. I tried to hack APC's in very obvious areas, but the power was going out, so no one was really paying any attention to that. Eleven APCs flashing blue and not one person stopped to ask why; the crew was, in general, headed towards killing themselves from a lack of competence, and there's precious little I can do if someone doesn't want to play along. We aren't really supposed to ask about the APCs, most crew wouldn't know what all the colours mean, engineering MIGHT look into it, because it's abnormal, but we had no competent engineering staff. Instead of rushing killing everyone, we need an AI that does something interesting, like tries to get the crew to build a monument to the AI's glory or something, not an AI that just starts killing and then calls Delta.
Guest Posted February 8, 2015 Posted February 8, 2015 Brage was kinda playing to win to as the AI... He released Carp, slimes, I walked into the Bridge and he blew up the communications console in front of me, he blue up genetics and chemistry out the blue. Then again, this is always how Malf AI has gone. Short of saying "bzzt, I am malfunctioning," how would you recommend I approach the situation? I involved the crew in unorthodox ways - blowing up the communications console was a method to stop the escape shuttle from being called; your positioning had very little to do with it. I tried to hack APC's in very obvious areas, but the power was going out, so no one was really paying any attention to that. Eleven APCs flashing blue and not one person stopped to ask why; the crew was, in general, headed towards killing themselves from a lack of competence, and there's precious little I can do if someone doesn't want to play along. We aren't really supposed to ask about the APCs, most crew wouldn't know what all the colours mean, engineering MIGHT look into it, because it's abnormal, but we had no competent engineering staff. Instead of rushing killing everyone, we need an AI that does something interesting, like tries to get the crew to build a monument to the AI's glory or something, not an AI that just starts killing and then calls Delta. Maybe the AI doesn't want to get the crew to build a monument to its glory because it knows a bunch of chemists, scientists and bartenders are going to go full hero mode and destroy it seconds after it makes an announcement. And that's not counting security, or the ERT.
EvilBrage Posted February 9, 2015 Author Posted February 9, 2015 We aren't really supposed to ask about the APCs, most crew wouldn't know what all the colours mean, engineering MIGHT look into it, because it's abnormal, but we had no competent engineering staff. Instead of rushing killing everyone, we need an AI that does something interesting, like tries to get the crew to build a monument to the AI's glory or something, not an AI that just starts killing and then calls Delta. No offense, but that's probably the least interesting idea I've ever heard - the second a demand is made, this is followed by "STATE YOUR LAWS" followed shortly by either the aforementioned mentality of must-kill, or boisterous laughter and dismissal of that cooky AI personality. There's no gravity to that kind of situation - gravity, conflict, and tension all build up into those fun situations. As the singular entity on the station incapable of movement, antagonistic AI's are almost wholly dependent on sabotage to put their plans into motion. If I were rushing to kill everyone, I'd have flooded the central hallway with plasma and lit it all on fire - instead, I chose the high road here to put a highlight on how ridiculous these two were acting.
DeezyJ Posted February 10, 2015 Posted February 10, 2015 Maybe i am a bit late, but i must say it. I was observing that round and i dont like how the things happened. Why? Because: 1. NanoTrasen Security Protocol #99719 was violated hardly. 2. Noone of that characters that were ramboing near A.I. core roleplayed at that moment (not only miner and scientist) 3. Massive metagame including: *Unfounded intentions to brake into A.I.core *Abusing knowledge of station layout *Ignoring immedeate treat to your character and abscence of intentions to save own life-This includes ramboing inside AI core under it's turrets as well as ramboing inside A.I core while you most likely should think how to evacuate from station *Abusing knowledge of A.I. game mechanics 4. As a result, taking player's ability to play without a good reason. Example: If A.I. wins- game just restarts. If you take down A.I., one player is dead and the rest of the round is fucked as well for previously dead players. 5. Playing to win. Nothing bad won't happen to you if you get a fancy pincure of exploding station. That's my personal opinion on this situation, no offence.
Valkrae Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Will archive this complaint unless someone wants to continue it.
Doomberg Posted March 12, 2015 Posted March 12, 2015 Okay, here's the way we see it. The moment you escalate to Code Delta, you should be preparing for a desparate assault. An IC announcement goes out more or less saying "destroy the AI now or everything explodes". It's fight or flight - a cornered animal is going to bite and claw at you. They did not powergame by using anything they didn't have the knowledge to use. As for the metagame point, it can easily be justified with Mesons. With that in mind, I don't see any reason to take action against either of these players, hence, I'll be marking this as resolved. The author is more than welcome to PM myself or Jenna in order to contest this. Locking and archiving.
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