Staff Complaint - Arrow768

[GlitterGuts]

BYOND Key: GlitterGuts

Staff BYOND Key: Arrow768

Game ID: b2f-b87r

Reason for complaint: I was killed without warning by an dev and received no message about the incident until I ahelped, because I thought that me dying was a glitch.

Evidence/logs/etc: clipped to the post.

Additional remarks: I could have been winded or warned instead of being taken out of the game, even if its just a few min timer. It felt like a severely disproportionate response to what I was doing and my ticket was closed before I could give a response. Rats chew on non-food items all the time to get nesting material like cardboard and wood so the part about it being for food doesn't matter a whole lot. Rat nests are filled with paper and insulation shreds. I also know ive seen other rats do this exact same thing for an entire round an nothing happens to them. Its annoying, yes, but thats why there are mouse traps and people easily kill rats whenever they want. I'm sure it seems petty but I really don't like being killed out of the blue for something I didn't know whats wrong, even if I was just a rat milling about, considering there's no rule against shredding boxes as a rat, unless this falls under the "dont be a dick" rule, where I say, rats are considered pests, so I was acting like one. Plus, eating a box isnt the end of the world, it doesn't destroy the items inside, it just inconveniences them a little. 

All I needed was a little "hey, try not to bug medical too much" or "you should really just go for unattended food"

[Arrow768]

For reference the text that shows up in the chat when you become a rat:

Quote

You are now a rat. Though you may interact with players, do not give any hints away that you are more than a simple rodent. Find food, avoid cats, and try to survive!

In a recent PR this specific wording was proposed:

Quote

You are now a rat. Though you may interact with players, try to avoid giving hints away that you are more than a simple rodent. Cause mischief, avoid cats, find food, and try to survive!

We intentionally choose to go with the first wording as in the past we have had issues with players being stupid with mice (that are now rats) and do not want to enable that via the description.

You were being stupid as a rat eating boxes that dont contain food in medbay (i.e. nitrile gloves, syringes, ...) to the point where the medbay players ahelped that.
As you were in the process of eating boxes at the time and I wanted to check a few more things before I talked to you, I just "dusted" you.

I probs could have winded you or told you to stop, but then again you are a rat nibbling boxes to annoy the people in medbay.
Taking into consideration the short respawn delay for simple mobs and that they are not a "character" involved in the round I believe that the response was fitting.

 

[GlitterGuts]

"you are dead now because you broke a rule that is not known or written down" does not seem like it was fitting at all. Even if its just a small respawn timer I dont think its a reason to take a play out of the game. Rats will eat through garbage cans, cardboard boxes and walls even if there is no food to be found, for nesting or to wear down their teeth so they dont grow too long. The players who ahelped it lost nothing by having their gloves be on the table instead of in a box. If you feel so strongly about rats not eating boxes, just make it more clear in the wording for other players that don't know, or remove it entirely because I can guarantee you that I wouldn't have messed with medical had I known it was a no-no

[Garnascus]

On 16/07/2019 at 01:01, GlitterGuts said:

"you are dead now because you broke a rule that is not known or written down"

The rules are not a comprehensive list. They do not detail every single niche scenario on behavior you can and cannot exhibit. This is one of those situations. You yourself admit that "its annoying but..". There is absolutely no reason for you to chew on medical's resource boxes other than to be an annoying butthead. I probably would have deleted you too.

[GlitterGuts]

1 hour ago, Garnascus said:

You yourself admit that "its annoying but.."

Its annoying but I dont think it warranted death. This is just like the meme of ss13 where sec shoots the clown bc they're annoying instead of dealing with it like a normal case.

[Garnascus]

But you where a mouse...

[Garnascus]

2 hours ago, GlitterGuts said:

Its annoying but I dont think it warranted death.

Can you tell me what went through your head then as you ate medicals boxes? I am struggling to believe you had wikipedia articles open of mice nesting habits and thinking "Aha... it says right here mice need carboard and things to build their nests. this is totally a legitimate reason for me doing this. I am not doing this just to piss off medical players!"

[GlitterGuts]

57 minutes ago, Garnascus said:

Can you tell me what went through your head then as you ate medicals boxes? I am struggling to believe you had wikipedia articles open of mice nesting habits and thinking "Aha... it says right here mice need carboard and things to build their nests. this is totally a legitimate reason for me doing this. I am not doing this just to piss off medical players!"

I was thinking of it more like a game of cat and mouse. I pester them and they try to set a trap or catch me. The only thing they lost was a box to keep their gloves in, which never leave that table anyway unless they're wearing them. Rats dont think to themselves "oh, they probably like this box so I should leave it alone". I wasn't causing harm to them or taking away their medicine, or doing anything a rat wouldn't do.

That said, I get that I shouldnt do that now, I just dont think I should have died bc admin didnt feel like warning me first.

Edited July 18, 2019 by GlitterGuts

[Garnascus]

 

On 18/07/2019 at 03:53, Coalf said:

In this case it seem the player was just deleted and had to actually ahelp for an explanation, thus negating any claims the action was supposed to serve as a warning

Well as i understand it from arrows post he was in the process of it? 

 

On 15/07/2019 at 14:19, Arrow768 said:

As you were in the process of eating boxes at the time and I wanted to check a few more things before I talked to you, I just "dusted" you.

 

On 15/07/2019 at 14:19, Arrow768 said:

I probs could have winded you or told you to stop, but then again you are a rat nibbling boxes to annoy the people in medbay.

Though to be honest winding would have been better. Does that seem fair @Arrow768

[Arrow768]

Yup, winding would have been fair game aswell.

But as I mentioned in my first post: from my point of view they played a rat not with the idea of roleplaying the gathering of nesting materials, ... but with the explicit purpose of being a annoying little beast.

This is further cemented by the fact that they didn't bring up their "proper" roleplay of gathering nesting materials when I informed them that nibbling "just for fun" is not something that we like to see.

With that in mind I just went for the kill option.

Regarding the "you are dead now because you broke a rule that is not known or written down".
Let me rephrase that: "you are dead now because you broke the dont be a dick rule by playing a rat with the explicit purpose of being a annoying beast"

[Garnascus]

9 hours ago, Arrow768 said:

But as I mentioned in my first post: from my point of view they played a rat not with the idea of roleplaying the gathering of nesting materials, ... but with the explicit purpose of being a annoying little beast.

Yeah, thats fair but i still would prefer you PM them next time. I know we have killed mice before that where causing the AI turrets to spam stun logs though. 

[Garnascus]

Locking and archiving