Security Officers wearing armor at code green

[Felkvir]

lol why is this even a thing

Literally no other RP server (or bay server for that matter) did i see officers being allowed to walk around with their armor on at code green when nothing is happening

[Guest]

We are not other servers. I think it looks good and somewhat makes sense from IC standpoint. Mall guards carry vests around during normal duty.

Otherwise, the real question is, why not?

[Serveris]

..Mooooooooost private security workers wear protective vests whilst on standard operations duty. It's usually a requirement in that line of work.

We currently have restrictions against wearing helmets on code green, which is considerably more understandable. I see very little reason why this should change.

Can you provide more than 'lol why is this even a thing?'

as to why you think it SHOULDN'T be?

[Filthyfrankster]

Majority of security rarely wears a helmet on code green.

The armor vest itself found in security officer/detective/CSI lockers is a mere stab vest, durable and lightweight enough to stop some random twat from stabbing them with a knife, offering protection to their squishy organs. What's wrong with an officer having the right to feel secure?

And do keep in mind that this is STILL considered a stab vest, so unless you're one for self antagging security, A weapon a much higher threat (E-sword, Traitor revolver, Nuke ops weaponry, Laser weaponry) will go through it easily.

Now if they were running amok on code green wearing a bulletproof vest/Riot gear/Alb armor, sure. That's a concern worthy situation.

[CakeIsOssim]

Security officers are given armor to wear, and should be encouraged to wear, for the same reason half of the command staff are given sidearms to carry around. "But, there's never any violence aboard the Aurora!" There's always the possibility of violence anywhere. Two things here, as well.

 

• -Insurance
  
  -High Value Target

 

The officers are given armor to wear as insurance. Their own safety is insured, meaning they can go on to keep doing their jobs as they might not have been injured from their last interaction with a detainee. It goes along the same line as to why there's an armory full of lethal weapons on a corporate space station, and why the owners of said station also have their own paramilitary/mercenary force (ERT).

People get violent. It happens. Let's say someone wants to get pretty violent, and they want to strike someone who would be pretty important to the station and/or crew. A security officer who's job it is to stop you from fucking around would be one. Command staff who lead said officers, command staff who maintain the crew's access and on-station credit accounts, and command staff who are in charge of the whole station, would also fall under this 'high value target' blanket. All of the command staff I just listed are given an e-pistol to carry, which is arguably more concerning to have visible than a vest meant to protect someone from a physical engagement (stabbing, punching, getting hit with other blunt/sharp objects in the chest).

 

Can you provide more than 'lol why is this even a thing?'

as to why you think it SHOULDN'T be?

 

Have to agree with Serv, here. Could you provide a reason why they shouldn't, other than 'lolno?'

[Guest]

-snip-

Can you provide more than 'lol why is this even a thing?'

as to why you think it SHOULDN'T be?

 

Have to agree with Serv, here. Could you provide a reason why they shouldn't, other than 'lolno?'

I like how Serv just rephrased what I asked and I get no points for it. Welp.

I'm gonna play the devil's advocate and provide a few reasons for consideration. First, Security is supposedly too strong on Aurora and stab vests just help keep the, again, supposedly unfair advantage. Second, we are apparently supposed to keep to this standard no vests every other server has, just so everyone else would feel more at home here. Third, Aurora is viewed as overly militaristic and the vests add to that view.

Now to sum up and refute my points before someone actually bothers to do so: Because people will moan about it sooner or later if we don't. To which I refute, who cares. Your average skilled antag can still wreck half of security despite the vests, your average shitty officer will die despite the vest. Otherwise, why conform to someone who won't play regardless.

[Frances]

For reference, here is the current level of protection security armor provides:

melee = 50, bullet = 15, laser = 50, energy = 10, bomb = 25, bio = 0, rad = 0

 

These numbers are based on a percentage ratio, meaning a melee or laser attack has a 50% chance to "miss" the user when wearing sec armor.

This protection applies to the torso and groin, meaning the head and limbs are exposed to full damage values.

[Zidanyia]

For reference, here is the current level of protection security armor provides:

melee = 50, bullet = 15, laser = 50, energy = 10, bomb = 25, bio = 0, rad = 0

 

These numbers are based on a percentage ratio, meaning a melee or laser attack has a 50% chance to "miss" the user when wearing sec armor.

This protection applies to the torso and groin, meaning the head and limbs are exposed to full damage values.

 

Kinda, not quite, though!

 

/*
run_armor_check(a,b)
args
a:def_zone - What part is getting hit, if null will check entire body
b:attack_flag - What type of attack, bullet, laser, energy, melee
Returns
0 - no block
1 - halfblock
2 - fullblock
*/
/mob/living/proc/run_armor_check(var/def_zone = null, var/attack_flag = "melee", var/absorb_text = null, var/soften_text = null)
var/armor = getarmor(def_zone, attack_flag)
var/absorb = 0
if(prob(armor))
	absorb += 1
if(prob(armor))
	absorb += 1
if(absorb >= 2)
	if(absorb_text)
		show_message("[absorb_text]")
	else
		show_message("\red Your armor absorbs the blow!")
	return 2
if(absorb == 1)
	if(absorb_text)
		show_message("[soften_text]",4)
	else
		show_message("\red Your armor softens the blow!")
	return 1
return 0

 

quoting living_defense.dm

Basically what this says is that you have three scenarios based on the probable outcome of the hit. First off, we have a couple procs as the base of the probability roll. Afterward, you have a proc that says "if our dice roll ended up with greater than or equal to two, then fullblock." Elsewise you get a chance for halfblock, which reduces half of the damage inflicted on you.

Or your vest fails miserably due to RNG, spiting you for getting shot at in the first place. :c

There's also stuff related to "sharp" type objects as well as "edge", but we're not going to go into that since there's not really an easy explanation for how that stuff works besides "It's brute damage, but it hurts you in different ways".

Oh, hi!

[Felkvir]

Got the impression early on by a staffmember that it was not normal to do when i asked, or they weren't sure or something and i remembered it so i made this thread .. Was explained about it in OOC the moment i linked it though so, uh.. *cough*

[Zidanyia]

I figure it's okay, nobody's going to hold that against you! Being wrong/mistaken is just fine.

[Prospekt]

Yes, because if someone runs up to me with a ballistic of some sort or a laser weapon, he/she is going to give me enough time to put on my vest.

Yeah, no. It makes sense for you to wear a kevlar vest as means of protection because at any point someone can take hostile action against you and possibly kill you depending on whether you have kevlar on or not.

[Dreamix]

Yes, because if someone runs up to me with a ballistic of some sort or a laser weapon, he/she is going to give me enough time to put on my vest.

Yeah, no. It makes sense for you to wear a kevlar vest as means of protection because at any point someone can take hostile action against you and possibly kill you depending on whether you have kevlar on or not.

Code green. Usually, on green, people don't run around with ballistics, and when they do, it's usually non-canon, so you can't remember that and always wear armour.

On the subject, it would be cool to actually see security officers walk around in suits, ties and stuff, like some kind of blue internal security. But, I see no other reason to disallow security of wearing armour on green.

[Dzheymz]

Yes, because if someone runs up to me with a ballistic of some sort or a laser weapon, he/she is going to give me enough time to put on my vest.

Yeah, no. It makes sense for you to wear a kevlar vest as means of protection because at any point someone can take hostile action against you and possibly kill you depending on whether you have kevlar on or not.

If someone running up to you and shooting you is a legitimate threat during the shift, you increase the alert level. That's literally what it's for: to regulate procedure based on the current level of threat facing the station and it's crew.

[Gollee]

Code green can also be applied to a police officer walking down the street; they still wear a stabvest; the reason being that an emergency can happen at any time; a stabvest helps ensure the officer is not the first victim; and is thus able to stop the psychopath/wannabe gangster/bank robber using said knife.

EDIT: Code Green doesn't mean no threat; it means no known threat; but one may emerge at any point; the same with standard policing.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

There are canon security threats and it is perfectly reasonable for officers to wear vests. Its not iif aurora is infiltrated, it is when.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Marlon Phoenix

[LordFowl]

Personally everyone on the station should wear helmets. It's not if the ceiling falls on you (Despite the ceiling not actually existing, shhh), it's when.

[Dzheymz]

There are canon security threats and it is perfectly reasonable for officers to wear vests. Its not iif aurora is infiltrated, it is when.

Then we should start on a higher alert.

[cdb]

There are canon security threats and it is perfectly reasonable for officers to wear vests. Its not iif aurora is infiltrated, it is when.

Then we should start on a higher alert.

That's silly, being at code blue at all times would be disruptive to work. Cops, private security, mall cops all have to deal with the reality that "any" time you may be facing a potential threat, on average it wont happen but a stab-vest is the least amount of effort you can put into insuring yourself against such a thing. You don't elevate the security level as a pre-emptive "Maybe something will happen, I dunno" with no real reason beyond that speculation.

[Guest]

There are canon security threats and it is perfectly reasonable for officers to wear vests. Its not iif aurora is infiltrated, it is when.

Then we should start on a higher alert.

In theory, yes, but reality is that we can't do that. If we were to stick what Aurora should be, a State-of-the-Art research facility, we would have constant security checks upon leaving the labs, high security level, camera recordings from every possible angle. We would have full rooster of professional and highly trained staff. It would be nothing like current Aurora.

So, what do we do? We find a golden path between letting people do what they want, to remind it's suppose to be a fun game, and some semblance of a professional workplace environment.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

There are canon security threats and it is perfectly reasonable for officers to wear vests. Its not iif aurora is infiltrated, it is when.

Then we should start on a higher alert.

 

Realism for the sake of realism is dumb and boring. The CDC or pentagon have security guards wandering around and don't have the places constantly locked down. Even the white house isn't like that with how many people managed to hop the fence and wander the halls before being body-slammed in the lincon bedroom or whatever.

The place is already a high security facility. There are cameras everywhere, armed cyborgs, and an armoury full of lethal weapons.