[1 Dismissal] Replace Detective/Forensics with a two slot 'Specialist' role (Aka, the Security K-9 Unit Suggestion)

[Azande]

First

Remove independent slots for Detective, and Forensic Technician. Put them into a single slot, 'Specialist Officer' , alt titles being 'Investigator, Crime Scene Investigator, K-9 Handler'

Then

Remove current Forensics Lab, Detective's Office. Replace Detective's Office with fluffy sitting area for crew.

Finally

Revamp old forensics lab into a multi-faceted area. Turn half of the evidence room into a K-9 Kennel for TWO security doggos. Keep a small portion of the new specialist's quarters as a forensics area, glassed off with white flooring, ensure there is a desk and regular office space for meeting with crew as investigator, put dog-related supplies in kennel area.

Second Finally

Create better dog mechanics, add dog food and 'searching' commands so dog can sniff out drugs and explosives.

[Pacmandevil]

I see several issues with this: of which are mostly opinionated.

1. The dog Searching sounds frustrating as fuck for antags; and would likely stifle RP. Antag trying to run a drug ring or something instead of murderboning? Tough shit meme dog saw you and it's radar detected drugs. if it wasn't automatic. it'd be useless. because you'd probably still need a warrant for it; in which case it'd be better to Actually search them yourself: because then you'd be able to actually find contraband that isn't drugs.

2. Why remove the detective like what no.

3. How would the dog even detect the regants? Would it just search for an Item in Inv? or would I be able to sprinkle crack on an innocent person to get them arrested?

4. Simple_animals are simple_minded. Which means it'll be either useless in a fight, or fucking broken. depends how it's added: Does it stun and have high health? Fuck that noise.

Is it insanely speedy and stun? Fuck that noise

Both of those would be frustrating to fight against to the extreme.

5. How would they be equipped?

would it be kept the exact same as the current detective/forensics? because that'll get rid of all the effort made to Separate the two.

Would it just be a security officer with a dog? Then it's a solid buff. which is bad.

Is it a det with doggo? again, solid buff; and if the dog stuns at fucking all: makes the det an antag hunting monster.

I'll probably add more to this as I think of things wrong with it.

[Azande]

not gonna address all your points rn because it's 4 AM but we already have a dog that follows commands and can attack and it's powerful and is the HoS' dog. This suggestion exists to provide non-whitelisted crew the chance to get fun sec dog.

Antags get assault rifles. Dog is hardly a power imbalance.

[Pacmandevil]

not gonna address all your points rn because it's 4 AM but we already have a dog that follows commands and can attack and it's powerful and is the HoS' dog. This suggestion exists to provide non-whitelisted crew the chance to get fun sec dog.

Antags get assault rifles. Dog is hardly a power imbalance.

 

I'm well aware the HOS gets a dog; but it's also the HOS's pet. and any self respecting HOS won't use it to gank the valids, because it's the damn pet.

Antags also don't get any assault rifles: Only a pistol, a tommy-gun, Sniper rifle (Which is 25tc, the whole budget) and revolver, Which I rarely see any of these being used anyway.

But "gibing all kool doggo" kinda defeats the point of the pet in my opinion anyway. it's supposed to be something that's exclusive.

[Azande]

exclusivity for the sake of exclusivity is dumb.

And it's not a pet, it's an attack dog trained specifically for the HoS to use in security woof.

[NoahKirchner]

Detective and forensics is fine as is, and enough stuff can be made to explode that a dog won't really be able to sniff it out.

[Pacmandevil]

And it's not a pet, it's an attack dog trained specifically for the HoS to use in security woof.

 

Then we already have this; if the HOS actually does it. I don't see the problem.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

no thanks. I enjoy being a detective more than I'd enjoy being a dog. This suggestion replaces a coherent feature that works well (forensics) to replace it with borks and more chair-rp locations for crew.

[Munks]

Lol. No. We made progress getting rid of having two forensics techs or two detectives and actually defining the difference between the two. Let's try not to not only undo that, but make it worse, allowing for Sec to be completely locked out of having real investigative staff just because people wanted to RP with cute fluffies.

[Azande]

I'll once again remind people that detectives do nothing except interrogate people and do lookouts (can't arrest outside of necessity) that has a lethal revolver.

Most detectives do this questioning aspect, poorly, and I have in fact never been questioned by the Detectives on board when arrested, but rather by the Warden or Head of Security. Replacing the role shouldn't be something you're against if it is for nostalgia's sake.

[Icuris]

I'm having trouble linking the idea of adding security dogs with the need to remove Detective/Forensic Tech roles

While I do like the idea of making detectives and forensic techs operate as specialist officers instead of specialist civilians I have always found suitable objectives for detectives and forensic techs alike while playing as my HoS character.

I will not make a secondary replacement suggestion in this thread

But for things like contraband sniffing and locating hiding staff members

I would personally look into R&D style upgrades for Beepsky instead of adding to the already large array of security equipment.

[Azande]

Beepsky is a bad apple that attacks simple mobs (including the HoS dog) and operates completely independently of a player 90% of the time and can take RP out of an arrest.

The point of changing the roles around would to be to keep the amount of security slots near what it is at now.

[DatBerry]

I disagree with this suggestion and wouldn't support anything more than cargo orderable doggo, all the points you make about the detective being useless can be spinned back at the dog dude, at least the detective has more than one niche job, not only do they interrogate suspects, they can also accompany the CSI and guard them, make hypothesis on the crimes and give ideas to the CSI, questioning witnesses etc, the doggo man does what? use his dog to sniff explosives or drugs. that's it. and as pointed out earlier in the thread, it doesn't fit well with our mechanics, either it becomes 'destroy every drug dealer ever' or useless.

[Arrow768]

Completely agree with DatBerry.

Dont get me wrong, but I believe this suggestion mostly exists because of the "Oh nice the HoS has a dog. I want that too"-Effect

Regarding beepsky.

There is a suggestion to make him less shitty.

I rather do that and give him his long overdue buff (since the implementation of sprint) than throw away forensics + detective and replace it with Security Dogs

[Dreamix]

I'd be fine with this, but only if I can be the doggie.

Or you could add a new playable one-slot semi-sentient race of dog-aliens who can help detectives and CSI's with crime. And then I'm the doggie.

[LordFowl]

Voting for dismissal. Dogs are not mechanically complex enough to justify removing the detective and the CSI to add a role that handles dogs and also the previous work of detectives and CSIs.

[MO_oNyMan]

I can't get behind the idea.

- Detective and CSI are an essential part of security team. Imagine the round with stealth lings where you have 2 dog handlers instead of CSI/detective duo.

- Detective effectively fill in an important niche of handling human interaction in ongoing investigations. The same can't be said about k9

- Dog mechanics are terrible as of now

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