Staff complaint

[Garuhn]

Byond Key: Garuhn

Staff Member: Cnaym

Round ID: b38-blZR

Description of the events: 

It was a normal vampire, my character went around rambling about being possesed and got discovered by security like its to be expected. My character tried to escape the situation so she dominated one of the security members (Forgot the name)  and hypnotises the other (Klaus Kitzler). She went ahead and charged the remaining officer expecting the dominated one to obey his command. Sadly he didn't for some reason so I got captured. I ahelped it but the issue was dropped with no intervention and I let it go since it didn't really matter too much. After escaping my character went around consuming blood in a frenzy until she "awakened". Becoming a fully powered vampire she got a new name and killed the ho, thralled one officer + making another one a vampire.

Until that point it was fine but then I was confronted together with my thrall by another vampire, Summer Snow. She wanted to capture me which of course my vampire mad with didn't allow. Knowing she is stronger than her she used her powers to dominate her, like the game mechanics intend. That is where the problem starts, thinking I was safe since I ordered both the vampire and the thrall I said that I will leave. She emoted being controlled so I waited for her to do WHAT SHE IS SUPPOSED TO DO. Instead she attacks me and I get killed while on the ground being suprised by the sudden attack with my thrall doing nothing (he was rping being dumb which is fine but he could have at least protected his master, I even told him to attack, which he didn't).

Confused I looced why she didn't follow my command and she responded with "I didn't want to follow it so I ahelped it and I was told it is fine to ignore the domination and turn on you. Feeling wronged I ahelped and SheWasTrying told me it was because cnaym said it was fine. I confronted him about and he said that vampires can't control vampires, which I correct (a fully powered vampire ignores all safeguards,it is only a normal vampire that gets the "you aren't strong enough YET to affect another creature of the veil). He told me he doesn't care and that a vampire shouldn't control a vampire and that its a dev/gameplay issue.

I think that is bullshit, I relied on what the game told me is working and got killed because Cnaym "nah I don't care" and was told its fine because "I am only removed from the round for an entire hour" which pissed me off to no end. So are vampire powerd suddenly meaningless and useless since players like summer can just decide "I don't want to follow the order". The could have at least warned me about not trusting her but no its if I am the one that is killed. That was 3 times that round alone players decided to ignore my vamp powe because they didn't want to. (2 dominions and 1 thrall, though I would be lenient with that one since klaus was rping being very slow and retarded from the powers controlling him)

Proof: Check ahelps, the discussion was in there

Edited November 8, 2019 by Garuhn

[Cnaym]

Let's start with the words I and other staff chose during the tickets:

[2011:43:23.250] b38-bIy7 ADMIN: MOD: Cnaym/(***) : yeah, vamp is imune against vamp afaik

[2011:45:34.398] b38-bIy7 ADMIN: PM: SonicGotNuked/(***)->Garuhn/(***): They're vampires. No they don't. I asked Cnaym aswell

After some back and forth that yielded no fruits

[2011:47:09.852] b38-bIy7 ADMIN: PM: SonicGotNuked/(***)->Garuhn/(***): If you disagree with the decision, feel free to make a staff complaint. I'm going to close this ticket now.

You then started another ticket demanding to talk to me, which I took. This was my conclusion to the entire situation:

[2011:49:52.650] b38-bIy7 ADMIN: PM: Cnaym/(***)->Garuhn/(***): There is no fully powered or lesser vampire. You can send them orders so you don't get a vampire detector. As soon as someone is a vampire they are equal and do not have to listen.

[2011:52:21.682] b38-bIy7 ADMIN: PM: Cnaym/(***)->Garuhn/(***): You win some, you loose some. Round will be over soon and we can all start from scratch. If you think the issue requires a closer look you are free to post a staff complaint. Another admin will then take a look at the situation and reevaluate it.

[2011:54:54.729] b38-bIy7 ADMIN: PM: Cnaym/(***)->Garuhn/(***): Apart from that you are free to discuss it with the player in question over discord or after the round if they so desire. Don't be rude in LooC, it does not get anywhere usefull.

My reasoning here was wrong. As it turns out vampires are able and allowed to dominate other vampires. What I think of this does not matter, I made a wrong decision. What matters are our rules:

Quote

All staff ingame decisions are final. OOC and adminhelp aren't the place to argue about our staff's decisions. If you'd like to contest a punishment, rule, or actions from a staffmember, start a discussion thread in the appropriate subsection of our forums, either Unban Requests, Staff Complaints, or General Discussion (for discussing specific rules).

You were informed twice to file a staff complaint. Instead you decided to use LooC and OOC to vent. After the server restarted you decided to let your attitude play out ICly, too. I do not mind admitting a mistake or having another staff member take a look at my decisions.

For the staff member taking this: Round ID was b38-bIy7

I do safe the forums the rest of my opinion on this situation.

[Garuhn]

And how does this have to do with anything? I am not appealing my actions afterwards so don't shift topic for no reason, that is really shady. 

[sonicgotnuked]

3 hours ago, Garuhn said:

And how does this have to do with anything? I am not appealing my actions afterwards so don't shift topic for no reason, that is really shady. 

I before hand asked Cnyam about it. This is something that you did do despite us telling you to make a staff complaint if you feel like the situation needs to be evaluated. 

Regardless, someone will take a look and a discussion will probably be made to determine if the ruling between me and Cnyam was correct. 

 

7 hours ago, Garuhn said:

I think that is bullshit, I relied on what the game told me is working and got killed because Cnaym "nah I don't care" and was told its fine because "I am only removed from the round for an entire hour" which pissed me off to no end. So are vampire powerd suddenly meaningless and useless since players like summer can just decide "I don't want to follow the order". The could have at least warned me about not trusting her but no its if I am the one that is killed. That was 3 times that round alone players decided to ignore my vamp powe because they didn't want to. (2 dominions and 1 thrall, though I would be lenient with that one since klaus was rping being very slow and retarded from the powers controlling him)

One of your dominates being ignored was handled by me previously. I contacted the player. 

While turning people into vampires can be rewarding, you are trading off the ability to control them from what I see. I'm sure the embrace power does come with information warning that they don't have to listen to you. While making them another dangerous force, you trade off part of your control. There is nothing stopping them from turning around and attacking you due to their hunger. Summer went through the appropriate channels and asked us. I'm open to being wrong about this, but I do agree with Cnyam. 

 

I rest my opinion as well on the matter.

[Garnascus]

Hello i will be taking this. Domination between two lesser vampires is mechanically restricted. Domination from a fully powered vampire to a lesser vampire is not mechanically restricted. @Aboshedab has told me this is the relevant bit of code. 

Quote

 

if ((mind.vampire.status & VAMP_FULLPOWER) && !(T.mind && T.mind.vampire &&

(T.mind.vampire.status & VAMP_FULLPOWER)))

return 1

 

I think it is fair of me to understand where you are coming from in your frustration over this. That of course does not excuse what i imagine where a few choice words on your part. Considering that the fault originally lies with us i am willing to lift this ban with your assurance that the next time a cooler head shall prevail on your part. Is that acceptable?

[Peppermint]

Heyo. Not sure if I'm meant to comment on this, but doing so to try and explain my side of the story. I played the vampire you turned, Genevieve.

 

So, err, firstly it was actually me and Adelina who attacked you, not Summer. I'm not sure if the in-game ability thing has this description, but the wiki does make it clear that vampires have no allegiance to whoever turned them. Likewise, I attacked you for two big reasons. Firstly it was due to you forcing me to kill the HoS earlier on into the round, then again for thralling Klaus, who's a friend of Gennie. During the actual fight, Summer never touched you (so far as I know), and we actually gave you a whole host of warnings to surrender peacefully. I only went for you once you started yelling at your thrall to kill us. 

[Garuhn]

First of all yes, I never expected for the converted vampire to help me, the vampire I dominated was an original one. And about you attacking it was fine, though I think you overreacted. Klaus didn't even move throughout the entire thing and I didn't touch you since I didn't want to fight and yet you went for the kill.

But either way, this issue has been dealt with as far as I am concerned with what @Garnascus said.

P.S: The vampire turning was entire for RP reasons, the ability offers basically no benefit as the turned vampire is ALWAYS hostile as expected

[Garnascus]

@Garuhn You will not take your anger to OOC, LOOC or ahelps in the future? 

[Garuhn]

Yes, I will just disable it from now on since it isn't really beneficial for me.

[Garnascus]

Cool beans. This is accepted and the ban is lifted.