EvilBrage Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 How about make it a t8r item that looks like a pair of black gloves? Yes plz.
Guest Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 Could we just make them stun-gloves that have the knockback when used to punch but also have a higher disarm rate for pushing people over...?
Guest Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 I should mention that I already have the code for these and will be placing them into the game. They will be locked to ERT and Traitors if I remember the talk that was had about them correctly.
EvilBrage Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 My dream of becoming a secret kung fu agent is one step closer to fruition. Now we just need those wrestling moves added back to the championship belt and I'll be happy for life.
Vanagandr Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 My dream of becoming a secret kung fu agent is one step closer to fruition. Now we just need those wrestling moves added back to the championship belt and I'll be happy for life. I think Bay is reworking grabs to add things like headbutts and jointlocks, so...
Skull132 Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 For the time present, as Soundscopes said: traitor and ERT items. We may look to incorporate these into RnD in the future, but I'd like to do something special for that. Instead of just: get level -> make thing -> kill nuke ops. Sound funzies?
Nik Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 I immediately have become bored and depressed concerning these. Because now they'll just be another way antags will be robusting about The station, allowing them to easily beat the shit out of sec. Considering that Sec is only best when in close quarters combat, since that's the only time you can 100% know they will have some tech to actually handle that (as anyone who tries to argue that Sec truly has access to the vault hasn't played a shift where sec couldn't even get in) having a way to fling them away means that they won't even have that anymore. All hope is lost. Abandon station. Time to make Sec characters into engineers and bartenders. edit: added gif that suits my mood towards everyone wanting to give Antags and ERT more things that will make them as godly as a Mage in DS1. Â
Nik Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 I should probably clarify that all I wanted was these without the damage buff, as they'd give sec something to use beside flash cuffs. Because I'll repeat myself a billion times.
Jamini Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 I should probably clarify that all I wanted was these without the damage buff, as they'd give sec something to use beside flash cuffs. Because I'll repeat myself a billion times. Â Flash cuff Pepperspray cuff Table cuff Baton cuff Pointblank taser cuff DOWN OR WE SHOOT YOU cuff Stunglove cuff (yes, you too can make stungloves as security. It's a bad idea, but possible) I still don't see the need for security to have more toys to make them stronger by default.
Nik Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 One of those is illegal, two of those are negated by sunglasses, another by saying no. In reality, it's baton day all day. and now you can just fling someone away before they baton you. Which is why I am concerned. Because taser won't do it against a Revolver, or crossbow, or E-sword being flung at your face.
Guest Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 You realize that being a security officer is mostly knowing how to escalate dependent on the situation, right? Talk it out with the criminal, try to reach an agreement. This fails? Order them to comply and face their sentence, or else force will be used to detain them. If they don't comply? Take them down. Force gloves, in a potential aspect, are just another means to reach an end. They would be another method to take down a suspect if all diplomacy and necessary force fails. It is an option, and like many options that have been nerfed horridly in the past because of abuse, then it will be tweaked if it is abused.
Jamini Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 Because taser won't do it against a Revolver, or crossbow, or E-sword being flung at your face. Â Why are you rushing someone alone against a person with a lethal weapon? You shouldn't be rushing into those situations. Why aren't you getting lethals of your own if you know someone has a weapon of that caliber? If you are being held hostage by said weapons, why are you fighting a fight you will clearly lose? I don't see how forcegloves would help against any of these except the e-sword, and by default I do not feel a single security officer should win in a 1v1 against an e-sword user without significant preparation.
Jamini Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 You realize that being a security officer is mostly knowing how to escalate dependent on the situation, right? Talk it out with the criminal, try to reach an agreement. This fails? Order them to comply and face their sentence, or else force will be used to detain them. If they don't comply? Take them down. Force gloves, in a potential aspect, are just another means to reach an end. They would be another method to take down a suspect if all diplomacy and necessary force fails. It is an option, and like many options that have been nerfed horridly in the past because of abuse, then it will be tweaked if it is abused. Â I do not see how these would be any more useful or necessary than current equipment, except for handling people who are using non-antagonist melee weapons. Even then, I don't see them being used more than batons. I don't see why security needs these at all, nor do I feel like they should get them without going through research. (Excepting perhaps the HOS, and even that is a stretch for me)
Jamini Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 Traitors do not need more gear. Â Neither does security really. Though diversity does keep things fresh on both ends. RnD is an nice, neutral place for these. Both sides can access them with good relationships with a researcher, without either having them by default. It's not terribly hard to get things from research if you communicate well and work with them. That's what we preach, is it not? inter-departmental communication and cooperation?
Susan Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 Yeah, sure, give it to Science. But traitors have enough cheap death/one-shot tools in their arsenal. If you want to add force gloves, I'd say remove the e-sword or revolver then. They have the 2 shot ded revolver, 2 swipe ded e-sword, 1 stab uber paralyzed parapen, stunlock e-bow (if it still retains that functionality), so on and so forth.
Guest Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 Take into perspective, then. Typical methods of escalating force from security are as follows... 1. Words. Words do a lot, if done right. Words can stop people from doing what they're doing and potentially doing anything equally as terrible in the future. This is the first thing an officer should consider, if not outright do in most situations, with explicit circumstances excluding this. 2. At this point, words have not worked and probably will not work because the subject is being a dismissive and non-compliant cock. Security officer is to warn them they will be detained prior to slapping cuffs on them. 3. Suspect has resisted arrest. Not only do they have another charge on them, but force is likely necessary to even take them in. An officer will need to use the least harmful disabling tool they have at their disposal, the flash. 4. A flash is not sufficient enough to disable the suspect, either by the suspect having protective headgear or the officer having a gut feeling a conflict is about to emerge. Pepperspray is cleared at this point, but to be used more wisely than the flash is. Note that pepperspray is far more harmful than the flash is, given the reaction of capascin to the senses. (Note that you should NEVER chase people with methods 3 or 4.) Also keep in mind of surrounding bystanders, otherwise move to method 5. 5. Pepperspray is likely to be not sufficient enough to take down the suspect, and the suspect is armed with a potential weapon or some sort of plan B. Stun batons are cleared for use. Switch on the capacitor, and make a swift jabbing motion into the suspect's centre mass area. Do NOT swing or use it as a crushing weapon. Note that stun batons utilize electrodes to immobilze targets, and have the potential to be painful with suspects with certain conditions. In general, however, stun energy stimulates the nervous system, with the potential to cause immense simulated pain. 6. A stun baton is likely ineffective if the suspect is fleeing or has a melee advantage such as stun gloves or another melee disabling method themselves. Range is now more important at this point. Tasers are cleared, but keep in mind about the note for method 5 on stun gear. When utilizing the taser, remember that keeping a distance from you and the suspect is important, yet you also need to be close enough to hit them. Be careful of friendly fire, dammit. And if you can't take on a threat alone, CALL FOR BACKUP. So, anyway. How does this tie into everything else? Forcegloves can act as the wedge between pepperspray and stun batons, by merely just table-cuffing a suspect and not causing them any serious body or nerve harm.
Serveris Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 Development staff are resolute on this not being standard access to Urist McOfficer. Adding them to research would be stretching it. It might happen, if Skull has a change in heart. As Scopes already said, the certain fact is that it will be accessible by response teams and syndicate antagonists via their uplinks.
Nik Posted March 23, 2015 Posted March 23, 2015 Because taser won't do it against a Revolver, or crossbow, or E-sword being flung at your face. Â Why are you rushing someone alone against a person with a lethal weapon? You shouldn't be rushing into those situations. Why aren't you getting lethals of your own if you know someone has a weapon of that caliber? If you are being held hostage by said weapons, why are you fighting a fight you will clearly lose? I don't see how forcegloves would help against any of these except the e-sword, and by default I do not feel a single security officer should win in a 1v1 against an e-sword user without significant preparation. Â I never said diddle about ME going at them. I said THEM coming at me. Which they do. Secondly, when antags have forcegloves, the point is that they now have dominance over short range combat, because they can just fling you away. You said other things, but I can't be arsed to quote them. But the point is that Antags don't need another way to fuck Sec over in short range. To the RD thing, NO. NO. NO. NO. NOOOOO. We do not need more things under RD that's meant for Sec that Sec will never see. Because I've NEVER seen a lawgiver in a Security Officers hands, (Do not say "But when I am blah blah" because that's a blind argument, as thats you. So stahp.) and I probably never will, I've only seen them in RD's hands. Anything that you can find in RD is almost never seen outside of RD, unless it's a mining drill. I'd rather nobody has this then Antags or RD having it, because then It'll just be another problem for the lack of balance in combat, and Sec being armed like low level riot police when they are atypically handling lunatics with lethal weaponry, magic men who can turn you into a monkey, cultists with blood stupidity, and every wing possessing some way to get better gear then a random Sec Jockie.
duck Posted March 23, 2015 Author Posted March 23, 2015 Hi. Creator opinion here. I'm actually pretty against research having this. If it absolutely must be restricted to antags/ert, I'd prefer it much more still if sec could at least get like four in the armoury. also my numbers are not balanced so you might want to lower the 2.5x to like. 2x. or something. i don't know.
Susan Posted March 24, 2015 Posted March 24, 2015 2x amp to melee damage means force glove + e-sword is a literal instant kill. Target head. Slice. 140 damage. Dead.
duck Posted March 24, 2015 Author Posted March 24, 2015 but eswords have 30 brute. did we change something stupid like to make ninja energy blades buyable or something. 2x should bump your lightsaber into the 60 brute range. which seems reasonable, other things considered.
Guest Posted March 24, 2015 Posted March 24, 2015 2 slice critting is still not balanced. Hell, even with one slice you can instant decap if RNjesus wanted you to.
Vanagandr Posted March 24, 2015 Posted March 24, 2015 We do not need more things under RD that's meant for Sec that Sec will never see. Because I've NEVER seen a lawgiver in a Security Officers hands, (Do not say "But when I am blah blah" because that's a blind argument, as thats you. So stahp.) and I probably never will, I've only seen them in RD's hands. Anything that you can find in RD is almost never seen outside of RD, unless it's a mining drill. There's a reason for this. The thing about sharing toys is that they're 'experimental', and thus sec will get pissy if you hand them out and the RD will get pissy if you hand them out, so the safest thing to do is to wander off somewhere and go SSD.
Nik Posted March 24, 2015 Posted March 24, 2015 It doesn't change that the gear is never handed out. Engineers never see plasma cutters, for example, but I've caught multiple scientists with them in their satchels. Id also just remove the damage buff entirely. Because that is a nearly instant kill with the Telescopic baton or the e-sword. The other two abilities are what make this good.
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