Topic of the Day: Cloning

[Caelphon]

How do you guys feel about the latest changes to Cloning? How do you feel about cloning in general? Discuss it with us!

[ImmortalRedshirt]

Cloning's always been one of those tropes in sci-fi that doesn't really click from my POV, and it mostly has to do with the concept, but not the feasibility. A more favorable view is developed when its use is limited in scale and capabilities(rare, no flash cloning, etc.) so in relation to the Aurora lore update, this is an okay change.

[Captain Gecko]

I'm REALLY not fond of them.

 

Apprently people abused it or something and that was one of the reason that led to their change, which I'd like to say I, or any of the people I asked about this, have never seen or heard about such a thing, but, whatever, I'll stay strictly on the lore side.

So lore-wise.... I think it makes no sense, the way it turned. More consequences for people getting cloned? Sure. I don't mind, and actually like the idea of cloning bringing things like muscle diseases, weak bones, the fact it may take weeks or months to clone people, people being unable to be cloned repeatedly (because I assume that being the clone of a clone will basically lead to some... More overt consequences, if you can even be cloned at that point) or even mental illnesses, it makes it so that cloning is not a "press to rez" button, assuming people don't really care about the monstrously huge costs of such an operation; basically something that sticks with their character, but that is still leaving freedom to players (IE: Choose your horrid cloning illnesses!)

But, firstly, on a strictly "realistic"* standpoint, cloning is something we already do TODAY, in REAL LIFE. Sure, it's not as advanced as what we see (or rather, saw) in Aurora, obviously, but what we get now is that compared to right now, knowledge in cloning has basically made little to no advances, over the course of multiple centuries, and contact with a mostly friendly alien race that happily shared their more advanced knowledge (in this field) with us.

Now of course I'm talking of what we have 2021, in our timeline, so what about the Aurora Timeline? Perhaps such advances in cloning so early never happened, since, you know, different timelines and all. HOWEVER, it actually makes even less sense in Aurora because the Skrell figured out cloning literally OVER A MILLENIUM in the past, and sure, not advanced enough, then, to "clone people", BUT, you'd think that after 1119 YEARS they would've figured this one out? Especially since apprently, all of the Glorsh affair did not lower the technological base in THIS field according to the wiki:

Quote

The Era of Synthetic Oppression reigned over by Glorsh-Omega brought with it significant advances into the field of cloning, mostly confined to the archologies across Aliose. Glorsh-Omega had managed to propel the field of cloning and genetics exceptionally during their reign, managing to unlock the secret that prevented the flash growth of organs and limbs. Upon contact with humanity in 2332, Skrell began sharing their research in the field of cloning with Zeng-Hu Pharmaceuticals — specifically its subsidiary, Yomi Genetics Innovation and Research.

- Cloning wiki page

...that and they then shared that knowledge with humanity, obviously.

 

Apparently, the reason for such a change, lore-wise, was that the cloning page was old or static or something... And look, I'm ok with changes, but I feel like we should rather expand on things if they need change, and not outright nullify them?

So beyond the scemantics where we, right now, are only talking of cloning IN NAME (what we have now is mostly "genetic-engineering"/"Bio-engineering"); we, because apparently the cloninig lore was never really expanded upon, just basically nullified the actual cloning part and made a thing that, right now, makes basically no sense lore-wise, and realistically speaking, and I'm far from being the only one with this opinion.

At this point, either we add back the old cloning lore but ACTUALLY expand on it, like maybe add more consequences to cloned people, beyond just the finiancial part if we want to avoid having people abusing this too much, or we just outright remove it, and rename the cloning page to "Bio-Engineering" or something like this, because that's what it is at this point. Now that we changed it, I feel like the new cloning page now actually needs some kind of change, in any directions, but it needs to make more sense.

 

PS: On the "realism" part. PLEASE, BEFORE someone says "It's sci-fi, it's alright"... Yes, it's sci-fi, but it doesn't mean that things should make no sense, suspension of disbelief is important. Note also that while we are clearly not in Hard Sci-fi, thank god, this is not Star Wars, this is not Star Trek, we have a setting, mostly due to SS13's gameplay, that tries to explain how the giant glowy crystal can generate power, or how this or that species' biology actually works. That and we try to make a lore that actually makes sense.

Edited December 11, 2021 by Captain Gecko

[Marlon P.]

Figuring out how to permanently kill or remove someone in DnD who has access to clones/resurrection magic is very fun and challenging. Same for our scifi equivalent. 

[Roostercat]

I have been against the change from the beginning, and have stated my reasons for such multiple times. At one point I had even drafted out a rework that adds more effects and background and etcetera. Originally the reasoning behind this was that it was a plothole. IE "Why not clone frost?" to which I answer "They shot him in the head fifteen times". This change felt extremely forced and on rails and it did not at all feel like I had any say in it at one point. I think it should be reverted to what it was before and changed to add ill effects and restrictions IE no cloning if the head is gone and similar lines. It adds another origin for people and gives interesting ways to roleplay out being a clone. If they don't RP it out and just use it as an excuse to revive, its breaking the believable character rule. These changes have outright nullified a few characters due to drastically changing their backstories so hard they can no longer be played without some major asspulls, all because some people looked at lore and came up with a bogus hypothetical situation to justify removing lore.

 

[Kintsugi]

Personally I think cloning prior to the changes was essentially defunct lore that stood in contrast with every aspect of our setting. It was out of place and simply did not work - the new changes are good because it put an end to that problem without presenting any new issues. The fact of the matter is that narratively, cloning sucked. Removing it was the best outcome and long overdue, in my opinion.

[Billy Mays]

I really love the new changes to cloning, I don't think the cloning lore we had before did not really click into our setting, even though some backstorys had to be edited I believe it was for the greater good.