Staff Complaint - ReadMyNamePls

[Myazaki]

BYOND Key: mikomyazaki2
Staff BYOND Key: ReadMyNamePls
Game ID: cgE-dLFO (I think!)

My character: Melody Loop, Atmospherics Technician

Reason for complaint: I ahelped to complain that the AI and HoS were being over-zealous in tracking me & preventing me from taking any action. After being told the situation was fine, I asked what I should do with the rest of the round since I could not reasonably act -- A sane character would not act while they are under constant surveillance from an AI and a full sec department. I was told something to the effect of "get a gun and armour" (I believe they were implying 'go fight sec'). 

I believe I could not have followed this suggestion without breaking multiple rules -- I would like clarification about why it was suggested, because I am concerned I misunderstand the antagonist rules, or the rules / traitor guide need updating. The specific rules I believe this would have broken are: No ganking, Only kill if it drives the story, Conflict must be believable.

- My character had not been aggressive or done any appropriate RP to justify attacking security.
- There were six(ish?) security members, an AI and two(?) borgs that security were using to help -- Attacking security alone with no hope of success nor escape would have been insane and suicidal. This is not a believable character, even allowing for some eccentricity due to being a traitor.
- As I had joined late (1.5 hrs into the round) there was not much time left. By the time of my ahelp about the AI, there was something like ~30 minutes left in the round -- I believe it is frowned upon for antagonists to start new things so late?

 

Please clarify if starting a fight with security, with no build-up, character motivation, nor hope of success, that late in the round would have been okay in this situation -- Or what I should have done instead -- And help me understand why?

Thank you.

Evidence/logs/etc: Please check the round logs for cgE-dLFO.
Additional remarks: I will explain briefly the situation from my perspective in case it is relevant to why ReadMyNamePls suggested what they did:

Spoiler

I don't have the round logs. Please treat times as approximate. 

 

- Spawned late (1.5 hrs in) was autotraitor'd instantly.
- Began work on a gimmick involving messing with the other engineer. Ultimately this did nothing because everyone was distracted by a bomber traitor.
- Gave myself a syndicate radio key. Within a short time I heard myself being talked about on the radio related to bombings (was the other traitor. I caused no explosions.)
- Sec tracked me via the AI, kept asking it where I was - So I stayed in Atmospherics and did my job while waiting for the pieces I had put in place for my gimmick to work (paperwork I asked someone to deliver to the HoS for me).
- Got dragged in for a search. Nothing illegal on me. Only antagonist items "visible" were the chameleon stamp and pen but they looked like a normal stamp and pen. Security did not answer my questions about the situation or let me try to remove suspicion from myself.
- Heard I was still under suspicion via sec channel despite the search finding nothing. 
- Decided that I had to deal with the AI if I was to achieve anything. So broke into secure storage while no one was around.
- Within a very short time of breaking in the AI starts yelling over security channel that they should look at these photos of me in secure storage.
- I run away, hide, try to plan my next move and ahelp to check what the AI/HoS were doing (which was completely ruining my ability to even start antagonizing properly) was okay.
- I try to complete subverting the AI and build an AI Upload Console in Maintenance, but hear over command or security that the AI is asking the HoS to regularly check its laws (and the round was nearly over anyway) so I give up, hide and try to plan a disguise with my remaining TCs.

 

Please note I am not making a complaint about the HoS or AI. This is the first time I have met those characters and they probably thought they were dealing with a bomber antagonist and needed more caution than usual.

Edited February 26, 2022 by Myazaki

[MattAtlas]

This will be handled by @Faye <3 and myself.

[Faye <3]

 

Hi! Could @ReadThisNamePlzplease chime in with their side of the ticket, and their thought process behind it?

Additionally, we would like @Flpfs and @CakeIsOssim both to walk us through their interactions with Miyazaki's character, Melody Loop? Specifically, how much attention was levied towards them.

 

[Flpfs]

I played the HoS

Shortly after I left cryo, I already had a weird interaction with the engineer (i forgot their name), they stared at me and called my name, running at me, then they dropped the conversation and walked away. I found it strange, but didn't pay much attention.

When I was in the kitchen, eating waffles, I saw the maintenance door to the hallway open, and you talking in Solarian to the engineer, before you went deeper into maintenance and they left the tunnel, turning to directly face me. They stuttered, then whispered to me that they have a bomb, and that they were being forced to kill me.

I took them to security to be interrogated by the investigators, and asked you to come for a search, as I thought you had been blackmailing her. After the search turned out empty, I let you go and turned my sights towards other suspects, as the engineer said they had been made to do it by a member of the Trinary when the interview concluded.

The AI tells me you broke into secure storage, and prints the pictures in sec's photocopier. I begin looking for you, since you likely had the AI's upload board, and then the round ends without me finding you anymore.

 

TL;DR - The whole reason I was suspicious of you is because you talked to them in the tunnels 5 seconds before they went at me and broke down in the kitchen.

 

I posted an image below to clarify what I saw, this was not taken live and I took it on a random round and scribbled on it. The maint door was open and you two were talking at pretty much the tile I marked down.

 

I don't have any more comments unless it involves me administratively 

[Flpfs]

I couldn't edit the post so I am doubleposting. 

 

Here's the relevant screenshot, I found it by looking at my folders. This was when the engi was approaching and you went deeper into maint after that

[Myazaki]

26 minutes ago, Flpfs said:

*snip*

 

TL;DR - The whole reason I was suspicious of you is because you talked to them in the tunnels 5 seconds before they went at me and broke down in the kitchen.

The HoS was totally right to be suspicious of me for that.

He didn't know that I was just trying to ask the other Engineer what they were up to -- I was hanging around Cargo & Kitchen grabbing some food and giving a folder to the QM. The other Engineer mumbled at me, then walked off to do their thing and I poked my head into maintenance a couple of times to see if something was happening in there.

[CakeIsOssim]

AI player reporting.

There were only two instances where I was for-sure tracking you, and as I stated in OOC post-round, I don't like to track people unless ordered to do so. The first time was when security suspected you of coercing the other person into blowing up the head of security. I had actually spotted two people exiting that maintenance hatch posted in the screenshots above, but I don't recall who they were. Then, the HoS said they found grenades on the person accused of being coerced. At that point, I ordered the two borgs to start searching that particular maintenance section for additional explosives - they had orders to be discrete because the HoS said they didn't want to cause any alarm or tip off the person responsible. They didn't find anything, and right about when they finished, the HoS asked for Melody Loop's location. I tracked them and gave it over the command channel at the engineering lobby. That's when security stacked up on the front door, and asked me again if Loop was still there, to which I replied in the affirmative. That was the extent of me tracking Loop the first time.

I didn't even have a reason to be suspicious of Loop, so I didn't bother checking on them again later. I think security cleared them of wrongdoing, and I went about my business managing the borgs and opening doors for people.

Typically, when nothing is going on, I scan around the station just to see what people are up to. Not much else to do when little is happening if you're playing AI. I had just scanned over robotics toward the northern half of it and saw the maintenance door in the hallway open. Melody Loop emerged, and out of nothing but curiosity, I followed them as they walked over to tech storage. I watched them hack the door, which I wouldn't have even bothered to report or take photographs of because it's not a big deal. Then, they started hacking into secure tech storage, where the AI and cyborg upload circuits are stored. I watched and waited to see what they'd do, and right as they started picking up the circuit boards, I started taking pictures. AI is bound by law to protect itself, and it's a natural progression to say that an atmos tech/engineer has no business taking those circuits. I took this information to the HoS, showed them the pictures, and told them what was stolen. Still wasn't tracking Loop 100% of the time after that, merely checking on them every couple of minutes.

I didn't order any borgs to try and locate Loop, and I didn't even bother to keep my eye on Loop despite knowing they had possession of the law boards. I warned command that there was a risk I would be subverted and.. that's really the extent of it. I'm pretty sure I was ordered to locate you only a total of twice, maybe three times. If the borgs were following Loop around, I didn't personally order them to do so. Like I said, me finding Loop hacking into tech storage was a completely random chance, and I would say just sheer bad luck on your part. While I do practice some willful ignorance to give antags some leeway in their gimmicks, I can't just let an atmos tech stealing the upload boards slide. I even tried to practice a little restraint in that regard by taking it directly to command instead of security.

I tried to provide everything I know all in this post, but if you have questions, I'll be happy to answer them.

[ReadThisNamePlz]

"Please clarify if starting a fight with security, with no build-up, character motivation, nor hope of success, that late in the round would have been okay in this situation -- Or what I should have done instead -- And help me understand why?"

I wasn't saying to start a fight with no escalation or anything.  I said "When in doubt, the revolver and heavy armor exists." or something along those lines. I don't recall the exact thing I said, because I barely even remember this interaction. 
If I remember properly, I said this because 
1.) You were already being watched by Security, so I was merely suggesting if you want to do something against them, the loud option exists and would provide lots of escalation. 
2.) You were a traitor. Probably the most versatile antagonist type aside from mercenary. If you're being stalked by an AI/Security, you have every right to use that as escalation/reason to start f*cking things up. Atleast in my opinion. 

I can't comment on the round time but I'm pretty sure it was like, an hour into the round. But generally I do not have an issue if antagonists start things up later into the round, if it is not entirely out of the blue. And in this case, you were already being framed/stalked, so the building blocks were there. 

But if you're really wanting to know why I said "when in doubt, the revolver and heavy armory exists", it was just me suggesting to go against Security for being overzealous. I think I okay'd it because the other antag was framing you. But again, I barely remember this because I didn't see much of an issue with the whole situation. 

Sorry for confusing you though, it is never my intention to confuse players. 

[Myazaki]

39 minutes ago, ReadThisNamePlz said:

*snip*

I can't comment on the round time but I'm pretty sure it was like, an hour into the round. 

*snip*
 

I think you said something similar to another traitor in AOOC who was having trouble deciding what to do, earlier in the round (around the time I joined). The (second and relevant) ahelp I made was definitely much later.

But anyway, thanks for clarifying -- I'll feel safer about fighting without build-up in a similar situation, in future.

Edited February 27, 2022 by Myazaki

[MattAtlas]

On 27/02/2022 at 23:42, Myazaki said:

I think you said something similar to another traitor in AOOC who was having trouble deciding what to do, earlier in the round (around the time I joined). The (second and relevant) ahelp I made was definitely much later.

But anyway, thanks for clarifying -- I'll feel safer about fighting without build-up in a similar situation, in future.

Is this part of the complaint resolved, then?

[Myazaki]

15 minutes ago, MattAtlas said:

Is this part of the complaint resolved, then?

I don't think there is anything else to say about it. So sure.

 

[MattAtlas]

Alright. Closing this, then.