New weapons in the armory

[Theplahunter]

EDIT: Added more weapons, armor types, and arms producers.

We all know we have energy weapons: Tazers, laser rifles, energy carbines. But, there is a flaw I see in the designs: Ammo. Sometimes you're in a prolonged firefight and your energy weapon run's empty, of course you only have one (unless you're a greedy piece of shit.) and you're left with a non-lethal tazer or a stun baton, so what would you rather have? An extra bulky energy weapon that can crap out with only four-six shots or be hit by an EMP? Or would you rather carry a lighter, more powerful projectile weapon! Yes we're talking about Rifles, pistols, shotguns, sub machine guns, and defenses or counters you can put in.

COMPANIES (will be changed as more weapons are developed.)

 

Robinson & Redelle arms company: An arms company that is known for the popular XM-4 Tornado rifle and MAR-Rhotec navy rifles, founded by Wayne D. Robinson and

Daniel J. Redelle in 2454. They use designs from old earth italian companies and are one of the main suppliers of multiple Navies and Marine branches.

Heckler and Koch: One of the oldest weapons manufacturers, dating all the way back to pre-destruction earth. They are still a prominent Police and Civilian weapons designer and seller, they are the biggest producer and seller to Nanotransen.

Bradley arms: An arms company founded by Valerie Bradley in 2392, known mostly for the SSR-20 battle rifle in use with the Old earth defense guard and the Bradley handheld shotgun, an infamous civilian handcannon.

Fasse armoir: Founded by Vernon Fasse and Joshua Fasse in 2458, two twins, they became fascinated with old french designs and worked hard to bring front new french designs, under contract with Nanotransen for the NSS aurora.

Rim arms company: A cadet company of Heckler and Koch, breaking off in 2442 to produce different designs rejected by H&K. It had no real founder and was (and is still) run by a committee of engineers, scientists, accountants, and veteran soldiers.

Callis security: Founded by Allen Stoner and Erwin Galil in 2372, far distant relatives of the famous Eugene Stoner and Yisrael Galil. They became a security arms production company for nanotrasen and developed most of the ERT weaponry in partnership with H&K.

Syndelle: The syndicates arms manufacturing branch, making easy to produce and use weapons for Syndicate forces.

Automov Salski Inc: A Russian company founded in 2456 which takes old Russian design and ‘Improves it.’ and in contract partnership with Syndelle to co-produce and design Syndicate arms weapons.

Dwight and Silver: An american “Cowboy” company that creates old fashioned cowboy weapons with extra stopping power.

First: Increased equipment.

The armory is quite bare bones, one bulletproof vest and one ablative vest. Fuck that. This is a research station with very important progress in an unstable region, why the hell would we not have more armor? I'd say some more Mk. II light armor vests that can protect against pistol's and SMGs along with lower powered Rifle rounds (which would still give you bruised ribs or a cracked sternum but not completely punch through.) and a Kevlar and plastic bulletproof helmet (that can really only protect the head, not the face. And would only protect against pistol caliber, maybe SMG.)

Protection area

VEST: NECK, GROIN, CHEST.

HELMET: BACK OF HEAD, SIDE OF HEAD, TOP BROW OF HEAD.

BALANCE

Balance:

It would only reduce damage, with the side plates (if you face sideways.) being very vulnerable to fire (which would give flanking a nice use.) and the limbs very open to fire (you shoot a man's arm or leg and he's a lot more injured and easy to kill/capture.) while the groin plate would have less ceramics and only a level of SMG protection (up to .357. While the Chest is put to 5.56 NATO protection standard (The AK 7.62x39mm however would only half penetrate, reducing power but more able to cause internal wounds.)

TRAITOR ANTAG BALANCE: Another balance for antagonists would be traitors could purchase Mk. I lightweight Kevlar vest that can protect against pistol bullets at the chest and neck area (good for code blue if Security is armed with pistols.) A ballistic Kevlar face mask (pistol bullet's as well and can be bought with a voice changer modification for a great disguise.) a P-96 9mm semi automatic pistol, and armor piercing bullets to be extra effective against armor.

NUKE OPS BALANCE: For nuke ops, when they come aboard they have an option of bringing along a different outfit. A V-5 heavy vest, a blood red bulletproof helmet mounted with a side camera and thin glass visor that come's down to the top of the nose or a Ballistic face mask (One cannot fit with the other unless you want obscured vision.) and a light inner layered Kevlar suit (I thought of having this as an actual suit 'a la payday' but thought of using a chameleon projector so people can choose.) for leg protection. However, the hard suit would be nerfed against bullet damage but you can walk through space.

Having a stronger outfit against bullets that needs to be changed out would discourage people from just blowing the shit out of the station to cut off people and kill by using pressure.

 

WEAPONRY

These are possible nominations for weapons and multiple types for different people/different situations/different styles

NUKE OPS ARMORY

NOTE: The names will be changed most likely, and I am more than willing to come up with the renames and some face lifts.

ARMOR

MK. IV Syndelle Plate vest: A heavy duty vest that protects against rifle bullets to the chest, and has protection for the crotch, upper arm, and neck.

MK. III Syndelle Ballistic mask: A lightweight ballistic mask that protects against shrapnel and bullets to the head (Cannot be combined with the helmet without a sight penalty.)

MK. V Syndelle Bulletproof helmet: A cheap copy of the ERT helmet without the visor and ballistic mask but installed with a camera and up link to see what other agents see.

Same

Standard energy weapons&Cr-20 and sketchkin.

SIDEARMS

PISTOLS

SIG P229 (.40 S&W.) (Rim arms company Sidearm .40 | RAC-S40.) wiki link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_Sauer_P226#P229

Smith & Wesson model 15 (for the cowboy feel.) (Dwight and Silver Model 32 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_%26_Wesson_Model_15

Smith & Wesson model 1006 (Dwight and Silver Model 100) (10mm Auto, a powerful weapon that has less capacity than the SIG but more stopping power.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_%26_Wesson_Model_1006

MACHINE PISTOLS

MAC-11 (Syndelle/Automov Salski Inc MEC-9) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAC-11

PRIMARY WEAPONS

SUB MACHINE GUNS

PP-BIZON (Automov Salski Inc Mini-MG.)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bizon_SMG

MAC-10 (wooden stock|.45 ACP) (syndelle/Automov Salski Inc MEC-15) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAC-10

CARBINES

Rename: Polish Covert Assault Carbine Mk.V (PCAC MK.V) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skbk_wz._1989_Onyks

Winchester Model 1894 (Dwight And silver Model 2100) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winchester_Model_1894

ASSAULT RIFLES

AK-101 & AK-102 (Automov Salski Inc AK-408 & AK-450) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AK-102

MSBS Radon (Robinson & Redelle Marine Assault Rifle .308 | MAR-308) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MSBS_Radon

BATTLE RIFLES

M-14 Battle rifle (Bradley SSR-20.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M14_rifle

Shot guns

Ithaca-37 (Robinson & Redelle Breaker-40)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ithaca_37

Lupara (smugglers gun.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lupara

SNIPER RIFLE

Dragunov SVU (Automov Salski Inc Falcon Bullpup Sniper Rifle | Falcon BSR) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragunov_SVU

SIDEARM/SHOTGUN MIX

TARUS JUDGE (Bradley Handcannon.)(takes .454 cascull, each shot reloaded one at a time.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taurus_Judge

 

SECURITY ARMORY

Nanotransen Mk. V Ballistic vest: Nanotransens own developed Utility armor vests for security forces on station, with heavy plates in the front and back that can protect against rifles but pistol side plates for more flexibility.

Nanotransen Bulletproof helmet: A standard bulletproof helmet with a tinted visor that goes down to the tip of the nose for flash protection and a SEC hud.

 

SIDEARMS

PISTOLS

Beretta 9mm (Robinson & Redelle Redelle 9mm | Redelle 9mm) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beretta_M9

Glock 22 (Rim Arms Company Astro .40 | RAC Astro .40) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glock_22

Walther P22 (same.)(something maybe for code blue, it's .22 and pocket carryable) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walther_P22

Mr-73 (Fasse MR-99) (3 inch barrel.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manurhin_MR_73

PRIMARY WEAPONS

SUB MACHINE GUNS

MP5A2 (H&K MP5A7) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_MP5#Larger_caliber_versions

MP7A1 (MP7B4) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_MP7#Ammunition

CARBINE (main weapons of security on code red)

SG 552 (Rim Arms Company Commando Rifle 552 | CR-552) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_SG_550#SG_552_Commando

ASSAULT RIFLES

M16A4 (CALLIS SECURITY M16A6) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M16_rifle

FAMAS G2 (FASSE FAMAS G5) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M16_rifle

SHOTGUNS

Benelli M3 (Robinson & Redelle Robin M2 | Robin M2)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benelli_M3

Mossberg 930 (Bradley Stardust 990) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossberg_930

SNIPER RIFLE

RENAME: Callis Security Designated security rifle-11 | DSR-11. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desert_Tactical_Arms_Stealth_Recon_Scout

 

A smaller Security armory, yes. But it's to prevent OP armed security forces

ERT

PISTOL

Mark 23 (Mk.27) http://hk-usa.com/hk-models/mark-23/

Automag (Callis Security Semi .44) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AutoMag_%28pistol%29

SUB MACHINE GUN

H&K UMP (H&K ERT UMP.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_UMP

Kel-Tec PLR-16 (Callis Security KTC-5.56) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kel-Tec_PLR-16

ASSAULT RIFLE

HK416 (HK450) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_HK416

G36C (HK36C) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_G36

SHOTGUN

H&K FP6 (H&K FP9) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_FABARM_FP6 (img here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_shotguns#/media/File:H%26KFabarmFP6entry.jpg)

Franchi Spas 12 (Robinson & Redelle ERTS-15) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franchi_SPAS-12

SNIPER RIFLE

PSG-1 (H&K PSG-8) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_%26_Koch_PSG1

equipment

Same ol' hardsuits with minor bullet nerfs

Callis Security MK. IIII Kevlar helmet & ballistic mask: A combined Mask and helmet for large head protection. Covers the entire head.

Callis Security MK. V Plate carrier: A plate carrier that covers the upper arm, chest, neck, and groin with rifle stopping protection.

*WIP. Will be edited more later but I am happy to take suggestions and opinions and answer questions now as is.*

Edited April 28, 2015 by Guest

[Guest]

We actually have tacsuit armor in the code, though I think it's only the sprites at the moment. It's literally payday 2 green SWAT armor, though.

Also, another thing. NT Security's signature weaponry is primarily energy-based. Adding pistols and shotguns to the default armory is really not a good idea.

Ballistics and lasers have their differences, and are useful in certain ways, which I'll outline here. Please note that I will preface that, neither are better than the other. They both have different uses in different situations. I personally prefer laser rifles. Anywho.

Lasers:

-Are quite accurate.

-Have unsatisfactory firedelay times, often.

-Deal burn damage, which takes forever to naturally heal from in comparison to brute.

-Inflict sepsis/infections rather fast.

-Practically infinite supply of ammo, provided you retreat to recharge your weapon.

-More widely available compared to ballistics.

-Paincrit hits 2x harder, given the burn damage. Therefore, you can incapacitate someone a lot easier with two or three laser hits.

-Gets rekt by EMP.

Ballistics:

-Mostly inaccurate. High stopping power.

-Very spammy. Zero firedelay, meaning you can fire as fast as you can click.

-Bullets like to embed into people. They shatter bones, too. Lovely.

-As bullets embed into people, if they move, it practically deals a crapton more damage to that limb its embedded in. As a result, they can die rather fast if they attempt to retreat. They're pinned + fucked.

-Very limited, rare, or expensive amounts of ammo existing in-game. Good luck getting more C20r ammo after spending 3-4 mags.

-Availability is very low.

-Doesn't get rekt by EMP.

-Most ballistic weapons are concealable in bags. Compact, easy to carry.

They have their place, basically, but security's laser weaponry tends to do better in terms of incapacitating compared to outright killing. Nuke ops was made for killing, basically, which is why they get ballistic weapons. They're designed to outright kill. Lasers typically function better as weapons for incapacitation, although they still can kill.

Also, gun diversity isn't ever good. Especially when you have a lot more than what's needed. Dakka is nice, but there is such a thing as too much dakka. Not healthy for gameplay.

[Theplahunter]

We actually have tacsuit armor in the code, though I think it's only the sprites at the moment. It's literally payday 2 green SWAT armor, though.

Also, another thing. NT Security's signature weaponry is primarily energy-based. Adding pistols and shotguns to the default armory is really not a good idea.

Ballistics and lasers have their differences, and are useful in certain ways, which I'll outline here. Please note that I will preface that, neither are better than the other. They both have different uses in different situations. I personally prefer laser rifles. Anywho.

Lasers:

-Are quite accurate.

-Have unsatisfactory firedelay times, often.

-Deal burn damage, which takes forever to naturally heal from in comparison to brute.

-Inflict sepsis/infections rather fast.

-Practically infinite supply of ammo, provided you retreat to recharge your weapon.

-More widely available compared to ballistics.

-Paincrit hits 2x harder, given the burn damage. Therefore, you can incapacitate someone a lot easier with two or three laser hits.

-Gets rekt by EMP.

Ballistics:

-Mostly inaccurate. High stopping power.

-Very spammy. Zero firedelay, meaning you can fire as fast as you can click.

-Bullets like to embed into people. They shatter bones, too. Lovely.

-As bullets embed into people, if they move, it practically deals a crapton more damage to that limb its embedded in. As a result, they can die rather fast if they attempt to retreat. They're pinned + fucked.

-Very limited, rare, or expensive amounts of ammo existing in-game. Good luck getting more C20r ammo after spending 3-4 mags.

-Availability is very low.

-Doesn't get rekt by EMP.

-Most ballistic weapons are concealable in bags. Compact, easy to carry.

They have their place, basically, but security's laser weaponry tends to do better in terms of incapacitating compared to outright killing. Nuke ops was made for killing, basically, which is why they get ballistic weapons. They're designed to outright kill. Lasers typically function better as weapons for incapacitation, although they still can kill.

Also, gun diversity isn't ever good. Especially when you have a lot more than what's needed. Dakka is nice, but there is such a thing as too much dakka. Not healthy for gameplay.

 

0: NT's signature may be energy, but that can easily be changed/modified.

1: I prefer ballistics due to: Ammo may be rarer but easier to re-load. Let's say mid combat, your energy pistols out and next to the man another officers pistol runs out of ammunition. The energy guy has to either: Find another gun, slowly re-charge it, or take out his back up. While the pistol guy can load another magazine and keep fighting without heavily moving position.

2: I'm not saying we should remove laser weapons and replace them all with ballistics, i'm just saying we can mix both in the armory. I think both have uses as well, and with new armory gun's and armor it allows situational pickings and foresight. As in "Hm... I can take this assault rifle, which has more ammo and it'll cut through like butter if they have hard suits or ablative gear... But if they have bulletproof gear and an energy weapon i'm in a very bad spot." It has advantages and disadvantages over each side.

3: Gun diversity can be fixed in a simple way, I think of the NATO ammunition standards act. The M16A4 and FAMAS both take 30rnd STANAG 5.56. So if your mate dies, you can take his ammo. The reason I chose variable weapons for Nuke Ops is because they would most likely try and get their hands on anything, so ammo would be much more spread out. A draw back due to the heavier armor they wear.

[GreenLightbulb]

While I do love me some ballistics, there is an issue that is always brought up with this sorta thread: Bullets make glass go bye-bye. Which can be bad for a station floating in space with glass windows on the exterior.

[Theplahunter]

While I do love me some ballistics, there is an issue that is always brought up with this sorta thread: Bullets make glass go bye-bye. Which can be bad for a station floating in space with glass windows on the exterior.

 

Well, it -is- double layered bulletproof glass. So you'd need to unload an entire magazine into it.

[Erik Tiber]

Eh, why are they using 400 year old guns and armor? We could just give them something like what you see in the movie avatar.

Rather than explicitly calling them Kevlar, we could call them something like "Ballistic Armor" or "Ballistic Covering" and maybe have them look sorta like these.

 

Or just something else that looks like semi-rigid armor, without going full Halo and using flat-out metal plates. We could say it incorporates nanomaterials into the armor.

And for the guns, we could maybe just give them some new names, or generic ones. And maybe look like this.

Or something else, hopefully bullpup, that doesn't look exactly like either a modern rifle or a cardboard box with a handle.

While I do love me some ballistics, there is an issue that is always brought up with this sorta thread: Bullets make glass go bye-bye. Which can be bad for a station floating in space with glass windows on the exterior.

Having windows into space at all is pretty silly. The windows need to withstand getting hit by a small micrometeorite with the KE of a bullet, as standard practice. They're already very bulletproof. An actual bullet isn't too much of a danger, really.

Just make them hollowpoint bullets if you have to.

[Theplahunter]

Eh, why are they using 400 year old guns and armor? We could just give them something like what you see in the movie avatar.

Rather than explicitly calling them Kevlar, we could call them something like "Ballistic Armor" or "Ballistic Covering" and maybe have them look sorta like these.

 

Or just something else that looks like semi-rigid armor, without going full Halo and using flat-out metal plates. We could say it incorporates nanomaterials into the armor.

And for the guns, we could maybe just give them some new names, or generic ones. And maybe look like this.

Or something else, hopefully bullpup, that doesn't look exactly like either a modern rifle or a cardboard box with a handle.

While I do love me some ballistics, there is an issue that is always brought up with this sorta thread: Bullets make glass go bye-bye. Which can be bad for a station floating in space with glass windows on the exterior.

Having windows into space at all is pretty silly. The windows need to withstand getting hit by a small micrometeorite with the KE of a bullet, as standard practice. They're already very bulletproof. An actual bullet isn't too much of a danger, really.

Just make them hollowpoint bullets if you have to.

 

I am going to rename the gun's in the final version if implemented. And re-naming it from Kevlar will also happen, I was thinking of having it like this however to fit the whole "Groin, chest, neck covers: http://www.safariland.com/tactical-carriers/fav-mkii-enhanced-carrier-FAV_MKII_EN_M_V.html

EDIT: And for the guns, Ehhh... Alternate reality. Besides most of the designs ARE solid.

[canon35]

I'm up for more guns. It can added in, sprited to look more futuristic, and renamed. Anyways, regarding the whole "Space station plus ballistics is bad", remember that we already have ready access to guns, and tools that can fuck a window up. By that same logic we should remove the tool storage rooms.

[Guest]

Lasers oneshot windows+grilles anyway.

[Vittorio Giurifiglio]

Melee Lethels, All I can say

[Theplahunter]

Melee Lethels, All I can say

 

That reminds me; Canon and I were discussing the Space swiss guard and we were taking about space Halberds and swords, I dunno about you but I think giving the HoS a ceremonial officers sword is bad ass.

[Skull132]

There is a reason for the armoury being stocked as it is. And it's not an IC thing either, despite Tau Ceti being relatively stable and not as bad as you make it out to be. The reason is: abundance breeds laziness and a lack of interest. Arming security to the teeth would remove the excitement and crunch of a difficult situation from the game, and diminish greatly the antagonist's abilities. An explanation of the last note: the entire premise of the nuke ops is that they outgun security under normal circumstances. And unless the staff ingame take active measures to counter it, that's how it should be.

As for the armour. Riot gear already covers majority of the body, including extremities. And the plate carriers for ERT are designed for operations in confined areas (space stations), which is why they only protect the vital organs. Everything is made for a purpose.

And the guns: There aren't many ways to differentiate weapons in SS13. Specially those of the same type. You have your pistols, revolvers, assault rifles, battle rifles and sniper rifles. One or two of each type, and that's about it. Every other weapon is more of a tool, like the freeze gun, rather than a front line weapon.

[Guest]

There is a reason for the armoury being stocked as it is. And it's not an IC thing either, despite Tau Ceti being relatively stable and not as bad as you make it out to be. .

 

Actually Skull, according to our lore, Tau Ceti has been in a state of duress lately, with riots and such in Mendell over the NanoTrasen Free Trade Zone and I believe that New Gibson's entire lore is police state, riots constantly. Sooooo.

[Theplahunter]

There is a reason for the armoury being stocked as it is. And it's not an IC thing either, despite Tau Ceti being relatively stable and not as bad as you make it out to be. The reason is: abundance breeds laziness and a lack of interest. Arming security to the teeth would remove the excitement and crunch of a difficult situation from the game, and diminish greatly the antagonist's abilities. An explanation of the last note: the entire premise of the nuke ops is that they outgun security under normal circumstances. And unless the staff ingame take active measures to counter it, that's how it should be.

As for the armour. Riot gear already covers majority of the body, including extremities. And the plate carriers for ERT are designed for operations in confined areas (space stations), which is why they only protect the vital organs. Everything is made for a purpose.

And the guns: There aren't many ways to differentiate weapons in SS13. Specially those of the same type. You have your pistols, revolvers, assault rifles, battle rifles and sniper rifles. One or two of each type, and that's about it. Every other weapon is more of a tool, like the freeze gun, rather than a front line weapon.

 

The problem I have is: It's still a science station, I would think it would be way more protected. And everything is a bit too "passive." sure we have full sets of Riot gear and laser weapons but the vests and rifles could have more of a use, I don't see the reason about differentiating. Different weapon caliber, different sprite, different handling, different ammo count, different damage. And Riot gear in real life wouldn't really protect against bullets.

I do understand the reason for outgunning the ingame staff, but that is simply fixed by having the Nuke ops weapons be more powerful and better armored. Nuke ops weapons > ERT weapons > Security weapons. ERT Armor > Nuke ops armor > security armor. Security size > ERT size > Nuke ops size.

Just because it might make people 'lazy' I think it'd be the opposite, we could enforce ROE and a rule of "One sidearm, one Primary." and if you take multiple primaries you get punished or ICly it's too heavy to carry. It could fit different play styles and different tactics.

Damage

Energy > Ballistics

Rate of fire

Energy < Ballistics

Reloading while in Combat

Energy < Ballistics

Non lethal

Energy > Ballistics

EMP Resistance

Energy < Ballistics

Malfunctions

Energy > Ballistics

use in space

Energy > Ballistics

Internal damage

Energy < Ballistics

Armor piercing

Energy > Ballistics (a laser can easily shoot through a bulletproof vest.)

I would not say security is armed to the teeth, but still able to be flexible and able to defend a bit better against Nuke Ops.

And having gun fights and ballistics armor could prevent people from just blowing holes out of the station to cut off non-hard suited men, because both sides will have ballistic armor, hard suits would be more susceptible to bullets so it's a bigger risk to wear it.

The ballistics and new armors DO serve a purpose for different situations. And gunfights and standoffs could add excitement.

And what Xander said, due to some de-stabilization it would cause heavier weapons funding to go to stations in that region and the Syndicate would compensate by designing and purchasing new weapons.

EDIT: And during code blue unless there is an immediate danger/all the heads are dead. Pistols only.

[Skull132]

In practice, your concepts don't work.

If you scale up the weapons for both sides, then most confrontations will escalate nearly immediately to the lethal stage, and more of than not, the station will be left a giant battleground. You can already witness this is you see ERT deployed against a nuke team. Arming the security staff to be on par with present ERT, even if we increase the combat capacity of the nuke teams, will simply result in that situation becoming a thing. I don't think that's beneficial.

Further more, the types of weapons I outlined are limited by very hard ceilings in the game. There are only so few variables ingame that we can modify for a weapon. For shooters like ArmA there are more. But here, it's roughly: ROF, damage, magazine size, method of reload. That is. Amazingly limiting, and the spectrum of weaponry already in place covers it quite aptly.

And yes, riot armour doesn't protect against gunshots too well. And gun armour doesn't protect extremities. Which is how these things go: packing kevlar onto extremities is a really bad thing to do. And that groin flap? That's for anti-frag, not for stopping bullets.

[Theplahunter]

In practice, your concepts don't work.

If you scale up the weapons for both sides, then most confrontations will escalate nearly immediately to the lethal stage, and more of than not, the station will be left a giant battleground. You can already witness this is you see ERT deployed against a nuke team. Arming the security staff to be on par with present ERT, even if we increase the combat capacity of the nuke teams, will simply result in that situation becoming a thing. I don't think that's beneficial.

Further more, the types of weapons I outlined are limited by very hard ceilings in the game. There are only so few variables ingame that we can modify for a weapon. For shooters like ArmA there are more. But here, it's roughly: ROF, damage, magazine size, method of reload. That is. Amazingly limiting, and the spectrum of weaponry already in place covers it quite aptly.

And yes, riot armour doesn't protect against gunshots too well. And gun armour doesn't protect extremities. Which is how these things go: packing kevlar onto extremities is a really bad thing to do. And that groin flap? That's for anti-frag, not for stopping bullets.

 

Well, arming up security a bit more does give Nuke Ops a bit more of a challenge, and upping weapons would simulate an arms race that would happen between the syndicate and ERT. Besides, ROF, Damage, Mag size, and reload types with other types of sprites is good variables.

The groin flap will be fixed, thank you for telling me that.

Well, the riot armor Gun armor thing is something that goes back to my situation point, you could take an ablative vest or a Bulletproof vest depending on how the enemy is armed. If nuke ops brings a bunch of kevlar and no Ablative it gives security an energy advantage. But if security gets caught by a nuke ops ambush who have rifles while you have energy armor you're screwed. It's different weapons and types, which is not a bad thing. I think if Nuke ops and ERT both had M16A6s nobody would know who's shooting at who because they're the same. While however, a nuke ops and ERT firing it out with an AK-408 and an ERT with a HK450 you can tell who's fighting and the advantages and disadvantages. It may seem like little differences but they can be big in certain places, like who's fighting, how many there are, damage it could put out, location, ectera.

EDIT: It also makes me realize the lore that could be added with companies, arms races, certain IC events like scientists thinking up new weapons, the OOC and IC people who run/work for the company (We could have people design, pitch, and create guns and companies and see how it reacts IC through events/RP) It could add a layer of corporate espionage, contracts, even some special work like Jeremy Silver and Erik Bradley both come down to the station to pitch the newest weapon to the HoS/Captain/Duty officer/NT rep. Like a 9 shot 12.7mm revolver and A .44 sub machine gun (a little outlandish yes) and the characters start debating it and seeing how they test and work and decide on what else goes in the armory. We could even code in/RP malfunctions/Jams/breaking once and awhile for tests as it would be "Prototyped weapons."

Or could add nations and yeah... Arm races, that could be influenced by the players or created. from a fourm RP to economic trade RP or corporate espionage RP. Another example

Robinson & Redelle engineer Louis Voltic comes onto the NSS aurora with a brand new design, the Redelle 21 (beretta M12.) meanwhile, Corporate spy for Fasse Armoir Jean Fettersen tries to steal the design to make a cheaper copy and sabotage the work and business. During a test Jean and two Greytide- Er... Two mercenaries assault Voltic and the captain, knocking them unconcious and taking the blueprint. It could be a good antag objective/Event for people who like weapons.

It also gives good RPers and imaginative minds like SierraKommando to get their gun designs inside the game and make ingame money for their characters. Like Sierra Private security arms (SPSA) doing deals on station or on the fourms. It also can have people make more backstory and get second jobs working for the other companies (Scientists and Engineers who actually make some pretty good stuff in game but get it wiped.) who can be approached by Scouts/Investors for the rights to the patents or a job offer or they could apply for the position depending on how good they are. I know this is about a space station but it could also expand to the companies.

Edited April 28, 2015 by Guest

[Skull132]

Well, arming up security a bit more does give Nuke Ops a bit more of a challenge, and upping weapons would simulate an arms race that would happen between the syndicate and ERT. Besides, ROF, Damage, Mag size, and reload types with other types of sprites is good variables.

 

Except. Please put yourself into my position. Understand this: each human has 200 health. Each human has a tolerance for pain. Increasing one variable forces you to decrease another, in order to keep the weapons in line with the with each other. There is no meaningful way, beyond speciality weaponry, to produce variations from here. You could have minor difference, or things like that, but I have a fun little story about that.

Basically: introducing a slew of weapons that are of slight variation to each other will result in the objectively best being used, and the rest discarded. And that isn't a cost effective tactic for a small development team.

 

Well, the riot armor Gun armor thing is something that goes back to my situation point, you could take an ablative vest or a Bulletproof vest depending on how the enemy is armed. If nuke ops brings a bunch of kevlar and no Ablative it gives security an energy advantage. But if security gets caught by a nuke ops ambush who have rifles while you have energy armor you're screwed. It's different weapons and types, which is not a bad thing.

 

...All of this can already be simulated with the tools at your disposal. Well, except for the note that Nukes don't have access to energy weaponry, but I'm of mind to amend that easily enough. Now, how is it already possible? Simple: go to cargo, order supplies, voila. There is very little that positively enhances gameplay that can come from providing security with these tools from the getgo.

 

I think if Nuke ops and ERT both had M16A6s nobody would know who's shooting at who because they're the same. While however, a nuke ops and ERT firing it out with an AK-408 and an ERT with a HK450 you can tell who's fighting and the advantages and disadvantages. It may seem like little differences but they can be big in certain places, like who's fighting, how many there are, damage it could put out, location, ectera.

 

No. Tracer ammunition is not used, and even if tracers were in the game, or multi-coloured lasers, all of it goes belly up once people realize that attempting to identify a terrorist force based on the signature of the weaponry they use is silly. You ID by uniform, and confirm that before you shoot. Also, this can already be simulated ingame with present resources, and it really doesn't change anything. I've been in confrontations where both sides use the identical weaponry (laser rifles, or so forth), and I've never been confused as to who to shoot.

You can only shoot the people you see, ergo, any point about second-hand identification is a very small one.

 

EDIT: It also makes me realize the lore that could be added with companies, arms races, certain IC events like scientists thinking up new weapons, the OOC and IC people who run/work for the company (We could have people design, pitch, and create guns and companies and see how it reacts IC through events/RP) It could add a layer of corporate espionage, contracts, even some special work like Jeremy Silver and Erik Bradley both come down to the station to pitch the newest weapon to the HoS/Captain/Duty officer/NT rep. Like a 9 shot 12.7mm revolver and A .44 sub machine gun (a little outlandish yes) and the characters start debating it and seeing how they test and work and decide on what else goes in the armory. We could even code in/RP malfunctions/Jams/breaking once and awhile for tests as it would be "Prototyped weapons."

 

I'm just going to drop the lore arguments, my apologies for ever going with them. I am responsible for maintaining aspects of gameplay, and lore can be bent any which way, with ease, to accommodate whichever approach serves gameplay best.

[Theplahunter]

Well, arming up security a bit more does give Nuke Ops a bit more of a challenge, and upping weapons would simulate an arms race that would happen between the syndicate and ERT. Besides, ROF, Damage, Mag size, and reload types with other types of sprites is good variables.

 

Except. Please put yourself into my position. Understand this: each human has 200 health. Each human has a tolerance for pain. Increasing one variable forces you to decrease another, in order to keep the weapons in line with the with each other. There is no meaningful way, beyond speciality weaponry, to produce variations from here. You could have minor difference, or things like that, but I have a fun little story about that.

Basically: introducing a slew of weapons that are of slight variation to each other will result in the objectively best being used, and the rest discarded. And that isn't a cost effective tactic for a small development team.

 

Well, the riot armor Gun armor thing is something that goes back to my situation point, you could take an ablative vest or a Bulletproof vest depending on how the enemy is armed. If nuke ops brings a bunch of kevlar and no Ablative it gives security an energy advantage. But if security gets caught by a nuke ops ambush who have rifles while you have energy armor you're screwed. It's different weapons and types, which is not a bad thing.

 

...All of this can already be simulated with the tools at your disposal. Well, except for the note that Nukes don't have access to energy weaponry, but I'm of mind to amend that easily enough. Now, how is it already possible? Simple: go to cargo, order supplies, voila. There is very little that positively enhances gameplay that can come from providing security with these tools from the getgo.

 

I think if Nuke ops and ERT both had M16A6s nobody would know who's shooting at who because they're the same. While however, a nuke ops and ERT firing it out with an AK-408 and an ERT with a HK450 you can tell who's fighting and the advantages and disadvantages. It may seem like little differences but they can be big in certain places, like who's fighting, how many there are, damage it could put out, location, ectera.

 

No. Tracer ammunition is not used, and even if tracers were in the game, or multi-coloured lasers, all of it goes belly up once people realize that attempting to identify a terrorist force based on the signature of the weaponry they use is silly. You ID by uniform, and confirm that before you shoot. Also, this can already be simulated ingame with present resources, and it really doesn't change anything. I've been in confrontations where both sides use the identical weaponry (laser rifles, or so forth), and I've never been confused as to who to shoot.

You can only shoot the people you see, ergo, any point about second-hand identification is a very small one.

 

EDIT: It also makes me realize the lore that could be added with companies, arms races, certain IC events like scientists thinking up new weapons, the OOC and IC people who run/work for the company (We could have people design, pitch, and create guns and companies and see how it reacts IC through events/RP) It could add a layer of corporate espionage, contracts, even some special work like Jeremy Silver and Erik Bradley both come down to the station to pitch the newest weapon to the HoS/Captain/Duty officer/NT rep. Like a 9 shot 12.7mm revolver and A .44 sub machine gun (a little outlandish yes) and the characters start debating it and seeing how they test and work and decide on what else goes in the armory. We could even code in/RP malfunctions/Jams/breaking once and awhile for tests as it would be "Prototyped weapons."

 

I'm just going to drop the lore arguments, my apologies for ever going with them. I am responsible for maintaining aspects of gameplay, and lore can be bent any which way, with ease, to accommodate whichever approach serves gameplay best.

 

1: I do understand the code it will take and I know it's a big job, but I think it could be just for the small variations and not a big game changing thing. Also to discourage dropping weapons it could just be an issue of ammo scarcity. Like Nuke ops, ERT, and Sec all have different ammo types so they can't change it out, making them have less ammo and less of a fire rate advantage. I'd assume if anybody is dropping a weapon it's because they like the AK more than the M16, and even then that's a very questionable move. All miltaries have once scavenged the battlefield for weapons, and I don't think that's a bad thing. It gives people preference. And there won't be a "best" both will have their weaknesses and strengths for balance.

2: Yes, it can be simulated. But sometimes cargo is not in working order or you cannot order ballistic lethals. It might cause positive game play by adding variants, and yes its a big order. And I do not expect it to all be done, but i'd be more than willing to learn how to code and sprite to help out, or get some more people (I know a few coders from other communities that would be willing.)

3: I'm not saying tracers. But sounds. If you're being shot upon you can tell from the noise you're being fired at with an AK and you can try and calculate where the bullets are firing from by using the bullet sprite (bullets do have flying sprites I think.) And snipers can get easier pings (due to scopes.) and both sides using the same weapons: Good point. But sometimes if one side has kevlar and the other side has kevlar and you're already jumpy. You could be a security officer running into another officer that decided to gear up in Nuke ops gear and you I.D by looks, and not mousing over.

4: The lore thing I brought up is because you brought it up and it still could bring in some special RP and player driven interaction. Like somebody buys stock in my (Robinson & Redelle) company and in an RP scenario NT buy's a contract for a new Sniper rifle. I then go to my engineers and scientists (who got hired.) and talk it out and brainstorm with them. Lets say I succeed, stocks for that guy go waaaaaaaaay up and he makes money, however if the sniper is not up to par the contract is failed and stocks go down. Which could have RP depression, anxiety, extra job stuff, it could make a story. And I don't think we should drop it, as it is still is something valid to discuss. Although you are not in charge of it it could be for a debate.

EDIT: And skull, I cannot get on the Server or TS and I do not know anybody who is in charge of that type of lore so if you or anybody else can get somebody to discuss this as well, I would appreciate it.

[Skull132]

You missed my point. By "Dropped", I mean never used.

Example: I used to play ArmA with a group of 20-40 players, depending on the time of the year. We had, in our modpack, roughly 100+ weapons. Only 15-20 were actively used. That is, basically, a loss of 80%+ of the weapons.

If cargo is not working, then you need to find another way to solve the issue. This game is all about solving issues, and your argument basically reads: "I don't want to solve this issue, I just want to avoid it, so it'd be easier for me."

About point 3. Audio range is just slightly greater than visual range. And even there, it wouldn't produce a meaningful difference. Just, not something within the capacity of the game's setup, in my opinion.

Here is the hard cap for weapon variations in this game:

In order for parallel weapons to exist, the time to kill needs to be equal, but the other variables can be different.

There are only three variables for us to play with: damage, rate of fire, magazine capacity.

The incrementation necessary to produce meaningful sets of variants is not present, unfortunately.

[Rusty Shackleford]

I'm a red-blooded American, so naturally I possess an ingrained adoration for firearms of all sorts.

But yeah, the most you can really do with this is make different sprites, adjust the values by miniscule amounts and make any guns that are more powerful rarer or simply harder to obtain ammunition for.

As much as it pains me to say it, there's not too much flexibility in terms of firearms in 2d spessmen.

Unless you start talking about magrifles.

[Theplahunter]

You missed my point. By "Dropped", I mean never used.

Example: I used to play ArmA with a group of 20-40 players, depending on the time of the year. We had, in our modpack, roughly 100+ weapons. Only 15-20 were actively used. That is, basically, a loss of 80%+ of the weapons.

If cargo is not working, then you need to find another way to solve the issue. This game is all about solving issues, and your argument basically reads: "I don't want to solve this issue, I just want to avoid it, so it'd be easier for me."

About point 3. Audio range is just slightly greater than visual range. And even there, it wouldn't produce a meaningful difference. Just, not something within the capacity of the game's setup, in my opinion.

Here is the hard cap for weapon variations in this game:

In order for parallel weapons to exist, the time to kill needs to be equal, but the other variables can be different.

There are only three variables for us to play with: damage, rate of fire, magazine capacity.

The incrementation necessary to produce meaningful sets of variants is not present, unfortunately.

 

0: Ehhh, this isn't 100 weapons, however. Its 10 types for each 'Faction' that all have uses, and I don't think comparing it to Arma where some weapons are absolute shit tier (Lee Enfield, CZ hunting rifle, AK-47) is a good comparison to a group of smaller, balanced weapons that all have uses and play styles and situations.

1: Yeah, I see what you mean. But by having a limited amount of weapons (like say 2 rifles, 3 SMGs, 2 carbines, and the max amount of each pistol.) would require some people who arrive late to the pick to be forced to grab something else (or just have the warden Dole out loadouts while using everything.)

2: It does sound like that now that I think over it, but you cannot order ballistic rifles in the first place, which is my problem. It's easier to get them from the armory instead of waiting 3 minutes for a crate that you need the HoS to open when Nuke ops is running up on you and/or setting up the nuke.

3: I did not know about the sound thing, good to know. I'll try and think of a different way for it to work out.

4: I'm not saying it'd be a hardcore massiv varying thing. I think for the basics Firerate Damage and Ammo cap would work, Lets say you have more Fire rate and ammo but less Damage, but more damage and less fire rate and ammo.

And to rusty:

Yeah I know, but different sprites, sounds, ammo, fire rate, and Damage still can work. It's not about flexibility, honestly. It's about the new items to use and give advantages and disadvantages and different types of weapons that can be found.

Aaaaaaand this wouldn't be necessarily be set as Ballistics only, now i've had a discussion with Erik. We've been talking about Railguns and Coil weapons and other types of lasers. Also I wanna bring it back to the lore/RP situation: An arms race evolution. As it goes on people could create flexible ways and different types (Bull pup Sub machine guns, .50 cal MGs, Railguns, ectera.) It may not be a gameplay thing, but a Lore and RP thing.

I'm also a fucking gun nerd, I live in Iowa and I swear every time I go out to my step-uncles farm and shoot it feels sooooo good...

[Skull132]

1: Yeah, I see what you mean. But by having a limited amount of weapons (like say 2 rifles, 3 SMGs, 2 carbines, and the max amount of each pistol.) would require some people who arrive late to the pick to be forced to grab something else (or just have the warden Dole out loadouts while using everything.)

 

And. I'm not seeing an issue with this. If you don't plan ahead, then that's a fault of planning. I repeat: you should not be prepared for every situation from the getgo. It breaks one of the key points of this game, regardless of serer.

 

2: It does sound like that now that I think over it, but you cannot order ballistic rifles in the first place, which is my problem.

 

The highest powered ballistic weaponry is an SMG. It's not available through cargo because NT prefers energy weapons. Here's what I'm still stuck on: you seem to be wanting variety, but this is exactly what variety is about. I'd rather have one group limited to a distinct set of weapons, as opposed to giving everyone the same weapons, just sprited and named differently. Think about it.

 

It's easier to get them from the armory instead of waiting 3 minutes for a crate that you need the HoS to open when Nuke ops is running up on you and/or setting up the nuke.

 

It's easier, yes. That's actually exactly why I don't want it to be a thing. The armoury is already targeted to the point where a lot of folks complain, and making it the soul source of everything forever will just mean it gets attacked more often. And it literally detracts from the game to give sec all of the weapons, all of the tools, at once. Refer to one of my arguments in my previous reply.

 

4: I'm not saying it'd be a hardcore massiv varying thing. I think for the basics Firerate Damage and Ammo cap would work, Lets say you have more Fire rate and ammo but less Damage, but more damage and less fire rate and ammo.

 

My point with the talk about ArmA was missed, apparently. In order for there to be a set of meaningful variances, we need to have more incrimentation. You need more space to work with. We don't have it. The best example I can show you is the energy carbine versus laser rifle. The difference is, without thinking too hard, non-existent beyond the fact that one can stun as well. But codewise, and realistic capability wise? They're effectively the largest contrast you can create, while ensuring both remain effective. Anything between those two is practically worthless.

[Theplahunter]

1: Yeah, I see what you mean. But by having a limited amount of weapons (like say 2 rifles, 3 SMGs, 2 carbines, and the max amount of each pistol.) would require some people who arrive late to the pick to be forced to grab something else (or just have the warden Dole out loadouts while using everything.)

 

And. I'm not seeing an issue with this. If you don't plan ahead, then that's a fault of planning. I repeat: you should not be prepared for every situation from the getgo. It breaks one of the key points of this game, regardless of serer.

 

2: It does sound like that now that I think over it, but you cannot order ballistic rifles in the first place, which is my problem.

 

The highest powered ballistic weaponry is an SMG. It's not available through cargo because NT prefers energy weapons. Here's what I'm still stuck on: you seem to be wanting variety, but this is exactly what variety is about. I'd rather have one group limited to a distinct set of weapons, as opposed to giving everyone the same weapons, just sprited and named differently. Think about it.

 

It's easier to get them from the armory instead of waiting 3 minutes for a crate that you need the HoS to open when Nuke ops is running up on you and/or setting up the nuke.

 

It's easier, yes. That's actually exactly why I don't want it to be a thing. The armoury is already targeted to the point where a lot of folks complain, and making it the soul source of everything forever will just mean it gets attacked more often. And it literally detracts from the game to give sec all of the weapons, all of the tools, at once. Refer to one of my arguments in my previous reply.

 

4: I'm not saying it'd be a hardcore massiv varying thing. I think for the basics Firerate Damage and Ammo cap would work, Lets say you have more Fire rate and ammo but less Damage, but more damage and less fire rate and ammo.

 

My point with the talk about ArmA was missed, apparently. In order for there to be a set of meaningful variances, we need to have more incrimentation. You need more space to work with. We don't have it. The best example I can show you is the energy carbine versus laser rifle. The difference is, without thinking too hard, non-existent beyond the fact that one can stun as well. But codewise, and realistic capability wise? They're effectively the largest contrast you can create, while ensuring both remain effective. Anything between those two is practically worthless.

 

1: Alright.

2: Yes, they do prefer energy weapons. BUT that can always change, energy is not going to last forever. And I still bring up the whole ammo thing, energy: Good for quick combat. Ballistics: Good for prolonged fire fights. Let me bring up the Beretta and Colt m1911 example: A colt (energy weapon) is good for a short firefight where you just want to kill somebody quickly. A beretta is good when you're engaging multiple targets in cover who can fire back. (Refer to 2/3,5/4 for a better explanation. I flubbed this a little.)

3: Yeah I do see your point about the whole "Easier" thing and I don't really have any argument for that other than time is going to be close while you're waiting for those weapons and it would just be morel logical and convient to have them on hand, it's not laziness its Logic. A somali pirate band raiding your ship, you won't have time to call Jerry down in munitions and get a boat full of rifles. You're going to want to get that fucking gun-locker open and start defending yourself.

2/3.5/4: The variety part of it, it may seem miniscule but still with new sprites, sounds and handling it could work. It isn't the same, you may think it's only sprited differently -but- it could have other ways to reload, extra steps, having to cock the weapon after firing or reloading, pumping the weapon, bolting it, jams, maintenance, cool downs, also with the evoloution of companies with Railguns and laser and ray stuff it would cause a bigger divide of weaponry and types. it's an evolutionary thing, everybody gets a pistol, during a comparison however. The Captain of the Aurora could pick a breech loading rail firing design, The equipment commander for the ERT could pick a semi-automatic multi-shot bullet, and the Syndicate could pick a quick shooting machine pistol that fires a sort of "laser" cartridge... Yeah the laser thing is just an example. Also.. The lore and RP. This is kind of being shifted to RP and lore focus as I think it over. I already explained it to rusty so i'll wait for his response.

EDIT: Or, this could come eventually

Robinson & Redelle Prototype magazine laser carbine-1 (PMLC-1) (Has a chargeable 10 shot magazine | Easy to reload | renewable ammo.)

http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2014/096/1/d/laser_rifle_concept_by_hazzard65-d7dcu56.jpg

[EvilBrage]

Security already has the annoying tendency to block everyone else out of events to make them "security only."

We don't need additional mechanics (namely, "let's arbitrarily buff Syndies and Security") to support that.

[Theplahunter]

Security already has the annoying tendency to block everyone else out of events to make them "security only."

We don't need additional mechanics (namely, "let's arbitrarily buff Syndies and Security") to support that.

 

Well, that seems a bit like cherry picking, evil. I don't think it would be possible for security to make it their own special thing. Considering you'd need a sales rep, a tester, and a lawyer. It could go through a three test process, let me write a 'Scenario' below.

3 Robinson & Redelle employees come onto the station, Representative Helen Valern | Engineer Dean Alezkander | Scientist Mario De fierro. Dean and Mario bring in the newest revolver design, the Bottiglione spazio .357 (.357 snubnose | 6 shots | Gyroscopic | single action) and came to the Aurora with NT permission to show off the newest design. http://i790.photobucket.com/albums/yy183/haraplane/rhino3.jpg

2 Fasse Armoir employees, however, come on with NT permission as well: Representative Louise Clermont and Engineer Daren Clermont. They bring in the newest revolver that the twins created: The Valor-1 Energy revolver. A revolver with instead bullets, a battery cylinder, it is double action, 5 shots, and to reload you had to eject the entire cylinder and put in a new one (Which can cause jams and malfunctions.) (http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4003/4389773143_3f3744272a.jpg)

and a single start up company brings in one man; The owner Johann Vesuvius with the Pompeii Gauss revolver Mk.X. A revolver with seemingly infinite firing power that fires 20 Gauss rounds but requires a lengthy reload process and can be hooked to a charger instead. It has a chance of overheating and burning the users hand if he does not wear gloves and the new Gauss design is a little unstable where if it is fired after being overheated can melt the frame of the gun (http://fc06.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2011/259/1/a/capsule_pistol_by_spex84-d4a0i4z.jpg)

An ERT commander, 2 engineers (who volunteer/are chosen) 2-3 scientists (depending on volunteers) The warden, a security officer, the HoS, RD, Captain, CE, and HoP (depending on who is on at the time.) and maybe a NT rep are taken to the security firing range/science testing range. Each inventor and rep shows off the inner workings of the weapon, and shows off the weapon firing (probably should use trusted RPers for the guns so they can actually RP malfunctions, failures, ectera.) Each employee is a player, active RPers who have either applied for a company, applied for a job, created the weapons design and features, its drawbacks, ect (there will be a balance system implemented)

After the displays all the staff discuss it, it could change the field of combat with new weapons, the players can decide what is put into the armory and sometimes what is replaced/upgraded. Some security officers, engineers, scientists, ectera could even RP making their own upgrades and new guns that could put them up the corporate ladder. Now, the ERT and NT reps pick the Fasse Armoir revolver, as they are picking it due to NTs love of energy. While the Aurora staff selects the Spazio .357 (under the contract name the Security-357/ S-357 Mk.I.) the two companies get a boost in profits and stock values shoot up, while Johanns company sadly goes under and he files for bankruptcy. His company and designs are bought out by Bradley arms and the company starts improving the design (or not, depending on what the company players decide.)

The weapons are integrated slowly as the contract is filled, with one S-357 starting out in the armory and replacing the Fasse MR-99, while the Valor-1 is put along side the Mk.27 and semi-44. It couldn't be 'security' only because it requires a committee to decide and watch, of different branches of staff (medical can go fuck itself though.)