Player Complaint: Callum99877

[Hycinth]

BYOND Key: Hycinth

Player Byond Key: Callum99877

Staff involved: None

Reason for complaint: Ezra Scott as Captain evidently pardoned a prisoner, leading to security action to arrest him. Upon this, he proceeded to barricade himself in the bridge, refusing to comply with legal requests from sec to surrender himself. When sec entered the area, he fired shots (on lethal) from his energy pistol at them.

When arrested and in processing, Callum proceeded to ghost, rather than take their punishment.

This constitutes massive violation of the loyalty implant, sanity, and reflects poorly on whitelisted players, as Captain is a whitelisted position.

In addition, Callum is staff, and therefore should be held to a higher standard than other players. I am quite frankly DISGUSTED by these actions.

Approximate Date/Time: 14/6/15 4.45 CST

---------

This is Ezra Scott!

He is wearing an orange jumpsuit.

He is handcuffed!

He has PDA-Ezra Scott (Captain) about his waist.

He is wearing some orange shoes on his feet.

He has a radio headset on his right ear.

He is totally catatonic. The stresses of life in deep-space must have been too much for him. Any recovery is unlikely

Criminal status: [None]

Security records: [View] [Add comment]

Ezra has brown spiked hair and long ... More...

[CakeIsOssim]

Player of one of the officers present during most of the incident here.

I have some information. Keep in mind, there's going to be a lot of text beyond the spoiler. The logs have been doctored to a point of only including the relevant details. Things like radio chatter and otherwise have been excluded.

 

*A wild Centurion walks into the brig*

Ezra Scott says, "Your free to go."

Phobos asks, "I d- Captain, what are you doing?"

Phobos says, "You cannot release her before the sent-"

LEMON states, "She is charged with screaming and threatening the CMO for refusing a genetics experiment involving species reassignment."

Skyler Briggs says, "Two counts of threat of murder, one count of failure to execute an order, and battery captain."

Skyler Briggs says, "Or just let her out."

Centurion says, "This is true."

Ezra Scott says, "You cant even give me a crime, you dont detain people /without/ knowing the ccrime"

*Ezra walks away after saying this, most officers follow.*

Centurion says, "We knew the crime."

Skyler Briggs says, "I know the crime, sir."

Skyler Briggs says, "Two counts of threat of murder, one count of failure to execute an order, and battery captain."

Ezra Scott asks, "And you couldnt say thaty before because?"

*Ezra, again, walks away, seemingly avoiding any response to this question.*

Phobos says, "You did not ask over our channel for those who actually handled the brigging."

Skyler Briggs says, "You already let her out..."

Phobos says, "Get back here."

Phobos [security] says, "Cease, criminal."

Ezra Scott [security] says, "Regardless, the warden should be able to tell me."

Phobos says, "Exceeding offical powers is a breach of regulation."

Ezra Scott asks, "Essel?"

Centurion says, "Caesar."

Phoebe Essel asks, "..Do you want something?"

Centurion says, "I spoke to the chief medicus. They were, in fact, insulted by Essel."

Centurion says, "Releasing Essel is a breach of regulation."

Skyler Briggs [security] says, "Phobos, let it go. She had like two minutes left. It's not like she's an actual murderer."

Centurion [security] says, "That changes nothing."

Phoebe Essel says, "Who cares? You can brig me again after I finish my procedure."

Ezra Scott asks, "You will behave, you will stop talking to yourself or you will go back in a cell, is that understood?"

Centurion [security] says, "We do not violate regulation. We uphold it. Even if there was a single second left."

Phoebe Essel says, "I will talk to myself as much as I please. I like myself more than any of you."

Phoebe Essel says, "I don't see why that's a problem."

*Phobos moves in to make the arrest.*

Phobos yells, "Captain!"

Phobos says, "You are under arrest."

Ezra Scott says, "Just behave ok? Niether of us want the hastle"

Ezra Scott asks, "Yes?"

Phoebe Essel says, "Yes, whatever. Now, I need out."

Bao Xi says, "Right.."

Phobos says, "For violation of corporate regulation i214, Exceeding Offical Powers."

Phoebe Essel says, "I must attend my procedure."

Phobos says, "Please do not resist."

Phobos says, "Centurion."

Centurion says, "Caesar."

Bao Xi yells, "What the fuck!"

Phobos says, "Handcuffs."

Ezra Scott says, "You wont touch me"

Centurion says, "Yet again, you exceed official powers."

Phobos says, "Do not resist, it will be an additional breach of regulations."

Centurion says, "If I must detain you, you will not resist."

Phoebe Essel says, "..Just behave, Okay, Scott? None of you want the hassle."

Centurion says, "Or I will use force."

Andrew Guess says, "WATER :"

Alexander Sheppard says, "Centurion, Phobos. Explain."

Artemis Shire [145.9] says, "Security is like... Mutinying against the Captain in the Brig."

Benjamin Garneys asks, "The hell is goin' on?"

Ezra Scott says, "You refused to tell me the crime, so it is you at fault."

*Yet again, Ezra walks away. Again, seemingly to avoid consequences. However, this time, Ezra runs all the way to the bridge. They stand inside, and look out of the window at all he officers standing there, trying to coax them out using legal and logical methods.

Phobos says, "The Captain released a prisoner before their sentence was over"

Benjamin Garneys says, "Oh."

Phobos [security] says, "You are sparking a manhunt, Sir."

Centurion says, "Come back here."

Benjamin Garneys says, "Cap'n."

Benjamin Garneys says, "You can't go releasin' prisoners like that."

Ezra Scott says, "You will cease."

Centurion says, "I am not fucking aorund."

Centurion says, "We will not."

Centurion says, "Either you are foolish, or you do not know regulation."

Centurion says, "Either way, you are going in a cell."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Security."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Explain yourselves."

Raymond Galloway [security] asks, "Meaning - why am I told the captain is being arrested?"

Centurion [security] says, "The caesar has exceeded official powers by releasing a prisoner."

Benjamin Garneys [security] says, "If'n there's explainin' to be done, I'm thinkin' it might be the cap'n who needs to do."

Phobos [security] says, "The Captain released a prisoner before their sentence was over."

Raymond Galloway [security] asks, "Who?"

Ezra Scott says, "Maybe you should be able to give me a crime? And she left the brig no earlier than her sentence finished as i had a chat with her beforehand."

Phobos [security] says, "And is now resisting arrest for exceeding offical powers."

Centurion [security] says, "Phoebe Essel."

Skyler Briggs [security] says, "Phoebe Essel."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Right, apologies."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Carry on."

Phobos says, "Negative."

Phobos says, "You do not decide times."

Centurion [security] says, "He has barricaded himself in the bridge."

Ezra Scott [security] says, "Security refused to state a crime."

Centurion [security] says, "WE stated it twice."

Centurion [security] says, "Fool."

Skyler Briggs [security] asks, "Did you bother to ask either arresting officers?"

Mu'in Tak [security] asks, "What ... was the crrrime?"

Bao Xi [security] asks, "But.. They said it multiple times?"

Centurion says, "Now."

Centurion asks, "Are you going to come out, or am I going to have to come in?"

Phobos [security] says, "Galloway, we require allowance into the bridge."

Phobos [security] says, "The Captain hides from us."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Him being allegedly unfit for command is not grounds for insulting him."

Centurion [security] says, "Him being a fool is plenty grounds."

Ezra Scott [security] says, "The warden refused, so i let her out her cell, you stated it after i did so. I spoke to her for over three minutes and she left the brig no later than she would have otherwise. You will cease or your employment will cease."

Phobos [security] says, "A fool is a fool, Galloway."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Show a modicum of professionalism."

Skyler Briggs [security] asks, "Can the arresting officers be professional?"

Alexander Sheppard says, "Your insults are noted."

Alexander Sheppard swaps his gaze from one IPC to the other.

Skyler Briggs [security] says, "Two counts of threat of murder, one count of battery, and failure to execute an order."

Phobos [security] says, "Scott. You having a conversation does not count as time in a cell. Cease."

Centurion [security] says, "I have shown plenty by giving the caesar plenty of leeway. He continues to run from us, and away from our handcuffs."

Raymond Galloway says, "Right."

Benjamin Garneys says, "Christ."

Benjamin Garneys says, "Evenin', Galloway."

Raymond Galloway asks, "Which of you is most knowledgeable about this situation?"

Phobos says, "Galloway, if you would please open the door."

Phobos says, "We have explained everything thus far."

Centurion says, "Garney's arrested Essel, but I was present for the caesar releasing Essel."

Benjamin Garneys says, "This situation went an' happened after I left the brig, so it ain't me."

Raymond Galloway says, "Centurion."

Raymond Galloway says, "Step inside the IA office with Agent Sheppard here."

*This is where I went away with the internal affairs agent, and everything I told him has already been stated in the logs above.*

Ezra Scott [security] says, "This is due to the warden being nable to state a crime."

Centurion says, "Ask away, and I shall answer."

Phobos [security] says, "This does not excuse you."

Centurion [security] asks, "What part of the warden stating them three times now do you not understand?"

Ezra Scott [security] says, "If im not told a crime its securities incompetance. The warden stated them /after/ you had arrived and waited for five minutes."

*I finish with internal affairs, walk out, and see this.*

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Arrest the captain."

Jillian Fleming [security] says, "The bartender is allowed to defend themselves from rowdy patrons."

Centurion [security] says, "Assuming they are not still barricaded in the bridgge."

Centurion says, "Assuming they are not still barricaded in the bridgge."

Centurion [security] says, "And, my report with internal affairs is complete."

Centurion says, "And, my report with internal affairs is complete."

Benjamin Garneys [security] exclaims, "T - The cap'n just fuckin' shot me!"

Centurion [security] says, "Should we not wait for the response from central command to arrest the cae-"

Centurion says, "Should we not wait for the response from central command to arrest the cae-"

Centurion [security] says, "Okay."

Skyler Briggs [security] says, "He fired lethal rounds."

 

End wall of text. That's my input on this, as I was there for most of it. A captain is not above the law, nor are they the law themselves. They follow regulation like everyone else should. However, in this case, the captain was implanted. Everything that Hycinth stated, how a captain acting in such a way is questionable when it comes to sanity and whitelist, I completely agree with.

[Jamini]

You know. I'm just going to point out that only security can get away with ignoring any order they don't like completely scot-free.

Just saying. Nobody else can really do that. Might be worth making note.

[Eliot Clef]

You know. I'm just going to point out that only security can get away with ignoring any order they don't like completely scot-free.

Just saying. Nobody else can really do that. Might be worth making note.

 

Ezra Scott released a prisoner who, if the logs are to be believed, was attempting to undergo a species reassignment procedure and getting screamy/violent when they weren't allowed to go about it. This was explained, up front, to Ezra, who disregarded this input and said that no charges were presented. And continued to claim that this was not explained to him throughout the entire ordeal.

Ultimately, this incident is somewhat petty as it was over a handful of minutes at most.

But.

If a Captain is stepping in and interfering with Security without understanding what is going on with a Security situation, I absolutely do think they're within their rights to arrest him for Exceeding Official Powers.

Let's read Exceeding Official Powers.

 

This is for any head of staff who abuses the power given to them, such as the Head of Personnel acting like a security officer in a non-emergency, the captain acting as if he is above the law, etc. Heads of Staff trying to order a different department or ignoring the captain also comes under this. Also covers anyone illegally promoting themselves, such as with a stolen ID.

 

Captain Ezra Scott, in this situation, interfered while:

1) Disregarding Security explanations,

2) Willfully refusing attempts to clarify,

3) Releasing a prisoner prior to completing their brig time, and insisting correctness in spite of explanations justifying the prisoner's (allegedly minor) brig time,

4) Fled Security to the bridge, where other members of Command got involved and requested an explanation... and agreed that the Captain should be arrested.

5) Escalated to lethals before the conclusion of the conflict.

Even if you agree that literally everyone else was in the wrong up until step 5, there is basically no universe in which step 5 was acceptable.

Everyone was telling Ezra he was wrong, and he wasn't listening. Dealing with superiors when they break the rules is, in fact, Security's job. This is not rendered invalid when the person being subjected to arrest thinks they're wrong. Of course they get to tell their bosses no and get away with it completely scot-free.

[Tainavaa]

Even so, what Jamini said is irrelevant to Ezra pardoning someone for their charges, then bunkering down in the bridge and shooting officers. Then ghosting.

The order the captain gave was an illegal order.

• If the sentence has been ordered, you do not pardon it and undermine security's authority with an invalid order in the first place. You punish/discipline the officer/s that made this wrongful charge and execution.

 

The captain then refused to admit this.

The captain ghosted when caught.

How security having this luxury is relevant is beyond me.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Captain's are permitted to pardon people who were brigged unjustly. That's literally stopping a bad brigging in process. You don't just spank sec after the fact.

The Captain cannot exceed official powers when "exceeding official powers" is "giving an order security doesn't like". The captain has the official power to override decisions made by any lower Head. That's within his authority. Instead of contacting Internal Affairs or Central Command to contest this, you proceeded to engage in mutiny. Arresting the highest authority on the station is generally something you need clearance for unless they're being totally insane and violent, if only because they are loyalty implanted.

Of course the behaviour of going to lethals was totally dumb and makes it really hard to justify defending him.

[Jamini]

Captain's are permitted to pardon people who were brigged unjustly. That's literally stopping a bad brigging in process. You don't just spank sec after the fact.

The Captain cannot exceed official powers when "exceeding official powers" is "giving an order security doesn't like". The captain has the official power to override decisions made by any lower Head. That's within his authority. Instead of contacting Internal Affairs or Central Command to contest this, you proceeded to engage in mutiny. Arresting the highest authority on the station is generally something you need clearance for unless they're being totally insane and violent, if only because they are loyalty implanted.

Of course the behaviour of going to lethals was totally dumb and makes it really hard to justify defending him.

 

They did contact central, after making numerous attempts to arrest and detain Ezra.

That said, he did eventually go to lethals. Which was unwarranted. But I'd hardly call anyone in security blameless. Quite the opposite in fact.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

They did contact central, after making numerous attempts to arrest and detain Ezra.

That said, he did eventually go to lethals. Which was unwarranted. But I'd hardly call anyone in security blameless. Quite the opposite in fact.

 

That's the stickler: after. It should be "before". Anything is justified with CC permission.

And we have to be wary to justify their actions because of the consequences stacking the 'justify' hand in their favour.

[Guest]

from Corporate Regulations on the wiki:

http://wiki.baystation12.net/Corporate_Regulations

 

The Captain is not above Corporate Regulations, and can be arrested by Security for breaking it. The only time that the Corporate Regulations can be overridden is when there is an imminent and overwhelming threat to the station.

Pardons are only legitimate if they come from a NanoTrasen higher-up (that is, someone who ranks above the Captain). Despite his high ranking, the Captain cannot spit in the face of Corporate Regulations, and any attempts to do so are infractions.

 

Sorry Jackboot, you're wrong.

What I also want answered is this, given there was a name that popped up that was rather concerning given there's a 'cult' surrounding that character. Callum, if the criminal was not the specific character that was pursued by security in this instance, what would you have done? Because I've seen signs of your characters making decisions that made me suspicious of the whole cult/ICmeta-buddying trend I see with a few characters as of recently. This complaint just confirmed my suspicions, as well.

This isn't acceptable as someone who holds so much power on the station.

[Tainavaa]

What Delta said.

You do not undermine the authority of security, Jackboot. You discipline and punish those who have wrongfully imprisoned someone.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

oops

well I mean

Well

Yeah OK I forgot about that final waiver that it has to be someone above the Captain. Arguments withdrawn.

[callum99877]

Player of one of the officers present during most of the incident here.

I have some information. Keep in mind, there's going to be a lot of text beyond the spoiler. The logs have been doctored to a point of only including the relevant details. Things like radio chatter and otherwise have been excluded.

 

*A wild Centurion walks into the brig*

Ezra Scott says, "Your free to go."

Phobos asks, "I d- Captain, what are you doing?"

Phobos says, "You cannot release her before the sent-"

LEMON states, "She is charged with screaming and threatening the CMO for refusing a genetics experiment involving species reassignment."

Skyler Briggs says, "Two counts of threat of murder, one count of failure to execute an order, and battery captain."

Skyler Briggs says, "Or just let her out."

Centurion says, "This is true."

Ezra Scott says, "You cant even give me a crime, you dont detain people /without/ knowing the ccrime"

*Ezra walks away after saying this, most officers follow.*

Centurion says, "We knew the crime."

Skyler Briggs says, "I know the crime, sir."

Skyler Briggs says, "Two counts of threat of murder, one count of failure to execute an order, and battery captain."

Ezra Scott asks, "And you couldnt say thaty before because?"

*Ezra, again, walks away, seemingly avoiding any response to this question.*

Phobos says, "You did not ask over our channel for those who actually handled the brigging."

Skyler Briggs says, "You already let her out..."

Phobos says, "Get back here."

Phobos [security] says, "Cease, criminal."

Ezra Scott [security] says, "Regardless, the warden should be able to tell me."

Phobos says, "Exceeding offical powers is a breach of regulation."

Ezra Scott asks, "Essel?"

Centurion says, "Caesar."

Phoebe Essel asks, "..Do you want something?"

Centurion says, "I spoke to the chief medicus. They were, in fact, insulted by Essel."

Centurion says, "Releasing Essel is a breach of regulation."

Skyler Briggs [security] says, "Phobos, let it go. She had like two minutes left. It's not like she's an actual murderer."

Centurion [security] says, "That changes nothing."

Phoebe Essel says, "Who cares? You can brig me again after I finish my procedure."

Ezra Scott asks, "You will behave, you will stop talking to yourself or you will go back in a cell, is that understood?"

Centurion [security] says, "We do not violate regulation. We uphold it. Even if there was a single second left."

Phoebe Essel says, "I will talk to myself as much as I please. I like myself more than any of you."

Phoebe Essel says, "I don't see why that's a problem."

*Phobos moves in to make the arrest.*

Phobos yells, "Captain!"

Phobos says, "You are under arrest."

Ezra Scott says, "Just behave ok? Niether of us want the hastle"

Ezra Scott asks, "Yes?"

Phoebe Essel says, "Yes, whatever. Now, I need out."

Bao Xi says, "Right.."

Phobos says, "For violation of corporate regulation i214, Exceeding Offical Powers."

Phoebe Essel says, "I must attend my procedure."

Phobos says, "Please do not resist."

Phobos says, "Centurion."

Centurion says, "Caesar."

Bao Xi yells, "What the fuck!"

Phobos says, "Handcuffs."

Ezra Scott says, "You wont touch me"

Centurion says, "Yet again, you exceed official powers."

Phobos says, "Do not resist, it will be an additional breach of regulations."

Centurion says, "If I must detain you, you will not resist."

Phoebe Essel says, "..Just behave, Okay, Scott? None of you want the hassle."

Centurion says, "Or I will use force."

Andrew Guess says, "WATER :"

Alexander Sheppard says, "Centurion, Phobos. Explain."

Artemis Shire [145.9] says, "Security is like... Mutinying against the Captain in the Brig."

Benjamin Garneys asks, "The hell is goin' on?"

Ezra Scott says, "You refused to tell me the crime, so it is you at fault."

*Yet again, Ezra walks away. Again, seemingly to avoid consequences. However, this time, Ezra runs all the way to the bridge. They stand inside, and look out of the window at all he officers standing there, trying to coax them out using legal and logical methods.

Phobos says, "The Captain released a prisoner before their sentence was over"

Benjamin Garneys says, "Oh."

Phobos [security] says, "You are sparking a manhunt, Sir."

Centurion says, "Come back here."

Benjamin Garneys says, "Cap'n."

Benjamin Garneys says, "You can't go releasin' prisoners like that."

Ezra Scott says, "You will cease."

Centurion says, "I am not fucking aorund."

Centurion says, "We will not."

Centurion says, "Either you are foolish, or you do not know regulation."

Centurion says, "Either way, you are going in a cell."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Security."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Explain yourselves."

Raymond Galloway [security] asks, "Meaning - why am I told the captain is being arrested?"

Centurion [security] says, "The caesar has exceeded official powers by releasing a prisoner."

Benjamin Garneys [security] says, "If'n there's explainin' to be done, I'm thinkin' it might be the cap'n who needs to do."

Phobos [security] says, "The Captain released a prisoner before their sentence was over."

Raymond Galloway [security] asks, "Who?"

Ezra Scott says, "Maybe you should be able to give me a crime? And she left the brig no earlier than her sentence finished as i had a chat with her beforehand."

Phobos [security] says, "And is now resisting arrest for exceeding offical powers."

Centurion [security] says, "Phoebe Essel."

Skyler Briggs [security] says, "Phoebe Essel."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Right, apologies."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Carry on."

Phobos says, "Negative."

Phobos says, "You do not decide times."

Centurion [security] says, "He has barricaded himself in the bridge."

Ezra Scott [security] says, "Security refused to state a crime."

Centurion [security] says, "WE stated it twice."

Centurion [security] says, "Fool."

Skyler Briggs [security] asks, "Did you bother to ask either arresting officers?"

Mu'in Tak [security] asks, "What ... was the crrrime?"

Bao Xi [security] asks, "But.. They said it multiple times?"

Centurion says, "Now."

Centurion asks, "Are you going to come out, or am I going to have to come in?"

Phobos [security] says, "Galloway, we require allowance into the bridge."

Phobos [security] says, "The Captain hides from us."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Him being allegedly unfit for command is not grounds for insulting him."

Centurion [security] says, "Him being a fool is plenty grounds."

Ezra Scott [security] says, "The warden refused, so i let her out her cell, you stated it after i did so. I spoke to her for over three minutes and she left the brig no later than she would have otherwise. You will cease or your employment will cease."

Phobos [security] says, "A fool is a fool, Galloway."

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Show a modicum of professionalism."

Skyler Briggs [security] asks, "Can the arresting officers be professional?"

Alexander Sheppard says, "Your insults are noted."

Alexander Sheppard swaps his gaze from one IPC to the other.

Skyler Briggs [security] says, "Two counts of threat of murder, one count of battery, and failure to execute an order."

Phobos [security] says, "Scott. You having a conversation does not count as time in a cell. Cease."

Centurion [security] says, "I have shown plenty by giving the caesar plenty of leeway. He continues to run from us, and away from our handcuffs."

Raymond Galloway says, "Right."

Benjamin Garneys says, "Christ."

Benjamin Garneys says, "Evenin', Galloway."

Raymond Galloway asks, "Which of you is most knowledgeable about this situation?"

Phobos says, "Galloway, if you would please open the door."

Phobos says, "We have explained everything thus far."

Centurion says, "Garney's arrested Essel, but I was present for the caesar releasing Essel."

Benjamin Garneys says, "This situation went an' happened after I left the brig, so it ain't me."

Raymond Galloway says, "Centurion."

Raymond Galloway says, "Step inside the IA office with Agent Sheppard here."

*This is where I went away with the internal affairs agent, and everything I told him has already been stated in the logs above.*

Ezra Scott [security] says, "This is due to the warden being nable to state a crime."

Centurion says, "Ask away, and I shall answer."

Phobos [security] says, "This does not excuse you."

Centurion [security] asks, "What part of the warden stating them three times now do you not understand?"

Ezra Scott [security] says, "If im not told a crime its securities incompetance. The warden stated them /after/ you had arrived and waited for five minutes."

*I finish with internal affairs, walk out, and see this.*

Raymond Galloway [security] says, "Arrest the captain."

Jillian Fleming [security] says, "The bartender is allowed to defend themselves from rowdy patrons."

Centurion [security] says, "Assuming they are not still barricaded in the bridgge."

Centurion says, "Assuming they are not still barricaded in the bridgge."

Centurion [security] says, "And, my report with internal affairs is complete."

Centurion says, "And, my report with internal affairs is complete."

Benjamin Garneys [security] exclaims, "T - The cap'n just fuckin' shot me!"

Centurion [security] says, "Should we not wait for the response from central command to arrest the cae-"

Centurion says, "Should we not wait for the response from central command to arrest the cae-"

Centurion [security] says, "Okay."

Skyler Briggs [security] says, "He fired lethal rounds."

 

End wall of text. That's my input on this, as I was there for most of it. A captain is not above the law, nor are they the law themselves. They follow regulation like everyone else should. However, in this case, the captain was implanted. Everything that Hycinth stated, how a captain acting in such a way is questionable when it comes to sanity and whitelist, I completely agree with.

 

No, as you missed out a 5 minute conversation where an incompetant warden cant even state a crime this means nothing. It was until centurion came along i knew not what she had done. If all three security members that were there cant state a crime i will always think "Why are they in a cell"

Secondly i did not "barricade" myself in the brig, i walked in there, its not as if i barred the windows.

Thirdly, shooting was wrong, yes, but when im climbing into a cryo cell and they start arresting me (i had to go) it starts to become a bit much. I apologize for that.

[Filthyfrankster]

The captain isn't above the law, I thought it was specifically stated. I'm starting to detect some whole metafriending going on here since the captain was /so/ on point with wanting to pardon the prisoner.

Whenever I see Ezra as an assistant, they're nothing but a troublemaker and tend to trespass into security, but when I see them go captain the next round later, they become a total hardass.

Turning lethals on security and firing on them to avoid detainment is a /very/ stupid thing to do, ghosting upon arrest and as a STAFF MEMBER Is even more shameful. A proper captain would of remained cool and on point, took the sentencing like a man and dealt with the issues. Not get into a firefight with security and ghost after they lost.

[callum99877]

The captain isn't above the law, I thought it was specifically stated. I'm starting to detect some whole metafriending going on here since the captain was /so/ on point with wanting to pardon the prisoner.

Whenever I see Ezra as an assistant, they're nothing but a troublemaker and tend to trespass into security, but when I see them go captain the next round later, they become a total hardass.

Turning lethals on security and firing on them to avoid detainment is a /very/ stupid thing to do, ghosting upon arrest and as a STAFF MEMBER Is even more shameful. A proper captain would of remained cool and on point, took the sentencing like a man and dealt with the issues. Not get into a firefight with security and ghost after they lost.

 

You clearly did not read my post, also, as an assistant i go afk. Ive not once trespassed into security and i believe your now just making things up.

I was arrested while litarally climbing into cryo.

[Filthyfrankster]

Well, I certainly remember one incident of it along with you being a general annoyance to sec, and you simply left after. So I'm not going to harass you on that.

Main fact is, you shot at security with lethal force, as a captain, and I'll be damned if that is considered ganking.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Guest

[callum99877]

And i have apologized and said i know im in the wrong for that. If security (not centurion) Werent incompetant, as we have seen many times, then the whole situation would have been avoided. All the people here were in the security department so this is more of a "There are more of us so everything we did is right" situation.

[Hycinth]

Pardons are only legitimate if they come from a NanoTrasen higher-up (that is, someone who ranks above the Captain). Despite his high ranking, the Captain cannot spit in the face of Corporate Regulations, and any attempts to do so are infractions.

 

From the corporate regulations page on our own wiki.(I know Jackboot acknowledged this up the thread, but I'm just placing this here in case)

[SgtSammac]

ALright, lets all step back? Breathe. And let the administration team deal with this okay?

[callum99877]

Hycinth, this was not about being "above the regulations" i released her because the three officers there (i believe one was a detective, one phobos and one the warden) could not tell me the crime, after i released her centurion came along and told me the charges. Hence why i delayed her exitting the brig.

As i said, the warden should be able to present a charge when asked, not wait five minutes for centurion to come along.

[Ryfer]

Hycinth, this was not about being "above the regulations" i released her because the three officers there (i believe one was a detective, one phobos and one the warden) could not tell me the crime, after i released her centurion came along and told me the charges. Hence why i delayed her exitting the brig.

As i said, the warden should be able to present a charge when asked, not wait five minutes for centurion to come along.

 

Speaking as a player here.

Callum. I was playing Phobos, and attempting to interact with Essel when you came along. You waited around one minute before you just opened up the cell door and let her walk out, I know this for a fact because the timer was actually just right there. And around two minutes were left. Perhaps I got overzealous for arrest for you overstepping powers, but you did overstep and you're using the excuse that nobody immediately told you charges. Whilst it's the Warden's responsibility to maintain the brig, they aren't omniscient; things can be overlooked by people sometimes. You don't just jump to conclusions and make decisions you have no authority to choose with just an assumption, and not expect repercussions over it. As I stated, you could have spoken over the channel. It would have been that easy, you have access to it. Centurion didn't even need to come, you didn't wait more than a minute, you didn't attempt to communicate beyond two people who you thought weren't aware. You simply walked in and let a prisoner go for no valid reason. You acted like you were above the regulations, whether you realize it or not; it wasn't right.

It honestly wasn't that big of a deal on it's own. It really, really wasn't, though you escalated the situation with acting out further as it went on. You were OOCly angry, saying you were going to kill all of the officers with no rp because you were angry with their response to what you did. I doubted you'd do it, but then you tried by opening fire with lethals. I know you apologized for this part and I'm not looking for another one, but it isn't the only thing you did wrong. It's another issue of keeping feelings separate and letting that influence you, as I see it.

[Chaznoodles]

BYOND Key: Hycinth

Player Byond Key: Callum99877

Staff involved: None

Reason for complaint: Ezra Scott as Captain evidently pardoned a prisoner, leading to security action to arrest him

 

>Not listening to the Captain

>M-MUH LAWFUL GOOD

Seriously man, if the Captain says something, it's probably best to do it rather than disagreeing just because. If you don't want lethals fired at you, don't mutiny against the authority.

[Frances]

So, just out of curiosity, why did Callum resort to shooting down sec rather than trying to explain in LOOC that he had to go?

In my general experience, if you have to go, most (like 95% of players) will be kind enough to accommodate you. Cryo is also (mostly) sacred - you don't fuck with it, and in turn players leave you alone when you use it. Wouldn't it have been better to try to talk to the sec players about that, than to try to provoke further conflict?

[Eliot Clef]

BYOND Key: Hycinth

Player Byond Key: Callum99877

Staff involved: None

Reason for complaint: Ezra Scott as Captain evidently pardoned a prisoner, leading to security action to arrest him

 

>Not listening to the Captain

>M-MUH LAWFUL GOOD

Seriously man, if the Captain says something, it's probably best to do it rather than disagreeing just because. If you don't want lethals fired at you, don't mutiny against the authority.

 

There is zero justification for firing lethals at security on green alert to avoid a fifteen minute brig sentence. Even if you disagree with Security comprehensively (and I think you would be wrong to do so in this situation), this is indefensible behavior.

I'd still like Nursie to weigh in directly, but as I've said in other threads, she indicated to me that she was legitimately brigged for threatening murder against the (I think) CMO, among a few other minor charges that she didn't recall. Ezra let her out a bit early because people didn't answer his questions in what he considered a timely manner.

This isn't OK. I'm willing to believe that Ezra was acting in good faith, but it doesn't mean that he was right. He was objectively, irrefutably wrong even insofar as Skull32's criteria for Captains overriding Security decisions in green alert is concerned.

[Jamini]

This isn't OK. I'm willing to believe that Ezra was acting in good faith, but it doesn't mean that he was right. He was objectively, irrefutably wrong even insofar as Skull32's criteria for Captains overriding Security decisions in green alert is concerned.

 

Howso?

 

The Captain has overriding authority with every single decision, as long as his decision falls in line with Corporate Regulation and the Station Directives (during standard operation). During non-standard operation, the decisions made by the Captain do not have to fall in line with Corporate Regulation and the Station Directives.

In either case, the actions of the Captain are reviewed afterwards. That is to say:

His orders cannot be overturned once issued.

Any review of his orders is to be conducted after their execution, unless the order is an outright and clear violation of Corporate Regulation or Station Directives on code green. On code blue or higher, orders are to be followed without question between receipt and execution.

If found guilty by an investigative party (IAA or CC), then they are punished after the fact. Not during.

 

I would argue quite the opposite really. Security were refusing, repeatedly, a valid order to give a prisoner an early release. In part because security had failed to give the reason for the brigging in the first place when asked. (Later the reasoning was given, however it did take quite a while for anyone to say what the charges were. And yes I was on the security channel.)

While firing his gun on lethal was wrong, it doesn't change the fact that security grossly overstepped in this case.

Frankly, this should be an incident report. Possibly one for both sides.

[Guest]

No, as you missed out a 5 minute conversation where an incompetant warden cant even state a crime this means nothing. It was until centurion came along i knew not what she had done. If all three security members that were there cant state a crime i will always think "Why are they in a cell"

Secondly i did not "barricade" myself in the brig, i walked in there, its not as if i barred the windows.

Thirdly, shooting was wrong, yes, but when im climbing into a cryo cell and they start arresting me (i had to go) it starts to become a bit much. I apologize for that.

 

While this actually changes things, what still went on was repeated failures of both parties to communicate and talk this out. Which led to shooting.