Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 This is a guide to provide reference to the laws of the major factions, how they relate to each other, and how they relate to Nanotrasen. This is a work in progress. edit: I might as well make this open until it's done. If you want to see anything added or defined, lemme know. I'm trying to stick to what is relevant for people in rounds. IE clearing up the "I AM REQUIRED TO A LAWYER" expectations or w/e. Republic of Biesel You are entitled to a lawyer. Capital punishment is not legal. Cyborgification is not considered capital punishment. You do have the rights of privacy; police need a warrant to search you. You do not need to be told your rights when being arrested. You do need to be informed of your charges when arrested. You are entitled to a tribunal for major crimes; with a public or personal defender. Mega-corporations are expected to follow Biesel laws when in Tau Ceti space. Biesel is a signatory of the Luna Convention of Galactic Law. On Capital Punishment And Major Crimes Capital punishment is illegal, but Biesel does not consider borging as a form of execution despite the Luna Convention of Galactic Law. Borgification is considered an alternative to life imprisonment. The Sol Alliance You are entitled to a lawyer. Capital punishment is legal. Cyborgification is considered capital punishment. You do have the rights of privacy; police need a warrant to search you. You do not need to be told your rights when being arrested. You do need to be informed of your charges when arrested. You are not entitled to a tribunal for major crimes; with a public or personal defender. This is instead handled by a Trial by Magistrate. Mega-corporations are expected to follow local laws when in Alliance space. The Alliance is a signatory of the Luna Convention of Galactic Law. On Capital Punishment And Major Crimes Capital punishment is legal, and regularly executes 714 people every year on average; all of them major felons. This is despite being a signatory of the Luna Convention of Galactic Law. Izweski Hegemony You are not given lawyer. Capital punishment is legal. Cyborgification is considered capital punishment, but is rarely done by lack of ability. Authorities do not need warrants to search or arrest you.. You do not need to be told your rights when being arrested. You do not need to be informed of your charges when arrested. You are not entitled to a tribunal for major crimes; with a public or personal defender. This is instead handled by the Lord of the land you are vassal to. Mega-corporations are expected to follow local laws when in Hegemony space. The Hegemony is not a signatory of the Luna Convention of Galactic Law. People's Republic of Adhomai You are given lawyer. Capital punishment is legal. Cyborgification is considered capital punishment, but is rarely done by lack of ability. Authorities do need warrants to search or arrest you. You do not need to be told your rights when being arrested. You do not need to be informed of your charges when arrested. You are entitled to a trial for your crimes, presided by a judge and against a jury of your peers. Mega-corporations are expected to follow local laws when in Adhomai space. The People's Republic is not a signatory of the Luna Convention of Galactic Law. On Capital Punishment And Major Crimes Capital punishment is legal, and regularly 952 citizens are executed every year on average; all of them mid-to-major felons. Firing squad is the most common form of execution, with gas chambers a close second. Adhomai police are cleared to discharge their weapon in pursuit of an individual suspected of committing a felony; the Fleeing Felon rule. They can be shot dead if they attempt to evade law enforcement. Espionage is a serious crime; should one be found guilty of espionage against the government, for megacorporations, other governments, or other factions, the sentence is immediate public execution by firing squad. Jargon Federation *warble* Luna Convention of Galactic Law Declares capital punishment a violation of sentient rights. Outlaws torture or 'revenge' attacks on captured hostiles after armed conflict. Forbids hindrance of humanitarian or medical workers. Forbids cruel or excessive punishment of criminals. Guarantees all sentients the rights to: Water, food, medical care, and protection of civilians from armed conflict. Note: Nanotrasen has NOT signed onto this convention. Our station regulations are the regulations Biesel mandates NT enforce in Biesel space. Quote Link to comment
keinto Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 So, the Biesel laws apply on-station? What happens when you want a lawyer and there are none around? Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 So, the Biesel laws apply on-station? What happens when you want a lawyer and there are none around? Currently you get Internal Affairs in lieu of a lawyer. If we ever implement lawyers, you'll get an actual lawyer. Quote Link to comment
Guest Menown Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 So, you've thrown code blue/red out of the window. Now, even in Blue, we need warrants to search people. Now, when a greyshirt comes and breaks something, or trespasses, they can for their 'two minute charge' request a lawyer and drag it out over something amazingly stupid. Tau Ceti is Alliance/RoB space, if I remember correctly. "Mega-corporations are expected to follow Biesel laws when in Tau Ceti space." This means that you are /not/ entitled, yet you are entitled to a tribunal. This fallacy lasts through the capital punishment clause. NanoTrasen hasn't signed into the LCGL, yet they're expected to follow Biesel's laws. Explain that one, when they do, but they don't, again with the addition of the whole 'Sol Alliance' thing. Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 So, you've thrown code blue/red out of the window. Now, even in Blue, we need warrants to search people. This is in relation to the factions, not the station. Nothing on those changes. This is supposed to only reinforce the notion that you need warrants on green alert. Biesel is the only place where these have any true impact, and the goal is to make them reinforce what is already here. Now, when a greyshirt comes and breaks something, or trespasses, they can for their 'two minute charge' request a lawyer and drag it out over something amazingly stupid. We don't have lawyers yet. But hypothetically when they are a custom job, they're only supposed to care if the charge is somehow invalid or based on insufficient evidence. But your hyperbole is nice; good effort. Currently Internal Affairs fills in this role just fine, and satisfies Biesel's IC desire for oversight into corporate security matters. Tau Ceti is Alliance/RoB space, if I remember correctly. Incorrect. Tau Ceti is Biesel space. Biesel is independent. The Sol Alliance has no jurisdiction over Tau Ceti. NanoTrasen hasn't signed into the LCGL, yet they're expected to follow Biesel's laws. . . Most humanitarian NGOs feel that the USA commits a human rights violation every time it conducts an execution, and they say so. Hundreds of millions of Americans agree, though the US government does not. But despite that disagreement - and it is a meaningful one - the USA still supports the work of humanitarian NGOs, and humanitarian NGOs continue - for the most part - to think that the US government has a positive role to play in the world. Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 So, the Biesel laws apply on-station? What happens when you want a lawyer and there are none around? I'm going to re-quote this to make an addition clear. There's going to be an additional clause that Biesel expects NT to follow its specific "corporate regulations". The IC regs that we have are what Biesel requires NT follows. The rest of this stuff is what happens if you are in Biesel space itself; for fluff and ending disagreement over things like capital punishment, and reinforcing the IC regs. So to clarify: Our station regulations are the regulations Biesel mandates NT enforce in Biesel space. NT regs can be different in other systems/stations. This neatly explains references to other stations, which may use different sets of laws. Quote Link to comment
Jakers457 Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Lawyers would be an off station kind of thing. The court process and such happen after they get back to Biesel no? Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Lawyers would be an off station kind of thing. The court process and such happen after they get back to Biesel no? That's no fun. But that's how it currently works unless you get the custom job title. Quote Link to comment
keinto Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Lawyers would be an off station kind of thing. The court process and such happen after they get back to Biesel no? It's no fun, and it allows Security to get away with brigging you unjustly with no resistance whatsoever, like it's happened so many times in the past. At least with a lawyer, people might have a fighting chance. Although for the sake of the flow in RP, people shouldn't get a lawyer for minor sentences. Jackboot, with the current way IAA is perceived, the suspect isn't guaranteed to get IAA to help them. Just yesterday, IAA refused to help me because they "didn't want to meddle with Security affairs." Quote Link to comment
nanotoxin Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 (edited) So in Canada, we have the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, which basically lists what our rights and freedoms as a Canadian citizen are. I'm wondering if NT or whichever system their in has some sort of thing like that. I assume that it does, because nobody would go work here if they had neither rights nor freedom. Take this for example. This would be a violation agaisnt our fundamental freedom of association. I don't know if there's a variant of these for space, or whatever, but if not, it'd be a good addition to lore. *Edit* If we're talking about realism and law, I think something like this should be written up. Edited June 18, 2015 by Guest Quote Link to comment
Jakers457 Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Internal Affairs are there for wrongful brigging, if an IA refuses to help you then that is because that particular IA is a shit and doesn't cover all of his job requirements. If you get a good IA, which is somewhat rare, then you basically have a lawyer for Internal Affairs, it goes with the name. Having an actual lawyer would be redundant, there is currently no court process and to organize one would be long winded. I would go into detail why having a lawyer title would be bad, but I don't want to go off topic with all the pruning that's going on. Quote Link to comment
Guest Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 I'd like to note, a Lawyer doesn't just do trials IRL.. They provide legal counsel, and for corporations, ensure there is nothing going on that could bring a lawsuit against the company. Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 Let's keep this thread on track and relevant to the OP itself please. This isn't the thread to debate lawyer mechanics, because in the OP itself this is for Biesel-side law, not for NT. Derailing posts purged. Quote Link to comment
Guest Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 My post was not completelly irrelevant, yet, you've purged only mine. So, I'll just repeat for sake of clarity. Lawyers are irrlevant to the entire thing. They have nothing to do with regulations. Corporate regulations are not laws, they are based on laws. A lawyer deals with laws, IAA deals with regulations. Brigging someone on station has nothing to do with a proper court. With that out of the way. Only place where NT can openly break human rights is in territories outside Sol Alliance and other faction's who signed the thing. Nanotresen is not a government, it operates under governments. Quote Link to comment
mrimatool Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 I'll do Jargon law later. Quote Link to comment
Jboy2000000 Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 So, even though the the SA and Republic are sighed under the Luna Convention. they still both execute people, despite it being a clear violation of it? And if all the alien races needed to sign it for trading right, like was said in a different thread, why is execution legal in all the other (completed) race's laws? Quote Link to comment
Central Posted September 27, 2015 Share Posted September 27, 2015 And under the Luna Convention, does not sentient AI fall under the 'all Sentients' category? Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 And under the Luna Convention, does not sentient AI fall under the 'all Sentients' category? You'd think. Quote Link to comment
Central Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 Then would Central theoretically be able to apply for citizenship under Biesel law, using the Lunar Convention of Galactic Law to support his right to request citizenship status? Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Then would Central theoretically be able to apply for citizenship under Biesel law, using the Lunar Convention of Galactic Law to support his right to request citizenship status? He can sure try, but it will fail! Quote Link to comment
Central Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Then would Central theoretically be able to apply for citizenship under Biesel law, using the Lunar Convention of Galactic Law to support his right to request citizenship status? He can sure try, but it will fail! Huh. Why would it? Biesel does not recognize Synthetics as sentient? Quote Link to comment
Alberyk Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Huh. Why would it? Biesel does not recognize Synthetics as sentient? As Jackboot said before in another topic; http://aurorastation.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=30686#p30686. Ipcs, and AIS for sure, are not legally considered sentients. Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 So, even though the the SA and Republic are sighed under the Luna Convention. they still both execute people, despite it being a clear violation of it? And if all the alien races needed to sign it for trading right, like was said in a different thread, why is execution legal in all the other (completed) race's laws? I missed this post, sorry. Signing a convention doesn't magically make you adhere to it. Nations that signed the Geneva Convention violate it all the time, including the US of A. In fact, international law is messy and complicated as heck and people argue all the time. I probably can't even list off what the USA itself has done that count as violations or war crimes without sparking a flame war. Can you still say that the US is not a force of good, with its support of NCO's like the red cross, or that they still work together? Yes, SA and Biesel violate parts of the Convention. What are you going to do about it? That'swhere the fun is. Quote Link to comment
Jboy2000000 Posted September 30, 2015 Share Posted September 30, 2015 Arguably, you can say that they get away with it because of some Victor's Justice mumbo jumbo, but capital punishment, at least in the SA and Republic, should be well documented, and possibly public statistics. I can understand that adhering and tracking every law, in every planet, in every space faring nation would be hard and/or impossible, but surely there'd be at least some reprimandations but something like this. Quote Link to comment
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted September 30, 2015 Share Posted September 30, 2015 Arguably, you can say that they get away with it because of some Victor's Justice mumbo jumbo, but capital punishment, at least in the SA and Republic, should be well documented, and possibly public statistics. I can understand that adhering and tracking every law, in every planet, in every space faring nation would be hard and/or impossible, but surely there'd be at least some reprimandations but something like this. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d0/Capital_punishment.PNG The numerous executions of the US is all well documented. I found them all with a simple google search. http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/execution-list-2014 That's 35 people. What reprimands were taken against the USA? A lot of condemnations. But I mean lol what are you going to do, invade them? Treaties and international law are well and nice but it's silly to imagine the law is enforced always. Quote Link to comment
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