Cliques & etc.

[Vanagandr]

Can someone who isn't completely socially oblivious please explain to me what all these dramas are about?

What is a clique?

What do cliques do?

What do they look like?

Why are they so world-shatteringly terrible?

What is "toxic" RP?

And... what the hell is an SSL?

Please explain as though to a man who has no background in RP and who thinks "hello" is a full and sufficient greeting.

I'm not talking about this latest drama, either, though it's the catalyst; there's been a new thread on the subject every week or so since I first started browsing the forum, and I'm no closer to understanding things now than I was then.

[Frances]

Cliques are the idea that there are groups among the server with various degrees of exclusivity - generally, when people here speak of cliques, they speak of group that would (supposedly) be problematic specifically because they exclude a part of the playerbase one way or another, usually for reasons that would be silly or unjust.

I personally think that cliques aren't really a problem, but that the constant drama and complaining against them from everyone is starting to be one.

Also, SSLs are "Suicidal Space Lesbians", a stereotype of a kind of female Medbay/Science character who usually ends up turning into a jailhouse lesbian due to their (male) player's own sexual preferences, creating ridiculously exaggerated IC drama, and dating other characters of their kind. I'll leave up to you to judge whether these characters are a reality on Aurora or not - I wouldn't really know.

[Skull132]

Cliques, groups, etcetera are something that cannot really be done away with (in my mind, feel free to point out an environment where they don't exist, and how to emulate it) on Aurora. It's just a matter of making sure the situation doesn't get too idiotic, and then letting the people manage themselves. Ultimately, my preference has been, is, and probably will remain to stay the fuck out of it, unless I see something super ridiculous. Minus the one violation of that rule yesterday, of course.

Heck, even in the ArmA unit, a closed, application based group of no more than 50 players, we had groups internally. We even had internal groups on the warpath with eachother, it was a lot of fun (mind you, a competitive mindset in that group actually helped foster improvement).

[Xelnagahunter]

For a layman's terms on cliques, you have this. Remember high school (Or still in it)? Jocks, goths, preps, nerds, cowboys, metal heads. Essentially any group you weren't a part of if you DID NOT share the values, ideals, or likes that they did. The degree of exclusivity varies from group to group and they can be relatively large, contrary to the official definition.

Cliques, on aurora, generally just chill with only one another, presenting a problem that they don't help new players learn, and generally don't add to productivity on the station. Most of the time this isn't a severe negative unless all of engineering isn't doing shit.

There is not "visual" identifier for them. Any group of people doing their thing can be considered a clique.

They aren't overtly terrible. they are a part of modern society. The worst part about them is the lack of interest in interaction until they have a history of being just like what the clique wants. If everyone on the server were to be part of a particular clique, new players would have no where to turn. (It took me forever to find someone willing to teach me things. And I still haven't been able to get a proper "mentor" for a security position because they are always too busy chucklefucking as shitcurity or dealing with others massivly chucklefucking.

Toxic RP I don't know a legit definition for. I'd assume it's bad RP or RP that plays constantly on a negative basis.

SSL was explained above by Frances.

I would also like to note that "Hello" IS a full and sufficient greeting. Don't get discouraged.

[Hackie]

To be honest, the best choice you have is to pick a relatively slow round, and find someone to, 'cling' to. Ask them for a beer, or ask to be their partner. This develops relationships with one-another, and it's a great way to make friends. A lot of people are cool dudes, so pick generally lesser known characters, if you talk to each other you can develop backstories, improve skills and encourage people to read the lore. For example, if you want a really close-knit group of rebels pick Engineering. It's not too awfully hard, and most people are willing to give a helping hand.

Now, Vanagandr's list.

What is a clique?

clique

klēk,klik/Submit

noun

a small group of people, with shared interests or other features in common, who spend time together and do not readily allow others to join them.

synonyms: coterie, set, circle, ring, in-crowd, group

What do they look like?

They don't have an appearance, but a good idea is a close group of friends in character and out of character. Departments usually form large cliques.

Why are they so world-shatteringly terrible?

Because it is a literal hamster-ball of toxicity that will form a large indestructible force of death if you step on a member's toe. Or, simply just exclude you from their ERP. Some are bad, some are dear-god-please-kill-this-with-fire.

What is "toxic" RP?

Basically, it's like clawing someone to crit because they called you a cat. Generally, it's just shitty RP, being a dick for no reason other than, 'muh edge'.

[Frances]

Because it is a literal hamster-ball of toxicity that will form a large indestructible force of death if you step on a member's toe. Or, simply just exclude you from their ERP. Some are bad, some are dear-god-please-kill-this-with-fire.

Actually...

Since the topic seems rather appropriate for it, could we take some time to either prove, or demystify this? Because even now, as much as I've heard of people disliking cliques, I've heard basically no stories of them doing something bad. So like, does anyone have any examples of that?

Strictly on server. We're making a point not to talk about the Apartment Server drama for a day or two to avoid another bloodorgy thread.

[Guest Menown]

I'll weigh in here.

I play a strict group of characters, usually different ones constantly because I have a short attention span, that exist primarily aboard the station to work. They do their jobs. Sometimes congregate with others during a rare break or two at the four hour mark (when we get that far). Otherwise, I spend most every shift alone doing my job.

I've been told it's bad that I do that. That I'm not very 'wecoming' to other people, because I refuse to stop working ICly, to go meet in the bar, or take time out of working to learn about somebody's past, or who they are. Can I ask why it's a bad thing that I refuse to RP with people, unless I feel I'm ready to?

[Hackie]

-snip-

 

Basically, I haven't been very active, so I can't give an opinion that it up with the times. Cliques are never at fault until they are openly hostile to a new player/character. It's never a clique's fault until they decide that a perfectly good roleplayer shouldn't belong in their little self-contained bubble. People should try to instigate, not turtle up and wait for someone to come. The absolute most horrible thing I've seen, is when a group of friends go to a bar, lock the counter or table up and simply ignore other characters.

But, I know that you can be open and accepting and run around absorbing people into your little hamster ball, so they're still bad in my opinion.

tl;dr players need to instigate, cliques need to accept. Everyone sucks

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

I'm on the same boat as Meowy-kun, albeit I'm a career command player so it's a bit different. The analogy is most firmly manifested in my HoP, Houssam, so I'll focus on him.

Houssam is a work-centric character. He's curt, and short, and doesn't engage in a lot of small talk. I don't think it's physically possible for Houssam to enter into a clique. I think I've noticed people attempting to; during stressful or super busy situations, characters try to chat about unrelated things, or their life stories. Houssam isn't caught into this, and asks "can this wait?" before moving on.

That, I think, underlines the major problem with what we're identifying as cliques. Excluding the isolation-based jobs such as virologist, xenobiologist, annnnnnd librarian(?) our major jobs rely on work work work. But there's this idea that socialization and work are completely separate - hence the retreating to the bar.

Houssam is a workaholic and still managed to make friends in Command and friendly acquaintances with underlings; a work relationship based on respect and both knowing that the other is reliable. Tina Kekael is a good friend of Houssam, and he's friggen married to the security guard Nur, but neither relationship takes priority over his work. Despite that, these relationships managed to form through work itself; and I get OOC'ly on edge if for some reason I have to sit down and chat with someone instead of doing the 3 other tasks I have on my agenda at the moment.

I really think we identify behaviour as cliquey when it's really not. It's just a failure to balance work with play. Doctors and security guards who are workaholics still interact with a lot of people, as many as they want/are forced to. Any command job is a job of delegation, and that means you have to talk to people and manage them.

The best way to break this behaviour is to balance work with play. Ask someone to work in botany with you, and grow potatoes while talking at the same time. Use the department radio for idle banter, reach out to people for even the smallest favour or business offer you have. Work relationships are just as valid as bar or whisper-gossip relationships.

[Japak121]

I'll weigh in here.

I play a strict group of characters, usually different ones constantly because I have a short attention span, that exist primarily aboard the station to work. They do their jobs. Sometimes congregate with others during a rare break or two at the four hour mark (when we get that far). Otherwise, I spend most every shift alone doing my job.

I've been told it's bad that I do that. That I'm not very 'wecoming' to other people, because I refuse to stop working ICly, to go meet in the bar, or take time out of working to learn about somebody's past, or who they are. Can I ask why it's a bad thing that I refuse to RP with people, unless I feel I'm ready to?

 

No.

Nothing wrong with that at all. This is a game and if that's how you want to play it and how you get your enjoyment from it, then have at it. People who say that's wrong don't seem to quite grasp how the real world is anyway. Plenty of people go to work and avoid there coworkers, focusing entirely on the job at hand. As long as you aren't breaking any rules and having fun, keep up the good work.

[Jakers457]

I've yet to encounter roleplaying crushing cliques if I'm honest. I play a good hand full of characters, none of them really have a group they 'cliquedy clique' with and at the same time, I can usually find myself chatting to people without little hindrance and that's without them knowing who the player is behind my character.

I remember saying as my IA character to another, who was apparently new to the station, something along the lines of 'people will take awhile to warm up to a stranger. So don't take it to heart, you can't make people like you and you should trust me on that, I work in Internal Affairs.' Which is something I'm now inclined to tell all new 'employees', it takes time for people to warm up to you and it's like the in the real world. No matter how much we can argue about pretend characters in a pretend setting, the social tendencies of people will always be real and that includes people not being super warm to strangers. You can't change that, you just have to work with it, even irl workplaces have cliques and it's near impossible not to have them.