delta

[the_furry]

BYOND Key: xXTheFurryXx

Player Byond Key: oneonethreeeight

Staff involved: (This is if the complaint was ahelped and if it was handled by a staff member)

Reason for complaint: metagrudgeing, don't be a dick rule

Approximate Date/Time: 08/28/2015 6:40~ central

Delta waits until the director is cryo before asking me if I had permission to get my powers. So if you guys don’t know every round I have to track down a director or another head and have them sign an executive permission so I can step foot outside of genetics. I do this because if I don’t security wont hesitate to perm brig me for going to get a coffee while I have genetic powers (everyone else is allowed to but only I need to have that kind of permission, how many scientists walk outside with bags of holdings?). Now on this round I had verbal permission by kate to disregard the directive(which is standard for almost everyone else). I left it with permission because she even informed security and was insistent that it would be ok. Also had verbal permission by her to test on the warden and give the warden powers. So most of the round goes fine lots of fun and what not and I see vira a few times. Approximately 4 mins before the shuttle gets here kate went to cryo. Vira only now decides to ask safi if she had written permission to be outside of the lab. Of course safi didn’t because she had verbal permission (which is all anyone else ever needs) from an active rd who literally stayed active the entire round until 4 mins before the shuttle. I saw vira plenty of times and she could have inquired then, but no it’s only now once the rd is gone and I have no way to defend myself. This was just a dick move, vira could have easily asked, way before the end of the round, kate to verify but no only after kate goes to cryo do I have to deal with this. The only reason she apparently asked now, is because I was moving a locker, not attacking anyone with it not doing anything other than moving it so I can sit in it on the shuttle.

So I’m lucky I didn’t get arrested and I think the only reason I didn’t is because it was less than three mins of the round and the damn warden also had powers. So we all got on the shuttle and the warden started playing around with a locker. At this point delta warned me oocly that I need to stop fucking around with genetics (first I’ve gotten permission by the director every step of the way, second it wasn’t even me). I then explain it wasn’t me doing it and delta tells me I just need to stop with it and shouldn’t be giving powers to random people (again permission from director, and moving a locker hardly constitutes as fucking around). Sadly by this time the server restarted and crashed, which is why I don’t have logs.

So it’s absolutely ridiculous that I have to do such extensive work to be allowed to walk out of the damn department with even one power when literally security ignores anyone else who has department items out of the department. That is a major criticism I have against security but delta is one of the primary perpetrators. On top of that the waiting till he knew I couldn’t verify the information with the current directive pushes this from poor security to just being a general dick and violates the don’t be a dick rule. Dealing with delta is not an unknown for me, I’ve had issues with him in the past where he is unfairly harsh against me bordering metagrudgeing. Add in the comments oocly that was way off base (considering moving a locker is hardly a problem and it wasn’t even me). like even if it was me, why is moving an item considered so detrimental to all of everyone’s enjoyment? I get it if I was moving the damn nuke or a stun baton, but I’ve been (oocly) told not to fuck around for moving a paper cup. This is a general opinion a lot of people have but delta is one of the worse and his position as hos lets him kick anyone out of the game for moving a cup.

*edit late add*

Im gona add this in there. It rubbed me the wrong way but I was hoping it would be just a one off but I’m suspecting metagrudging all over again. so a few rounds ago it was rp rev and several people had died. As a decent geneticist I was cloning as many as I could. Something that happens a lot is security will drop a dead body in with equipment and all. Safi will often take the security items off the body and keep them on her person till she can turn them over to security. Now it was a busy round so I didn’t exactly get a chance to drop by security often and I acuminated a hefty supply including a carbine. Another of which is a security head set that I pulled off a detective who was having a hallucination fit. When I am confronted I turn them over to vira explaining that I haven’t had time to turn them in. now somehow the detective remembers me taking the headset off (even though he was hallucinating so there is no reason to believe him) and demands my arrest. Vira sides with the hallucinating maniac that shot up medical. After I saved a good 5 people and have turned over all items vira charges me with looting and disrespecting the dead. Now my reasoning is “should I just leave the fucking carbine around so someone else who has access to the morgue can get it”? also that the detective was hallucinating a lot, and I’ve been completely cooperative. But does any of that matter? Nope I spend the shuttle in cuffs.

[Garnascus]

Right, hi everyone I'm a trial mod who was ghosting and observing this situation up until the shuttle docked at centcomm as I had to get ready for work IRL. For transparencies sake let me verify some fractals here.

Safiya and the warden did indeed have genetic powers.

Safiya and the warden where indeed moving lockers.

The HoS did indeed ask for written approval of the powers.

The general consensus in msay is that genetic testing is entirely an IC issue so long as we don't get rampaging hulks or self antags. What is described here is a situation that happens so often I could retire. Regardless of what the directive states the general consensus I see is that verbal permission is indeed enough to leave the lab and honestly it shouldn't be an issue in the first place.

I have a lot of experience playing CMO and with Safiya, out of all the geneticists running around with powers she is honestly the last one you should be going after. In fact I find the whole notion of going after geneticists with powers in the first place completely absurd. Alright so you find a guy with a few powers outside and without permission and brig him for a bit. What have you accomplished exactly? Now of course if they begin distributing it wily nilly or causing a ruckus then its a problem (and perhaps something to ahelp).

Granted I didn't see the OOC remarks but I don't really see how they where called for.

[Guest]

Delta waits until the director is cryo before asking me if I had permission to get my powers. So if you guys don’t know every round I have to track down a director or another head and have them sign an executive permission so I can step foot outside of genetics. I do this because if I don’t security wont hesitate to perm brig me for going to get a coffee while I have genetic powers (everyone else is allowed to but only I need to have that kind of permission, how many scientists walk outside with bags of holdings?). Now on this round I had verbal permission by kate to disregard the directive(which is standard for almost everyone else). I left it with permission because she even informed security and was insistent that it would be ok. Also had verbal permission by her to test on the warden and give the warden powers. So most of the round goes fine lots of fun and what not and I see vira a few times. Approximately 4 mins before the shuttle gets here kate went to cryo. Vira only now decides to ask safi if she had written permission to be outside of the lab. Of course safi didn’t because she had verbal permission (which is all anyone else ever needs) from an active rd who literally stayed active the entire round until 4 mins before the shuttle. I saw vira plenty of times and she could have inquired then, but no it’s only now once the rd is gone and I have no way to defend myself. This was just a dick move, vira could have easily asked, way before the end of the round, kate to verify but no only after kate goes to cryo do I have to deal with this. The only reason she apparently asked now, is because I was moving a locker, not attacking anyone with it not doing anything other than moving it so I can sit in it on the shuttle.

No, I didn't. I never knew the director was ever in cryo, I assumed they were awake. The problem is, every single time you get permission to walk out of your department with genetic powers, you start flinging closets across the hallway with a telekinetic grab in your hand. This is why I immediately beelined to speak to you because my character and your character have had plenty of altercations with each other in IC regarding responsibility in science, specifically with genetic powers. Almost every single round, by the time there's a crewtransfer I see your head glowing with TK. Verbal permission becomes squat when the person (who I had not even known had disappeared) suddenly disappears. Kate NEVER announced they were going to cryo.

The reason why I asked is because the entire shift, all I got were reports and complaints about the geneticist abusing their TK, and I did nothing up until the very last time over at escape for fear of being taken for 'metagaming' because you're goofing off with genetic powers and annoying the crap out of people. Geneticists on other servers who do this get LYNCHED, and they don't have rules against metagaming what genetic powers people have. And yes, that's right, they don't get put back into the round afterward because they were being dumbnuggets.

I tried really awfully hard to ignore it, but you do this almost every single round, and I've let you get away with it as a HoS, and I've let you get away with it as an RD, and I've even had your back as either. My decision wasn't based on one select incident, it was several incidents throughout the shift that were communicated to me as annoying and disruptive to the rest of the crew. I chose to talk to you and ask if you had documentation of you being allowed to mess with genetic powers. Given how generous Reyjakai is with their own scientists, I had assumed you had permission to mess around with said powers, until you told me you didn't.

 

So I’m lucky I didn’t get arrested and I think the only reason I didn’t is because it was less than three mins of the round and the damn warden also had powers. So we all got on the shuttle and the warden started playing around with a locker. At this point delta warned me oocly that I need to stop fucking around with genetics (first I’ve gotten permission by the director every step of the way, second it wasn’t even me). I then explain it wasn’t me doing it and delta tells me I just need to stop with it and shouldn’t be giving powers to random people (again permission from director, and moving a locker hardly constitutes as fucking around). Sadly by this time the server restarted and crashed, which is why I don’t have logs.

 

Not to mention I was fearful to make an arrest because I've seen others and myself get accused for arresting a geneticist who is messing around with their genetic powers, for metagaming. I told you rather nicely in OOC to please cut it out because it was getting really really annoying how you were practically immune from any action for the past few rounds you've messed with genetic powers. I gave you advice, that's your perogative whether or not you want to follow it. I did in fact see you with a telekinetic grab moving the closet around, Nia was not flinging it around escape into people. That was you. Please do not lie in a player complaint.

 

So it’s absolutely ridiculous that I have to do such extensive work to be allowed to walk out of the damn department with even one power when literally security ignores anyone else who has department items out of the department. That is a major criticism I have against security but delta is one of the primary perpetrators. On top of that the waiting till he knew I couldn’t verify the information with the current directive pushes this from poor security to just being a general dick and violates the don’t be a dick rule. Dealing with delta is not an unknown for me, I’ve had issues with him in the past where he is unfairly harsh against me bordering metagrudgeing. Add in the comments oocly that was way off base (considering moving a locker is hardly a problem and it wasn’t even me). like even if it was me, why is moving an item considered so detrimental to all of everyone’s enjoyment? I get it if I was moving the damn nuke or a stun baton, but I’ve been (oocly) told not to fuck around for moving a paper cup. This is a general opinion a lot of people have but delta is one of the worse and his position as hos lets him kick anyone out of the game for moving a cup.

 

What? Please, don't give me that excuse that it's hard. You yourself taught me in-game how to get TK in less than 15 minutes, just a few months ago, I was there as my Research Director. As a powergamer myself, I already know what you do and how you manage to do it. You cannot within good faith say that getting any genetic power is difficult whatsoever. You happen to be the telescience brainiac here, aren't you? You have history of monkey bombing in the middle of departments.

Is it metagrudging? Not really, you AND your characters are notorious for creating situations of conflict when they are not necessary. Every single time Isra is in-game, I get nothing but complaints about her except when she is actively cloning people. I feel like it's a stretch to say that so many people are metagrudging against you (though it's certainly possible), but when you accrue a negative reputation with a character, you can expect nothing but negative consequences as a result. See: Travis Davis.

 

*edit late add*

Im gona add this in there. It rubbed me the wrong way but I was hoping it would be just a one off but I’m suspecting metagrudging all over again. so a few rounds ago it was rp rev and several people had died. As a decent geneticist I was cloning as many as I could. Something that happens a lot is security will drop a dead body in with equipment and all. Safi will often take the security items off the body and keep them on her person till she can turn them over to security. Now it was a busy round so I didn’t exactly get a chance to drop by security often and I acuminated a hefty supply including a carbine. Another of which is a security head set that I pulled off a detective who was having a hallucination fit. When I am confronted I turn them over to vira explaining that I haven’t had time to turn them in. now somehow the detective remembers me taking the headset off (even though he was hallucinating so there is no reason to believe him) and demands my arrest. Vira sides with the hallucinating maniac that shot up medical. After I saved a good 5 people and have turned over all items vira charges me with looting and disrespecting the dead. Now my reasoning is “should I just leave the fucking carbine around so someone else who has access to the morgue can get it”? also that the detective was hallucinating a lot, and I’ve been completely cooperative. But does any of that matter? Nope I spend the shuttle in cuffs.

 

You were stealing and looting a bunch of security items off of the dead. You had a security headset tuned into security to listen in on what's going on. This is a violation of procedure and it defeats the point of having a secure network. This really torqued me off IC that you were commiting one of the many sins of the medbay, and that's stealing and hoarding equipment off of the dead who are about to be cloned anyway. People get really pissy when their ID, toolbelt, flash, or anything above that gets stolen by M.D. Ash Hol. You were acting like 'that guy', and it was pissing me and the rest of the people in security off that you were doing that. I didn't arrest you because I opted to go the route that pisses the least people off and creates the least amount of player complaints.

Overall, I want to say this. What the hell, man? What did you even expect from doing all of that self-antagonizing, thievery, and goofing off? Do you really think this is worth a complaint, as well, if you think anybody should be able to get away with the same things you're doing/do on a daily basis?

[Guest]

Sorry for the double post, but this is an additional response to the guy who posted above me.

 

Right, hi everyone I'm a trial mod who was ghosting and observing this situation up until the shuttle docked at centcomm as I had to get ready for work IRL. For transparencies sake let me verify some fractals here.

 

Hi.

 

Safiya and the warden did indeed have genetic powers.

Safiya and the warden where indeed moving lockers.

The HoS did indeed ask for written approval of the powers.

 

Yes, yes, and yes.

 

The general consensus in msay is that genetic testing is entirely an IC issue so long as we don't get rampaging hulks or self antags. What is described here is a situation that happens so often I could retire. Regardless of what the directive states the general consensus I see is that verbal permission is indeed enough to leave the lab and honestly it shouldn't be an issue in the first place.

 

I suppose flinging lockers at other people and trapping them inside isn't really self-antagonizing. 'Regardless of what the directive states--' No, this is where we backtrack, because this is part of the IC law here that was being broken. Station directives dictate that geneticists ask for permission from any head of staff if they want to goof off and have a bit more fun with their role.

Okay, so that's done. What happens after that? I have powers now, but now security is concerned why I have hulk. What happens if the person I asked for permission about goes to cryo, and their word effectively means nothing if they didn't tell anybody? At this point, as a self-tester, I'm really boned.

This is why paperwork exists. Is it fucking annoying? Oh, absolutely, but guess what it does.

It makes security fuck off because now you have valid proof and evidence that you went to the effort to get a sign-off on it, and now nobody will ever bug you. If they do, you can flash the form in their face and laugh at them as their tail curls up beneath their hind legs and they whine pathetically.

It creates an image of accountability and transparency.

This is why I love paperwork. It either will humble me, or it will humble someone else. In addition, nobody will get in trouble for goofing off, because they have a form that says, 'I'm allowed to goof off, as long as I say it's for science.' Anyone who is reading this, do we have an understanding here?

Okay, next point.

 

I have a lot of experience playing CMO and with Safiya, out of all the geneticists running around with powers she is honestly the last one you should be going after. In fact I find the whole notion of going after geneticists with powers in the first place completely absurd. Alright so you find a guy with a few powers outside and without permission and brig him for a bit. What have you accomplished exactly? Now of course if they begin distributing it wily nilly or causing a ruckus then its a problem (and perhaps something to ahelp).

 

People don't cause trouble if they're under the command of someone they respect and know they can be fired inmediatamente for sticking a furry toe out of line.

In addition, Safiya Isra, nor any other person, is ever the 'first person' I 'go after.' I am not biased. I treat each and every geneticist the same for screwing around with genetic powers. Many of the other security players such as Alberyk and Keinto (sort of, he was present for that RP rev round the other day), can corroborate to the story of self-antagonizing. I deal with everyone the same. If you feel like criminal scum just based on character interaction, maybe you should really take a break from this video game.

Also, regarding the whole ahelping thing. No, I knew this was an IC issue and I was deadset to deal with it in IC.

 

Granted I didn't see the OOC remarks but I don't really see how they where called for.

 

Ask the admins to fetch logs. This was not too long ago, and I asked rather nicely (or, rather, suggested) for Furry to cut it out with the ridiculous procedure breaking and genetic quarantine violations. I made no disparaging nor derogatory remarks.

Edited August 29, 2015 by Guest

[Garnascus]

Those are all good points delta. Its starting to look to me like maybe delta wasnt t being unreasonable here considering he also didn't actually arrest you. I wasnt watching the rest of the round but if its true Safiya was goofing off with TK even just having fun then perhaps it may have gone a bit over the line?

Was Safiya spoken too during the round before this incident at departure?

[Guest]

I was honestly questioning myself whether I should have arrested them when this complaint was written up. I didn't want to be biased at all, but I didn't want to be literally space hitler either. So I picked a medium and just said, "Okay, here's the deal. If you continue with this I'm going to take action to stop you from doing this, you're beginning to wear everyone's patience based on how it seems like you're betraying everyone's trust here for a giggle. Please stop."

It probably wasn't right, maybe I should've picked one of the two extremes.

I made a warning of that in OOC as future action I might take in IC if this keeps on going.

Furry, please note that I do not hate you. I do not play to powertrip, I play to have fun. I am not having fun when everyone is complaining to me about every single issue on the station, and I figure they don't have fun complaining to me either.

I make it a point to be fair in IC, if not OOC. I, for one, would indeed like to play a game, and it would suck if all of a sudden I were not to be able to play the game with everyone else.

[Garnascus]

That seems reasonable to me honestly, from what you posted here I don't think taking a medium was wrong. I think we can all agree there's a line to be drawn here about how far you can go with genetic powers even with permission. I also think fury's defensiveness is understandable. Security breaking down genetics to arrest testers is a thing that happens so maybe she's already conditioned to be a bit jaded in dealing with security.

I don't know if Safiya DID cross the line but I would like to hear her side from earlier in the round.

[Reyjakai]

As the Research Director in question here, I did announce that I was going to sleep (cryo) a minute or two before I did, and I gave verbal permission for Safiya to be outside of science with modifications. I also PDA'd the Warden about it, asking them to notify all of security to let them know that my permission was given. I normally sign/stamp the paperwork, but /SOMEONE/ told me that verbal permission was acceptable. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't.

Also the issue of throwing lockers at people /ever/ should probably be brought up with respect to genetics. The approval generally goes as far as having the powers active outside of the science department, with minor testing, not that you can use these to irritate crew members.

Edit: I also gave permission for Nia to have powers for testing, as long as they signed a personal liability waiver.

Another note: I wouldn't keep giving out permission to leave genetics with powers allowed to a player that's been a consistent problem. This hasn't been my experience, and most of the time where they're blamed, it's another person with powers. In this case, that was Nia.

[the_furry]

I agree with everything garnascus is saying. It’s gotten to the point the other heads are actually annoyed that I persistently ask them to sign a damn piece of paper. But the moment I don’t I know I will be arrested. That is a statement about security itself.

Now delta there’s a lot I have to say to you. I can believe that you did not know kate had gone to cryo, but demanding written proof under threat of arrest is not excusable for the reasons garnascus(and I) stated. You seem to believe that I play around with genetics all the time. Let me correct you. More often than not the complaints being piled against genetics is not the cause of me but someone else who has powers. I’ve seen this happen several times now where I’ll give powers to someone else (with written permission by the RD) and that person will go around chuckle fucking with people. Then when the complaints come in people tell safi to stop messing around. You think I mess around with genetics all the time? NO, I can tell you for fear of constantly being arrested the only time I mess with anything is to bring lockers onto the shuttle. Now if someone else is causing these complaints that is not my responsibility. Hell arrest them for being outa the lab without permission. But safi has permission, she got approval by the RD, and the RD approved of the test subject. It is not safis job to screen test subjects that’s why the RD has to sign as well. That is exactly what the complaints where about this round (Nia, who was approved of by the RD was fucking with people). This has happened plenty of other times in rounds you've been on. I’ve seen rounds where I’ll be so busy cloning people I’d be in the lab all day then I’m suddenly told to stop messing with genetics or I’ll be arrested.

So let me correct you on this “I tried really awfully hard to ignore it, but you do this almost every single round, and I've let you get away with it as a HoS” no, you haven’t you’ve been placing blame on me for something that is not my responsibility. So let’s break this down even more, the last time I actually fucked around with telekinesis was when I moved the shot gun from the bartenders backroom into disposals. That happened a good month ago. If you’ve gotten valid complaints since then it was not me (I believe this is a major part of the issues, I’ve been siting in my lab and will hear my name yelled by security for what someone else has done a number of times now). Now I use the word ‘valid’ for a reason. I say valid because moving a cup to splash someone with water is not a ‘valid’ reason to permabrig(or lynch) someone. Moving a damn locker unless I do it excessively is also not a valid reason. But yes I do move lockers around, toys around, cups around, have I ruined someone’s game by doing that? Now let me define excessively (because I understand repeatedly hitting people with lockers or cups can be annoying. Generally the moment I’m told to stop, I stop. That seems reasonable. However I hardly call moving lockers and putting someone in one for a brief moment as something as serious as self antaging and surly not arrest worthy, I can understand a warning.

So I don’t just loot and steal off of dead or cloned people. One why is security bringing in people with guns strapped to their back and leaving them in medical? Aside from that, once I finish the cloning process I generally give all the items back to the person that was cloned. The most I’ve done in that case was ‘pretend’ to forget that I had the headset just to provide a small chuckle to the officer (I’ve never kepted ids or other important items of that nature). As for looting the dead uncloneable, yes I take their items with the intent of turning over to security when I get the chance (as any geneticist should be doing). Which is exactly what happened when you came in, I turned over the items. From what I saw the detective would not let up about having me arrested for some random ass reason (considering I didn’t grab any more security items), and finally you gave in. I do appreciate you withholding the arrest the first time, but it should not have even been considered.

I really want you to give me specifics on what I have done to cause so much problems, Particularly in the last month on being on this server. You bring up what I did as travis davis, and I agree. The monkey bomb was too far, and I’m sorry for the problems it caused. I’ve been spoken to by the admins about it and corrected the issue. That was more than 6 months ago. I’ve learned to be a better player. This is why I’m asking for you to actually analyze the past month of safi game play. Be specific as possible, what has safi actually done that you constitute as “doing all of that self-antagonizing, thievery, and goofing off”. I feel like you are holding onto things that was long ago or that is not my responsibility (you brining up Travis and what nai did, points that out). If you look at what safi and I actually do, I dare say we are the best geneticist on this server. I don’t mean best at the job, I mean best at producing fun and exciting role play for the rest of the crew. You say that I have built up a reputation for self-antagonizing. If I’m self antaging tell an admin. Because as of right now I’ve only been spoken to once (months ago) about self-antaging. If this is still a thing, then I am not aware of it; which is why I am biding you to give me specifics so I know exactly what it is I did that constitutes self antaging. I also give you that challenge because I believe once you actually analyze my actions you will find that I am not doing anything wrong.

You holding on to things more than six months ago or that are not my fault has put me in a constant fear of being arrested and prompted this complaint.

I want to ask you about is this. “This is why I love paperwork. It either will humble me, or it will humble someone else. In addition, nobody will get in trouble for goofing off, because they have a form that says, 'I'm allowed to goof off, as long as I say it's for science.' Anyone who is reading this, do we have an understanding here?” Why aren’t you arresting anyone else other than me? I see scientists with bags of holding, I see riplys at the bar, I see engineers with fire axes, do any of them have written permission? I doubt it. It seems to me you like using paperwork as an excuse to arrest people in jobs you don’t like.

More replies are coming in as I write this. So, all this being said I have had a couple of pleasant rounds with you recently and I hope to have more rounds of that nature. However I take a strong stance in that I don’t think I did anything arrest worthy. The decision you made to stick to the middle ground was perfect. I expect to be told to stop, which is why once I’m told to stop, I stop. I am more upset by the ooc comments of giving me warnings for things that were not my responsibility and pinning blame on me for genetic fuckery that was not my cause. I don’t think moving a locker once or twice on someone is arrest worthy or self-antaging. Sure definitely tell me to stop and when I’m told to stop I do just that. If you take this middle ground option more often, you will see that I will work with you. But I cannot control other people’s actions and should not be blamed for all the fuckery you seem to attribute to me. I can also tell you, I am not travis from 6 months ago, let go of the antaging events I did back then so you can see what I am doing now is not wrong.

*edit*

So in summary, your blaming me for things that have not been my fault and your holding on to antaging events that took place months ago has put me in a very uncomfortable position. I’m constantly arrested and unable to reason with you in game because you’ve attributed these things to me. Like I said, that middle ground is great, and if that is why you didn’t arrest me then I’ll go for it. But as it stands, I cannot believe you wouldn’t have arrested me if the round wasn’t already ending. It’s gotten to the point that I expect to be arrested for things that are not my fault because you refuse to listen to me for a moment. If you want to maintain that even if I didn’t have paper work you would have simply told me to stop, or at the most told me to return to genetics/remove my mods, I will go on faith that you’d actually do that. But I can guarantee you that I will be submitting an immediate complaint if anything else happens. (note I am not revoking this complaint, I want deltas response before I do that)

[Garnascus]

Is it possible that this largely may have developed from a misunderstanding? Even though reyjakai said he announced it and had PDA messages between nia and him delta did say he was unaware. Its entirely possible he missed the announcement and frankly if he saw two people with powers in escape, one was one of staff and the other the geneticist I can understand at least investigating it.

[the_furry]

Yes it’s entirely possible and infact likely that this was a misunderstanding. My issue is how quickly delta takes the side of the other person based on “safi is known to cause issues” when in fact all of this since the beginning has been misunderstand and misinformation. rey even points out he’s seen this happen. If this ‘misunderstanding’ was a first time issue I would be fine with it, but it’s gotten to the point that I can’t be trusted and it shows in the amount of times I get arrested/warned, because of misinformation and detla having an expectation that I am doing something wrong (which is also based on other accounts of misinformation). This is why I'm asking delta to give me an actual hard example of what i've done wrong. because I'm constantly arrested or threatened to be arrested and treated like crap when I've hardly caused an issue.

[Guest]

Right before we get into a fight about it all (If that hasn't happened already) I am going to read through that rounds log. I will see everything that was said, everything that was emoted, when it happened, and who said what.

Then I will come back with my information and probably a few questions for those involved.

[keinto]

Going to clarify a thing from furry's first post.

 

Im gona add this in there. It rubbed me the wrong way but I was hoping it would be just a one off but I’m suspecting metagrudging all over again. so a few rounds ago it was rp rev and several people had died. As a decent geneticist I was cloning as many as I could. Something that happens a lot is security will drop a dead body in with equipment and all. Safi will often take the security items off the body and keep them on her person till she can turn them over to security. Now it was a busy round so I didn’t exactly get a chance to drop by security often and I acuminated a hefty supply including a carbine. Another of which is a security head set that I pulled off a detective who was having a hallucination fit. When I am confronted I turn them over to vira explaining that I haven’t had time to turn them in. now somehow the detective remembers me taking the headset off (even though he was hallucinating so there is no reason to believe him) and demands my arrest. Vira sides with the hallucinating maniac that shot up medical. After I saved a good 5 people and have turned over all items vira charges me with looting and disrespecting the dead. Now my reasoning is “should I just leave the fucking carbine around so someone else who has access to the morgue can get it”? also that the detective was hallucinating a lot, and I’ve been completely cooperative. But does any of that matter? Nope I spend the shuttle in cuffs.

 

I was the detective that round. You didn't take the headset from me. I saw you taking the headset of an officer who had was recovering from a hallucination episode and was on the ground, or SSD. My character had stopped hallucinating when he saw you do this. He wasn't in the middle of shooting the Medbay like he was a few minutes ago. You claim the officer was dead and you were just saving their equipment to return to sec, and on the off-chance that you really believed they were dead, not only did you take their headset, but you replaced it with an engineering one. To me and my character, that just seemed like you were fucking around. And that was before you were seen taking another security headset from someone else.

To avoid this in the future, don't wear other department's headsets if you're going to return them.

[the_furry]

Going to clarify a thing from furry's first post.

 

Im gona add this in there. It rubbed me the wrong way but I was hoping it would be just a one off but I’m suspecting metagrudging all over again. so a few rounds ago it was rp rev and several people had died. As a decent geneticist I was cloning as many as I could. Something that happens a lot is security will drop a dead body in with equipment and all. Safi will often take the security items off the body and keep them on her person till she can turn them over to security. Now it was a busy round so I didn’t exactly get a chance to drop by security often and I acuminated a hefty supply including a carbine. Another of which is a security head set that I pulled off a detective who was having a hallucination fit. When I am confronted I turn them over to vira explaining that I haven’t had time to turn them in. now somehow the detective remembers me taking the headset off (even though he was hallucinating so there is no reason to believe him) and demands my arrest. Vira sides with the hallucinating maniac that shot up medical. After I saved a good 5 people and have turned over all items vira charges me with looting and disrespecting the dead. Now my reasoning is “should I just leave the fucking carbine around so someone else who has access to the morgue can get it”? also that the detective was hallucinating a lot, and I’ve been completely cooperative. But does any of that matter? Nope I spend the shuttle in cuffs.

 

I was the detective that round. You didn't take the headset from me. I saw you taking the headset of an officer who had was recovering from a hallucination episode and was on the ground, or SSD. My character had stopped hallucinating when he saw you do this. He wasn't in the middle of shooting the Medbay like he was a few minutes ago. You claim the officer was dead and you were just saving their equipment to return to sec, and on the off-chance that you really believed they were dead, not only did you take their headset, but you replaced it with an engineering one. To me and my character, that just seemed like you were fucking around. And that was before you were seen taking another security headset from someone else.

To avoid this in the future, don't wear other department's headsets if you're going to return them.

Let me take two seconds and justify what i did. You and the officer where throwing a hallucination fit. Safi came in and hit you both with a tranquilizer to hush you up. At which point i saw the radio chatter start and the last thing i needed was a crazed officer screaming safi shot them over coms. So yes for that reason i took the headset. About the only fuckery i did was toss an engineering headset at them(hardly arrest worthy) as i had no space for things at that point. This is completely reasonable to do and i turned over the headset next chance i had.

This is a perfect example as to why i am submitting this complaint. Rqther then going with what i am saying, delta (and you apparently) likes to assune i am doing the worce thing ever and will look for an excuse to arrest me. I am tired of being arrested and threatened over stupidity when I've not done anything wrong. Especially when its comeing from unfair bias because you guys just know "im always up to fuckery". When infact i am not and you guys are just metagrudgeing against me for things i didn't even do.

*edit*

One thing I want to say is that i don't think this metagrudgeing is done maliciously. Its based off of unfair bias that needs to be recognized. I have to submit this complaint because no matter what i say icly it's ignored and i end up in cuffs. This issue is easily resolved, take a moment to recognize im not doing anything wrong. Take a moment to recognize i dont fuck around all the time (the way delta suggests). Then maybe delta will listen to reason and be fair with me rather than assuming im doing the worce things ever and deserve an arrest.

[Guest]

Let me take two seconds and justify what i did. You and the officer where throwing a hallucination fit. Safi came in and hit you both with a tranquilizer to hush you up. At which point i saw the radio chatter start and the last thing i needed was a crazed officer screaming safi shot them over coms. So yes for that reason i took the headset. About the only fuckery i did was toss an engineering headset at them(hardly arrest worthy) as i had no space for things at that point. This is completely reasonable to do and i turned over the headset next chance i had.

This is a perfect example as to why i am submitting this complaint. Rqther then going with what i am saying, delta (and you apparently) likes to assune i am doing the worce thing ever and will look for an excuse to arrest me. I am tired of being arrested and threatened over stupidity when I've not done anything wrong. Especially when its comeing from unfair bias because you guys just know "im always up to fuckery". When infact i am not and you guys are just metagrudgeing against me for things i didn't even do.

*edit*

One thing I want to say is that i don't think this metagrudgeing is done maliciously. Its based off of unfair bias that needs to be recognized. I have to submit this complaint because no matter what i say icly it's ignored and i end up in cuffs. This issue is easily resolved, take a moment to recognize im not doing anything wrong. Take a moment to recognize i dont fuck around all the time (the way delta suggests). Then maybe delta will listen to reason and be fair with me rather than assuming im doing the worce things ever and deserve an arrest.

 

So you decided the best decision was to hoard several security items and not even bother to remind anyone that you were going to give them back?

Why on earth would a geneticist have trouble with inventory space?

[the_furry]

Let me take two seconds and justify what i did. You and the officer where throwing a hallucination fit. Safi came in and hit you both with a tranquilizer to hush you up. At which point i saw the radio chatter start and the last thing i needed was a crazed officer screaming safi shot them over coms. So yes for that reason i took the headset. About the only fuckery i did was toss an engineering headset at them(hardly arrest worthy) as i had no space for things at that point. This is completely reasonable to do and i turned over the headset next chance i had.

This is a perfect example as to why i am submitting this complaint. Rqther then going with what i am saying, delta (and you apparently) likes to assune i am doing the worce thing ever and will look for an excuse to arrest me. I am tired of being arrested and threatened over stupidity when I've not done anything wrong. Especially when its comeing from unfair bias because you guys just know "im always up to fuckery". When infact i am not and you guys are just metagrudgeing against me for things i didn't even do.

*edit*

One thing I want to say is that i don't think this metagrudgeing is done maliciously. Its based off of unfair bias that needs to be recognized. I have to submit this complaint because no matter what i say icly it's ignored and i end up in cuffs. This issue is easily resolved, take a moment to recognize im not doing anything wrong. Take a moment to recognize i dont fuck around all the time (the way delta suggests). Then maybe delta will listen to reason and be fair with me rather than assuming im doing the worce things ever and deserve an arrest.

 

So you decided the best decision was to hoard several security items and not even bother to remind anyone that you were going to give them back?

Why on earth would a geneticist have trouble with inventory space?

You can’t fathom why a genetics might have a full inventory, or why I was so busy that I didn’t have time to report security items to security? Let me take two more seconds and answer that question for you, half of medical was dead/arrested for the rev rp. I think I was literally the only one treating people in medical towards the end of it. I was loaded up on medical supplies for toxins infections and brute damage. /and/ since I was the only one in medical I was too busy to turn over equipment the moment I found it. hell I sent you a few messages and you ignored them because you were to busy dealing with the revolution. there, easily answered, will you believe it i doubt it; because you just 'know' i always am fucking around.

Let me ask this, why the hell do I have to defend every single action I do to the letter with you. Why does bullshit like this always end up in an arrest when theres completely reasonable explanations, half of which I shouldn’t even have to provide. You just can’t fathom that I’m not up to bullshit, and because of that you will arrest me on anyone else’s word or if you just don’t have time to hear me out(which is almost every time). even during this conversation you can’t take a moment to understand that I was acting properly and your looking for reasons why I was fucking around because that’s all you believe I do. I gave you a challenge for a reason, name a time that I actually fucked around. Because if you can’t this assumption that I always do is just bullshit and it’s caused so many unfair arrests and threats that I am tired of dealing with it.

[Guest]

I will concede, I'm sorry that you feel that way.

However, please note every time I have confronted you or 'harassed' you in some way according to your interpretation, it was because someone spoke to me about it first and complained about it.

I have an obligation as a head of staff and a whitelisted player to investigate conflicts of interest and resolve it in IC.

[the_furry]

I will concede, I'm sorry that you feel that way.

However, please note every time I have confronted you or 'harassed' you in some way according to your interpretation, it was because someone spoke to me about it first and complained about it.

I have an obligation as a head of staff and a whitelisted player to investigate conflicts of interest and resolve it in IC.

Wow, I appreciate the apology. I really hope my words are getting through. I understand whenever there’s a complaint you need to investigate the conflict, and if I am ever actually fucking around I fully expect an arrest. But more often than not I am not doing anything and it’s someone else with powers or some other reason I’m acting the way I am. If you can give me the benefit of the doubt and investigate fairly I do believe you will see a lot of the times the issue was not caused by me, when it is you won’t even have to cuff me just tell me to report to the brig (I make it a point not to resist arrest).

[Guest]

I understand, then, I apologize for the misconceptions as of recent.

I've merely just been led to believe by some other people that you somehow cause more trouble than you actually do, and I was wary of the information.

I'll keep the information you've brought to me in mind, and hopefully we won't have any future altercations.

[Guest]

I've read the log, and I have to ask.

Who was complaining about the geneticists all round? I searched for 'Safi'&'Isra'&'Genticist'&'Biologist'&' TK ' and couldn't see a single complaint pointing to them.

The warden was talking about their powers all round and even told Vira when she arrived the HoS never asked them.

Nia and Safi mentioned to Vira that Nia could verify but was ignored over telling them off.

Both Nia and Safi threw the locker in escape, Vira went straight to Safi and only Safi saying she could see her hand waving, even though it was Nia throwing the locker the most and no emotes about it.

Permission was given verbally, it was also documented on the PDA messages on Nia's PDA.

Katelynn mentioned a few times that she was going to cryo*(Unknown on if it was on the headset or just in person)

Although I hardly suspect that this was a metagrudge. It's more Delta's hate for genetics showing.

Furry actually tried to get written permission at the start of that round

	Line 1641: [17:52:16]SAY: Safiya Isra : kate safi need a thing frrrom herrr
Line 1642: [17:52:16]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : Maaaaybe~
Line 1645: [17:52:20]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : Mmkay.
Line 1652: [17:52:22]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : And thanks.
Line 1660: [17:52:30]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : Yaaay, paperwork.
Line 1661: [17:52:31]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : Hello.
Line 1663: [17:52:32]SAY: Safiya Isra : also yes safi grrreets
Line 1674: [17:52:48]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : Also, you don't need paperwork to be signed, you simply need my consent.
Line 1684: [17:53:06]SAY: Safiya Isra : yes but when safi not get paperrr worrrk signed securrity arrrests herrr anyway
Line 1689: [17:53:14]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : Boom.
Line 1696: [17:53:29]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : And if they try to do something, I'll crack down on them.
Line 1719: [17:54:13]SAY: Safiya Isra : safi would feel much morrre comforrtable if she got sign (blame the time the rd went ssd and i spent the rest of the round in the brig because security)
Line 1724: [17:54:33]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : Mm, I just notified the Warden and asked her to inform all of security.
Line 1730: [17:54:43]SAY: Safiya Isra : ah ok!
Line 1736: [17:54:48]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : ((When was the last time I went SSD in a round for more than a minute?))
Line 1753: [17:55:26]SAY: Safiya Isra : (i know i know but still, if you die or something security will arrest me, thats happend to me a few times to, basicly the moment the rd disapears for a second security tries arresting me)

Line 6052: [19:31:37]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : mm, I'm going to cryo.
Line 6082: [19:32:18]SAY: Katelynn Mcmullen : Mm, going to cryo. Night.
Line 6138: [19:33:32]ACCESS: Logout: (Katelynn Mcmullen)
Line 6211: [19:35:20]SAY: Vira Taryk : Safiya.
Line 6214: [19:35:25]SAY: Safiya Isra : mhmm?
Line 6217: [19:35:29]SAY: Vira Taryk : I want to see that executive permission form, please.

Line 6052 was said in person, line 6082 is unknown if it was in person or on radio.

I can't say that all of Delta's actions were in the right or wrong, neither can I say that for Furry.

Line 6493: [19:42:12]OOC: OneOneThreeEight : you should honestly also be more responsible on who you give TK too

How do you know who you can give things to without first giving them it? By that definition we should never let anyone have anything in fear or them messing around with it.

[the_furry]

so scopes I very much agree with your assessment of the entire situation. I don’t think delta was metagrudging against me but maybe against genetics as a whole. I do think that kind of mentality is still a problem because it means anyone that gets in genetics is going to have an unfun time because of the hate. I am hesitant but I do believe delta is working to correct how he treats the specific individuals in genetics. After submitting this complaint we had a situation that perfectly showed what I had been talking about. Someone was calling for the arrest of every single geneticist ever, and when I showed vira (played by delta) that I had permission from the RD he took what I thought the right action was and stopped the actual people messing with genetics. He did tell me to remove my powers too; which I thought was unfair but I think it was more because it was the end of the round and the entire thing escalated far more than it ever should have. The situation could have been fixed far sooner if someone just took a minute to ask/listen to safi to see if she had permission in the first place rather than explode with calling for perma but that is hardly detlas fault.

I would like to find further solutions (short of just removing genetics) so that others stop calling for the immediate arrest and perma brig because a geneticist moved a locker, this kind of mentality is killing it for everyone that wants to play genetics. That round I didn’t even use the powers but because I was associated with genetics I was guilty and thus had to stop doing the whole thing. I also had to stop cloneing people because every five mins someone was trying to arrest me. This part isn’t exactly focused on delta (he used to do this, it remains to be seen if he still will), but I want to know scopes where can I have this conversation. It’s an important conversation because it not only kills the round for geneticist that are hardly causing problems, but it stops cloning which kicks anyone dead out of the round, and it causes massive headaches to security (as shown in last night’s round, delta can vouch for that). The explosive responses geneticists get for doing something as simple as moving a book or locker once or twice is the problem here. Delta was but one person responsible for this kind of mentality.

[Guest]

Line 6493: [19:42:12]OOC: OneOneThreeEight : you should honestly also be more responsible on who you give TK too

How do you know who you can give things to without first giving them it? By that definition we should never let anyone have anything in fear or them messing around with it.

 

Because the infamous Nia Snyder was given TK, and it wasn't just Safiya that round using it.

[the_furry]

Line 6493: [19:42:12]OOC: OneOneThreeEight : you should honestly also be more responsible on who you give TK too

How do you know who you can give things to without first giving them it? By that definition we should never let anyone have anything in fear or them messing around with it.

 

Because the infamous Nia Snyder was given TK, and it wasn't just Safiya that round using it.

Actually you totally just made scopes point. I honestly have no idea who Nia Snyder is or what makes her infamous. I rarely do anything with security and until that round I had no interactions with her. there is no way I could have known she would abuse the powers which is exactly why I shouldn’t be held responsible, especially if I’ve asked another head of staff if Nia is ok to give powers too.

[Dreamix]

I would like to find further solutions (short of just removing genetics) so that others stop calling for the immediate arrest and perma brig because a geneticist moved a locker, this kind of mentality is killing it for everyone that wants to play genetics.

Just going to add something. I don't think that people are freaking about genetics in general, but about telescience telekinesis. You can goof around, without leaving any fingerprints. And you can almost get away with it. You were messing with tech storage, or maybe threw bartender's shotgun down disposals? Doesn't matter, blame it on a random assistant. If anyone saw you using your powers, they will need to think of some bullshit like "I saw you fiddling with your hand, must have been telekinesis". Telekinesis is the most problematic power, really.

No matter how hulk would be overpowered, you have certainty that he only smashed a couple of walls, and nothing more. With telekinesis, there's no guarantee. And people will suspicious and distrustful.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Guest

[Guest]

I presume that the problem with "me" is mostly resolved, though I figure it might be best to copy+bin a couple posts in this thread for some genetics department discussion and how it fits in the metagame of the Aurora at the moment.

I could be wrong, though.