IPC Cryo Cooling

[November]

So this issue came about when the shuttle had a wall blown out. No air and no pressure meant heat buildup for a IPC. Jumping into cryo did not cool me down at all, which I find sort of odd. I get that the heat probably just visually replaces the oxy loss, but still. Just wanted to mention it so it has a chance of being changed to make sense.

[Dreamix]

What should happen is, the IPC dies when put into cryo. Because, either the cryo-fluids flood insides of the IPC, destroying its internal components (and computers don't like water, you remember?), or the IPC's cooling-vent-things close down and the IPC doesn't cool down in any way at all (dying, yup). Keep in mind that IPC's use air to prevent themselves from overheating, replacing air with water wouldn't work (unless you modify it's entire cooling mechanisms, but that would render the IPC unable to cool down using air).

So, yeah.

[Kaed]

What should happen is, the IPC dies when put into cryo. Because, either the cryo-fluids flood insides of the IPC, destroying its internal components (and computers don't like water, you remember?), or the IPC's cooling-vent-things close down and the IPC doesn't cool down in any way at all (dying, yup). Keep in mind that IPC's use air to prevent themselves from overheating, replacing air with water wouldn't work (unless you modify it's entire cooling mechanisms, but that would render the IPC unable to cool down using air).

So, yeah.

 

I don't think that the insides of cryo tubes are made from water, or they would freeze solid during operation. They get very cold inside, you see. But have no evidence the contents are even conductive, which is the main issue with getting computers wet - you can immerse them in certain oils and they function fine.

And convection cooling is largely unnecessary when your environment is so cold your are conducting all your heat into it anyway. I think you might have problems when you EXIT the cryo sludge more than when you are in it, on account of your internal circuitry being full of thick sludge that you need to clean out.

But hey, that's just me, using my basic understanding of science. I've been told to put it away before for 2D spacemens.

[Taintedglory]

What should happen is, the IPC dies when put into cryo. Because, either the cryo-fluids flood insides of the IPC, destroying its internal components (and computers don't like water, you remember?), or the IPC's cooling-vent-things close down and the IPC doesn't cool down in any way at all (dying, yup). Keep in mind that IPC's use air to prevent themselves from overheating, replacing air with water wouldn't work (unless you modify it's entire cooling mechanisms, but that would render the IPC unable to cool down using air).

So, yeah.

 

I mean, Unless the Cyro liquid is proven to be conductive, it wouldn't harm the IPC in any way

 

 

You can submerge a real life computer in Mineral Oil, and a few other oils that I cant remember off the top off my head. Also some other liquids too, but I can't remember.

However, its still a weird and dumb SS13 logic thing that probably wont even be even bothered with.

[Dreamix]

(...)

(...)

Well. Cryo-tubes can be filled with a million different things. It would be safe to just assume that the cryo-fluid (the one you add clonexadone or dylovene into) is electrically conductive, instead of making a long list of (non-)conductive things and checking whether the cryo-tube will kill the IPC every time something is added to it.

Example. If cryo-fluids are non-conductive, and I fill my them with ammonia, it should be safe for an IPC to cool down inside. Hovewer, when I fill it with water, or something like copper (?), it should kill an IPC.

But, we can just avoid the problem entirely, by making the cryo-fluids conductive, and no matter what other chemicals you put into it, it will kill the IPC anyway.

But that's just one way of doing things (which I like, yeah). You could just make it safe for IPC's to be inside, for a cheap or gimmicky (?) mechanic.

[Kaed]

To be honest, I'm kind of with Dreamix here. These tubes were made for organics to heal in, not for an overheating IPC to jump into to keep itself functional. I don't think that there would be a priority there to make it compatible liquids.

[Guest]

As an explanation, November:

The reason why your IPC did not have their body temp return to normal/cool levels is due to how cryogenic cell processing works. IPCs are immune to almost any form of chemical processing. The cryoxadone stored in the cryo cell in combination with the cell's temperature is supposed to do a few things:

1.) Cool down the body placed in the cryo cell

2.) Chemicals are slowly "injected" by .2 increments every second into the spaceman

3.) Cryoxadone/clonexadone will gradually heal someone whose body temperature is below a certain threshold, below 170 kelvins IIRC.

Unfortunately, IPCs do not process chemicals. They process temperature in a, shall we say "unique" and specific method. If they exist in an area with very low concentrations of pressure, their body will heat up and burn damage will be gradually dealt to all of their limbs over several seconds. Internals will not save them, only a suit cooling unit and an EVA suit will help them. The biggest issue is that IPCs cannot lower this temperature threshold without being thrown into somewhere with satisfactory pressure levels and allowed to cool down.

Pressure has no bearing in a cryo cell so the game won't register the IPC mob as being in a pressurized environment and thus will not allow them to cool off. Cryo cells were never designed for IPCs either, so their interaction with IPCs was effectively rendered null and it became an oversight.

My knowledge on whether it'd be a good idea to throw an overheating sentient toaster into a cryogenic cell or not is rather limited, so I'm not entirely sure what to say regarding immersion.

[Nanako]

As an explanation, November:

The reason why your IPC did not have their body temp return to normal/cool levels is due to how cryogenic cell processing works. IPCs are immune to almost any form of chemical processing. The cryoxadone stored in the cryo cell in combination with the cell's temperature is supposed to do a few things:

1.) Cool down the body placed in the cryo cell

 

This is not correct.

Cryoxadone does nothing to your body temperature, cryotubes cool you directly based on the gas contents, which they will do with or without a medicine beaker.

I'm not sure why it doesn't work, are you certain it doesn't? I've done it once before and saved an overheating IPC

In any case, i support this idea, because it would be fun for gameplay, and include IPCs in the world a little more.

it should perhaps have some drawback associated with it though

[Guest]

amusingly enough, as i've personally tested, if the room around the cryo cells are vented and the cell that the tile exists on has no pressure, then the subject inside the cell will take pressure damage and also suffocate.

whether they die or not depends on the contents of the cryo cell. assuming we're still discussing organics and not IPCs.

 

I'm not sure why it doesn't work, are you certain it doesn't? I've done it once before and saved an overheating IPC

 

absolutely certain, in the circumstance regarding the atmosphere of the room where the cryo cell is existing. if the room has no pressure, then the IPC will not cool off even if they are in a cryo cell.

 

Cryoxadone does nothing to your body temperature, cryotubes cool you directly based on the gas contents, which they will do with or without a medicine beaker.

 

The cryoxadone stored in the cryo cell in combination with the cell's temperature is supposed to do a few things:

 

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough?

[Guest Complete Garbage]

Just. Make a fucking red light flash or something when you try to put an IPC in a cryo tube:

"Incompatible Lifeform detected. Unit loading failed."

Or similar.

If cryo tubes can report a subject's name and vitals, it's reasonable to assume they can also tell whether you're a human or a toaster.

[Carver]

I still question how they don't take damage anyways since any semblance of a basic built-in cooling system in them is non-existent. They run at about 150-170 Fahrenheit as their normal body temperature, wouldn't someone realize the very obvious design flaw there?

[Nanako]

I still question how they don't take damage anyways since any semblance of a basic built-in cooling system in them is non-existent. They run at about 150-170 Fahrenheit as their normal body temperature, wouldn't someone realize the very obvious design flaw there?

 

What?

First we're in space, go away imperial system.

Secondly, my PC runs at about that temperature under heavy load, and it has a cooling system too. That's not too bad

[Guest]

Secondly, my PC runs at about that temperature under heavy load

 

how does your CPU not melt oh hell

150-170 fahrenheit (or above 70 celsius for europnerds) is the average temperature the hood of a car will get to in full exposure to summer sunlight, for instance. For one, you want to avoid having your PC undergo such temperatures. Mine only goes up to 40 celsius under the heaviest load and standard clocking, though I have a four-core processor.

90-100 Celsius is the effective threshold into where your computer parts will start malfunctioning immediately, most cores have a safety measure to never operate over 80 celsius. Under 60 Celsius is acceptable operation for standard machines under heavy load.

Meanwhile, we're 442 years into the future and our walking free robots struggle to not explode the moment someone whispers "hull breach". The rate at which IPCs burn up in a vacuum is insane, and the threshold that they even consider as livable to exist in, is quite laughable.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

I'd be fine with cryo cooling them down. It'd be a very utility situation but no doubt very welcome to everyone involved except the antags.

[Guest]

Fairly niche quirk to implement, honestly. It wouldn't hurt to put into place but it still doesn't hammer down the issue regarding cooling for IPCs.

[November]

amusingly enough, as i've personally tested, if the room around the cryo cells are vented and the cell that the tile exists on has no pressure, then the subject inside the cell will take pressure damage and also suffocate.

 

It looks like this is the source problem. Cryo cooling down IPC's faster would still be cool, but I would be perfectly happy if this (admittedly more important) aspect was prioritised.

[Guest Complete Garbage]

We should probably wait until Polaris toastercode is in (assuming it will be some time soon) before making major changes to IPC shit.

[Carver]

First we're in space, go away imperial system.

Secondly, my PC runs at about that temperature under heavy load, and it has a cooling system too. That's not too bad

Firstly, imperial system is the only system I believe in.

Secondly, this is the future, there is no excuse to have these smaller robots running (In normal conditions, mind you) hotter than my computer playing Evolve at max settings on release day. They would burn people they touched, which is unusual considering these are generally designed to be around people, wear clothes, and handle things that should generally be kept room temperature. Get some liquid cooling in these fuckers.

[DatBerry]

How come space cools down heat exchange pipes yet IPCs magically heat up?

The fact that space is actually room temperture makes no sense unless we're really close to a star, but at that point we would die to radiation and what not and communication would be almost impossible

As it is now, you can go EVA in a fire suit for as long as you have enough air

[SierraKomodo]

How come space cools down heat exchange pipes yet IPCs magically heat up?

The fact that space is actually room temperture makes no sense unless we're really close to a star, but at that point we would die to radiation and what not and communication would be almost impossible

As it is now, you can go EVA in a fire suit for as long as you have enough air

 

Space itself doesn't cause IPCs to heat up. The lack of atmospheric pressure in space is what causes it. The IPC generates its own heat, and uses air with fans to cool itself (Like a computer). No atmosphere/pressure means no air to move. No moving air means all that heat collects and builds up (See what happens if you block all the fans in your computer).

[NebulaFlare]

I thought I posted here already...wierd

.Anyway, I just wanted to point out that we have people jumping into cryo nwit mechanical limbs - the threat of electrical discharge shouldn't be problematic.

Also, we got a swimming pool IPCs can jump into with no mechanical issues. Because yay baycode. I'm pretty sure IPCs are waterproof.

[Nanako]

Secondly, this is the future, there is no excuse to have these smaller robots running (In normal conditions, mind you) hotter than my computer playing Evolve at max settings on release day.

 

By normal conditions, you mean not in combat?

Computers generate heat from processing, more than anything else. Large scale movements, like manipulating robotic arms, aren't really expensive.

Under 'normal conditions' an IPC has to process a probably intellectual job, and social interactions with organics. Which is really more complex than combat or crisis situations and would generate more heat imo

[DatBerry]

How come space cools down heat exchange pipes yet IPCs magically heat up?

The fact that space is actually room temperture makes no sense unless we're really close to a star, but at that point we would die to radiation and what not and communication would be almost impossible

As it is now, you can go EVA in a fire suit for as long as you have enough air

 

Space itself doesn't cause IPCs to heat up. The lack of atmospheric pressure in space is what causes it. The IPC generates its own heat, and uses air with fans to cool itself (Like a computer). No atmosphere/pressure means no air to move. No moving air means all that heat collects and builds up (See what happens if you block all the fans in your computer).

 

Yes but my computer is not in the freezing vacum of space

[Carver]

No, I mean: In the station, at the default temperature, with unaltered atmospherics. Completely normal workplace.

Also, if thinking and interaction and so forth generated heat, then positronic brains would heat up the tile they are on when active. As they don't, it's not the processing of their core that generates heat, it's the operations of their chassis. A chassis with very minimal plating, considering how easily damaged they are, which would lead me to assume it should have far better ventilation than it does.

Image

[Nanako]

Oops i accidentally edited your post, tried to repair it

 

Also, if thinking and interaction and so forth generated heat, then positronic brains would heat up the tile they are on when active.

 

They should generate heat, much like computers do. Computers with no moving parts. There's a reason server rooms have such powerful cooling

The reason IPCs don't generate heat right now is either:

1. Someone just forgot to do it

or

2. The increase in heat wasn't significant enough to affect gameplay, or to be worth the extra processing power/coding effort

In either case, i wouldn't take the current functional state as a representation of lore