ShameOnTurtles

Well, this has been open for ages and with the combination of them seemingly coming to an agreement in the thread and the lack of further reply from the reporter I will be closing this.

I don’t like the idea of adding a hard coded CC-approved time to get off work. There are many complications this raises with jobs. The fact it is an optional break also doesn’t really make sense, and people already break from work to get food/drinks. Unfortunately, if it isn’t optional, it raises a host of problems as I mentioned before. With this in mind, I would not like this added. -1.

There hasn’t been any activity on this thread in over a week. [mention]TheLoneWolfer[/mention], is this complaint withdrawn? If you still want to pursue it, also let me know.

What I’m saying here is going off my limited understanding of the mall game mode, I assume that delta encryption hack is the one that gives you access to the delta alert level? If so, I would be fine with being able to upgrade combat cyborgs but I definitely do not think it should be stealthy. At that stage you should be openly hostile.

[mention]Bauser[/mention] Of course there are risks involved in faking your appearance. It should be very difficult to fool a clever forensics technician. Anyways, what fix do you support/propose for forensics?

I know this wasn't exactly directed at me but I have an idea. What if the fibres were changed to the colour and class of the clothing? For example, someone wearing black gloves and an engineer uniform would leave black glove fibres and/or yellow or orange jumpsuit fibres. Someone wearing a black suit and jacket would leave fibres from a black suit and black coat. This would remove the, quite frankly, ridiculously specific analysis but still narrow down the search pool. A counter to forensics is simply not wearing stuff that's unnecessary, and keep your clothes generic. I think people should be encouraged, if they want to avoid being identified by forensics, to seek out counters to that kind of thing. We have lots of lockers with random jumpsuits, hats, and otherwise. I do think time to get the evidence is a valid concern here. Back when I used to play forensics technician/CSI it took a long time to get evidence in your lab, catalogued, analysed, then your conclusions drawn up, and communicated to the relevant people. By the time that is finished most- I'd go as far as to say almost all- criminals have already either outsed themselves or been caught another way. Anything we can do to shorten this to make it more viable is something I think worth pursuing.

Making an ATLAS character is just like making any character from a potentially contentious background: The character has to be foremost a person, not an ATLAS member. What I mean by that is you should not make the character being ATLAS their single defining characteristic. That leads to shallow characters that become stale to play and observe. A way to flesh our your character is really delve into where they are from, and the specific views they carry with them - and why. 'Why' can be just as important as 'what.' The primary way I suggest making a character from Sol, regardless of their political views, is to consider where they are from. The lore writers have put an incredible amount of effort into each location and background in order to give you the most information possible. There are even suggested majority views to conform (or not!) to, things to know, prejudices to have, and full character concepts! However, as I said earlier, I think the most important thing to keep in mind is that you're making a character, not a caricature.

Apologies again that this complaint has taken so long. Rest assured with this post it will be closed. [mention]Butterrobber202[/mention], we believe your premise of engaging the captain was legitimate. Them pulling a gun on you is reason to be cautious and possibly shoot them first. It is unfortunate the aim mechanic continues to be broken so it was hard to utilize it properly. Where you went wrong was eswording the captain multiple times after they were subdued for no apparent reason. This really isn't okay in the scope of the situation, and was where you went wrong. [mention]EJ_Denton[/mention] has been spoken to regarding their in character involvement in the adminhelp by Strudel. As a resolution to this complaint the warning will be reworded to reflect that it wasn't engaging the captain that was the issue but eswording them. Locking and archiving this, if either of you have an issue please message me over discord or byond.

I think that parapens should be consistent with other hyposprays, and should be delayed by full armour. Though, due to the nature of their stealthy purpose, they should not display a message when injecting through armour. I do not believe their functionality is broken or in need of a rework, though I would be open to the kind of rework that Coalf proposes. Introducing a 5-second delay to it knocking you out will not be an impactful nerf for antagonists. It is very easy to tail someone for 5 seconds and it takes no 'effort.' Call me cynical, but I would speculate that one of the only changes from an introduced delay would be certain people rushing to get within sight of others as soon as they feel the parapen working on them. This argument is a bit tangential, but we should be primarily concerned about balance, not about eliminating mechanics that insta-stun someone. Those two purposes often fall in line, but I do not think the parapen is OP or in need of a nerf. Once a poll is up I would ask that it contains an equal amount of for and against options.

Yep like Kaed said I would like some indication that the flag has been torn down for those that were not present when it was taken down, whether that is done in the form of posters, where they leave ripped corners in the wall, or by actually making a torn flag object.

Yes this also would be very good.

As the title says. I would like to take the current mechanic to tear down posters and copy it over to flags. It's not very dramatic to carefully unscrew a flag rather than tearing it off the wall (as those filthy sedantis flags deserve)

I guess it would depend on the jobs and the access, but I do not think this should be implemented for most, if not all, jobs considering the argument of having access to an area means you have all the skills to use everything in that area. I would be fine with this, but I'm not sure it's necessary anymore. I'm just looking through #game_status and it feels like a good spread of gamemodes. I wouldn't like to see this, for reasons stated by Schev and Abo. Major events, yes. Especially blob/major spiders can be completely crippling (even vines on lowpop are a massive hassle sometimes.)

On the topic of Fear RP: On the topic of powergaming: On the topic of escalating to a permanent ban: I believe I have addressed everything now. Please, unless there is new information to bring up, let's not go over the same points that have already been talked about.

Archiving by request of the OP and because this is already a feature. Perhaps we will see it used in the game soon.

The issue about fear RP/technical ability of Kanza does not have anything to do with how they look, but how they act. You are free to make a veteran of the Tajaran civil war who is putting on a brave face, but that needs to be roleplayed as a brave face- an act. I would also expect that someone who's a capable sniper and someone who refers to guns, and I quote, as "shooty pew pews" would not be the same person. I would go as far as to say those outlooks are dichotomous. Being taught stuff in round is great, and I'm glad that RP happened, but a lot of the stuff on station, including R&D, isn't as simple as just being talked/walked through it, even if this isn't represented mechanically. The exact level of skill level of your assistant is not a major point, nor is the fact you were printing stuff off. It is the way that equipment was used and the intent behind printing it off. I am treating you and your arguments with respect and I ask that you would do the same. This not about either of our egos.

The raiders in this situation had decided to take over the station for the round, and they were pretty much successful establishing this. As far as I recall, there was only the warden for security, and the raiders quickly grouped up civilian crew, including Voyd, and told them what was up. Not long after, Voyd, playing Kanza the lab assistant, printed off weaponry and equipment including force gloves, a plasma cutter, a Lawgiver Mk. 2 and I believe more but I do not know for certain. I witnessed them go to the Warden, give them the lawgiver, and instruct them how to use it (while wearing the force gloves they printed off). This move was witnessed by raiders who decided to 'teach her a lesson' in the form of a beating. Two raiders come to the security lobby and try to beat her (the beating consisted of stunning them with a baton, and hitting them twice with it, then stepping back). During the beating Kanza attempted to get up and hurl the raider hitting her to the ground with forcegloves, at the end when he stepped back, she pulled out a plasma cutter and unloaded on him, before getting shot and headgibbed by another raider who had come on scene, who had a revolver. Not once from when the raiders initially gathered up civilians, to when they had killed you, did you show any kind of reasonable fear RP. Full PM logs: The exact wording of the ban: The issues that lead up to me contacting you: Lack of fear RP You specifically say that your character was not afraid because they are only afraid of humans, yet any reasonable person should be afraid of someone with obvious hostile intent who has guns, especially someone as child-like as the character Kanza. Not only did you escalate the combat with the raiders, but beforehand you showed no fear whatsoever of them or their capabilities, continuing with child-like naive behavior that was completely inappropriate to the situation. I am not saying you have to RP fear/caution a certain way, but you must RP it to some extent. Powergaming As a lab assistant you should not be self-sufficient with Research and Development. I do not expect lab assistants to never print anything but printing off and using advanced equipment in the protolathe is not one of your abilities. I was mostly concerned about the fact that you stocked yourself up with combat gear, and when confronted by antagonists, used it to go into a suicidal rush against them. To be clear: Your escalation was somewhat valid, but the methods used definitely were not. As soon as you could you fired all the shots from the plasma cutter into the raider. When you say 'I wasn't exactly firing it with accuracy' that is completely false, as all shots landed on their target. What made me escalate to a ban: You made it very clear to me in the ticket that you disagreed, and were not going to abide by my ruling. You refused to acknowledge what you did wrong in this situation, and you refused to acknowledge my decision as staff. Staff decisions are final, on server. I did not believe that, with this attitude towards the ruling, a warning or a 'time out' in the form a temporary ban would have seen a change in your behavior. The attitude I referred to was not your tone, but you actual attitude towards the ruling. Lastly, regarding what you describe in this thread: The fact that you still say what you did was valid is exactly why I wanted to force this extended dialogue. You tried to 'run and gun' away from a situation as a civilian player. In this instance, it was not acceptable, and your primary focus as a civilian should be to stay safe and not cause yourself harm, not escalate the situation with the antagonists. There is no reasonable basis to say that I am biased, harassing, or trying to make a 'power-play move'. I have never interacted with you before to my knowledge, and certainly not in an administrative capacity. Please stop trying to make this out as me specifically targeting you.

I propose that if you are damaged to the point of bleeding on a particular bodypart, a message should pop up when you are examined that says "Blood is soaking through the clothes on [name]'s [bodypart]" Simply because it's a bit weird when someone is damaged to the point of death but you can't see any damage on them from a glance because clothes hide injuries now.

Voting for dismissal. I don’t think any additional policy will help the issue.

I will contest the fact that a lot of these deaths are canon to my dying breath. A lot of the stuff on station doesn’t have antag involvement but it not consistent and believable in our setting, such as someone being willing to work on a station with a body count higher than the battle of the five points. With that said I am pretty much neutral to this role being added. I see the appeal, and having someone dedicated to handling any corpses that pop up would be nice.

As long as the system is based on how efficiently/effectively/competently you can do an action, and not the ability to do the action itself, I am fine with this. In regards to specific implementation, I am not sure and would have to think more on that, but I think attempting to adapt the current skills system we have is worth a shot.

There have been some good points brought up in this thread. Some civilian militias can feel 'cheap' and I think the solution to this rests on a few things. Unfortunately what would possibly be the best option is to have a moderator/administrator constantly observing and monitoring the militia, as it forms and acts. This is not a reliable way to moderate behaviour and isn't really feasible. [mention]Mofo1995[/mention] brought up a great point. I think we can all do little things to help improve the game experience for others. Sometimes those poppies are appropriate and sometimes not. [mention]Kaed[/mention], on the idea of there being IC policy regulating militias, I am not in support. NanoTrasen having policy saying that 'if Security is dead do this..." does not promote confidence in the department, nor does it give any sense of safety to the crew. Barricades and weapons made are primarily makeshift, not official armoury contents. In regards to low staff numbers, IC policy is based off when each department has the necessary members to function, primarily when it is full, not what we experience during lowpop. Last thing on this note: no one but the Captain knows there is a self-destruct on station, so anyone not them that acts with knowledge of the nuclear device should be adminhelped. I think this really hits the nail on the head. Militias are a defensive tool. They are not an excuse to validhunt, and this includes chasing retreating antags (to an extent). Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to moderate how people use weapons, but I would expect anyone who kills someone else, even if the person they killed was an antag, to properly roleplay out the effects that killing someone would have on the average person. Garn is correct where it is not feasible to comb through each person's records to see if they have weapons training. Suffice to say, only engineers or those with the proper knowledge should be making makeshift weapons but for the most part, anyone can use them. Guns are a bit more difficult to use and should be ICly treated as such. I will bring this up with other staff to make sure our views are consistent, but I don't think any policy changes are necessary. I think the primary solution rests with the community to double check whether the militia they are forming is valid, and other people to adminhelp what they feel is questionable behaviour. [mention]Kaed[/mention] what do you think about this?

I’m keen. I am literally 12 hours removed from your time though. I can be on, GMT time, from about 4am-11am.

I think the Chapel should be slightly smaller, as I doubt 25 people are expected to be inside for mass or another ritual at any one time. Were the dorms moved or deleted? I would kind of like them to stick around, if possible. I really like the kind of 'busy industrial kitchen' feel the current layout has, if that makes sense. Could that be carried over in any way, or are you dead set against the current layout? If the general bar/lounge area is being revamped too, I would definitely like to see the return of booths. I have a dream of organizing a functioning restaurant one day. Has maintenance size around that area been condensed, or kept the same?

ok thank you. night night