Tablespoon Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 ** For simplicity's sake, all playable, non-human races/species/IPCs will be referred to as a 'race', 'races' or 'aliens'. I know this isn't technically correct, but it makes things 1000% easier to explain ** Ok, so the last thread has been locked as I move the discussion here. And it's time for a new poll regarding how we should handle alien whitelists. My thoughts on how to potentially handle alien races being heads on the station is that Aurora is being touted as being an 'equal workplace' for all races (also explains the high alien pop we have). This would allow alien characters to play heads while still experiencing IC racism or discrimination. I think this has the potential to satisfy both parties Please continue to weight in, but, as always, be RESPECTFUL. Understand that you (the player) are not your character and if someone insults them they are not insulting or oppressing you. On the flip side, know that some of the alien players just want a chance to create new and interesting rp stories with their established characters. Please keep in mind that the admin and lore team is only using these polls as a baseline for discussion. Why these polls and comments do have an impact, they are not the final factor in determining how we will weight in on the issue.
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 I do enjoy the restrictions and discrimination against alien characters - it gives, in my view, an incentive to prove that your character is capable enough. My own character, Houssam Jawdat, slipped into the HoP spot by virtue of having been in it for awhile before the ban. The exception has given a lot of interesting roleplay, and he's faced a lot of IC questioning and comments. However, I understand that this is unfair to other people, because the rule so far has been a 'hard' restriction. I think that it would be a great system if the ban was a 'soft' one - if your alien proved IC'ly to be an exceptional member of their department, and could convince NT that they'd be a good Head, they'd be granted it tentatively. IC conflict and discrimination is a good thing, because even if it sparks debates and conversation, we can all have fun with it, and have rewards for having these well thought out characters which players have to invest in, if only because proof of this investment and character development and the fact they want to keep their race character in Command.
Dea Tacita Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 I'm (Obviously) in-favor of my proposal (The last one) Humans: Obviously would be allowed to have any position, this has never been questioned. It's a Human station afterall Skrell: Being the most advanced race, and the first one encountered by Humanity. They'd have the same as Humans, due to generally having the best relations with Humankind, along with being their technological betters, along with y'know...actually having a function government for lobby for them. Tajara & Unathi: Would have access to any rank other than Captain, and they WOULDN'T be barred legally from being Captain, there just simply wouldn't be any due to the short time they've be in N.T.'s employ, along with some (de-facto) bias. I think this works because, I see it as a fair compromise of RP opportunities without falling back to "Fukken aliens" as an excuse for a restriction. IPC - IPCs are capable, they're sentient or at least Quasi-Sentient in nature, and obviously capable of doing their jobs. But their memory is literally accessible as long as you can (Not literally) flip their power switch and remove their Positronic brain. Allowing them CE, RD and CMO allows them an opportunity for wider role-playing opportunities while still making sense ICly, as they'd be barred from ranks with much higher access to classified data. Dionea - They're typically slower, less ambitious and generally not terribly suited for Command positions. But I believe it fair to hand them SOME positions, the same as the IPCs for RP's sake. While barring them (Not legally) but de-facto simply due to a lack of desire in most Dionea to reach higher-up positions. While not wholly ideal for the situation, I believe this is better than ALL other alternatives as it maintains a precarious balance between IC restrictions and RP opportunity.
LetzShake Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 I'm (Obviously) in-favor of my proposal (The last one) Humans: Obviously would be allowed to have any position, this has never been questioned. It's a Human station afterall Skrell: Being the most advanced race, and the first one encountered by Humanity. They'd have the same as Humans, due to generally having the best relations with Humankind, along with being their technological betters, along with y'know...actually having a function government for lobby for them. Tajara & Unathi: Would have access to any rank other than Captain, and they WOULDN'T be barred legally from being Captain, there just simply wouldn't be any due to the short time they've be in N.T.'s employ, along with some (de-facto) bias. I think this works because, I see it as a fair compromise of RP opportunities without falling back to "Fukken aliens" as an excuse for a restriction. IPC - IPCs are capable, they're sentient or at least Quasi-Sentient in nature, and obviously capable of doing their jobs. But their memory is literally accessible as long as you can (Not literally) flip their power switch and remove their Positronic brain. Allowing them CE, RD and CMO allows them an opportunity for wider role-playing opportunities while still making sense ICly, as they'd be barred from ranks with much higher access to classified data. Dionea - They're typically slower, less ambitious and generally not terribly suited for Command positions. But I believe it fair to hand them SOME positions, the same as the IPCs for RP's sake. While barring them (Not legally) but de-facto simply due to a lack of desire in most Dionea to reach higher-up positions. While not wholly ideal for the situation, I believe this is better than ALL other alternatives as it maintains a precarious balance between IC restrictions and RP opportunity. Sums it up perfectly, really. I think it's just kinda forced to make restrictions tighter than this. It seems like forced unnecessary racism for the sake of it.
Susan Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 Scratch that. Keep it how it is. I don't think IPCs should be heads and restrictions for species should be left to their developers, not the community.
Gollee Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 Scratch that. Keep it how it is. I don't think IPCs should be heads and restrictions for species should be left to their developers, not the community. The community should dictate the lore, not the other way round, in the end, the lore is a tool for players to use for roleplay, not the 10 commandments
LetzShake Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 Scratch that. Keep it how it is. I don't think IPCs should be heads and restrictions for species should be left to their developers, not the community. The community should dictate the lore, not the other way round, in the end, the lore is a tool for players to use for roleplay, not the 10 commandments Absolutely this. While the lore writers are important, I don't think they should just be able to essentially dictate rules, unilaterally. And I think a lore writer who is unwilling to listen to the community probably isn't fit for their position.
Guest Posted January 27, 2015 Posted January 27, 2015 Scratch that. Keep it how it is. I don't think IPCs should be heads and restrictions for species should be left to their developers, not the community. Is there an actual reason as to why you don't like IPCs as heads? Besides "the thought of a machine being my boss makes me uncomfortable." You've been very adamant in saying "I don't like this" without giving a coherent reason as to why, and then going on to assume that you have a final say in the matter. As Gollee said, it's the community that dictates the lore. Not the writers. The writers apply what needs to be changed as is their job to analyze whether the lore is good or not.
Valkrae Posted January 27, 2015 Posted January 27, 2015 I'm all for Dea's idea. When it comes down to it, It falls to whether or not the community enjoys it or not. We can't all be on the Lore Team, and if the species are stuck with their devs, then what choice do we have in what even RP? The Developers could in all intents and purposes do whatever they felt like with their own respective species, and go off on their own. +1 for Dea.
LetzShake Posted January 27, 2015 Posted January 27, 2015 Scratch that. Keep it how it is. I don't think IPCs should be heads and restrictions for species should be left to their developers, not the community. Is there an actual reason as to why you don't like IPCs as heads? Besides "the thought of a machine being my boss makes me uncomfortable." You've been very adamant in saying "I don't like this" without giving a coherent reason as to why, and then going on to assume that you have a final say in the matter. As Gollee said, it's the community that dictates the lore. Not the writers. The writers apply what needs to be changed as is their job to analyze whether the lore is good or not. IPCs not being heads makes sense, to me, because they're still very new and experimental and we're not sure of their vulnerabilities to being hacked or whatever. their memory is literally accessible as long as you can (Not literally) flip their power switch and remove their Positronic brain. as Dea said
Frances Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 IPCs not being heads makes sense, to me, because they're still very new and experimental and we're not sure of their vulnerabilities to being hacked or whatever. By that logic you do recognize Tajarans and Unathis wouldn't be in head roles either, yes?
Carver Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 IPCs...*cut* Allowing them CE, RD and CMO allows them an opportunity for wider role-playing opportunities while still making sense ICly, as they'd be barred from ranks with much higher access to classified data. CE, RD RD barred from ranks with much higher access to classified data Maybe I'm not getting this, but how are the Station's local architect/Engine maintainer/T-Comm's manager/knower of all that is machine on-board, and the Director of all it's important research/AI coding/messaging server maintenance bereft of classified information? What they know is vastly more valuable to any would-be sleeper agent than the HoP's meagre banking information. If anything, give them HoP rank but strip the RD rank. I would not expect the Research Director, the station's face and forefront manager of all it's breakthroughs, to be anything less than a brilliant and trusted Human or Skrell.
Conspire2Ignite Posted January 28, 2015 Posted January 28, 2015 I would not expect the Research Director, the station's face and forefront manager of all it's breakthroughs, to be anything less than a brilliant and trusted Human or Skrell. This has always been my view on it. People often forget this is a research station above all else, especially on rounds like Mutiny and Rev and the like. RD is an extremely serious position ICly even if it's not addressed as such very often. Overall, I'm in favor of the different restrictions (Dea's) idea with some tweaks. I'm not sure about giving the alien races HoP either, but it would be a better choice than RD.
LetzShake Posted January 29, 2015 Posted January 29, 2015 IPCs not being heads makes sense, to me, because they're still very new and experimental and we're not sure of their vulnerabilities to being hacked or whatever. By that logic you do recognize Tajarans and Unathis wouldn't be in head roles either, yes? Yes, I know Tajaran and Unathi are very vulnerable to hackers. But seriously though, no. They aren't as new to things as IPCs are, and they also are biological. They aren't 'new and experimental', really. Tajara have been in contact with humanity for a while now.
Frances Posted February 1, 2015 Posted February 1, 2015 But seriously though, no. They aren't as new to things as IPCs are, and they also are biological. They aren't 'new and experimental', really. Tajara have been in contact with humanity for a while now. 20-40 years, afaik. Last time humanity discovered a different race (of humans, no less) on a new continent, it took more than two decades for them to trust them in important management roles. You're throwing a lore argument at me, I'm throwing one back at you.
Guest Marlon Phoenix Posted February 1, 2015 Posted February 1, 2015 Instead of arguing about the current lore justifying the status quo we should ask if the status quo is worth keeping on its own merits. Based on the poll, the answer is no.
Frances Posted February 1, 2015 Posted February 1, 2015 That was indeed my point from the start. The "common sense" route, lore-wise, has been toyed with for Tajarans and Unathi to allow them more gameplay and story freedom. If people want these limitations to be enforced for IPCs, they must understand they should be put back onto other races out of a sense of fairness. This is one of the main complaints of IPC players - that Tajaran and Unathi players get to play their characters in whatever roles they want, yet they can't do the same with theirs for seemingly no valid reason.
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