Bokaza, Captain

[Hackie]

BYOND Key: Hackie Mhan

Player Byond Key: Bokaza

Reason for complaint: This round, in general, was a clusterfuck. It was a secret round, that involved multiple changelings. However, the conduct of Bokaza during that round is inappropriate for a captain. I don't have the logs, sadly, and did request for some during the round. But, to summarize it, the changeling was running around, killed Winston, and was severely injured. Followed by this, it was detained, contained and was stored in execution for some reason. There was very little communication over the radio, so I can't give a good reason why, the changeling was stuck in there. This was followed by her being moved to medical, with Bokaza strongly encouraging the HoS (Rukia Takeda) to move the changeling slowly across the hall. This, would potentially risk the life of the changeling because they had exposed, untreated wounds. She later told me, that they were conspiring to kill it, instead of just plain out telling security. The execution room, had apparently not been used (to my knowledge).

Approximate Date/Time: April 4th, 2015. 19:00 - 22:00 Pacific time.

[Baka]

Who was the changeling in question?

[Guest]

Honestly, it's more of an IC issue, not sure what you're blabbering about. The point was it was a loophole in the orders, because, I couldn't order to kill it, thus I told the HoS to make sure they die on the way to medbay. Why? Because, once in a blue moon I decide to do something bad with Elena, and every time I do it, it promptly ends with either an incident report or a character complaint. I swear, people are just waiting for any oportunity for me to screw up so they can crucify me.

They were in the execution chamber because every other room in the brig was fucked by gray tide or unsecure for containment.

The changling was TechnoKat, I think..

[Hackie]

You do, bad things with Elena. You have done screw ups as Elena, many considering antagonist rounds. You are not jumped on at every moment. The reason specifically I'm writing this complaint is because of your stream of incidents. For example, take one time, as the captain, you pulled out a Vampire's eyes. Then, gave it proto-human eyes without rejection medication. This string of incidents is not appropriate, for someone as experienced as you, and in a role as Captain. I can go on and on about the incidents we've had as you captaining but, that doesn't make anything progress. We don't write complaints because we want to crucify you, we write them because there is an issue with Elena we want fixed. That is not doing psycho, immoral stuff, like, sending a lab assistant to pull out a creature's eyes out.

[Frances]

Heads being a douche to everybody is more annoying than fun which is why we discourage it.

But heads being hardcore/dickish in dire situations? What do we want to do with that?

I remember when Houssam Jawdat got pissed at a nuke ops and executed them (with RP), and there was a player complaint. Isn't this sort of what roleplay is supposed to be about? People break under stress, they make bad calls, and they break rules for their own benefit.

[witchbells]

You do, bad things with Elena. You have done screw ups as Elena, many considering antagonist rounds. You are not jumped on at every moment. The reason specifically I'm writing this complaint is because of your stream of incidents. For example, take one time, as the captain, you pulled out a Vampire's eyes. Then, gave it proto-human eyes without rejection medication. This string of incidents is not appropriate, for someone as experienced as you, and in a role as Captain. I can go on and on about the incidents we've had as you captaining but, that doesn't make anything progress. We don't write complaints because we want to crucify you, we write them because there is an issue with Elena we want fixed. That is not doing psycho, immoral stuff, like, sending a lab assistant to pull out a creature's eyes out.

 

In Bokaza's defense, that was me. More specifically, Phoebe Essel.

The eyes were removed in order to further study the "bio-luminescent fibers" within the vampire's eyes, allowing it to flash nearby mobs. The eyes died, and I attempted a transplant of the protohuman's eyes (The blood type matched, I checked) however, the transplant was not completed because I lacked the necessary tools. Note, this was well before the addition of a surgery locker in robotics, so they were rolled to medical in a failed attempt to finish the job. I had never done a transplant before in game, so I was a ignorant to all the precautions necessary.

Regardless, said incident was on me, not Bokaza.

[Doomberg]

Loyalty implanted heads of staff being obligated to follow Corporate Regulations is a very reasonable argument to make. However, let us consider the following.

What, exactly, is the purpose of Corporate Regulations? They were created, I imagine, to ensure productivity of employees and optimal functioning of the station while keeping the corporation operating within the bounds of Sol Alliance law. The moment someone grows a massive flesh blade, however, one can reasonably assume they are a hostile unknown species, which would evidently not be protected by either Corporate Regulations or Sol law, thus permitting the loyalty implanted staff to forego regulations in this specific scenario.

What could definitely be a problem, however, is killing, or, through inaction, allowing the killing of said unknown alien species despite direct orders from Central Command to preserve it as a loyalty implanted character.

That leaves us with two questions:

1) Was the changeling in question identified as an unknown species? Did it display any of its abilities?

2) Was Bokaza instructed to preserve the changeling by Central Command?

[Guest]

You do, bad things with Elena. You have done screw ups as Elena, many considering antagonist rounds. You are not jumped on at every moment. The reason specifically I'm writing this complaint is because of your stream of incidents. For example, take one time, as the captain, you pulled out a Vampire's eyes. Then, gave it proto-human eyes without rejection medication. This string of incidents is not appropriate, for someone as experienced as you, and in a role as Captain. I can go on and on about the incidents we've had as you captaining but, that doesn't make anything progress. We don't write complaints because we want to crucify you, we write them because there is an issue with Elena we want fixed. That is not doing psycho, immoral stuff, like, sending a lab assistant to pull out a creature's eyes out.

 

In Bokaza's defense, that was me. More specifically, Phoebe Essel.

The eyes were removed in order to further study the "bio-luminescent fibers" within the vampire's eyes, allowing it to flash nearby mobs. The eyes died, and I attempted a transplant of the protohuman's eyes (The blood type matched, I checked) however, the transplant was not completed because I lacked the necessary tools. Note, this was well before the addition of a surgery locker in robotics, so they were rolled to medical in a failed attempt to finish the job. I had never done a transplant before in game, so I was a ignorant to all the precautions necessary.

Regardless, said incident was on me, not Bokaza.

 

It created so much RP. You said it doesn't make anything progress? How not? If it was left up to the standard protocol, the vampire would've rot inside the brig till the end of the shift. Just like that. The player's round would've ended there. And I never told her to cut his eyes out, I thought she was going to take tissue samples or something minor.

That same round, security decided to rebel. What was the result? The vampire escaped. Yes, security failed their fucking job because they were to busy dealing with butthurt and spitting on the chain of command, which was in the end not even justified.

You did the same damn thing. Bickering over pointless issues that were already resolved instead of just doing your job. This resulted in a complete breakdown of the security department. Yes, you fucked over the entire security department with your shit. Yet, I don't see anyone calling your security abilities in question.

Ohh, let's put another thing: An obviously sexist Unathi CE going activelly out of their way to questiong every single order that Elena did, still has a job? It was again, the same shift.

What the hell do you actually want? You want me to change my playstyle and never do anything that is even minor antag behavior? Just be a corporate drone? Are you even aware how much patience and focus effective captaning during an antag round demands? Well, I'm sorry, I cannot always obliege with perfect streight A captaining. Sometimes, I actually want my character to be a human with flaws and weaknesses. It can actually make the round more interesting and create RP scenarios. You don't like what I did? Guess what, every else in security seemed to have liked it. Isn't that what matters?

 

1) Was the changeling in question identified as an unknown species? Did it display any of its abilities?

2) Was Bokaza instructed to preserve the changeling by Central Command?

 

Yes, it was identified as a ling and Contral Command ordered to preserve it. I insisted on keeping it alive to the dismay of everyone in the security department. However, the damage it was doing, aka. killing Carton and causing halucinations, one which caused a short term mental breakdown of the HoS, made me change my mind and attempt to circumvent the orders through a loophole.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Elena was extremely... Passive aggressive this round. I was the Chief Engineer Sirasairot Uaekis, and my IC attempts to get information from the command channel were met with "Stay in your lane." or subtle hostility from Elena. As well as this, when Joshua Carton came to me to write a complaint on the Captain and HoS, and I told them I was faxing it to Central Command so they could deal with it since CE's don't do complaints, she said "I'm glad you take the word of a loud mouthed security officer over your Captain."

It wasn't sexism, lol wtf? It was basic questions to figure out what was going on, because Elena was going all "top secret classified" on a fellow command staff member. I think you're getting worked up, because wanting basic information doesn't get people fired.

Before that, when the HoS was hallucinating, Sirasairot was attempting to talk him into getting calm. It had almost worked, but then the captain immediately stripped the HoS somehow, then stuncuffed him and silently dragged him off. It took like four "what are you doing" over the command channel to pry out Elena's plan to strip the HoS of his rank temporarily because of the hallucinations.

I don't know, Elena is kind of a butt, and was playing super head of security. There wasn't any dialogue, or attempts to have the departments cooperate on anything, it was all only things Elena herself wanted to interject herself in. I mean I can see how it can be fun, but quite a bit of it was detracting from some fun in some areas, like the stated hallucinating HoS, and angry response to calling a DO to clear out a big mess rather than take the matters into my own sexy hands.

The biggest complaint, and the subject of this complaint, is her attempt to kill the changling with the HoS. I was the Duty Officer that wrote the fax with the condition that it be kept alive, and I was unamused that "I can murder him by neglect and it's not murder" was a line of thought to circumvent CC orders. A simple fax saying "We can't contain it" or even a radio message could have gotten her clearance to off it.

There were two directives, which I remember:

1) It must be preserved at all costs

2) It must be experimented on to discover its secrets so we know how to fight it, and how to identify it and any others.

Neglect is manslaughter or murder; at the very base level it's the opposite of keeping it alive.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

No, Jackboot, I told you to stick to your lane because you were telling me what to do and being rude. I don't know exactly why you do it, but there was a condescending undertone in everything your character says to mine. Why, I have no clear idea, but I've decided to pin it on your character being Unathi, basically.

 

Sirasairot was offering advice, if I remember correctly, not telling her what to do. Can you provide an example of Sirasairot being condescending in telling her what to do? If I'm wrong I apologize, but I remember him trying to establish a dialogue. When he does question things, it's on the basis of it being dishonourable to him, or somehow breaching a law or regulation and he doesn't have the full information he wants to make a judgement call. I think you're injecting yourself into your character, because a fellow Command Staff member trying to establish a dialogue and offer advice on what he feels is necessary shouldn't be met with hostility and the belief that he's questioning everything.

 

At no point did you actually ask nicely to be informed of what's going on.

Yes he did. "What are you doing?" was the running theme of the round because ridiculous things would happen and Elena would silently swoop in and handle it. I mean, to Sirasairot someone's using black magic to turn themselves into an abomination, and people are dying. His engineers could be at risk, station integrity could be at risk. He's going to ask questions, you shouldn't get angry at them.

 

And I didn't strip the HoS, she stripped herself on account of being insane. I had no intention of stripping them of their rank and if you had any trust at all in what I told you over the comms (which you did not), you would've believed it.

As soon as you gave your explaination over the radio Sirasairot accepted it and dropped the subject. I remember it because he went back to working on the piping in the hallway.

 

The extra rudeness from me came from the distractions you caused, as I had too much on my plate do deal with. Informing a CE about complex security issues is hardly the top of my list during code red.

 

While I understand some things are classified by necessity, this is a command staff member. There wasn't even an attempt to communicate with him by the Captain or the HoS. The HoS is new, I believe, which gives him benefit of the doubt, but you're a regular Captain. The Chief Engineer should be made aware that there's a crisis, and you can at least give him basic cliffnotes so the command staff can walk in lockstep. It just made it out that you didn't trust Sirasairot, or were hiding things. He's not malacious, or trying to undermine Elena, he's trying to figure out what's going on. He hates being left in the dark, or unaware of what's happening.

 

I don't remember directive 1) and if it was there, there is your for the shady move to circumvent it. 2) we had no xenobiologists, and even if we did, trying to hold it in xeno would've caused extra strain for already crumbling security. It's not manslaughter or murder because a ling is not protected by law.

 

The analogy was to explain the reasoning for it being an improper loophole. And I mean, you can experiment on a changling without a xenobiologist (but 99% of the time it requires them to be cooperative and not hallucinating you all the time so I can forgive not really doing it) and at any time could have blown the horn to Odin to explain the situation, rather than intentionally try to circumvent your loyalty implant. These are all symptoms combining into a wholly frustrating experience, and they are not from you, Bozaka, but Elena. Everyone makes mistakes, and can play a character in an unpopular way for awhile. I have, Hackie has; that's why complaints and feedback exist. There was a problem, and we're presenting what we see as a problem.

[Guest]

Decided to delete it because I was angry as fuck when I wrote it, but here it is:

 

Elena was extremely... Passive aggressive this round. I was the Chief Engineer Sirasairot Uaekis, and my IC attempts to get information from the command channel were met with "Stay in your lane." or subtle hostility from Elena. As well as this, when Joshua Carton came to me to write a complaint on the Captain and HoS, and I told them I was faxing it to Central Command so they could deal with it since CE's don't do complaints, she said "I'm glad you take the word of a loud mouthed security officer over your Captain."

It wasn't sexism, lol wtf? It was basic questions to figure out what was going on, because Elena was going all "top secret classified" on a fellow command staff member. I think you're getting worked up, because wanting basic information doesn't get people fired.

Before that, when the HoS was hallucinating, Sirasairot was attempting to talk him into getting calm. It had almost worked, but then the captain immediately stripped the HoS somehow, then stuncuffed him and silently dragged him off. It took like four "what are you doing" over the command channel to pry out Elena's plan to strip the HoS of his rank temporarily because of the hallucinations.

I don't know, Elena is kind of a butt, and was playing super head of security. There wasn't any dialogue, or attempts to have the departments cooperate on anything, it was all only things Elena herself wanted to interject herself in. I mean I can see how it can be fun, but quite a bit of it was detracting from some fun in some areas, like the stated hallucinating HoS, and angry response to calling a DO to clear out a big mess rather than take the matters into my own sexy hands.

The biggest complaint, and the subject of this complaint, is her attempt to kill the changling with the HoS. I was the Duty Officer that wrote the fax with the condition that it be kept alive, and I was unamused that "I can murder him by neglect and it's not murder" was a line of thought to circumvent CC orders. A simple fax saying "We can't contain it" or even a radio message could have gotten her clearance to off it.

There were two directives, which I remember:

1) It must be preserved at all costs

2) It must be experimented on to discover its secrets so we know how to fight it, and how to identify it and any others.

Neglect is manslaughter or murder; at the very base level it's the opposite of keeping it alive.

 

No, Jackboot, I told you to stick to your lane because you were telling me what to do and being rude. I don't know exactly why you do it, but there was a condescending undertone in everything your character says to mine. Why, I have no clear idea, but I've decided to pin it on your character being Unathi, basically.

At no point did you actually ask nicely to be informed of what's going on. And I didn't strip the HoS, she stripped herself on account of being insane. I had no intention of stripping them of their rank and if you had any trust at all in what I told you over the comms (which you did not), you would've believed it. The extra rudeness from me came from the distractions you caused, as I had too much on my plate do deal with. Informing a CE about complex security issues is hardly the top of my list during code red.

I don't remember directive 1) and if it was there, there is your for the shady move to circumvent it. 2) we had no xenobiologists, and even if we did, trying to hold it in xeno would've caused extra strain for already crumbling security. It's not manslaughter or murder because a ling is not protected by law.

[Guest]

The analogy was to explain the reasoning for it being an improper loophole. And I mean, you can experiment on a changling without a xenobiologist (but 99% of the time it requires them to be cooperative and not hallucinating you all the time so I can forgive not really doing it) and at any time could have blown the horn to Odin to explain the situation, rather than intentionally try to circumvent your loyalty implant. These are all symptoms combining into a wholly frustrating experience, and they are not from you, Bozaka, but Elena. Everyone makes mistakes, and can play a character in an unpopular way for awhile. I have, Hackie has; that's why complaints and feedback exist. There was a problem, and we're presenting what we see as a problem.

 

Honestly, no one gave me any rope for admiting I screwed up. The issue was ractified, because Carton kind of shamed Elena into seeing it was wrong. No further steps needed to be made, but they were made nonetheless. I recived resistance for every order I gave, much of it was what you would've supported.

Your character is maybe not sexist, I was wrong, because that would imply that Jawdat is sexist as well. The issue is, that both of your characters are openly condescending to Elena, and do the same sin I obviously did this time. They don't bother to inform me of doing things that are even outside their lane. That said, I don't believe you have the ability to completely seperate yourself from your character. It's hypocritical. Don't tell me that the things I've been getting is not hostile, because I don't believe it.

Being exposed to this sort of hostility is damaging to my own patience to play. Fine, doing psychotic crap is bad, I get that and I can stop doing it, but trying to function as a head in such a hostile enviroment is not even worth it. Everything that happens is still pinned on me for some reason, even though I had limited control in the events.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Because it's not the subject of this thread, if you PM me we can discuss what about my character's behaviour you view as problematic, or sexist.

As I said, the majority of problems is simply a lack of dialogue. Many of my own issues with characters or players are rescinded once I get the full picture of what's going on, through IC or OOC means.

I can say Sirasairot only wanted to know the full picture, and tried to give Elena advice, but obviously if it's coming off as hostile and sexist then something has gone wrong, here. I'm sure the same can be said of Elena in this instance; it wasn't malice, but everyone trying to achieve the same goal through different methods, and everyone involved not knowing what the other is doing.

[Serveris]

I feel like this is a wholesome DO issue and would be better suited in the incident reports section of the complaints. I can't really pick out much OOC wrong doing, (Excluding the 'Don't be a dick' rule, which IMO is the go-to reason for banning people that staff don't like[not to say some banned people haven't been raging dildos, though]).

As far as I see, one member of command staff had a personal issue with another member of command staff, and don't really see any kind of basis for a solid complaint. You mentioned that duty officers were contacted over this? Or there were plans to contact them? I'd like to hear more about how that played out.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

I feel like this is a wholesome DO issue and would be better suited in the incident reports section of the complaints. I can't really pick out much OOC wrong doing, (Excluding the 'Don't be a dick' rule, which IMO is the go-to reason for banning people that staff don't like[not to say some banned people haven't been raging dildos, though]).

As far as I see, one member of command staff had a personal issue with another member of command staff, and don't really see any kind of basis for a solid complaint. You mentioned that duty officers were contacted over this? Or there were plans to contact them? I'd like to hear more about how that played out.

 

The round was an antag round, and is thus non-canon.

[Guest]

Can I be reminded what the actual issue is here? I have a fucking headache reading through the first half of the first page and the rest of the second.

[Guest]

Can I be reminded what the actual issue is here? I have a fucking headache reading through the first half of the first page and the rest of the second.

 

Yeah, I get it too, and I wrote half of it. The issue, which is pissing me off, is that Hackie attempted to convince me that I have a streak of shit behavior as a Captain, by gaving an example from three to four months ago and tying it to this one. This and what I believe generally bad attitude from both of them ingame has led me to conclude that I'm being a target of metagrudging. However, I do not expect anyone to act on my feelings, as I marely wanted to clear out the issues that are hampering my gameplay and are loosely connected to this incident. Due to me generally being pissed at life currently, I've failed to conway it in an orderly fashion.

That said, I admit trying to circumvent orders was bad, I understood that the moment I went back on my actual decision ingame. I was not willing to admit this eariler, though, because all complaints smell of OOC inquisiton and this being here is generally pointless. This is, again, why I don't use these, but prefer to clear it out with them privately. Being exposed here to this shitstorm I've only done the same for them. Jackboot has pointed out to some actual issues, however, like me failing to communicate properly with certain Heads.

I will be rectifying the mentioned issues and would like that this complaint is closed, unless you intend to strip me of my whitelist. Maybe wait a day or so for people to post additional accusations

[Chaznoodles]

...Wait, is this a complaint for someone dragging a confirmed ling through the hallway?

what

There is absolutely zero problem with this. Like, at all. There's a point where complaints are being made for the sake of complaining and for no real reason, and I feel this is one of them.

[Guest]

more like a complaint of an antag having their round 'ruined' because things didn't go their way and they got robusted by security for escalating from 0 to 88 mph.

which happens literally every fucking time. and it's getting very grating when other people try to hop onto the hatewagon to make something out of nothing

[Guest]

more like a complaint of an antag having their round 'ruined' because things didn't go their way and they got robusted by security for escalating from 0 to 88 mph.

which happens literally every fucking time. and it's getting very grating when other people try to hop onto the hatewagon to make something out of nothing

 

It's not even the antag complaining, lol, it's an officer complaining on the antag's behalf (something I don't think they even asked for) because they think I did something horribly wrong. It was wrong, though, but kinda funny.

[Guest]

As someone who consider himself a vocal opponent of shitcurity and command most of the time, I have to say that if the antag is widely known to be some sort of alien monster, has actually killed people, and is running around causing other people to go insane while supposedly trying to kill them, Security is justified in taking them out.

If you wanna abandon subtlety and go full murderboner, you should be able to accept the consequences of being unrobust and being caught.

[Guest]

As someone who consider himself a vocal opponent of shitcurity and command most of the time, I have to say that if the antag is widely known to be some sort of alien monster, has actually killed people, and is running around causing other people to go insane while supposedly trying to kill them, Security is justified in taking them out.

If you wanna abandon subtlety and go full murderboner, you should be able to accept the consequences of being unrobust and being caught.

 

I feel like people have missed the point. To clarify, again, it's not about the antag, it's about me trying to circumvent a direct CC order as a Captain and doing something IC-ly psychotic. I don't think the antag actually has anything to do with this complaint.

[Guest]

Well, I dont think that failing to carry out an IC order like that one should result in OOC punishment.

[Guest]

On a research station, the loyalty implanted Captain should follow all direct orders from Central Command to an absolute tee, unless otherwise physically or mentally incapacitated. However, I think secretly devising a plan to have the ling die enroute to the Medical Bay is AN EXCELLENT method of avoiding the effects of a loyalty implant. Captain just needs to imply something to their HoS, HoS takes the long way around, ling dies of injuries, Captain says the HoS is not to blame, but rather poor layout of the Aurora, and BAM, the Odin doesn't fire their asses right away.

I feel conflicted on this complaint though. I do not think Captain's should display behaviour such as what Jackboot mentioned, but that entire argument belongs in it's own complaint. Really, the Captain should ALWAYS be relaying important information to the command staff, they are your allies, not your enemies. Use them like the tools they are.

[Valkrae]

On a research station, the loyalty implanted Captain should follow all direct orders from Central Command to an absolute tee, unless otherwise physically or mentally incapacitated. However, I think secretly devising a plan to have the ling die enroute to the Medical Bay is AN EXCELLENT method of avoiding the effects of a loyalty implant. Captain just needs to imply something to their HoS, HoS takes the long way around, ling dies of injuries, Captain says the HoS is not to blame, but rather poor layout of the Aurora, and BAM, the Odin doesn't fire their asses right away.

I feel conflicted on this complaint though. I do not think Captain's should display behaviour such as what Jackboot mentioned, but that entire argument belongs in it's own complaint. Really, the Captain should ALWAYS be relaying important information to the command staff, they are your allies, not your enemies. Use them like the tools they are.

 

The loyalty implant isn't there to make someone a slave, it's there to make sure the person who has it doesn't do anything that would ruin anything of NTs property or image.

It's not like, some sort of slave instrument.