Ra (Bulwark) "Aegis Stance" Ability

[Happy_Fox]

Give Ra the ability to "lock down" into a defensive stance that makes them immobile but highly resilient to damage (temporary massive armour buff). Give it a charge-up and wind-down period (progress bar) to avoid people flicking it on and off in combat. Have it block line of sight like a mech but also reduce the Ra's sight to very close range (like blinders). Allow it to be pried apart by other Bulwarks, G2s and anything which allows you to force bolted doors open in the same manner.

Make wall/door ants a reality.

[KingOfThePing]

I think Lore dictstes Ra to run away from danger, not stand and facetank it, though 

[Happy_Fox]

47 minutes ago, KingOfThePing said:

I think Lore dictstes Ra to run away from danger, not stand and facetank it, though 

"Similar to Workers, Bulwarks are generally passive, and prefer to flee a fight rather than resist. Though due to their speed, they may still choose to defend themselves should they be unable to properly escape a battle. The main exception to this is when another Vaurca is in danger. When this occurs, they tend to put themselves in between the attacker and the Vaurca, acting as a shield of sorts. They won’t go out of their way to take down the attacker, but will ensure the others get away safely."

[KingOfThePing]

So, they only do this to protect other Vaurca, then? I'll be honest, I dont know much about Ra, I have not caught up to it, yet. I mean, it sounds reasonable enough, question is if it's nessecary. How is the armor buff explained ICly?

[Myphicbowser]

1 minute ago, KingOfThePing said:

So, they only do this to protect other Vaurca, then? I'll be honest, I dont know much about Ra, I have not caught up to it, yet. I mean, it sounds reasonable enough, question is if it's nessecary. How is the armor buff explained ICly?

Placement. If you angle the human skull right its thicker in some places, and a lot of armor on the Bulwark is above its head, so if it angled it right its entire body would be a support system for its thicccc armor which is why it's immobile.

[Carver]

This sounds absolutely miserable to deal with as either an antagonist or security.

[Zer0Winds]

5 hours ago, Carver said:

This sounds absolutely miserable to deal with as either an antagonist or security.

I believe that's the point. Bulwarks aren't even that common to begin with but they are kinda supposed to be tanks. Yet they're actually rather weak despite the appearance. More intimidating than actually strong.

However, they can't move in this proposed state, so the most that you can do is like... block a door or something. And a Bulwark probably wouldn't even do it except to protect another Vaurca, or especially to keep a Ta safe.

I like the idea, honestly.

[whitewolftamer]

On 29/12/2021 at 02:21, Happy_Fox said:

Allow it to be pried apart by other Bulwarks, G2s and anything which allows you to force bolted doors open in the same manner.

Could have the bulwark in question take brute damage when this happens, +1 from me

[Carver]

11 hours ago, Zer0Winds said:

I believe that's the point. Bulwarks aren't even that common to begin with but they are kinda supposed to be tanks. Yet they're actually rather weak despite the appearance. More intimidating than actually strong.

Yes, this makes sense given they're not made for combat situations. Being able to defend yourself does not mean being able to turn into an objectively better riot barrier that can only be answered by intense firepower or a handful of specific mechanics/tools. I do not like being encouraged to buy or bring heavy ballistics/lasers as antag/security because someone decided 'yes I'm going to place myself in a combat situation with a meme ability as the justification'.

11 hours ago, Zer0Winds said:

However, they can't move in this proposed state, so the most that you can do is like... block a door or something. And a Bulwark probably wouldn't even do it except to protect another Vaurca, or especially to keep a Ta safe.

Bolting was nerfed to shit for a firm reason. Blocking a door is one of the single strongest moves you can do, especially if it can't just be crowbarred out of the way.

This ability sounds like something that should be solely in the capacity of Warforms or some other admin-spawned entity, not a station race.

[Colfer]

As long as I can beat the Ra until they unfold (or die) for flopping down on the floor like a disobedient child and I'm not punished for doing so if im doing it as security, I'm only disapproving of this.
However, if this ability makes it even more difficult to hurt them without something like a rail gun or an energy sword (OR ANYTHING CLOSE TO THIS) then I absolutely cannot support this suggestion in any way. We don't need a race that acts as an early warning system if an antagonist tries to attack them and then they just flop on the floor and become immune (or heavily resistant) to damage while calling for help. Much less Ra antagonists using this ability to annoy everybody including security in the same vain as unathi cuff break. 

If a Ra antagonist does something that warrants them being immediately arrested and uses this ability to waste my time, I will dislocate their legs with the same treatment that unathi get for spamming their abilities to break cuffs constantly. What im saying is that; this adds nothing other than a headache for everybody other than the Ra and whatever is behind them.

[Arrow768]

1 hour ago, Carver said:

Bolting was nerfed to shit for a firm reason. Blocking a door is one of the single strongest moves you can do, especially if it can't just be crowbarred out of the way.

The thing with bolting is that it was very “cheap” to use and had no consequence if someone forced their way through.

The difference with that ability is that if someone needs to force their way through it can have severe consequences for the Vaurca.
If it is made clear (icly and occly) that you can use whatever force is required to discourage a ta from continuing to use a blocking ability then I don’t see too much of an issue with it. (And yes, that includes beating it with a Batton until it either moves or dies)

[Gr33d]

someone said that we could just, use a crowbar on it to open it, I think that is a very good solution to this issue. If anything crowbarring with a "loading bar" maybe three times could cause a Ra to open like a clam and maybe cause hallos paincrit? Also, Ra are not actually tanky at all to begin with and certainly dont need a rail gun to kill. This is the way to make them tanky without being OP imo, because right now, they are weaker than other vaurca in combat.

[Zer0Winds]

They aren't supposed to be memeing with it, they're supposed to be doing literally what they are said to do; shield other vaurca. You shouldn't be planting yourself firmly into a door to stop a random guy with a railgun because you can. You should only do it to keep preferably another Vaurca safe. Ra especially are discouraged from dying as it is based solely on the fact they're less than a year old, they are too young to be uploaded to VR when they die. The only time I see a Ra actually doing that realistically is to protect another vaurca, ESPECIALLY a Ta.

Yeah they're not made for combat. They're made to literally lift heavy stuff, and defend other Vaurca. They're called Bulwarks for a reason, and this really does not seem all that overpowered. This makes it sound like you're going to have to get like, a bluespace artillery shot to remove the Ra, but that's literally not the suggestion at all. A crowbar, was suggested to be capable of removing the Ra. Literally beating them was suggested.

Besides, Vaurca can use hivenet no matter what, even in crit, attacking a vaurca in any capacity is an 'early warning system' as long as there are at least two on the station, or one and any stationbound.

[Happy_Fox]

Very well put. Ra are supposed to be very tough but in a defensive manner. They currently aren't and die very very quickly (this happened in the Bayonet Hand event when one was trying to save another vaurca). I have no idea where the idea they would be invincible requiring BSA to dislodge came from. Blocking a single tile is also only really effective in very specific places. Ignoring for a moment that you can literally just dislodge them/burn them until they move - most of the station can be accessed through separate routes or has several doors in a row (like the main corridors or department entrances). I think some people are blowing the tactical advantages of a slow, defensive-only bug turning into a single tile piece of inanimate and very destroyable, flammable terrain completely out of proportion.

[Myphicbowser]

People just hate content for Vaurca, and having an actually playable subspecies is too much for some. Personally playing a Bulwark right now is agonizing, you can't defend like you can lore wise. You can't lift like you can lorewise. You can't survive like you can lorewise.

 

Playing a Bulwark is just agony, and if I had some mechanical incentives to offset the fact that I am slower then a Breacher Suit, yeah I might consider playing more as my Ra.

[KingOfThePing]

Feel free to code lifting/weights. Other than that it is nothing new that some species cannot perform like in lore. It took ages until Tajara got darkvision, despite being lore. 

Also generally saying "people hate content for vaurca" is just senselessly talking down on people. No one hates content for vaurca, but no one wants unfun mechanics either. What is proposed here is just not good. Anything balancing wise, regarding speed and survivability is a whole other topic