Rename/Repurpose XO to Flight/Crew Chief

[Sycmos]

Considering the substantial delay in action since the discussion regarding making XO 2IC I took it upon myself to make a thread with my initial concept for replacing XO and giving it and OM more of an identity without resorting to reorganizing command powers.

 

The initial proposal is as follows:

 

The primary issue that spawns from making the XO a true 2IC is that it has the potential to replicate the dilemma of unseating a captain or choosing an acting captain, without the simplicity of having a general command vote, which then forces the remainder of command to fall into a hierarchy in the event there's an absence of authority. If the 2IC's authority supersedes that of the other command staff they can simply choose to take acting captain regardless of whether or not command are comfortable with the character in question simply by virtue of their station, and if their authority supersedes that of the other command then ultimately they can choose to throw a vote of no confidence against the captain by weight of their station. If there is no XO, do we fill the position of 2IC or skip straight to acting captain? What if there isn't an XO available and the captain chooses a command member to fill in as 2IC? You then have the issue of who gets picked for this secondary position, and thus an entirely new problem of establishing a hierarchy arises.

A more simple fix that would avoid the issue of navalizing command would be this:

- Give OM authority over Service and Operations, leaving the XO to duties involving the bridge and its armaments, coordinating with Operations to load guns and Engineering to prime the Leviathan and optimize the engine
- Rename XO to something that does not deliberately imply being second in command, like Flight Chief or Crew Chief, implying their responsibility for the Horizon as a flying vessel, its operators (Bridge Crew), and its satellite vessels (Spark, Intrepid, Canary)
- (Whitelist/CCIA issue) Write and enact step-by-step protocol on choosing a new captain with X amount of command staff to keep accountability

The further away we stay from militarizing the positions on the Horizon the better we will be able to keep similar trends from our setting, which will serve to better set us apart from being compared to Bay (which already happens far too often as it is).

Edited August 31, 2023 by Sycmos
Updated proposal to include addition of the Canary.

[ClemTheDuck]

i really like this idea, Flight/crew Chief is very distinct and fits the Horizon setting, as well as giving the role itself an actual focus. 

[CatsinHD]

I like the idea quite of lot of renaming and changing the duties of XO and OM. On fact, it was my original suggestion to rename XO rather than make it 2iC, although my suggestions were Chief Bridge Officer or something similar.

I will note on the topic of enacting acting captain, there is already procedure for this on the Chain of Command page: https://wiki.aurorastation.org/index.php?title=Chain_of_Command#Appointing_an_Acting_Captain

The process is as simple as it looks on there. It is just a majority command vote, that's it, and there's no plans to change that.

[Dreamix]

I like this, and I think it'd be better than 2IC XO.

"Executive Officer" is a very bad name for a position that is not actually 2IC.

[Lent23]

I hold a strong opinion that, at the very least, Service should fall under the OM as opposed to the XO. Not only would it make it easier to actually fulfil bounties, but the idea that basic day-to-day operations should all fall under one manager seems fitting. It would make the OM role more appealing as well, because as it stands there isn't much for an OM to do other than "oversee" hangar technicians, who are generally pretty autonomous regardless - not to mention that shaft miners are extremely autonomous and the machinist is on the other end of the ship (and should probably be moved back to science imo anyways)

I am a fan of 2IC XO, but if we're not getting any actual feedback on how that's going, I definitely support this as an alternative.

That being said, I think that people focus too much on the replacing a captain aspect of a 2IC XO - when is the last time you actually saw a captain forcibly removed from their position? Ultimately, the XO is on the bridge, generally has the best relationship with the captain, spends the most time around the captain, has an idea for how the ship is going, and can alleviate a lot of the workload from the Captain given the right tools. I don't really think you need to fill the position of 2IC with the lack of an XO. Combining Service and Operations would leave the XO with just the bridge crew - give them access to some more radio channels and their role becomes essentially "Captain Support" - they won't have a true department to command unlike every other command member, which is what makes them a good 2IC, only having to focus on supporting the ship.

[ShakyJake]

XO is definitely a very misleading title for a role that isn't intended to be second in command, so I'd support that being changed. However, function wise, it seems that the XO is responsible for ID access changes as well as managing ship funds. They're given all the equipment and programs to do this mechanically, and are the ones these tasks often get delegated to in round whenever relevant. The wiki also seems to say these are the XO's responsibilities. With this change, would these responsibilities still fall under the Flight / Crew Chief, or would they be reassigned to another command role, like OM?

[Sycmos]

54 minutes ago, ShakyJake said:

XO is definitely a very misleading title for a role that isn't intended to be second in command, so I'd support that being changed. However, function wise, it seems that the XO is responsible for ID access changes as well as managing ship funds. They're given all the equipment and programs to do this mechanically, and are the ones these tasks often get delegated to in round whenever relevant. The wiki also seems to say these are the XO's responsibilities. With this change, would these responsibilities still fall under the Flight / Crew Chief, or would they be reassigned to another command role, like OM?

I feel that it would make the most sense to give responsibility of personnel matters to the OM as it would give the would-be Flight/Crew Chief more breathing room to handle matters pertaining to the Horizon and its satellite vessels. The OM already has underwhelming responsibilities in its current iteration, so I feel purview over Service and Operations with credentials and payroll responsibilities would give it some content that would make it feel more whole.

[Fluffy]

I prefer XO being 2IC over this proposal, for the reasons outlined in the relative thread that we're still pending the results on.

 

To address the points brought:

7 hours ago, Sycmos said:

it has the potential to replicate the dilemma of unseating a captain or choosing an acting captain, without the simplicity of having a general command vote, which then forces the remainder of command to fall into a hierarchy in the event there's an absence of authority.

Just like the captain can be removed with sufficient reason via a vote, so does the second in line of succession or elected acting captain

7 hours ago, Sycmos said:

If the 2IC's authority supersedes that of the other command staff they can simply choose to take acting captain regardless of whether or not command are comfortable with the character in question simply by virtue of their station

This would apply to the captain too, the captain does not need the rest of command to "be comfortable with the character in question", so I am not sure why it would matter here

7 hours ago, Sycmos said:

if their authority supersedes that of the other command then ultimately they can choose to throw a vote of no confidence against the captain by weight of their station

The regulations requires a majority of command to vote for this to happen, being 2IC does not grant you this ability outside established procedures, your vote has no additional weight in respect to any other command member on the matter unless stated otherwise

7 hours ago, Sycmos said:

If there is no XO, do we fill the position of 2IC or skip straight to acting captain?

The reason for a 2IC is to fill the gap in case the 1IC is incapacitated and there's something to handle, there is no need for it to be filled if there's nothing to handle, just like there would not be to elect an acting captain; if there's something to handle and the captain is incapacitated, the 2IC takes that position, if the 2IC is incapacitated too, someone else should likewise take that position

A line of succession can be established, or the third acting captain could be voted, for the very rare occurrences where both the 1IC and 2IC are incapacitated

It is important to note that IRL civilian ships have a structure with a chain of succession, as I have discussed in the other thread

 

Ultimately, it is a tool to quickly respond to emergency situations and threats, makes sense to be there, and the asserted issues that it would have that I have seen presented are either just equivalent to what a captain would be under, or easily solvable via regulations and policies

I therefore cannot support the whole of this proposal (though I tentatively agree on some department line reorganizations), I am however open to change my opinion on the matter if an issue can be presented that is exclusive of the XO being 2IC, not solvable via regulations and policies, and not a whitelist issue

Edited August 31, 2023 by Fluffy

[N8-Toe]

I prefer XO being 2IC over this in general. Due to things people have brought up such as having someone to step up in crisis, and since I've started playing captain myself. Having a 2IC to help handle things during busy rounds would be great. And on your issues. if the people in command are uncomfortable with the XO character taking command if the captain is incapacitated? Cool, awesome, sounds like fun RP.

on this proposal. There isn't much flight command to be done on most rounds, this is neutering the XO role which right now is in a neat little niche. We're on a ship with guns that's in deep space, thats expected to defend itself. some "navalization" is to be expected, and I dont think we have gone overboard at all.

[Carver]

As someone who rather despises the Bayification presented by 2IC, I’d quite like this. Though I’m rather torn on handing service to the OM given that overseeing the bridge by itself doesn’t offer too much, I’d personally like the return of Service Manager instead, but if that’s unfeasible then this route is perfectly fine. Flight Chief is a fine title.

[Boggle08]

I strongly disagree with this suggestion out of the principle of it being a retraction in what the XO directly presides over. Most of the functions of XO, such as flying the ship or organizing expeditions are meant to be delegated away to their bridge crew. It's a job where you spend all your time sitting around with your hands in your ass, aside from access changes and command functions which every command role is expected to perform.

They would become the most redundant and vestigial organ in the command roster, more than they already are, as service generally runs itself. Nothing would really change much with how XO plays with this, but I don't want it to set the precedent that the XO is "complete". It would just become a Bridge QM, and the only reason it would have to hold onto command authority is to make decisions about where the ship goes.

Edited September 1, 2023 by Boggle08
worded that shit way too strongly

[Fluffy]

With the XO being scheduled to become second in command, and after consultation with the head dev, this suggestion is considered essentially rejected as mutually exclusive with the accepted (XO2IC) one

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