Apartment Server Ban - My Grievances

[TechnoKat]

My whole opinion on this. People just have to move on and forget about things like this whole drama case, what's done is done. Doomberg already faced shitton of negativity, let's change that?

[Jakers457]

My whole opinion on this. People just have to move on and forget about things like this whole drama case, what's done is done. Doomberg already faced shitton of negativity, let's change that?

 

Techno, my little powergamey gem, I would shake your hand if I didn't fear being stungloved despite it all being pretend.

[nanotoxin]

There is really no way I can write much without sounding completely unprofessional and losing my cool for certain members of this community. So! I will say little and address France's with what I believe!

Personally I support the ban, though I'm sure just posting this will have most of you asking for my head and burning my body at the stake. She hated anyone who played Security and constantly and created multiple threads telling them how they need to change the way they play (( which some do, but blaming a entire department for the faults of a few is stupid. I don't blame the entire civilian branch for the journalist publishing woodys got wood over and over)). She has yelled at staff and players in LOOC when something hasn't gone her way, made many players feel u welcomed by her general attitude OOC wise amoung other things.

But she was never punished because this kind of reaction! But she makes a Skype group talking about over throwing skull and doom and the rest of staff because "We can do it better!", then leaks logs of ERP to players to laugh at them and people don't see the problem.

The group kind of reminds me of those popular girls in high school when the teacher gives one of them detention for being rude to another student. its also hilarious because Covert did a similar situation but where was the thread for him when he did this? He deserved the ban but at least be consistant with your complaints.

Honestly at this point? feel free to rip me apart, but that's why I believe she needed to go.

 

Honestly, you're the first person to give reasons other than "she's just a baddie, ew get her outta here", So thank you for that.

I would like to clear some things up though.

1) I made the group.

2) We never discussed overthrowing skull, although we did say certain aspects of the lore could be improved(That's about the closest we came to saying anything about overthrowing).

The group was made as a place for the friends I made to be in a skype chat and talk about what ever.

But, I'm only being a sassy popular girl because the group is being generalized as a group of Aurora hating, meta gamers, cliquey, and all the other juicy names.

[Jakers457]

Just... just think about it.

[TechnoKat]

My whole opinion on this. People just have to move on and forget about things like this whole drama case, what's done is done. Doomberg already faced shitton of negativity, let's change that?

 

Techno, my little powergamey gem, I would shake your hand if I didn't fear being stungloved despite it all being pretend.

 

Go ahead. Unsure if the post was a joke but: I'm not in favour of anyone

[Jakers457]

Go ahead. Unsure if the post was a joke but: I'm not in favour of anyone

 

I'm mainly in favor of moving on with our lives.

[Chaznoodles]

I'd rather this get dealt with properly so the excuse of 'BUt people just wanted it left alone and to move on' doesn't come up in future if this sort of attitude continues within staff.

[TechnoKat]

Cassie had already posted she does not want to be within Aurora anymore, why bother continuing the argument? It's just going to cause another chaos anytime soon.

[Jakers457]

I'd rather this get dealt with properly so the excuse of 'BUt people just wanted it left alone and to move on' doesn't come up in future if this sort of attitude continues within staff.

 

Then when it does cause the community to fall apart, we will simply find another community to go with.

[Chaznoodles]

Cassie had already posted she does not want to be within Aurora anymore, why bother continuing the argument? It's just going to cause another chaos anytime soon.

 

Because it's a matter of principle. Staff should realise that the actions taken were a mistake, as was trying to back it up in the face of the player backlash. Deal with it now before it happens again.

[Johnny Mnemonic]

Cassie had already posted she does not want to be within Aurora anymore, why bother continuing the argument? It's just going to cause another chaos anytime soon.

 

because this is about how staff dealt with this rather then Cassy being in any way relevant to the conversation. If you just intend to persist in shoving this under the rug, might i suggest you walk away from the argument? There's such a disturbing amount of you people that just want to end this prematurely and let the problem fester, you, thundy, Jakers, Delta, Tenenza, yada yada yada...

can we maybe stop with the "guise pls nu figt". It's only gonna cover this in useless posts burying the actual discussion taking place. You've made your point, I get it, thanks a bunch

might as well ban someone for being from Croatia and then when they don't want to come back pull out the "well, them not comin' back means we ain't gotta fix anything" and move on, like, seriously, problems should maybe be adressed

Edited July 14, 2015 by Guest

[josh1133]

There is really no way I can write much without sounding completely unprofessional and losing my cool for certain members of this community. So! I will say little and address France's with what I believe!

Personally I support the ban, though I'm sure just posting this will have most of you asking for my head and burning my body at the stake. She hated anyone who played Security and constantly and created multiple threads telling them how they need to change the way they play (( which some do, but blaming a entire department for the faults of a few is stupid. I don't blame the entire civilian branch for the journalist publishing woodys got wood over and over)). She has yelled at staff and players in LOOC when something hasn't gone her way, made many players feel u welcomed by her general attitude OOC wise amoung other things.

But she was never punished because this kind of reaction! But she makes a Skype group talking about over throwing skull and doom and the rest of staff because "We can do it better!", then leaks logs of ERP to players to laugh at them and people don't see the problem.

The group kind of reminds me of those popular girls in high school when the teacher gives one of them detention for being rude to another student. its also hilarious because Covert did a similar situation but where was the thread for him when he did this? He deserved the ban but at least be consistant with your complaints.

Honestly at this point? feel free to rip me apart, but that's why I believe she needed to go.

 

Honestly, you're the first person to give reasons other than "she's just a baddie, ew get her outta here", So thank you for that.

I would like to clear some things up though.

1) I made the group.

2) We never discussed overthrowing skull, although we did say certain aspects of the lore could be improved(That's about the closest we came to saying anything about overthrowing).

The group was made as a place for the friends I made to be in a skype chat and talk about what ever.

But, I'm only being a sassy popular girl because the group is being generalized as a group of Aurora hating, meta gamers, cliquey, and all the other juicy names.

 

I may have misunderstood a few things, but judging by previous post it sounds like at least a few people in your skype group talked about over throwing the server. Also, I don't mean everyone in your group, just the ones demanding blood.

Those may have not been the reasons she was banned, so don't take that as "Staff believes this" as I hate to talk for staff on any occasion unless asked to do so. Overall though, Cassie broke many rules and rubbed many people the wrong way during her time here.

On a side note, Chaz, I will not be apologizing to Cassie, nor will I apologize to Reddit, you, or this community for my opinion on the matter. If that makes me bad staff, I like a admin to tell me and I'll write a 9 paragraph post quitting my job and apologizing to the community.

[Jakers457]

Cassie had already posted she does not want to be within Aurora anymore, why bother continuing the argument? It's just going to cause another chaos anytime soon.

 

because this is about how staff dealt with this rather then Cassy being in any way relevant to the conversation. If you just intend to persist in shoving this under the rug, might i suggest you walk away from the argument? There's such a disturbing amount of you people that just want to end this prematurely and let the problem fester, you, thundy, Jakers, Delta, Tenenza, yada yada yada...

can we maybe stop with the "guise pls nu figt". It's only gonna cover this in useless posts burying the actual discussion taking place. You've made your point, I get it, thanks a bunch

 

We're merely saying why the fuck are you wasting so much energy on an argument over a digital community when there's undoubtedly more important things in your life.

[TechnoKat]

Cassie had already posted she does not want to be within Aurora anymore, why bother continuing the argument? It's just going to cause another chaos anytime soon.

 

because this is about how staff dealt with this rather then Cassy being in any way relevant to the conversation. If you just intend to persist in shoving this under the rug, might i suggest you walk away from the argument? There's such a disturbing amount of you people that just want to end this prematurely and let the problem fester, you, thundy, Jakers, Delta, Tenenza, yada yada yada...

can we maybe stop with the "guise pls nu figt". It's only gonna cover this in useless posts burying the actual discussion taking place. You've made your point, I get it, thanks a bunch

might as well ban someone for being from Croatia and then when they don't want to come back pull out the "well, them not comin' back means we ain't gotta fix anything" and move on, like, seriously, problems should maybe be adressed

 

Or you could just leave the server which has people who make their own decisions and see it fitting for the server? You simply can't change people, staff are taking much more abuse than you and Team Cassy should. This is disgusting of you.

[Johnny Mnemonic]

We're merely saying why the fuck are you wasting so much energy on an argument over a digital community when there's undoubtedly more important things in your life.

 

Jakers, there's more important things in my life then SS13 too, doesn't mean i'll stop playing, and while we're on note, shouldn't this apply to you too? there's undoubtedly more important things in your life then telling me that i have more important things in my life, and that's assuming i don't enjoy debates and arguments and what not. Which i personally do, writing these things out isn't a chore for me

Do you enjoy telling me I have a life?

 

Or you could just leave the server which has people who make their own decisions and see it fitting for the server? You simply can't change people, staff are taking much more abuse than you and Team Cassy should. This is disgusting of you.

I'll gladly wear the title of "disgusting" if it brings about any change. And I utterly despise the notion of people not being able to change, fault me as you may, i am gonna point out if people are in the wrong, because otherwise they can't improve.

and plus, clearly there's people still in your community that don't see these decisions as "fitting". Are you going to ignore them? Note, this was made by Frances, who wants to do the server better. Unless you actually want to address her and not bitch at me, do you think you wouldn't do better then walk away?

[Frances]

People arguing about whether this is an issue that can or should be fixed are completely missing the point of this thread.

Of course you want to fix issues in your community. And this isn't about bringing justice for Cassie, because people managed to piss/alienate Cassie to such an extent that she has no interest in coming back to the server. So there's hardly any point in doing anything for her.

It's not an apology to her that I'm demanding. It's an explanation for what was done, handed out to the community as a whole. I'm a bit sad that even a lot of staff who posted here seem to miss that.

I'll reply to Doomberg's post in a bit - hopefully we manage to get back on topic by then.

[Jakers457]

People arguing about whether this is an issue that can or should be fixed are completely missing the point of this thread.

Of course you want to fix issues in your community. And this isn't about bringing justice for Cassie, because people managed to piss/alienate Cassie to such an extent that she has no interest in coming back to the server. So there's hardly any point in doing anything for her.

It's not an apology to her that I'm demanding. It's an explanation for what was done, handed out to the community as a whole. I'm a bit sad that even a lot of staff who posted here seem to miss that.

I'll reply to Doomberg's post in a bit - hopefully we manage to get back on topic by then.

 

If I am to recommend anything Frances, PM Doom and speak to them without interference. It' will probably go a lot smoother

[Chaznoodles]

I like how people are now targeting those who are against the ban in an aggressive manner. This is why Aurora has a problem.

I've said my piece on this.

[SgtSammac]

I like how people are now targeting those who are against the ban in an aggressive manner. This is why Aurora has a problem.

I've said my piece on this.

 

Its going the other way as well Chaz. If anything, I think it is MORE from the other side.

Both sides are at fault. Both sides need to stop, read and listen.

Edited July 14, 2015 by Guest

[TechnoKat]

People learn their mistakes themselves, not us telling them what they did was wrong. I'm not going to continue anymore unless I see I should join back in with this topic. Hence the community is crippling, we're all being political in issues like this, making some people look dumb, maybe myself as well, but of course, staff did some terrible decisions. Pointing the issue out is more civil than posting a whole novel of a lash back towards staff, aggressively.

[Frances]

If I am to recommend anything Frances, PM Doom and speak to them without interference. It' will probably go a lot smoother

I'm not here for my personal satisfaction, though. This is something that a lot of people are dissatisfied with, and it would be nice to reach a global resolution about it.

However, if half the community simply wants to burn the administration at a stake, and the other half wants to give up on discussing the issue despite thinking they have been wronged (that is hyperbole, but many people have displayed one of these two judgments in this thread), then it doesn't leave any leeway for admins to solve this, and there's really not much I can do.

The one thing I do agree with Techno on is that people telling staff things can't be fixed isn't helping (whether they do this in bold red letters or normal text is irrelevant - and whether people who have actual points bring them up politely or through shitposting is mostly irrelevant as well, as long as others are capable of understanding them). However, I disagree with Techno that the issue should just be dropped - should people be capable of moderating themselves and refraining from engaging in personal attacks, we could actually get somewhere with this thread.

[Guest]

Due to an incident in which only our players/community members were involved, on a server that piggybacked on ours for obtaining the majority of its playerbase.

 

In all the history of SS13, with its ridiculous bursts of server Drama, badminry and so forth - there has never been a case I am aware of, in which an administrator of one server publically claimed ownership of another server which he doesn't actually own or moderate on..

If you're willing to be the first, be my guest but It won't do much to reflect you in a positive light.

 

The semi-public mockery of our players is what bothers me, not the fact that it was ERP.

 

If said players make a mockery of themselves on another server and you feel so offended at the prospect of it, you should ban the players responsible for representing the server in a negative light. What you can not do is claim authority over the other server and ban the host, while making the players' semi-public mockery public, along with your own.

 

I picked them for the sake of illustrating the entire "revolutionary" mindset I've seen constantly manifest in someone who hardly played on the server.

 

I can immediately point out another person who hardly played on the server with a "revolutionary" mindset.

If I remember correctly, you closed two complaint threads to defend her and refused to punish her for said mindset, or actual ingame rule violations.

 

Whether you agree with the initial measure and its execution or not, I find it extremely hard to believe that you can still fault the staff after taking in consideration all that's happened, the announced intent of certain members of the group in question to do as much damage to Aurora as possible, to attempt to publicly slander/humiliate various members of staff, etcetera - especially when most of their actions have been in line with said intent.

 

If you don't consider your actions faulty, then why do you consider publically pointing them out to be an act of humiliation?

If you're convinced you've done nothing wrong, why do you consider people being made aware of what you consider a just decision to be a form of slander?

How can I humiliate you if your decision is flawless and fair? If we're to assume your actions as staff weren't faulty, then I would be completely unable to act on my intention to harm, humiliate or slander Aurora. It simply wouldn't work.

 

But she was never punished because this kind of reaction! But she makes a Skype group talking about over throwing skull and doom and the rest of staff because "We can do it better!", then leaks logs of ERP to players to laugh at them and people don't see the problem.

 

If you're going to make such a claim, the burden of proof lies on you.

Don't twist my words and lie. If you're right, you don't have to resort to it to win the argument. The only person who insisted on making grandiose speeches about overthrowing everyone and taking control was Delta.

Delta is part of your clique, not mine. You take care of him.

I do congratulate you (non-sarcastically) on being the first person in these threads to be honest enough to admit that this is entirely rooted in Cassy's dislike of security, though.

 

Or you could just leave the server which has people who make their own decisions and see it fitting for the server? You simply can't change people, staff are taking much more abuse than you and Team Cassy should. This is disgusting of you.

 

Doomberg and Skull decided to staple a huge wall of ridiculous slander coupled with a permaban to an announcement on the top of the forum, under the assumption that the community will be happy to pelt her with rotten fruit and lynch her to their heart's content. That post is still stapled there.

If this ridiculous and immensely hypocritical witch hunt backfired for the staff and they ended up being the ones tied to a pyre instead, than the staff should deal with the result of their own intentionally malignant actions backfiring on them.

After countless weeks of "Stop the witch hunts!" and "Oh god lynchings, lynchings!" from the Staff's side, the only actual witch hunt on the server ends up being lead and organized by the same people who were trying to stop witch hunts for such a long time. Isn't that ironic?

Anyhow, Doomberg should be deadminned, Cass should be unbanned out of princible even if she won't return.

[Skull132]

Let's see. And let's run through something.

A ball was dropped during the decision making process, which lasted 48 hours.

• Mistake one: "I cannot care" was turned into "I did care." The reason for this ties into a momentary lack of judgement. Which I cannot explain, I was not in the mindset required to make a decision such as that, and as a result, judgement lacked reason. I fell back onto agreeing with Doomberg.
• Mistake two: Failure to recognize an improper mindset during decision making. This is probably the root cause of most of these shenanigans. I usually have a mental ticker which enables me to nope the hell away from any and all things leadership, unless absolutely required, until I've gathered myself properly. I failed to recognize such a state, and as such, a decision was made without the thought fully required.
  
• Mistake three: Praise -- Public; Punish -- Private. Was not followed. Self-explanatory as far as mistakes go.
  
• Mistake four: Hands were stuck where hands probably shouldn't have been stuck (at least, not without a soft-entry and proper foresight). And we got terribly burnt for it, to the 4th degree, probably.
  
• Mistake five: People were involved needlessly. Namely, my snarky get at the original thread. Unnecessary, needless, stupid. It was a golden opportunity that I should have realized I should never, ever seize. And I apologize for that.

 

Now, that's a clinical assessment of my own actions and involvement, from my own perspective. Feel free to add to it as necessary (although note that you'd be trying to put your thoughts into my head, at that point, which may not end well). I would like to say that with the second matter, considerably the key, is something that I have only mistaken against once before. And that was in an environment elsewhere. But, these are excuses, so I'll leave them be.

For the more humane bit? This entire situation is gobshite awful, and I apologize for the amateurish mistake against principles of leadership that got us here. The situation could have been managed infinitely better -- it was not. The situation could have probably ended with a less harsh move -- it did not. By now, all of the cards are probably on the table. The only question is, what next, gentlemen?

Oh. And if anyone thinks that we're willing or even planning to repeat this mistake. Yeah, no. Even an idiot understands that a hot stove burns. Plus, if I see another shitstorm like this, I'll probably take early retirement from here as I wait for my sorry ass to get conscripted.

[Johnny Mnemonic]

I may have misunderstood a few things, but judging by previous post it sounds like at least a few people in your skype group talked about over throwing the server. Also, I don't mean everyone in your group, just the ones demanding blood.

Those may have not been the reasons she was banned, so don't take that as "Staff believes this" as I hate to talk for staff on any occasion unless asked to do so. Overall though, Cassie broke many rules and rubbed many people the wrong way during her time here.

On a side note, Chaz, I will not be apologizing to Cassie, nor will I apologize to Reddit, you, or this community for my opinion on the matter. If that makes me bad staff, I like a admin to tell me and I'll write a 9 paragraph post quitting my job and apologizing to the community.

 

ok, phew, Josh, no one in the group (except Delta) wanted to overthrow the server. All of us actually just went and found another server to play at. No one even wanted, or wants, to be /back/ to the server, let alone take it over. What are you even basing this on? I want to call this out on being like, stupid, but it's not, it's more insane. Josh, i am gonna need you to just trust me (because i don't know how to prove a negative in this case), no one in the group wants the server for their grubby little hands. Seriously what are you basing this on?!

Yea, Cassy broke a lot of rules like...which one was it? her "rubbing people the wrong way" or "out of server conduct". I forget. Maybe it was her entire post history. Or maybe you just didn't like her because you play security and she pointed out shitcurity? Please feel free to tell me i'm a horrible person for thinking that, but it's the first thing that crossed my mind seeing as you don't have anything solid on Cassy except mentioning security in specific.

 

Is behaviour outside of the Aurora server, which impacts its players and reputation, to reflect on someone in-Aurora through administrative action?

The answer now is an apparent yes.

holy shit, that is terrifying, Jackboot. so you mean that out of server conduct punishable on server now totally a thing? you don't see a problem with that at all?!

Doomberg is gonna need a seperate post

[Erik Tiber]

Let's see. And let's run through something.

A ball was dropped during the decision making process, which lasted 48 hours.

• Mistake one: "I cannot care" was turned into "I did care." The reason for this ties into a momentary lack of judgement. Which I cannot explain, I was not in the mindset required to make a decision such as that, and as a result, judgement lacked reason. I fell back onto agreeing with Doomberg.
• Mistake two: Failure to recognize an improper mindset during decision making. This is probably the root cause of most of these shenanigans. I usually have a mental ticker which enables me to nope the hell away from any and all things leadership, unless absolutely required, until I've gathered myself properly. I failed to recognize such a state, and as such, a decision was made without the thought fully required.
  
• Mistake three: Praise -- Public; Punish -- Private. Was not followed. Self-explanatory as far as mistakes go.
  
• Mistake four: Hands were stuck where hands probably shouldn't have been stuck (at least, not without a soft-entry and proper foresight). And we got terribly burnt for it, to the 4th degree, probably.
  
• Mistake five: People were involved needlessly. Namely, my snarky get at the original thread. Unnecessary, needless, stupid. It was a golden opportunity that I should have realized I should never, ever seize. And I apologize for that.

 

Now, that's a clinical assessment of my own actions and involvement, from my own perspective. Feel free to add to it as necessary (although note that you'd be trying to put your thoughts into my head, at that point, which may not end well). I would like to say that with the second matter, considerably the key, is something that I have only mistaken against once before. And that was in an environment elsewhere. But, these are excuses, so I'll leave them be.

For the more humane bit? This entire situation is gobshite awful, and I apologize for the amateurish mistake against principles of leadership that got us here. The situation could have been managed infinitely better -- it was not. The situation could have probably ended with a less harsh move -- it did not. By now, all of the cards are probably on the table by now. The only question is, what now, gentlemen?

Oh. And if anyone thinks that we're willing or even planning to repeat this mistake. Yeah, no. Even an idiot understands that a hot stove burns. Plus, if I see another shitstorm like this, I'll probably take early retirement from here as I wait for my sorry ass to get conscripted.

I thank you for your self-awareness Skull, I certainly hope things on Aurora improve from here on out. This is a good first step, and I'll be sure to take this into account when discussing this incident in the future. Hope this pans out.

And if things improve, then I hope that Aurora's reputation will reflect that.