[Expired] Unban request - Server Ban

[Absynth]

BYOND Key: Absynth

Total Ban Length: Day ban, science job ban

Banning staff member's Key: SirCatnip

Reason of Ban:' Reason: Take a day. Cool off. Catnip is applying a science jobban. If you want to contest this, do it on the forums. Good day..'

Reason for Appeal:

I join as Ein, a weapons maker from day 1. Has never used them on an antag before (has AS antag..). I board the station and am immediately bombarded by requests to get to R&D and make bombs to take care of unknown intruders. Happily I comply, and within about 10 minutes I'm making my bombs in toxins while R&D is locked down. Meanwhile I hear building/construction noises in maint and Cadmus messages me saying the intruders are around R&D maintenance. With the area sealed off I keep working, and suddenly half my lab and most of maintenance explodes, with me caught directly in the blast. Everything is sloshed around and I am sucked out into the breached space along with the one bomb I had finished. When I awaken in space I am in hard crit with the bomb next to me; I am immediately shot at by a red hardsuited person firing odd laser things at me. I pick up the bomb, throw it, and trigger it and everything blows up again.

When I come to I am in the hospital, my claw is ripped off, and then I am banned.

Wait, what?

Please tell me how this makes any sense at all. I had no other avenue of escape. I was being shot at. I had no tools except a bomb on the floor directly next to me. I couldn't even see what was left of my lab. Please for the love of christ explain to me how a warrior caste bomb-making vaurca is supposed to do.. what exactly? just die, because Ein happens to be a scientist? What the hell? Why do I have to be security to be able to defend myself?

[Serveris]

As a note. I applied the ban listed at the top. Not catnip. Sircatnip applied a perma science jobban. I applied a day ban due to you getting extremely testy in admin PMs.

[Absynth]

I'd really like to know what I was supposed to do instead of throw the bomb at the antag shooting at me. We're both in space, there's ruins all around us, there's no way for me to escape since everything in RD is sealed. All I have is my air tank and the bomb I was working on. I am a weapons maker and I make and throw bombs every day. My life is clearly and immediately in danger. I honestly can't even believe I'm being punished for this.

[Absynth]

Just remember kids, if you're not playing security, your only role on Aurora is to sit back and die.

[Faris]

Just remember kids, if you're not playing security, your only role on Aurora is to sit back and die.

 

Posting these things is not helping your case, you may as well delete this thread. Just let the appeal run its course, you have other characters you can play while this is sorted out.

[Guest]

Just remember kids, if you're not playing security, your only role on Aurora is to sit back and die.

 

Because throwing a bomb that also annihilates everything including its intended target at an antagonist is a sane thing to do.

[Catnip]

A full post from me will be coming soon, but for now I'll say this.

As Delta said, there is a big difference between defending yourself within reason and literally gibbing the guy.

To be in the middle of fighting Security and suddenly get gibbed by a scientist who is refusing to fearRP, is an OOC issue.

As for the ban, it's 24 hours, you should know from your last appeal that we don't accept appeals for bans that are 24 hours or less.

[Absynth]

Just remember kids, if you're not playing security, your only role on Aurora is to sit back and die.

 

Because throwing a bomb that also annihilates everything including its intended target at an antagonist is a sane thing to do.

 

Sure, except someone already blew the RD maint hallway. My bomb did nothing except blow up the red hardsuit shooting directly at me. I was only even there because I was sucked out into the hall.

Let's see what's the "sane thing to do".

You are a scientist at work making bombs, because the RD/sec told you to. Your workplace is suddenly blown up by unknown hostiles. You have nothing except a bomb on the floor next to you, someone shooting blue bolts at you, a tangled mass of blown up fuel pipes between you and whatever's left of the door. The alternatives are either throw the bomb, which is that character's job, or inexplicably die. How can you honestly say that not throwing it would be the smarter thing to do? The most logical? The most realistic? What would any of your characters do?

"fearRP" is frigging nonsense. Learn how to RP. Learn that in character actions = in character consequences. RP is not your in game job. RP is the reasonable actions your character would take. Ein is a warrior caste vaurca thats absolute first instinct would be to throw a bomb that is currently held in hand at a hostile enemy. I don't care if I gibbed some antag who was breaking into my department. I didn't SEARCH for any antags. I was sucked into space and one began shooting at me, so I used what was on hand.

The sane thing to do would be to follow my character's RP and behavior, which anyone who knows Ein would know it's explosions. I don't care about the 24 hour ban (it's bull) but a job ban from science is double bull.

So who was it that set off the first bomb in maintenance? Was it the antag or Lukas Chapman, who also had one? Ifthe problem is gibbing antags now then you'll want to punish him as well.

Oh yeah, and the antag sure as hell didn't try to RP; I got blown out of toxins into space, woke up in crit, and was imediately shot at by the red hardsuited merc. I had no other items or tools except the bomb, which I had just finished and was sucked out into space with me. All my tools were on the floor of toxins.

[Taintedglory]

Ein is a warrior caste vaurca thats absolute first instinct would be to throw a bomb that is currently held in hand at a hostile enemy.

The sane thing to do would be to follow my character's RP and behavior, which anyone who knows Ein would know it's explosions. I don't care about the 24 hour ban (it's bull) but a job ban from science is double bull.

 

Im assuming Ein is a BA vaurca? As in the Combat minded and Combat focused Vaurca? Mentally speaking I dont even see how Ein works in Science. I mean, to be honest then it doesn't make any sense what so ever that Ein is even doing Phoron research, nor does it make any sense that Ein would literally risk dying and waste its Augments and training for a Human station under attack by Human problems.

I honestly think that with your behavior as Ein and other characters of yours this Job ban was justified. You never seem to respect the other players or the station in general with your science exploits, and this one is a major example of this.

[AttyZ]

I have to agree with Absynth on this one. A Warrior caste has every reason to want to kill the nearest thing shooting at it before it breathes it's last breath. It wouldn't be afraid, it would want to take down who is obviously attacking it. Unless there is also more to the actual story, it also seems like he had little to do with the explosions that destroyed the rest of the lab, and only retaliated after. I don't see this jobban as a reasonable thing myself. Why is the perma-jobban a thing? I can however say that you should perhaps calm down a bit, and refrain from replying with further agression, absynth. You might dig yourself into a bigger hole in regards to things like that previous remark, and should allow other people to defend you after you've made your point. It's my opinion that if what you said is true, the jobban can't stick and I, for one, support that it should be removed.

[Guest]

"other people were acting shit so it justifies me acting shitty in return"

nah

[Serveris]

A Warrior caste has every reason to want to kill the nearest thing shooting at it before it breathes it's last breath. It wouldn't be afraid, it would want to take down who is obviously attacking it

 

Warriors (Type B)

Type B are the second most prominent of Vaurca society, taking the form of heavily augmented warriors. Type B can range in size from 6ft tall to 20ft tall. They can be bipedal, quadrupeds, or hextopeds, which are called types BA, BB, and BC respectively. They usually have weapons physically attached to their bodies, making them unwieldy or impractical for any situation other than combat.

Warriors, unlike other types of Vaurca, are not typically passive. This means that they tend to be more suitable for combat orientated positions, while worker and breeder types tend to be poorly suited for the disposition these types of occupations demand.

The majority of warrior caste Vaurca employed by NanoTrasen are drone tier type BA, meaning that they are deprived of most advanced augments and mostly differ from other types simply in that they are more mentally suited for combat.

 

Where the hell are you basing your disposition on warrior vaurcae from? That's like saying a security officer should go down suicide bombing people just because they have a security officer title. Vaurcae, like literally every other species in the game, are expected to make rational decisions minimizing loss of limb or life. Lore in this instance is irrelevant. This is a core server rule. Using your character's species as justification for ignoring these simple core rules will not stand. Note how literally no species has "totally willing to throw down a bomb 4 meters in front of them" listed as a racial trait. That would be because it violates server rules. Species are not given set behavioral attitudes that would explicitly encourage them to break rules, because the lore staff that flesh these species out know better than to try something like that. No matter what your race is, you will not be permitted to validhunt.

[Catnip]

My bomb did nothing except blow up the red hardsuit shooting directly at me.

Logs, vars and witnesses were checked multiple times to confirm that not a single shot was fired at you, the merc was firing at a cyborg and not a single shot contacted with you. Keep in mind it was Ion being fired, thus more reason for a Vaurca to run, instead of charging forward with a bomb.

And you cannot say that running away wasn't an option. You weren't part of the conflict until you forced yourself into the conflict, you had plenty of time, and other possible routes, but you didn't.

Everything else has already been covered by Serv and other posts in this thread.

I'll leave this open for about 24 hours for any further input before closing it.

[Absynth]

My bomb did nothing except blow up the red hardsuit shooting directly at me.

Logs, vars and witnesses were checked multiple times to confirm that not a single shot was fired at you, the merc was firing at a cyborg and not a single shot contacted with you. Keep in mind it was Ion being fired, thus more reason for a Vaurca to run, instead of charging forward with a bomb.

And you cannot say that running away wasn't an option. You weren't part of the conflict until you forced yourself into the conflict, you had plenty of time, and other possible routes, but you didn't.

Everything else has already been covered by Serv and other posts in this thread.

I'll leave this open for about 24 hours for any further input before closing it.

 

Oh my god, you can't be serious. Why are you ruling in a case about you? I made this request to go over your head with someone who wasn't involved.

I wasn't hit by the ion gun, I was shot at while I was in space. The only witnesses were me and the antag and I didn't even see a cyborg there. Oh yeah, and I was already in crit and I had a bomb next to me while being ion gunned. So its either leave it on the floor and try to vaguely run away towards ??? or throw the bomb and hope for the best. How long is it before self defense becomes valid hunting? more than a few seconds? because this whole thing took about 2.

My vaurca was approved by whitelist admins and you have no right to decide how I RP my characters. Nobody's had a problem with Ein before now and it would be 100% out of character to panic and flail or whatever it is catnip wants me to do instead of fight back.

There was no way out of my department and if there was a way I could have got out I would have used it. You weren't there and you weren't watching, but you're judging me as if you were. How is this fair? I took the only reasonable course of action. You're blaming me for the bad aim and bad choices of an antag who blew up toxins and then faced down a scientist with a bomb, and lost. Jobbanning me for it is petty and makes it seem like you're just fishing for reasons.

 

Logs, vars and witnesses were checked multiple times to confirm that not a single shot was fired at you, the merc was firing at a cyborg and not a single shot contacted with you. Keep in mind it was Ion being fired, thus more reason for a Vaurca to run, instead of charging forward with a bomb.

 

No shot contacted me, but I was definitely fired at. Don't blame me for poor aim. Again, if you had actual witnesses you would know that instead of logs.

 

And you cannot say that running away wasn't an option. You weren't part of the conflict until you forced yourself into the conflict, you had plenty of time, and other possible routes, but you didn't.

 

Again, you were not there. I was in toxins, surrounded by fuel, which was then blown up by an antag who was breaking in. I wasn't part of the conflict? What? I had plenty of time? Other routes? I was blown up in crit in space with my hand missing before I even knew what had happened. WHAT other options did I have? WHAT option would be better than throwing the bomb? I was near the mix chamber and maint blew up 5 turfs away. The entrance to my department and all of R&D was cut off with blast doors. Pleas,e please tell me what other routes I had. Please tell me how much time I had, when you weren't there and have no combat logs.

[Absynth]

I mean, let's see. You are blown up and sliding into space. You wake up and theres a) a bomb, b) a guy shooting blue at you, c) a wrecked and darkened half a toxins lab with no power.

Do you:

a) somehow run back into burning, blown up, fuel-filled toxins, smash through the sealed doors while being shot at, escape miraculously, and let the antag have the bomb and access to toxins (and get punished for antag helping)

b) pick up the bomb, throw it, and wake up later in the hospital.

HUH WHAT IS THE MOST LOGICAL CHOICE HERE? WHICH WOULD YOU CHOOSE?

[Absynth]

"other people were acting shit so it justifies me acting shitty in return"

nah

 

All I was doing was my job, and a merc blows it up and tries to kill me. Defending myself with the only weapon I had is hardly "shitty". Who was the merc? I'd like to hear their opinion.

[Guest]

Oh my god, you can't be serious. Why are you ruling in a case about you? I made this request to go over your head with someone who wasn't involved.

 

I mean. Catnip along with everyone else sees the issue with throwing a volatile bomb in order to kill someone. Bombs are coded to be incredibly devastating regardless of the mole value. If you were that close, you literally would've killed yourself with that bomb too. I'm pretty sure someone mentioned that you already did. Mobs instantly die within the devastation range because of how incredibly powerful the bomb can be within the non-gib range. The tertiary range only makes a mere flash and thankfully doesn't instakill anyone but whatever, not the point.

Either way, Catnip was the one who had the most context from observing and also having dealt with you. From what I can discern, you gave them quite the childish tongue lashing because something didn't go your way.

You are not likely to whine your way out of this one, considering the gross disrespect you gave to a moderator who was only doing their job to hold you accountable for your mostly unjustified actions.

 

I wasn't hit by the ion gun, I was shot at while I was in space. The only witnesses were me and the antag and I didn't even see a cyborg there. Oh yeah, and I was already in crit and I had a bomb next to me while being ion gunned. So its either leave it on the floor and try to vaguely run away towards ??? or throw the bomb and hope for the best. How long is it before self defense becomes valid hunting? more than a few seconds? because this whole thing took about 2.

 

Man, it'll be the day when an admin considers throwing a bomb at your attacker a well-escalated form of self-defense. Thankfully, today will not be that day.

Heavy roleplay decision-making is not about taking the easy chickenshit way out, it's about making the hard decisions so that your survival puts some additional meaning to your experience and to the ongoing round narrative as a whole.

Throwing bombs to resolve conflict is the most chickenshit way out and I'd approve of a job-ban for anyone that does it. It is the shittiest use of a bomb in existence.

 

My vaurca was approved by whitelist admins and you have no right to decide how I RP my characters. Nobody's had a problem with Ein before now and it would be 100% out of character to panic and flail or whatever it is catnip wants me to do instead of fight back.

 

Whitelisters can giveth, and we can take away, too.

Your "clean and immaculate record" has absolutely nothing to do with this matter. The moderator that dealt with your case (and had an administrator overseeing it and backing the decision) was exercising a case-by-case outlook when dealing with your situation. You were found to be in the wrong.

 

There was no way out of my department and if there was a way I could have got out I would have used it. You weren't there and you weren't watching, but you're judging me as if you were. How is this fair? I took the only reasonable course of action. You're blaming me for the bad aim and bad choices of an antag who blew up toxins and then faced down a scientist with a bomb, and lost. Jobbanning me for it is petty and makes it seem like you're just fishing for reasons.

 

Oh, but being cornered excuses you to commit an act of heavy sabotage or borderline terrorism because your character was in a situation where they could die? Why does your character get to logically determine that bombing their workplace in order to escape a shitty situation is a good idea? Did nothing else process through your brain at the time?

Clearly not, otherwise you would've ran.

 

No shot contacted me, but I was definitely fired at. Don't blame me for poor aim. Again, if you had actual witnesses you would know that instead of logs.

 

By that logic, you had no witnesses either and nobody to benefit your case. Which begs the question as to why it was even remotely appropriate or intelligent to set off a bomb to fuck over an antagonist, regardless if they were pursuing you or not. That is still validhunting; seeking excuses to take an antagonist out of the round. And you managed to do it in the least excusable way possible.

 

Again, you were not there. I was in toxins, surrounded by fuel, which was then blown up by an antag who was breaking in. I wasn't part of the conflict? What? I had plenty of time? Other routes? I was blown up in crit in space with my hand missing before I even knew what had happened. WHAT other options did I have? WHAT option would be better than throwing the bomb? I was near the mix chamber and maint blew up 5 turfs away. The entrance to my department and all of R&D was cut off with blast doors. Pleas,e please tell me what other routes I had. Please tell me how much time I had, when you weren't there and have no combat logs.

 

You didn't even try. If you had tried, the bomb would never been set off in the first place. You obviously panicked and went nuclear in that situation so that an antag wouldn't kill you from your own perception.

That's hardly justifiable no matter how you phrase it.

Also, can you consider that you can reply to multiple people in a single post, without making additional posts? The post-count inflation is unnecessary.

[Pyrociraptor]

"other people were acting shit so it justifies me acting shitty in return"

nah

 

All I was doing was my job, and a merc blows it up and tries to kill me. Defending myself with the only weapon I had is hardly "shitty". Who was the merc? I'd like to hear their opinion.

I was one of the merc. But I think the merc you killed was Alberyk. Hunnewle was the one that made the first bomb explode (With him, in a sacrifice manner) to fuck up some of the sec team. When we heard the second explosion, we thought it was a fuel tank, but the concussion made by the explosion fucked communications for 5 minutes. It was hard to do shit after that.

[Absynth]

Here we go.

 

I mean. Catnip along with everyone else sees the issue with throwing a volatile bomb in order to kill someone. Bombs are coded to be incredibly devastating regardless of the mole value. If you were that close, you literally would've killed yourself with that bomb too. I'm pretty sure someone mentioned that you already did. Mobs instantly die within the devastation range because of how incredibly powerful the bomb can be within the non-gib range. The tertiary range only makes a mere flash and thankfully doesn't instakill anyone but whatever, not the point.

 

I was caught in both of them and was already in crit from the first one. You weren't there, and are commenting as if you were. What a surprise.

 

Either way, Catnip was the one who had the most context from observing and also having dealt with you. From what I can discern, you gave them quite the childish tongue lashing because something didn't go your way.

You are not likely to whine your way out of this one, considering the gross disrespect you gave to a moderator who was only doing their job to hold you accountable for your mostly unjustified actions.

 

Says the person who wasn't there and didn't see anthing. Bias much?

 

Throwing bombs to resolve conflict is the most chickenshit way out and I'd approve of a job-ban for anyone that does it. It is the shittiest use of a bomb in existence.

 

My department was bombed by silent red-hardsuited antags

 

Your "clean and immaculate record" has absolutely nothing to do with this matter. The moderator that dealt with your case (and had an administrator overseeing it and backing the decision) was exercising a case-by-case outlook when dealing with your situation. You were found to be in the wrong.

 

Squawk! Non-sec killed an antag! Squawk! Get out the guns! Sec Clique Only!

 

Oh, but being cornered excuses you to commit an act of heavy sabotage or borderline terrorism because your character was in a situation where they could die? Why does your character get to logically determine that bombing their workplace in order to escape a shitty situation is a good idea? Did nothing else process through your brain at the time?

Clearly not, otherwise you would've ran.

 

Do you even read the stuff you come up with? How does any of this make sense? I didn't bomb my workplace, the mercs did. I threw a bomb in the bombed-out hole in maint and blew up the one antag who was there shooting at me. You don't care about that, though. Or little things like facts.

 

By that logic, you had no witnesses either and nobody to benefit your case. Which begs the question as to why it was even remotely appropriate or intelligent to set off a bomb to fuck over an antagonist, regardless if they were pursuing you or not. That is still validhunting; seeking excuses to take an antagonist out of the round. And you managed to do it in the least excusable way possible.

 

I literally woke up from a bomb blast and the antag was shooting at me.

Using bombs as weapons (by SCIENTISTS! gasp!) is NOT forbidden by server rules. Therefore there is obviously valid reasons to use them. This is one of them.

Is it legal for Sec to use and throw bombs?

 

You didn't even try. If you had tried, the bomb would never been set off in the first place. You obviously panicked and went nuclear in that situation so that an antag wouldn't kill you from your own perception.

 

Thanks for telling me what I obviously did and could have done, backseat RP'er who wasn't there. Please just stop, you are not making any points in your favour.

[Guest]

No. Not a single person on station staff is expected to weaponize bombs against antagonists while still on-station. Please focus on the fact you were the one in the wrong and not literally everyone else. Please do not pretend you are exempt of responsibility because of the inherent determinism that cripples the community so much.

But it's okay, everyone has been wrong once. You're just taking a while to understand the gravity of what you did. Either that or you don't care. Which is fine too.

If you're happy with your childish shrieking being projected onto this forum publicly where everyone can see your rage and rancor, please post "honk" within your next reply. I am waiting anxiously for the next segment of outrage culture to switch on so I can devour a whole bag of popcorn.

[Absynth]

No. Not a single person on station staff is expected to weaponize bombs against antagonists while still on-station. Please focus on the fact you were the one in the wrong and not literally everyone else. Please do not pretend you are exempt of responsibility because of the inherent determinism that cripples the community so much.

But it's okay, everyone has been wrong once. You're just taking a while to understand the gravity of what you did. Either that or you don't care. Which is fine too.

If you're happy with your childish shrieking being projected onto this forum publicly where everyone can see your rage and rancor, please post "honk" within your next reply. I am waiting anxiously for the next segment of outrage culture to switch on so I can devour a whole bag of popcorn.

 

It's okay, let out all the ad-hominem attacks you want. It doesn't detract from the fact that you have no argument.

I didn't choose to make the bombs, I was told to by Sec and the RD since the moment I came on the station. The RD specifically told me to make bombs to use them against the antags. Security approved it.

If I left a live bomb on the floor and ran for my life and an antag picked it up and used it I would have been penned.

Leave it there for it to be ion'd, and it and the rest of RD blows up, would be penned.

(neither of these cases were actually possible, since there was no power, tools, and the blast doors were down)

Throw it desperately into space and detonate it, get jobbanned. Huh?

1138, you aren't even making points anymore, you're just flailing around to try to distract from whatever it is you're doing here. It's pretty funny that you, of all people, are going on about outrage culture.

[Guest]

And thus the pot called the kettle black, the pot misses the point of the kettle's original argument and the rest of the kitchen utensils have to sit back in horror for what would come next, for the only thing that matters now is how black the other is.

Today is the day that reason died.

[Absynth]

And thus the pot called the kettle black, the pot misses the point of the kettle's original argument and the rest of the kitchen utensils have to sit back in horror for what would come next, for the only thing that matters now is how black the other is.

Today is the day that reason died.

 

Excellent contribution. Why are you stinking up this thread again? You have absolutely nothing to do with it yet you continue to make pointless, useless comments that contribute nothing. Well done.

Back on topic, I still haven't heard any alternative actions I could have taken. The rules state that what I did is allowed, as self defense. The fact that it was a bomb and not, say, a laser rifle is completely besides the point. I defended myself with the only weapon available, as the only course of action I had available.

[Guest]

The rules state that what I did is allowed, as self defense. The fact that it was a bomb and not, say, a laser rifle is completely besides the point. I defended myself with the only weapon available, as the only course of action I had available.

 

Here's what they actually say.

 

And no, the method of self-defense is incredibly important. To say that it is a nuance and dismissing it as an issue of extreme exercising of force to kill a antagonist (supposedly, an attacking one, but the burden of proof lies on you and others' testimony) is one of many good reasons that you're job-banned from science.

I have been whitelist-stripped before for just about the exact reasoning and very similar context relating to science powergaming and validhunting. So I know what I'm talking about.

[UnknownMurder]

Not sure if anyone is keeping track...

Day Ban has been expired. Job ban is probably sticking permanently.