On the subject of IPC mechanics

[ZipZero]

Earlier today (or yesterday, depending on your time zone), there was a discussion in OOC about certain unpopular IPC mechanics. Speaking with some people who play IPCs frequently, I have identified the main problems that, I feel, detract from the enjoyment of playing as an IPC.

IPC specific language - Every other species gets their own language. Humans get Sol Common, tajara get Siik'maas, dionaea get rootspeak, etc. So, why not IPCs? Positronic brains already can use binary speak, so it would make sense that IPCs could as well, given that they have positronic brains in their head. Since having access to the regular binary channel would likely cause problems, I suggest the creation of a new language. Baystation's wiki mentions an Encoded Audio Language, perhaps we could use something like that?

Overheating in hardsuits - Now, I do enjoy the recent change where IPCs will overheat in hardsuits. It makes sense, given that they require air to cool their chassis. The problem is that there's no practical way to cool them down. Cooled internals, which should work, provide no benefit. While suit cooling units do work, they are too large to carry easily, can't be mounted to the suit, start with a tiny capacity initial battery, are limited in supply, and can't be accessed by everyone who might need them. My solution to this is to start portable suit cooling units off with a higher capacity power cell, place one at mining, one at xenoarch, and one at the syndicate shuttle, make them small enough that you can fit them in a backpack, and allow them to attach to both hard and softsuits.

Self-repair - IPCs are, for some reason, unable to repair themselves. This bothers me, as all others are able to heal themselves in some way. Organics can give themselves medicine, and can use welding and wires to repair damage to their own prosthetics, so why can an IPC not use the same tools on their mechanical parts? I get rather tired of having to visit a roboticist every time someone throws a book at me, or trips me with lubricated floors, especially when there are none on the crew. Skull, I believe, had mentioned something about repairing during combat. However, organics are already able to do this (enough medicine, welder/wires for prosthetics), it makes no sense to punish all IPC players for the actions of a hypothetical few, and IPCs already have enough weaknesses in combat. Just today, I saw one IPC go into critical from 2 laser shots to the arm. A single shot from an ion rifle will blow the head right off. And, I have no personal experience in this, but if an EMP can kill an organic with mechanical parts, I can just imagine what it would do to someone with a mechanical everything. I don't think it would be a problem to remove the self-repair restriction.

So, an overview. Here are the problems, and my suggested solutions:

Problem: IPCs do not have their own language. Solution: Give IPCs their own language.

Problem: Difficult to cool down hardsuits for IPC use. Solution: Make cooling units smaller and able to attach to EVA suits, give them a higher capacity default power cell, and place one at mining, xenoarch, and the syndicate shuttle.

Problem: IPCs cannot repair themselves. Solution: Allow IPCs to repair themselves.

There are other things I dislike regarding IPCs, namely the head restriction, but that is a discussion for another time.

Edits: Issue 2, included softsuits and syndicate shuttle suggestions. Issue 3, removed information about taser stunning

Edited December 21, 2014 by Guest

[ForgottenTraveller]

As an avid IPC player I thought the cooling issue was a bug due to the cooling units not seeming to work with soft suits and I have not managed to get it to work on hardsuits either. There is supposed to be a private language for IPCs but it has not been implemented. As for self repair. Nanopaste which currently has no effect [Redacted for naggyness - Apologies it was not supposed to come out like that] The Nuke ship will also need a cooling unit.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Guest

[Guest]

There's absolutely no way to justify being officially banned from all head positions, unofficially being banned from all departments which require EVA, and being put in crit by two laser bolts to the arms as gameplay mechanics.

I am somewhat buttfustrated someone took the time to fix the bug where they were unharmed by tasers, but left in the bug which makes them ignite in hardsuits.

I have yet to see any other whitelisted race get curbstomped as hard as IPC's (Or get curbstomped at all, really.) and now we're apparently going to add another one, while the update which actually makes robot people playable is set somewhere far, far into the unpredictable future.

Please, fix IPC's.At least to the point where three lasers dont kill me on the spot, and im able to wear a hardsuit/softsuit without imminent explosion.

[SgtSammac]

There's absolutely no way to justify being officially banned from all head positions, unofficially being banned from all departments which require EVA, and being put in crit by two laser bolts to the arms as gameplay mechanics.

I am somewhat buttfustrated someone took the time to fix the bug where they were unharmed by tasers, but left in the bug which makes them ignite in hardsuits.

I have yet to see any other whitelisted race get curbstomped as hard as IPC's (Or get curbstomped at all, really.) and now we're apparently going to add another one, while the update which actually makes robot people playable is set somewhere far, far into the unpredictable future.

Please, fix IPC's.At least to the point where three lasers dont kill me on the spot, and im able to wear a hardsuit/softsuit without imminent explosion.

 

You know, acting like a self-entitled git won't make us Dev's work.

We didn't decide what happens with the IPC's that's Bays project and we can and probably will fix it here (but not with your current attitude)

As for the bugs, I can't speak about that because I haven't actually seen anywhere where it's been confirmed we are adding them other than coverts lore work and event announcements the playable ones not even being scheduled yet.

[Dea Tacita]

I thought the cooling issue was a bug

 

Scopes told me it was a bug. So

And honestly, this suggestion (At-least in its wording) comes off as rude. Our development team is extremely busy fixing bugs and generally attempting to make the server a more enjoyable place for all of you, While I admit there are some problems with the IPCs. It is not their fault, blame BS-12 if you want to blame anyone, given time I'm sure the developers will attempt to make IPCs more enjoyable, but as previously said. They have a lot of work to do, bitching about this sort of stuff doesn't do anything but annoy them.

[ZipZero]

And honestly, this suggestion (At-least in its wording) comes off as rude. Our development team is extremely busy fixing bugs and generally attempting to make the server a more enjoyable place for all of you, While I admit there are some problems with the IPCs. It is not their fault, blame BS-12 if you want to blame anyone, given time I'm sure the developers will attempt to make IPCs more enjoyable, but as previously said. They have a lot of work to do, bitching about this sort of stuff doesn't do anything but annoy them.

I don't see how my suggestions are rude. I certainly didn't intend it to be that way. I was simply identifying some of the problems myself and other IPC players face that detract from our enjoyment. I posted it here to stop the discussions that were happening in OOC, filling the chat. The devs can address any of these issues, if they wish, when they are not busy.

[Carver]

and being put in crit by two laser bolts to the arms as gameplay mechanics.

Please, fix IPC's.At least to the point where three lasers dont kill me on the spot

This is what is called a balancing factor for a species that effectively shrugs off pain-crit, you take increased damage so you aren't the king of robust. (Though you shouldn't have any crit whatsoever, you shouldn't even die unless someone takes off your head, really)

[ZipZero]

I find no problem with the weakness to lasers. It certainly makes up for the benefits an IPC has, such as, yes, no pain crit. Though, it is a little weird that shots to the arm would be so deadly. Causes overheating, perhaps?

[Guest]

Skimming through this, despite being an avid IPC player who thinks the race should be looked at as soon as it is convenient... well. At risk of sounding like an arse, a lot of these arguments could have been worded a lot better. It came off as snarky, demanding, overexpectant, and a bit rude.

Hell, I have some pretty extreme opinions on how strong IPCs should actually be, but I wouldn't go so far as to say it's the fault of the dev team for this and that.

Give it time, right now the devs are working on fixing the bugs that came from the baycode patch.

[ZipZero]

Skimming through this, despite being an avid IPC player who thinks the race should be looked at as soon as it is convenient... well. At risk of sounding like an arse, a lot of these arguments could have been worded a lot better. It came off as snarky, demanding, overexpectant, and a bit rude.

Hell, I have some pretty extreme opinions on how strong IPCs should actually be, but I wouldn't go so far as to say it's the fault of the dev team for this and that.

Give it time, right now the devs are working on fixing the bugs that came from the baycode patch.

Please, tell me where I blamed our dev team for these problems. I didn't. I blame Bay's, not ours. And, again, I posted this here so that the devs can work on it when unoccupied, as there was a discussion about it filling up OOC at the time.

[Guest]

You know, acting like a self-entitled git won't make us Dev's work.

We didn't decide what happens with the IPC's that's Bays project and we can and probably will fix it here (but not with your current attitude)

As for the bugs, I can't speak about that because I haven't actually seen anywhere where it's been confirmed we are adding them other than coverts lore work and event announcements the playable ones not even being scheduled yet.

 

Consider any hostility in my statement entirely directed at Baystation, seeing as they're the ones who made this trainwreck.

Beyond that, Im just trying to convey how much i'd like some sort of fix to this situation, IPC's are unable to wear a space suit on a station floating trough space.That's kind of problematic.

The problem I am trying to point out here is that Im quite sure the version in which the IPC internals cooling worked properly was the last baycode version which actually supported IPC's.Baystation has since axed IPC's from development, and seem to plan to rework them completely (No info on that rework), every update seems to break them even further, and as a guy who loves playing the robot I'd just like someone to have a look at them.

You are neither the people who originally created the IPC mechanics, or the people who eventually broke them.So, there is no need to feel as if I am accusing you of some sort of crime.

 

This is what is called a balancing factor for a species that effectively shrugs off pain-crit, you take increased damage so you aren't the king of robust. (Though you shouldn't have any crit whatsoever, you shouldn't even die unless someone takes off your head, really)

 

Two shots from a laser rifle hit each of my arms, both of them showed up as having "Carbonized" burns.With the way robot limbs work when taking damage, this would be nearly the same as breaking both of someone's arms with a singular laser shot.

[TishinaStalker]

Just a note: IPCs are entirely immune to pain. Being hit by a taser doesn't knock you down, and instead applies fire damage. You said that tasers supposedly down them in one hit, but they don't.

[Guest]

Even while you're in crit, you don't fall on your face, snore, and cry out in pain. Paincrit just doesn't exist, if you're getting plugged full of bullets, you can just keep on going!

Until you get hit by EMP, that is.

[ZipZero]

Being hit by a taser doesn't knock you down, and instead applies fire damage. You said that tasers supposedly down them in one hit, but they don't.

Oh? I was misinformed, then. Sorry. Tasers should down them in one hit, though.

[Guest]

Eh, I happen to disagree, but it's the dev's decision to balance it, not mine.

[Gollee]

Being hit by a taser doesn't knock you down, and instead applies fire damage. You said that tasers supposedly down them in one hit, but they don't.

Oh? I was misinformed, then. Sorry. Tasers should down them in one hit, though.

 

I would assume they would have some form of non-conductive coating, to prevent short circuits, electricution handshakes and other safety reasons; which would mean, unless the taser pierced this layer somehow; which would have significant consequences; they would be immume to tasers.

Also, surge protectors.

[duck]

Hi. Going to address some concerns here.

It seems people have problems with IPCs regarding:

1. Language. I'm probably not touching that ever. You're probably on your own here. Sorry.

2. Overheating in hardsuits. This doesn't make much sense to me because robots aren't the only things that generate heat on their own (see: mammals or anything alive ever). Maybe they generate a lot of heat, okay, but the suits we have have to have some way of dispersing heat regardless. This line of thought seems to be a carryover from the look-for-reasons-why-robots-can't-spacewalk thing and doesn't make much sense. Also, current suit coolers don't turn off when they run out of power, meaning they can run indefinitely and ignore the cell. That's a bug, but I'm not sure if we should fix it, make it a feature, or axe the suitburning altogether because really, it doesn't make sense. Either way, right now you can get a suit cooler and turn it on and stick it in the suit and forget about it because the battery doesn't matter.

3. Self repair. Not sure about this one. An IPC able to repair itself is inherently much better off than any human. Also, EMPs are pretty rare (And they do instakill you.). They do an average of 67.5 damage but if it does that damage to your head, then your head blows off and you instantly die. This tends to happen a lot.

4. Frailty. IPCs aren't fragile. They take half brute damage and full burn damage. midbullet2s, aka the bullets nuke op SMGs, detective revolver, and R&D SMGs use, do a grand total of 6.25 damage on an IPC. A shot. Fire damage rate is normal. Could not replicate death in two lasers. They took the standard amount to kill, but I don't have the server's config files so things might be a little wonky. Will ask to test on the actual server and get back to you on that. Normal damage is 25. They take 1/4 brute.

5. The taser issue: Tasers don't apply firedamage. They do nothing. Tested. Still does nothing. Not a bug.

6. Nanopaste. Never knew about nanopaste. Will look into later probably.

The only really legitimate concerns I think are the language (not touching), self-repair (Need to discuss this), and the suit thing. Need to discuss that too.

[duck]

Okay I'm back.

Don't think IPCs should have self repair or emp-protection. They're already immune to breathing, chems, tasers, toxins, radiation, cloneloss, and they take 1/4th brute so fire's really the only thing that can hurt them. Fire and EMPs. EMPs are pretty stupidly rare.

However: Your hands flipflopping after taking any damage at all is kind of stupid so we're going to look into that. Probably going to add a threshold (For example: If damage > 20, then your arms start freaking out.)

Regarding suits: Going to fix power bug, decrease the rate at which IPCs heat up so you have some more time, and decrease the rate of power consumption.

[ForgottenTraveller]

Can you add suit coolers to soft exo-suit slots as well as hardsuits?

[duck]

Code infrastructure's not in place to make it attachable like helmet/boots, but you can put the thing in the soft suit and hard suit suitstorage spaces. Also, made softsuits capable of holding large tanks because why not.

Prosthetics, all prosthetics, will now need to take >11 damage before they have a chance of sparklefizzing and pooping out your item onto the floor. A hit with a welder or laser will still ruin your life, but it should take a hit or three for most blunts to mess up your hand. Should make prosthetics more useable.

Suit cooling units have been bugfixed. They should actually turn off when they run out of power now, buuuuut their battery life has been extended. Dramatically. Maybe too much. Give feedbacks later.