Skull132

The topic has some assumptions in it. And I can understand how it can probably offend or scratch. But, hopefully it's a start? My main concern, as I already raised to you: the guards set up on either side, and the somewhat clearly noticeable separation of staff and community. If the situation could be remedied, specially on the forums, then both sides would probably be more open to communication and discussion. And, you know. Actual fucking cooperation. Sounds neat, doesn't it? How to achieve it? Weell. We can stop by assuming, all of us. I've seen both sides carry assumptions that border on ridiculous, this leads to very select tools for communication, that shove the other side onto the defensive too early. And this ends with nothing constructive coming out of anything. Ever. Otherwise, re-establish communication, re-align the sights, so that the image that both sides are seeing is the same, and go from there. TL;DR: talk more. And no, I don't consider what either side has been indulging in for the past few months as talk. It's something more kekworthy.

Oh, and let me add onto my point one. Point one point five: I have never actually seen anyone harass another player over playing a character akin to the SSL parametres, or even an outright SSL. Again, my coverage isn't perfect, but. I have never seen it here. Never. In the two years of this server existing. Obviously you get whispers, rumors, yadda. But never actual outright harassment. And considering our policies on harassment, anyone reported as harassing will be dealt with rather swiftly. As has been the case in the past.

I do not know fully what happened with the deleted posts, as I don't involve myself in the admin shenanigans that much anymore. Buut, you can read my opinion's on the actions in question on Xander's forum mod application.

I honestly think this thread, and the entire argument is overkill. Point one, I haven't seen proper SSLs in ages. While I might be wrong, due to not being on 24/7, I do not believe that they are an active issue. And if someone conducts harassment, then, we simply ban them. Other than that, if people get really ridiculous with their concepts, we will manage them as well. 9/10 times, though. SSL is used as a joking remark. It is literally a SS13 meme, as much as baldies are.

I would suggest actually playing and using the tool in question before speaking on it. A single hit from the taser already disables: you lose your movement speed. A second shot puts you down. Even now, even without the one hit KO they used to have, they are effective. And there is a literal string of arrests and situations that have been managed to prove the assessment I am currently making.

There is a C, as well. If it's stupid, contact an admin. We've taken action against idiotic RP before, we can do it again. We just need to be made aware of it.

Aaaalrighty. I've zoned out of the moderator side of things, but this has been something that keeps popping up on my radar. From observation, and doing some reading, a lot of the reasons for Xander's actions have been along the lines of, "Removing potentially inflammatory material". This irks me. A lot. We have never removed content because it can potentially do harm, we have never removed content because it can potentially offend. It's silly. If people do offend someone outright (ad hominem or outright rip into someone), then sure. Warn them and discuss the matter with them. But if people potentially offend someone? First: who art thou, to judge what offends me? Second: good judgement should make it rather clear as to what is permitted and what is not. If it's good, and people still get offended, then. Well, hey, how about we do our jobs as moderators and actually see about clarifying things? Just me 2 cents, anyways.

Well, let's think. Weapons haven't been touched in forever, they are most likely unchanged from the time that you left. The revolver still kills in a single headshot, lopping off the head as well. All weapons are terribly powerful, also due to the fact that they cause very severe infections (anyone who doesn't receive immediate medical aid is going to end up very rather dead). I mean, I have a suggestion up about tweaking the taser, but people are allowed to post suggestions about anything and everything, even if it's petty. So, yeah, I wanted to grind an idea against the community and see where it goes. If it counts as totally converting everything to be "fair" instead of "realistic", then sure, hang me for expressing my opinion, something that I do rather rarely. EDIT3: We literally have not changed guncode since you left, except a few bugfixes (for shotguns, to eject the proper shell, and for the radbow, to make it actually effective again, so we've literally made changes that go counter to your argument, because if we wanted to make things more fair, you bet your arse I wouldn't let a 2-shot radbow into the mix. And yet. Here it is) and the addition of ballisticurity weapons. You can see for yourself: https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora/tree/master/code/modules/projectiles As for the station, that wasn't the outright intent. And there were plans to make the bridge harder to assail. Namely, shield generators and other fun things. These may still find a place in the world prior to us switching maps. Also, a part of the design makes it also harder for antagonists: anyone attempting to disable the AI by force is going to have a way harder time than they normally did. Unless they have a max yield bomb, but at that point, it really never did matter. Those arbitrary limits have always been in place. They weren't added to achieve an effect, per say. Although, the IPCs can heal themselves with nanopaste. Now, why are they still in place? Well, okay. There is a very curious line to be walked here: even if we're an RP server, gameplay is a factor. You cannot deny it. And some changes need to be around to facilitate gameplay. This is one of those things. It seems arbitrary, perhaps. But, I do not know, we still focus on gameplay and combat, and some changes need to be in place to facilitate it (the alternative is stricter enforcement of the powergaming rules on that specific count, as you will definitely see an IPC or two run into combat with a weapon in one hand, and a welder in the other, and they probably need to have their whitelist stripped at that point). And now that we've had a nice segue onto the topic of the rules. This is probably something to ponder on. If it would be possible to work with the Admin team to figure out how to walk that line, perhaps something can come of this? It is definately easier than trying to do all kinds of massive sweeping changes to the code, mind you. This is a tough point. It is the unfortunate reality, at least for a month or two. But, okay, when have we ever had a fully operational development team? Like, we've managed to do a whole bunch more shit, but one of the major factors of that was me actually learning how to code, and having time to code. Before that, Aurora never really was about the progress of the development team, the shift came about whenever we realized that, "Hey. We can actually churn things out now!" And that's going to tie down for a bit. But a lot of these problems can be solved through alternate means. Focus on the actual rules and environment, instead of just the new fancy toys that we throw into the mix. See about reobtaining that, perhaps? Also, Scopes needs to wake up. And Delta probably needs to get sleep. Posting while groggy does not mean you're having a good time. I am curious about this, though. Do explain further? EDIT: Also, let me say this. It's a trap, yadda, but I'm in a mood to not give a shit right now. Plasma has always been a catch-all for all the things. It does not matter if you call it Plasma or Phoron. It will remain what it is: a magical substance that does all the weird shit, like it has always been. As I noted, if you want to have it changed, speak to the lore devs, and we'll execute on their behalf. EDIT2: I still do not understand your argument. The reason we were arguing is because I do not understand whatever in God's name you are trying to say. You have a mixed argument that plasma is a catch all for all the things ever. Okay. Do you mean plasma/phoron as an in-game, mechanical element? Or with plasma as a name for said in-game, mechanical element? If you're thinking about the former, then you're going to have a heck of a time recording a massive chunk of code, and trying to enforce arbitrary consistency on something that was never meant to be consistent (plasma). If you mean the latter, the name, then just talk to the lore team, and have them decide on it. And for the lore bit. There used to be a magical time where server lore and development didn't really matter. What mattered was the environment and the rules. The player generated story. It was a lot more about singular characters doing extraordinary things: no one really needed a long series of posts about how the Unathi are getting waged war upon, or so forth. But this changed. It did so by the virtue of the fact that we acquired a larger playerbase, and as such, facilitating the single, "hero focused" storylines became harder. This is not good, nor is it bad. It's simply a change. I didn't really change, though. I will always remain stuck in that mode of thinking that I described earlier. Which is why my time here, in my current position, is up. Ultimately.

Alright, it's been 24 hours and slightly over. The ban is now lifted. Enjoy the game! And remember, if you have any questions or like that, feel free to contact an admin/mod!

Considering this is literally from January of last year, and you have no other notes, minus Adminbot's, I'm up for giving you another chance. I'll leave this for roughly 24 hours before moving ahead with it.

Buffing lethals will not achieve a similar result. If you get taken down in two shots, it really does not matter if you can neutralize your opponent in one hit, the moment someone decides to double-tap you, the amount of time you're given to react is very small, and you will not get a shot off, at that point. As far as equipment goes, there is an issue with this. A piece of gear that allows you to take 3 or 4 taser shots would very much turn into a "must get" for every traitor forever. Which is, as far as SS13 goes, shitty design. In my opinion, no one item on the uplink should be a must get, otherwise, we might as well hand it to every traitor automatically, without fee. There's also the issue that it'll turn into an immediate calling card, meta-wise (has suit, is traitor, great). The range idea is an interesting one, I'll say that much. And I'll mull on it while at work. Also, here's the thing about training. This would be training through mechanics. Because you're going to die horribly if you retain the present mindset. Plus, normal officer wouldn't have access to lethals.

After the debuff, you should generally fall after 3 hits, instead of 2. I forget the exact mechanics at play, though.

Okay. So many, many, many months ago, the tasers were buffed from the state we received them in. Preface: upon importing a pull from Bay that switched weakned based stuns out to agony based stuns, it was initially perceived that the tasers were too weak. So we made them use a more powerful projectile (70 vs 50 agony damage upon hit). After as many months of observing how situations develop with this, I am inclined to believe that the buff was a mistake. Here is why: in almost every situation, the taser disables in two hit. The issue is, this singular fact makes the taser leagues more lethal and useful, objectively better, than a lethal weapon (the majority of which disable after 3 or more hits). Which pretty much places security in a position where they can legitimately give no shits about fearRP, under the, as it stands, legitimate excuse that they know the effectiveness of their weapon system. The antagonists have access to no such weapons, unless they are a sec officers or manage to acquire one. This creates a situation where a security officer doesn't necessarily need to give proper thought to the weapons employed by his adversary, and enables a very simple mindset: run in, stun in two hits, cuff -- end of game. Which is, ultimately, lazy and leads to uninteresting scenarios. And that's my main issue with this. While the antagonists are given an assortment of lethal weapons, weapons that will fuck up your day if you let them. Stun is one of the most powerful tools available in SS13 combat. And security, almost exclusively, has access to the best ranged stun weapon in the game. I think that going back to where the tasers did 50 agony, instead of 70, would make situations more interesting, and force security officers to give proper thought to hostage situations, or how to manage antagonists in general.

I miss YeahChris. That is all. Well, I also miss the central character driven epic arcs we used to have. I suppose, as more people came around, the focus turned from one grand storyline to many smaller, as more people want to be involved. Oh, and please don't make me regret saying this. But another thing I miss are decently/well done persistent antags.

Okay. Since I am not the Head Admin anymore, the decision does not lie with me. But. There is a point you raised, perhaps in an effort to clear up the past actions, that is making me very cautious about even considering endorsement. Oh, and please don't take offence. I mean none, this is just my honest trail of thought. Point one, stress can cause relapse. Simple as that. Getting moderator status would almost certainly put you into stressful situations, and, if what you say is true, end oh so very terribly for you. And even if you think you can manage it, I'm going to call your judgement off on that count. Point two. No, seriously. Personal health first. I appreciate the fact that you're a person who is persistently wanting to push himself into Mod, so he can contribute more. But. Yeah. Plus, this creates a whole lot of new variables that I, were I still a head admin, would not want to bother myself with (purely for my own sanity).

Two notes. Sometimes you aren't forgotten about: simply that the way the round progresses renders you unrecoverable. This is thr nature of SS13: shit happens, RDs die, etcetera. Second, try adminhelping if it's too ridiculous. If the above isn't true, they should be inclined to SM someone to set you free.

You've applied a good few times now, so let me ask you this. Is there any improvement you think you've made to yourself, or your conduct? Or more generally, what's different now? Another point. Purely out of curiosity. You said that loyalty to friends is admirable, but not desireable in a member of staff. Did you mean that outright, ending with a full stop? If so, why?

Improvised weapons are a thing. Like, dude, no sec? Get creative. If they're a large enough pain in the ass, capture them, zip them up with cablecuffs, give them the boots, medium style, and throw them into a random place to rot (it would be nice if they had A way out, mind you). No sec will be around to arrest you for contraband or assault. And the staff usually don't mind, if the circumstances are stupid enough, and you don't just outright kill the person.

I'm sorry, what am I trying to brush under the carpet? I've been nothing but cordial, honest and to the point in my replies, and at this point, it really seems like you're pulling me towards the line of, "We demand an apology for you having a personal opinion that we do not agree with!" Okay. I don't go around asking people for that. I mean, I could. I very much could, but I don't. So how about we cut that here? If you wish me to explain the actual intricacies of managing leadership and personal opinions, then how about we look at the Covert situation? I held, way before December and his deadminning, a very clear and negative disposition towards the man. Because of this, in recognition of the fact that personal opinion shifts a human's focus (easiest demonstration: if you fall in love with someone, you focus on all of the positives that they have, as a person. Even to the point of molding some negative quirks into positive or "cute" ones), I raised my bar for evidence required to take harsh action, and deferred my judgement to my Head Administrator. At the time, we decided to simply demote him from Primary to Secondary Admin (we had 3 tiers, back then, not 2). Had I pushed harder, we could have probably ended up with him gone from staff before the incident with Hivefleet happened. Damned if you do, damned if you don't, huh? And it's a fun minefield which I would love to see any of you, who are willing to speak on the subject, walk. And, let's actually latch onto the word "minefield". And let's defer to mathematics, more accurately, the theory of probability. We'll call every administrative decision an event. Every single event in our problem has a chance of failure, no matter how simple. As time passes, and as these events keep happening (as administrative decisions are made), the cumulative probability of a negative outcome appearing will approach 1. And eventually, poof, we have this. If you gentlemen imagine that a proper administrative team works without making mistakes, then you happen to be an idealist. Unfortunately, we do not live in an ideal world. We have our ways of managing these issues, and we will make sure that they do not repeat. If you do wish to hold us to the magical standard of "No mistakes ever, yay", then we will disappoint you. I also suggest that you read the following posts, as they actually provide perspective that a lot of you seem to be lacking: http://aurorastation.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=3137&start=120#p31411 I will now be closing this thread, and quoting Gollee on the reason why.

If a character keeps doing stupid shit constantly,. and keeps getting caught. Then the Captain or HoS can get very creative with punishment, in my personal opinion. Demotions, injunctions, silly tasks and so forth. Not exactly worth a permanent brigging if it's something non-harmful, though.

So. I recently got finished with a game called the Talos Principle. And, just in a single sentence: if you enjoy philosophical games, or puzzle games, get it and play it -- it's amazing. On a slightly lengthier note (I'll try to avoid spoilers), it's a really interesting game. Not only is it a good brain exercise on the count of the puzzles, but the story and setting are rather interesting. A few of the puzzles can require needless and unfounded jumps of logic with the mechanics given (a negative, from a perspective), but they shouldn't be impossible. But, mind you, puzzles aren't the only thing that'll be twisting your head. If you actually pay attention to your surroundings, and the developments going on around you, you'll find find a rather interesting world raising rather interesting questions. And doing a bit more than that, as well. Welp, that's probably the best you can get out of me, as far as marketing ploys are concerned. It's interesting, and if you like puzzles or games about philosophy, give it a shot.

Let me point out something. I am entitled to my own opinion, as you are entitled to yours. Saying that I should, as an individual, agree with you "just becuz" is shit. I won't, don't have to, I am free to gain my own perspective and develop my own views. If a desired "conclusion" is me adjusting my opinion of the person? No. Not inclined to. Not how I operate. I'll simply make sure that I don't act on it, thank you very much. Now, let me tell you real quick something about being a member of staff. It's about recognizing personal bias, adjusting with it, and keeping it separate while conducting. Refer to my first post regarding the failures on that count. Those are legitimate issues, and we will make sure that they do not repeat. Cassy was unbanned in recognition of those mistakes. Now what, gentlemen? Am I to apologize for holding a personal opinion of a person and being frank about it? Much like Chaz does for Sue? I mean, I could have just written a post about us simply unbanning Cassy, leaving out my own views on the matter, albeit I feel like that would have been a half-truth at most. Unfortunately, I am not a politician.

The issue is. I happen to share Doomberg's issues with Cassy. He is not the only one. This is probably why I've been having so many outright mental blocks for actually posting this one. A militant attitude will end with both sides clashing swords, and absolutely fuck all coming from it. Well, fuck all, except for fun shenanigans like this. And honestly? I'm tired of it. It's childish, gentlemen. And in our mind, Cassy was one of the main driving forces behind fostering such an environment. Something that had been going on since December-ish last year. An issue that I chose to, at the time, to try and manage softly. Partly because I was lacking energy, partly because I wanted to give people a chance to bash out their differences. I have been led to believe that this, right here, would have happened anyways. The only unfortunate fact is the misstep taken by myself and my, our, team on this count in managing this specific issue. The rest? I am fine with the outcome. Regarding the ban? Initial ban is out of my jurisdiction, and moves were skipped. That's an issue. The fact that we opted to deal with this, in one form or another, is not. Eventually, the matter of people conducting themselves in a manner that Cassy chose to, over her entire stay here, would have been (and was actually planned to be) raised for review. And been dealt with. Rightfully so. I didn't answer the question, did I? No. I'll be lifting it. But I will reapply it, personally, and coupled with a forum ban the moment Cassy chooses to conduct herself in a manner that, once again, Bokaza wishes to summarize as "Militant". You can debate the definition amongst yourselves, but you know what it means. Enough is enough. I could go into further detail explaining and ranting about a very specific mindset which is harmful and damaging, and how generally participating in it has generated issues that you gentlemen cannot even imagine for the singular point that: you do not communicate with anyone at all. Period. But, I have neither the will nor the want to educate you gentlemen. Please do that on your own time, and not here. So, how about we get back to actually playing this god forsaken game, in a server of our own free choosing? How about that? Sounds like a novel ass concept, doesn't it?

Let's see. And let's run through something. A ball was dropped during the decision making process, which lasted 48 hours. Mistake one: "I cannot care" was turned into "I did care." The reason for this ties into a momentary lack of judgement. Which I cannot explain, I was not in the mindset required to make a decision such as that, and as a result, judgement lacked reason. I fell back onto agreeing with Doomberg. Mistake two: Failure to recognize an improper mindset during decision making. This is probably the root cause of most of these shenanigans. I usually have a mental ticker which enables me to nope the hell away from any and all things leadership, unless absolutely required, until I've gathered myself properly. I failed to recognize such a state, and as such, a decision was made without the thought fully required. Mistake three: Praise -- Public; Punish -- Private. Was not followed. Self-explanatory as far as mistakes go. Mistake four: Hands were stuck where hands probably shouldn't have been stuck (at least, not without a soft-entry and proper foresight). And we got terribly burnt for it, to the 4th degree, probably. Mistake five: People were involved needlessly. Namely, my snarky get at the original thread. Unnecessary, needless, stupid. It was a golden opportunity that I should have realized I should never, ever seize. And I apologize for that. Now, that's a clinical assessment of my own actions and involvement, from my own perspective. Feel free to add to it as necessary (although note that you'd be trying to put your thoughts into my head, at that point, which may not end well). I would like to say that with the second matter, considerably the key, is something that I have only mistaken against once before. And that was in an environment elsewhere. But, these are excuses, so I'll leave them be. For the more humane bit? This entire situation is gobshite awful, and I apologize for the amateurish mistake against principles of leadership that got us here. The situation could have been managed infinitely better -- it was not. The situation could have probably ended with a less harsh move -- it did not. By now, all of the cards are probably on the table. The only question is, what next, gentlemen? Oh. And if anyone thinks that we're willing or even planning to repeat this mistake. Yeah, no. Even an idiot understands that a hot stove burns. Plus, if I see another shitstorm like this, I'll probably take early retirement from here as I wait for my sorry ass to get conscripted.

This discussion is ultimately about the Admins and myself. You and your friends will thus no longer be mentioned. 3 hours until I can give this my full attention (am home)