BurgerBB

Bar is actually smaller than it once was. I think it's just as small as the original bar.

Maintenance areas were added. Chapel basic shape has been completed.

Pretty much what i'm doing in vine form: I hate the new kitchen and bar and I made it. Also people want hydroponics to be next to the kitchen like a proper server so here it is. This map contains the combined feedback of many individuals so lets hope its to everyone's liking. Plans: - Make a proper chapel or something. - Add pipes and detail

I personally don't see the problem and this is a good change.

Alright so straight off the bat we have people -1 in a project thread and not knowing what they're talking about. Lets nip this in the bud. Ratios of antags are handled in a special way inside the code. There are variables that dictate the ratio of antags to players. For example I think the ratio of traitors to non traitors for autotraitor is either 6 or 9, despite the current required traitor count and current required player count not reflective of that ratio, and that's fine because it's roundstart and there should always be a minimum amount of antags regardless of desired ratios. However even without that mechanic, there are 0 gamemodes that have seriously skewed ratios from before except for wizard and ninja (well, because 1:1 is greater than 1:6). This is a non-compliant. The gutting of the gamemodes is completely intentional. All those gamemodes are REALLY bad for lowpop. Their core design does not work for lowpop. AI is not good with a minimum of 2 people. Ninja isn't good with 2 people. Wizard isn't good with 2 people. This is not how it works. This is not how anything works. If you have less game modes it doesn't mean you have more chances to pick secret extended. It's all weighed meaning that secret extended will have the same chance of getting picked compared to other gamemodes. Nothing changed about it's weight.

https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora.3/pull/5247 Adjusts some of the gamemode required players and enemies so that the gamemodes themselves are more interesting. Reasonings: A single vamp/changeling isn't enough to provide the round with actual RP. Cult should require 9 players given it's objective, and slightly more starting cult members. Heist needs an increase in required players. 12 players means that there are 4 heist members and 8 crewmembers. This isn't fun. Malfunction should require significantly more players than just 2. Ninja should require significantly more players than just 1. Merc had a rare occurrence where there could only be 1 nuke op. Rev should have a higher player requirement. 4 players is nothing. Wizard should have significantly more players than just 1.

Nope, never, so my feedback is coming from a place of somewhat ignorance. I assumed they were just really tough mobs that have one ability or so to make it trickier to kill them like teleporting or going invisible or spawning fake copies of themselves around them. Is there a PR up where I can look at them in detail? Alternatively, could you detail their abilities in this thread? Of course. I'll get a video up shortly, but here's a short explanation. Ash Drake - Dragon looking motherfucker. Shoots fireballs that deal halos, and has a chance to swoop into the sky and then come crashing down. Can melee attack occasionally. Colossus - Tall looking motherfucker. Shoots ice crystals that deal hallos. Their attack pattern is like a bullet hell game. Bubblegum - Fat looking motherfucker. Sprays blood everywhere, and charges at people similar to ash drake. If you're stepping in blood, tentacles will spawn out of it and strike you.

Have you ever fought against a megafauna? Players will have all the abilities of megafauna.

Better effect is not equal to faster acting. KeloDerm should have a better effect on someone, as it heals more burn damage. That makes sense. It's not drug synergy as Dermaline is made from KeloDerm and mechanically that's not what's going on behind the scenes in the code. Currently there isn't any established lore behind the chemicals but you can suggest that in the appropriate area.

I decided to port all the lavaland megafauna. In the name of not copy-pasting (most) of the code, some of the abilities and whatnot are vastly different to account for aurorastation movespeed and balance. Everything works, except the loot it drops which I'm not adding. So far the plan is that the wizard can choose to summon one lavaland mob that deals hallos damage only, as part of a battle monsters expansion. To defeat them, you shoot at it until you die or use a high-power battlemonster card to destroy it. However not many people may like this since it's wizard exclusive and it may not mesh well with the balance of wizard, so here are the options I came up with. Note that no matter what, the monsters will do exclusively hallos damage to prevent murderbone, except for an admin-spawn variant. - Wizard Option A: Wizard can summon it via a battle monsters card and give commands to attack. - Wizard Option B: Wizard can summon it via a spell and control it for a short time. - Holodeck option A: Emag the holodeck, select preset, then emag the hologram to become it's master. You can order it to attack anything. Exists as long as the holodeck is on. - Holodeck option B: Emag the holodeck, select preset, it goes on a rampage. Exists as long as the holodeck is on. - Mining Powercreep Option A: Add an artifact that summons a megafauna monster that's an ally to the miner who summoned it. - Mining Powercreep Option B: Add an artifact that turns the welder into a controllable megafauna monster. - Cult Powercreep: After performing an intense ritual that requires a high amount of cultists, instead of summoning Nar'sie, the ruin's target can transform into one of the three lavaland megafauna. - Fuck You Burger: Just make it an admin only spawn.

02.png So let's get this right. The forums is the place to post, but feedback on the forums means nothing to you? No. If you, as a player, are telling me that other players don't want something, is meaningless. Giving a reason why, and depending on that reason, is meaningful. 1 million people could say that they don't like something, 1 million people could say that they do like something, it means nothing to me because neither of those things improve upon the final idea.

Telling me that most players don't want something based on feedback given in these threads and OOC means nothing to me anymore considering that it has been proven over and over again that the forums is not representative of the community. THe forums are useful for collecting ideas and not determining whether or not a project should be accepted or not.

Okay let's address it. "Furthermore, if this is supposedly a bug or an exploit, how is it over the course of a few years since the merge to Baycode, this supposed exploit has never been reported on the github as an exploit? Shouldn't it be the responsibility of the community to report bugs or exploits in the game, assuming we give any credit to the theory that it is an exploit at all?" The above is a red herring (See: Appeal to Tradition) and distracts from the main argument. Just because something hasn't been addressed doesn't mean it's an issue. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_tradition "Medical has had a very long past of constant nerfing to its effectiveness. Be that due to nerfing mechanics or remapping medical to be inherently suboptimal, these repeated nerfs to the department will not improve the quality of roleplay. The nerfs will drive people away from wanting to play it and..." Another red herring (See: Slippery Slope). The change has nothing to do with roleplay but to patch out an exploit that makes no sense mechanically or realistically. It uses dummy logic similar to "If I drank one flavor of gatorade, and then drank another flavor of gatorade, I will be hydrated twice as fast!" On top of this, you have provided 0 evidence to suggest that nerfs or changes make people not want to play medical. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope "This is is also a very hamfisted nerf to antagonists that wish to use more effective means of sustaining themselves either through the midst of combat or for first aid to treat themselves after a near-lethal confrontation. I will always dislike survivability nerfs especially when they apply to everyone that isn't an IPC/diona." If a tree falls down in the forest, and no one is around, is it an antagonist nerf? It's not an antagonist nerf if all the crew are equally affected. The crew has access to kelotane, and antags have access to kelotane. No one will end up dying because of this nerf. "In previous arguments for why this should be, the PR author has stated they want to make KeloDerm heal even less than what Dermaline heals on its own (that means less than 12 healing per 5 ticks, which is not insignificant). The PR author just wants to make it so that you're forced to adapt to a new style of play, because he views this strategy as an exploit." Strawmanning. This has nothing to do with me forcing a new style of play. It's plain and simple that I want to just patch out an exploit. I don't care if or how people adapt, I'm just fixing an exploit. This isn't 3D chess where I'm secretly destroying a meta or some shit, it's simply just patching out an exploit. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man "It's not an exploit, it's an optimal strategy. It's not powergaming, it's just part of the game. But a more interesting way of going about it instead of removing the advantageous nature of it entirely is to still make it usable with consequence. Make it so that chemicals of the same damage healing type still add to an overdose threshold, because even in real life, you shouldn't be taking several different medications. If you really want to punish chemists or medical doctors for using chemistry to cure all solutions, make overdose limits lower and especially so for combination chemicals. This will still add an interesting consequence of likely having to dialyzes someone you tried to heal to full health so quickly. This will make it so that medical doctors need to be more careful who they speed-heal, and characters that use Kelo-Derm in combat won't get completely nerfed into the dirt for trying to sustain themselves in mid-combat. Instead of removing powerful features from the game, add consequence to that strength to balance it out. Easy!" Adding shared overdose thresholds has no basis in logic. This isn't about solving powergaming or whatever it is you believe my intentions to be, but to fix faulty logic in the reagent code that allows this in the first place. This is barely a nerf to medicine. Let's make that absolutely clear. The only two things that this affects is the speed of which someone cures burn wounds. Before and After: Dermaline heals 12 burn damage per unit, with a metabolism rate of 0.2 units per second. That means it heals 12/5 units per second (2.4). Kelotane heals 6 burn damage pet unit, with a metabolism rate of 0.2 units per second. That means it heals 6/5 units per second (1.2). Combined, it heals 18/5 units per second (3.6). Absolute worst case scenario someone has 100 burn damage. With DermaTane or whatever it's fucking called, it would take 27 seconds to heal someone. With dermaline it will take 41 seconds. This is a 14 second difference per 100 damage (1.4 seconds per 10 damage, 0.14 seconds per 1 damage). This is absolutely nothing and can be easily reduced if you're actually a competent doctor (combining with burn kits, cryo, tricordizine). But sure lets dogpile the person who refused to argue with someone's post which consisted of several fallacies and assume I'm not addressing it because I just don't like it.

wew lots of replies let me try addressing all of them The purpose of this PR is to add realism. It shouldn't make sense that combining a lesser medication and a greater medication heals faster than just the greater medication on it's own. The logic doesn't make sense. Dermaline and Kelotane still heal pretty fast with this change. Dermaline heals 12u per unit. KeloDerm is an exploit and just because players like it, it shouldn't stay in the game. You won't be in medical for an additional 40 minutes because of this change. Healing chems are super effective. "Since the issue hasn't been complained about before, it's not an issue" isn't an argument and I'm not going to read that wall of text. Tricord will be unaffected by this change. If you want to make a super medication, mix tricord with dermaline.

The only reason you would use KeloDerm over Dermaline is if you want to avoid overdose and also want to save on chemicals.

I made a system that prevents the exploit known as KeloDerm and CryoClonexadone by making it so that metabolism is limited based on the chemical type. PR here: https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora.3/pull/5273

I don't think this part is necessary. For starters, just because a chef is present at round start doesn't mean they're 1) Competent 2) Going to be staying for the whole round (or even long enough for said break) 3) Want to DEAL with thirty people on a station all ordering at once 4) Even going to be in the kitchen if they want to do tator or ling things Keep the station time dynamic. People will eat when they want to eat. I have a character that eats. Constantly. You'd be surprised how few chefs are actually in the kitchen even when we HAVE a chef. Having kept up with this thread, though, I understand concerns and arguments for both sides. The only way to figure out which side is more true is to test it out and get some feedback. Hypotheticals about the numbers haven't really told me much until I feel it for myself. HoPs and cargo can order the crew pizza if the chef present isn't that good. Botany can provide fruit, and vending machines can fill up people. Donk pockets exist in almost every breakroom.

Incredibly false. Reread the github PR. "Penalties for not eating or drinking are now more severe. If you refuse to drink or eat all shift, you will be 4 times slower and take 4 times more pain damage. The amount scales based on your hunger or thirst levels. If you are considered hungry or thirsty, it starts scaling at 1 all the way to 4, until you're starving or seriously dehydrated. If you overeat and overdrink as well, you get a 25% reduced movement and pain tolerance with each mechanic." So pretty much everything you posted here was wrong but I'm going to comment on your idea anyways, which is how community should have a say in what gets added to the server. However, the community already has a say in the matter. If enough people actually argue and provide points as to why something shouldn't be added, the developers will likely not add the PR if there is a valid reason. it does matter and should not matter if a million people say that a PR is worse than sliced hitler, all that matters is the arguments put forth and the actual implementation of a PR. If the popular vote dictated what gets added or removed to the server, then there would barley be any contributions. People are more willing to complain about a feature than complement, virtually every PR that I've made has had massive -1s from the same few people. The PR gets added regardless and no one complains about it post-implementation because the complaints are almost always over-exaggerated.

Tbh if I have to I could make it so that people only get a 10% speed penalty from excessive hunger/thirst and work from there. Obviously I'm going to be on top of things and submit a shitload of master patches after it's implemented to fine tune the mechanics if I notice that the mechanics themselves are too disruptive. If this PR is submitted, another one will come after this. If a chef is present in the round, the station time is either set to 7am, 11am, or 5pm. A 15-30 minute optional breakfast, lunch, or dinner break will occur at 8am, 12pm, and 6pm and people's hunger levels will be medium-high at these times so people can dedicate time to social activities and eating in the holodeck and bar.

Pickpocking mechanics need to be a thing, I agree. It's also a bit silly how slow it takes to remove some items, or add them. It shouldn't take 30 seconds to remove a top hat from someone's head.

(Verbally abusing people gets me banned so that's not something I will ever do.) A point I wanted to make is that a lot of people are a little too scared of any mechanics changed because of assumptions on balance. Thirst is super adjustable so if there are any issues on launch it can be tweaked to be less of an impact, however I don't think that will be needed considering thirst is easy to maintain.

None of the posts they raised apply to this. I'm going to explain this once and only once, and if people don't read this post while still complaining about how it's crippling without understanding the code then I have a right to verbally abuse them. I can see a lot of misunderstandings and misinformation going on so let me correct it. A lot of the feedback and criticisms about the core concept of the thirst mod surprises me considering that this is an HRP server and the mechanics themselves aren't bad. Here is what the balance entails: Running does not take up an additional hunger or thirst point per tile. I removed it. The amount of nutrition lost by walking was reduced 50%. That 50% was added to hydration loss. The amount of nutrition lost by stamina regen was reduced 50%. That 50% and 25% more was added to the hydration loss. The amount of hunger required to have not-negative effects was doubled. The amount of thirst required to have not-negative effects is 50% lower than hunger. Antags and sec had a problem with maintaining hunger levels because they moved around a lot. This changes that.

This is surprisingly well done. Good work.

Fuck it, I gave up and just removed IPC thirst. Need to test it, however, because I drastically did some code improvements.

I'll remove lube reducing thirst for IPCs. I'll just make it some sort of combination with arrow's suggestion. It sounds like hydraulic fluid, so I'll just name it hydraulic fluid. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_fluid