Staff Complaint - Shadow7889

[AmoryBlaine]

BYOND Key: AmoryBlaine
Staff BYOND Key: Shadow7889
Game ID: b2v-dDvR
Evidence/logs/etc:

Yesterday during a round of Siege a player spawned with the intent of getting a merc slot, and immediately cryo'd when they did not get it. They made this very clear in dchat. I reported this to staff. The responding staff member was not able to reach the player in time. Rather than warn this player so that they may be informed of the infraction next time they join the server, I was instructed to make a player complaint against them. I took issue with this. Shadow stepped in and enforced the prior staff member's decision to have me make a complaint against the player. I did not do this. Again, today, I ahelped while the player was online in order to get action to be taken. It was, when another member of staff handled it. Shadow once again stepped in to confirm when this incident occurred that I was referring to. They refused admit that it is the responsibility of the staff team to handle the issue, and that I was suppose to make a complaint. I am not going to make a whole complaint against a player for a single issue that the staff team is already aware of, and very capable of handling it. The reason for this staff complaint is I would like it straightened out as to whether or not it is my responsibility, as a player, to make a complaint in addition to having ahelped an issue that is agreed upon by the staff member to be an issue PURELY because the offending player has gone offline.

Additional remarks: N/A

[Lady Fowl]

What rule is the player breaking? We are not the personal police to enforce your standard of whats right and wrong, we have no rules on the books for this so its hard to enforce something that isnt law. Furthermore why did you try and ahelp him later on for the same earlier incident if you were told make a complaint

[AmoryBlaine]

8 minutes ago, DRagO said:

What rule is the player breaking? We are not the personal police to enforce your standard of whats right and wrong, we have no rules on the books for this so its hard to enforce something that isnt law. Furthermore why did you try and ahelp him later on for the same earlier incident if you were told make a complaint

Try is the wrong word, as they were spoken to for their behavior once I ahelped while they were online again- as they would have been had they remained online the first time. I would say it is quite dickish to knowingly take up a slot for a job you do not intend to play, while trying to get an antag role.

Is it okay for players to purposely aim for antagonist roles, while rolling for limited slots they have no intention on playing?

[Shadow7889]

1. The staff member that was going to deal with the issue was a trial member. I had talked to them regarding the issue. We could not reach the player to allow them to confirm or deny the issue. 

2. When said player was active again and you ahelped, I took care of the issue. 

3. Your logic on ahelps and forum complaints needs some serious reworking. You refuse wholeheartedly to file a player complaint. However you will file a complaint against trial staff as well as myself as soon as you can. 

4. Even when the issue itself was handled, you were not happy with the outcome becuase it was not done when you wanted it done. 

5. Staff are not your personal slaves to do your bidding. We make mistakes. We are human. I have had this conversation with you at least three times. I'm unsure how you fail to see the point.

 

[AmoryBlaine]

My logic on when I ahelp and when I file complaints is sound. If the staff team is made aware of an issue, and fails to handle it in time- it does not then fall on me to file a complaint against anyone other than the staff member. I have done my part as a player in reporting the initial offense, the staff member is in agreement with my reporting of it. It is out of my court, and up to you to handle it, whether they leave or not. Especially when all the context needed was already available. They made a statement that lined up with their actions- this was incorrect and  needed to be handled by staff.

The outcome, being me having to ahelp again a day later while the player was back online, rather than forced to make a player complaint- is not one to be happy with. I should not have had to ahelp a second time, I should not have had to refuse to make a player complaint. The player should have been warned or noted the first day, given they left before they could be DM'd.

If you think being treated like a slave means having the expectation of handling issues you are already aware of the day of and not having players jump through hoops in order to get minor issues settled as they should be server side- I think you're in the wrong position. What mistake do you keep refering to? That the issue was not originally handled? Yes. He did not contact the player soon enough. That does not mean I am now responsible for seeing that the player's behavior is dealt with. It means that player should be warned or noted for future incidents.

The point of this complaint is to figure out where we exchange responsibility for server moderation. I, the player, made the report. The staff member was aware of the issue and was given evidence of the statement. The staff member checked the player's notes. The staff member intended to contact the player about their behavior. The player left. Does this mean the responsibility for this issue is back on me? If so, why? Is it fair to either player that they should have to extend the length of the issue? I do not think it reasonable for me to make a player complaint against someone who from my view has made exactly one misstep in behavior, has already been ahelped and is not to my knowledge in need of banning.

 

[Arrow768]

6 hours ago, AmoryBlaine said:

I do not think it reasonable for me to make a player complaint against someone who from my view has made exactly one misstep in behavior, has already been ahelped and is not to my knowledge in need of banning.

I want to correct only one thing: The purpose of player complaints is not to request the ban of a person. That is what ban requests are for.

[Garnascus]

So.....

 

What actually happened with the player in question? Did they get warned or something?

[Shadow7889]

A warning was applied, yes. 

[Garnascus]

So, the individual was dealt with. 

What happened in between amory being told to make a player complaint and the player getting warned? I dont get it. 

[Shadow7889]

Said player disconnected before the ahelp was taken/handled. Armory refused to file a complaint. Ahelped the following day. I talked to the player, informed them not to do such a thing again and applied a warning. I believe the complaint concerns the lack of response time. And my failure to take responsibility, if I'm understanding Blaine correctly. 

[Garnascus]

And i assume the warning wasn't given on the initial ahelp because he could have DCed or something and you did not have all the information to warn him?

[Shadow7889]

The warning was not issued because the player disconnected before the ticket was taken, the trial member in question couldn't reach them for their side. So yes, a lack of evidence. Once I made contact on the following ahelp, i got the full story and acted on that. 

[AmoryBlaine]

"Nah, il roll see if I get antag or not during round such as siege if I don't I cryo".

What relevant information were you given on the second day that the line I just quoted didn't already give you, coupled with my initial ahelp?

[Shadow7889]

I didn't have screenshots/nor the ability to speak with the player on the matter. I do not typically given warnings/ban/notes on players unless it's clear cut. As Kor was handling the ahelp and I was AFK, I wasn't sure if you had sent screenshots. The information I needed was given to me by that player on the following day. If it had not of been, I would have asked an admin to get me logs for that round to double check, then apply a warning. 

[Garnascus]

Mods do not have the .getserverlog verb so shadow would have been unable to verify it if he didnt see it in his chat log. I do not see anything wrong here.

[AmoryBlaine]

It was never requested, so, again- pushing responsibility on to me. If he isn't willing to ask for a screenshot the day of, the round of, but more than happy to tell me to go make a complaint- I'm going to take issue.

[Garnascus]

In situations as tame as this one its preferable to speak with the person in question first. Shadow did not do anything wrong in regards to how we expect moderators to act. This will be locked and archived in 24 hours. 

[AmoryBlaine]

If this situation was so tame, perhaps Shadow can take the time himself to make the complaint. If the situation was so tame, perhaps a screenshot would have done the job any conversation did. I am displeased with the turnout here, but I expected it.